Course Maker/Track Path Editor: A "badly-executed good idea"?

Would you agree?

  • !! YES, TO HELL WITH IT !!

  • Not really. I can manage.

  • No, it's great!!


Results are only viewable after voting.
1,988
United States
FL, USA, Earth, Sol, Local Bubble, Milky Way
TeamACRZARacingo
GyroxOpex
Once again, the number of votes that approve of the Course Maker outweigh the number of votes disapproving of it, and once again, the number of complainers in the thread outweighs the number of people who enjoy the feature. See, guys? This is the state of our community. Those who approve of anything about the game are too afraid to say so publicly lest they be verbally beaten down by the angry mob.

Is this how you guys want it? Is it?
 
336
Italy
Italy
Il_Conte_Sky
Why has my post been deleted? (Or is my connection that bad?)
It wasn't offensive at all, and it was pretty conclusive as well.


Btw, gonna unwatch this. Have fun.
 

regnar

Senior Member
Premium
1,364
United States
Florida, USA
red95gts
Desman1982
It's a good start, but feels a bit like they tried to get it the door before moving onto GT7.

In areas like the way that PD has set up a typical track section, the edge of terrain distance to road is too wide, such that recreating common tracks that are smaller than maybe 2.5 miles, the tightness of turns makes it nearly impossible to create, having the option of to modify sections like GT5 would be preferred with the additional option to reduce the terrain distance (in doing so would eliminate the ability to add track objects such as trees, bleachers, etc., as the terrain is reduced but that would be OK ) reducing the terrain distance would allow the meshes more room to bend before crashing into each other.

The way that PD has modularized the home straight, it would seem easy to offer more options, such as having smaller pit section.

Having a option to resize the track like Bobs Track Builder would make life easier were you draw the track then simply type in the in the new length, but the way PD has went about creating the editor, have placed limitations, since things like the home straight length, track section have minimum lengths, so the track can only be reduced so much.

I been able to create custom tracks quite easy and fast, but most that I like have turns are too tight, so I have to recreate tracks larger than I want.

Since this was built in a modular fashion pre-made sections of the track I believe could have been made, such as tight radius turns, 90 degree turns, chicanes and maybe even bridges though I think overlapping meshes maybe problematic with the program.

Being this is version 1.0, hope there is future updates.:)
 

photonrider

Let There Be Time!
Premium
7,436
Canada
Canada
photonrider
Some are calling it CM II. Whatever this version is it's a leap from the old version. I must have spent all of 15 minutes with CM in GT5 before putting it away in disgust. having lost faith in PD on that score. When it was delayed it didn't distress me too much. But the way it has been re-launched is climatic - a whole new angle to it, breaking away from the console and offering portability and potential for infinite flexibilty across peripherals and platforms.
Keeping in mind that mobile apps are taking off driven by today's ultra-mobile lifestyles, this app has tremendous potential and within a year will be so changed that this initial launch version will pale in comparison.
Sure there will be updates - lots of them.

Also factor in that the community involved in using this app can be not only vocal but will be so right across the internet - and that's not only the gaming community. There will be feedback, there will be changes, there will be improvements. There are many uses for this app apart from it being an application that Gran Turismo - the simulator - can use.
 
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131
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
dimebolt-1976
If they intend to patch the app at all, it'd be a big help if they could tweak these options...

1) The ability to reduce / increase the width of the track AFTER it's been drawn out too. It's a shame when you test it out and it's too narrow/wide in the game. But you have to start all over again if you want to change that. It'd save a lot of time and would be so handy.

2) Have the ability to copy your drawn layout, saving it to a cache of some kind, then PASTE it into any of the other map environments after. So you can trace in Eifel Flat, then copy it, start again in Death Valley, for example, then paste your previously drawn layout into that.

3) The ability to add tunnels as scenery, like the one on High Speed Ring.

4) Maybe a bit weird this one, but like a heat map of each environment that shows the peaks and troughs of the map, so it is easier to see what parts of your track are going downhill or uphill. That would possibly allow people to attempt recreating the climbs and drops of real world tracks more accurately. At this moment, as far as i am aware, it's very difficult to know what your track is going to when you get out to test it.
 
930
The big missing thing is the GPS feature. That was kind of the whole point really.

The ability to generate a track from driving the course with your phone in the car. They described it in the 'to come' list on the original release. What happened?
 
1,675
England
England
MaxPower211983
It isn't built in to the PS3, whether you emulate it, or do it on a tablet.

The transfer process is easy. You just press transfer on the pad, then click the import tab in the game and it's there. It's faster than joining an online lobby.

I know this now. It's all built into the Tablet app. I probably wasn't fully sure or in the understanding until yesterday. Even so, it doesn't justify me buying a tablet. I have had 0 success with the ANDY emulator on my laptop, it does nothing after so long. But doesn't even give any error or application crash. Everything stops working from my first two times experience of using it. I'll try it again tomorrow. I managed to do so much with it the first time using it, but then had to create track again, and it was probably after starting again or discarding that the problems occurred. idk i'll give it the benefit of the doubt.
 

Skygrasper550

I have returned to gaming, it's good to be back
Premium
3,077
Philippines
Philippines
skygrasper_550--
So I've finally managed to use the Course Maker feature (or the "Track Path Editor", to be more precise), and I have to say, I'm a bit of a mixed bag on how I feel towards it. While it was a step back on a few areas compared to the old Course Maker, it is leaps and bounds improved on the remaining other areas. I'm just going to add on from my initial thoughts as seen in the original post.

First off, accessibility. Yes, that is a big issue on my end, but thankfully I have managed to properly set up Bluestacks on my laptop and get the app working. My only problem is that I'm using quite an old laptop which is really only meant for office work, and so its CPU always peaks whenever the app is open (by peak I mean 100% CPU Usage :crazy: ). I might need a new laptop for this app, as well as my PS3 video recording equipment. Anyway, once in the app, I chose the Death Valley theme just to test what the app has to offer, and I finally got to tracing the outline of the sample track I had in mind.

That right there, was the moment where the brand Course Maker's amazing level of sophistication really shined. While the old Course Maker really should have been labeled as a "Course Generator" instead, in the new one you have full control on the outline of your dream race track (well, fine, 90% control). In the Layout Mode, you're able to make a straight as long as you want, as long as it's within the confines of the layout map, and having control of the tightness of the corners is really amazing. I like how the app displays info on each section of the map, like length for the straights and even the turn radii for the corners. And since that information is being displayed, this in turn allows you to create a sequence of corners that have the same turning radius, allowing the track to have a degree of consistency that was really not possible in the old Course Maker. What I noticed however, is that you can't make incredibly tight turn because the app doesn't allow you to, it says the pieces of the road would bump into each other. I didn't quite get this at first :confused:, maybe because the app doesn't have a more sophisticated algorithm that would allow you to do so. But I didn't mind much anyway, I just wanted to see how much and how far the app can get.

What I've made is a fairly high-speed course that's reminiscent of the Speed-type races in NFS: Prostreet. Earlier before getting to use the app, I went into a few lobbies using custom tracks, and I joined this lobby which had a course set in Death Valley. It was a very wide patch of road that stretched really long and has high-speed corners wherein you can just mash the throttle and go flat out. So okay, after taking inspiration from that and from Prostreet, I made sure I captured the essence of those, and that is where the Item Mode comes in. I really like how the game allows you to place items alongside the track, something the old Course Maker didn't have. And because the new Course Maker had this feature, it gives your custom tracks a sort of "life" into them. Kind of like decorating a room in your house, to make the place a little more lively.

Once finished, I encountered a small problem when transferring the track. It kept saying "Transfer failed", and so I looked up here to find possible solutions to address this problem. What worked for me is logging my PSN ID out of the Course Maker, restarting Bluestacks, logging in my PSN ID again and boom, transfer successful. Needless to say, I was really excited on trying out my first-ever custom track in GT6. :D It wasn't bad, and I think it could use some adjustments, and so I went back to the app to change some portions of the track.

Downsides of the app would be of course, not being able to set the track width on individual sections of the track. And you can't change it once you're on drawing the layout, either, so you'll have to start over again if you want a different track with. Being able to create super tight corners isn't possible, moreso if your track width is set to maximum. A 30 track limit would prove to be an inconvenience to others, as they would like to either copy as much real-life tracks as possible, or let their imaginations go wild. But so far, I personally have no qualms with it. And perhaps the biggest downside of the app, is that you only have a maximum of 10 kilometers of a stretch of road. Again, some would find this troublesome, and I think they should have allowed it up to 12-15 kilometers or so. a 15km-long track is pretty long, frankly. Another bad thing I experienced was that, because I am using an emulator to use the app, I can't exactly zoom in or zoom out freely. If anyone knows how to do so, please, do share it. :D

Overall my experience with the new Course Maker has been amazing. It's great, but just like the game which it supports, it has flaws in areas you wouldn't think of. And so my vote goes to "Not really, I can manage." :)
 

FS7

1,117
Brazil
Brazil
Track editor is ok at best. One has more control over layout than in GT5 but there's way too many limitations.

Things that cannot be done using GT6 track editor:
-tracks longer than 10km
-control elevation changes
-tight turns/chicanes/hairpins
-adjust width of individual sections
-adjust camber of individual sections
-have a main straight shorter than 500m
-choose starting direction of the main straight
-crossover section (figure 8 tracks like Suzuka, stuff like the loop at Cape Ring, etc)
-include brake markers
-place barriers close to the edge of the track (useful when recreating street tracks)
-adjust size of runoff areas
-choose which side to put the pitlane
-use track surfaces other than tarmac
-set time to night
-play custom tracks offline
-have more than 30 tracks saved at a time
-select custom tracks after creating a online lobby
 
2,993
Australia
Brisbane
jimipitbull
Once again, the number of votes that approve of the Course Maker outweigh the number of votes disapproving of it, and once again, the number of complainers in the thread outweighs the number of people who enjoy the feature. See, guys? This is the state of our community. Those who approve of anything about the game are too afraid to say so publicly lest they be verbally beaten down by the angry mob.

Is this how you guys want it? Is it?

The angry mob is just 4 or 5 guys that appear in most threads. They post certain key words or themes that seem to act as cues for each other in what looks like a game of "Dissect the positive post in a passive aggressive manner using at least one three-word-slogan in multiquote format."

In real life I assume they are actually quite timid, possibly agoraphobic.
 

AudiMan2011

Scottish
Contributing Writer
12,499
Scotland
GTPlanet
Street-King-07
Quattro Saltire
The idea could have been executed better with an in-game creator alongside the tablet version.

I've had a play with it for a while on my dad's iPad, and whilst fiddly, it's not bad but it could be better.
 

regnar

Senior Member
Premium
1,364
United States
Florida, USA
red95gts
Desman1982
Not expecting any significant changes to the creator by PD before GT7, but if their listening I would like them to add some additional tools to Line Tool tab (upper left) found in the Layout Mode, these would be a Hairpin Tool,
Left & Right 90 degree turns Tool & a Chicane Tool. The tools would have flexibility to adjust. These tools would help with the very tight turns that a so problematic, since they would occupy a minimum footprint no track objects could be added to them.

I would like to have Three options for Pit Area (home straight), "A" being what we already have, then going to a pit area "B" that is half the size in both length and width and the "C" being the smallest that is even smaller with no pit garages but just tents, "C" the length would be adjustable.

A small want would be to set the default time & weather for each custom track, instead of it always being 8:00 and sunny.

There is so much more I want such as elevation changes and cross overs, but not holding out hope.
 
7
Poland
Poland
alienisko
- Ability to remove (and greatly reduce/increase) buffer space around tracks.
Let me do tight curves or place run-off areas.

It would be great to see it in an update. I don't like most of my tracks because of no run-off areas :/
 

RC45

660bhp Z07
(Banned)
1,629
United States
Texas
RC45
RC45
It would be great to see it in an update. I don't like most of my tracks because of no run-off areas :/

^ this, and the track barrier/Armco obscures the world and makes for very uninteresting tracks.

Mt Aso had the same limited corridors in GT5 CM, but the wooden fence style railing let the scenery be viewed. Even the Nordschliefe is only that entertaining after a while due to its claustrophobic lack of runoff and obscured scenery.
 
75
United Kingdom
Manchester
I'm thinking it's pretty cool....I think PD do right....let's remember mobile technology is still relatively new and PD are prodomently Gaming writers....and combining the two is brand new....but you can see they have concentrated on future update abilaty...a solid foundation...at the moment it seems relatively simple....but it incorporates GT seemlesly as though it's always been there....also the GPS capability is there...( I see a future app that captures GPS and maybe some telemetry..as data logger app maybe....for smart phones...)
it's not the thousands of kilometres to drive in that I led myself to believe,but thousands of kilometres to make tracks in...maybe that will change in future updates
I can see future theme add ons ..maybe if they do a new track location ..we will also get that theme and seenary that comes with it and photo mode all rolled into one as DLC...( Ilse of man)
One or two issues to address ...like back up ...how can we back up of our many tracks created on iPad...
Like in game editor....
But it's early days and it's solid from the ground up...they done a top down on it....great job PD ...Propper...
Now bring on the DLC to all aspects of the game....

It isn't built in to the PS3, whether you emulate it, or do it on a tablet.

The transfer process is easy. You just press transfer on the pad, then click the import tab in the game and it's there. It's faster than joining an online lobby.
Yeah it's faster than getting in any track...amazing how fast realy...
 
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RC45

660bhp Z07
(Banned)
1,629
United States
Texas
RC45
RC45
I'm thinking it's pretty cool....I think PD do right....let's remember mobile technology is still relatively new and PD are prodomently Gaming writers....and combining the two is brand new....but you can see they have concentrated on future update abilaty...a solid foundation...at the moment it seems relatively simple....but it incorporates GT seemlesly as though it's always been there....also the GPS capability is there...( I see a future app that captures GPS and maybe some telemetry..as data logger app maybe....for smart phones...)
it's not the thousands of kilometres to drive in that I led myself to believe,but thousands of kilometres to make tracks in...maybe that will change in future updates
I can see future theme add ons ..maybe if they do a new track location ..we will also get that theme and seenary that comes with it and photo mode all rolled into one as DLC...( Ilse of man)
One or two issues to address ...like back up ...how can we back up of our many tracks created on iPad...
Like in game editor....
But it's early days and it's solid from the ground up...they done a top down on it....great job PD ...Propper...
Now bring on the DLC to all aspects of the game....


Yeah it's faster than getting in any track...amazing how fast realy...

Mobile technology is mature and gaming on mobile platforms is not new - PD are not newbs, they have been around long enough to not release unfinished rubbish like this, then again they are PD and the last title they release that was complete on launch day was GT4, well technically it was Tourist Trophy. The moment they could update the title after release they stopped bothering to complete anything. (This is true of all console developers)
 
75
United Kingdom
Manchester
Mobile technology is mature and gaming on mobile platforms is not new - PD are not newbs, they have been around long enough to not release unfinished rubbish like this, then again they are PD and the last title they release that was complete on launch day was GT4, well technically it was Tourist Trophy. The moment they could update the title after release they stopped bothering to complete anything. (This is true of all console developers)
Not all...it's easy to see..if you think about it....it's easy to make something..but a lot harder to make something future proof....this is a sound platform...I see future improvements and add on's DLC...well into and beyond GT7...mobile technology moves so fast anyone who's not considering at least 10 years ahead will have to start agian from scratch to keep up....
 

TS050

Premium
3,071
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
ask
Y'know, after using it for a few days, it's actually not that bad. Sure, I'd like to be able to control the elevation of the tracks, make proper hairpin turns and it should've really arrived much sooner, but I can see past it. It really is a breath of fresh air.

I can understand the backlash from it though. PD, you should've made it available to everyone...

--

Question.

Why do you always lurk around the GT forums talking smack in every single thread?

Honestly, I can't take some of you guys seriously...

Especially when you purposely misquoted something to make GT seem even worse.
 
4,466
Bulgaria
Bulgaria
--


Question.

Why do you always lurk around the GT forums talking smack in every single thread?

Honestly, I can't take some of you guys seriously...

Especially when you purposely misquoted something to make GT seem even worse.

Because GT 5 and 6 sucks,it"s became a second hand sim in every aspect :yuck:
 

TS050

Premium
3,071
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
ask
Because GT 5 and 6 sucks,it"s became a second hand sim in every aspect :yuck:

I don't have a problem with you disliking GT5 and 6, but why don't you leave that all in the Whining and Crying thread? It's there so you don't have to bring all of this to the other threads.

Some of us are trying to enjoy this game.
 
4,466
Bulgaria
Bulgaria
I don't have a problem with you disliking GT5 and 6, but why don't you leave that all in the Whining and Crying thread? It's there so you don't have to bring all of this to the other threads.

Let's put all people who complain in the GT6 Epic Whining and Crying thread and lock them up there as a prisoners.:rolleyes:

Some of us are trying to enjoy this game.
If you still enjoy the game my comments will not bother you,here is example:
I enjoy now of LFS.
Do you think that if someone start to post negative comments can spoil my joy?
The answer is NO,as you say I would not have taken him seriously.
I would take him seriously only if he is right,and in this case I would not tell him to go away I would support him because this will make the game better.
 

TS050

Premium
3,071
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
ask
Let's put all people who complain in the GT6 Epic Whining and Crying thread and lock them up there as a prisoners.:rolleyes:

Yeah, I didn't say that people who complain weren't allowed to externalise their feelings. I've got nothing against that. I'm saying when I see people who complain (literally only a select few) in almost every single GT6 thread.


(slight hyperbole, but I think you get the point)
 

RC45

660bhp Z07
(Banned)
1,629
United States
Texas
RC45
RC45
Yeah, I didn't say that people who complain weren't allowed to externalise their feelings. I've got nothing against that. I'm saying when I see people who complain (literally only a select few) in almost every single GT6 thread.


(slight hyperbole, but I think you get the point)

The reason for the complaints is the hope that PD/Kaz will take them to heart - the reason GT6 sales are 1/5th of GT5 sales in not because the title is better.

You cannot remove features and expect to improve market share - this was true of GT6 and this is true of the Course Maker.

I think there still not being a GT7 for PS4 yet is actually quite telling. The platform was released in 2013 after 2 years in development - so realistically Kaz has had 5 years to get with the program.

The GT franchise has gone from being a launch title to being almost the inside joke of the console industry.

There was a time when Sony sold Playstations to people simply because Gran Turismo existed.

He'll some of us even bought huge Sony 70" 1080p TV's just because GT was going to go native 1080p in 2008.

That is how big GT used to be - so yes we complain, a lot - because we want the old GT spirit of perfection and features and functionality back - not some misguided new wave rendition that the author thinks we want.

:)

If I was on Sony's board I would vote to stop spending resources on PD and drop them as a dev. That's how far they have slid.
 
2,005
United States
Los Angeles
GTP_DrivingPark
Finetales
I don't know, I like it.

It's a little odd that they made it for tablets only, but it took me less than a minute to get it up and running on my phone (which is no slouch, but isn't a new model). I wasn't prepared for it to be separate from the game, but I actually like it that way because I like device integration. Also, my friend who plays Forza but not Gran Turismo downloaded it to his tablet and has already imported tracks he's made to my account. It's making him a lot more interested in GT6 because he can play the tracks he made. :D

As for features, yes I would like to be able to change elevation and yes I would like to be able to make the track cross over itself. But it's really fine...I just use Eifel and there's plenty of elevation change to be had. The trackside elements are pretty lackluster, but as long as the track itself is good I think I'll survive. What's wrong with a track that looks like a country road? That's what the Nurburgring is and we all love that.

At any rate, the Track Path Editor's introduction got me playing GT6 again, so that's a successful new feature in my book.
 

eran0004

Premium
9,690
Sweden
Sweden
eran0004
The reason for the complaints is the hope that PD/Kaz will take them to heart - the reason GT6 sales are 1/5th of GT5 sales in not because the title is better.

If we go by vgchartz it's actually 30%, not 1/5th.

And the question is if their methodology can accurately account for digital download copies sold... I guess probably not, since their guesses are partly based on retail polls, and retail polls wouldn't show copies sold online directly from the publisher. Case in point: World of Warcraft: Cataclysm, which was an expansion for World of Warcraft released in 2010. According to vgchartz it sold 2.07 million copies, which would mean that out of 12 million subscribers worldwide, only 1/6th of them actually played the game. I find that extremely hard to believe, especially since Blizzard's (the studio) own figures reveal that 3.3 million copies were sold within the first hour.

But chances are that if you indeed were on Sony's board you'd have access to the actual sales figures, and not vgchartz's guesswork.
 
7
Switzerland
Switzerland
ratc1234
My biggest complaints over the limitations, problems and issues with this "V 1.0 app" so far:

-crashes every time I try to load .kml files created in Google Earth, had to convert .kml files to .gpx

-doesn't use elevation data from .gpx/.kml files for the track, which means...

-... you have no control over elevation on the track itself, so no control over jump points either. All you can do is use the default elevation from the themes provided as a best guess for your track layout.

- Have you ever thought about making a track on the edges of a precipice or canyon? Forget about it. You have no control over the surrounding terrain.

Importing terrain elevation data for the surrounding terrain and then allowing to either create a track there from scratch or use the elevation of .gpx/.kml files to place the autogenerated track in the imported terrain would be perfect.

-doesn't use .gpx/.kml files to autogenerate tracks (you'll always have to draw tracks from scratch, .gpx/.kml files just serve as outline for drawing tracks)

-when using files from real world circuits as outline, it considers plenty of track sections as being too short and corners as being too tight!! lol

-Not only is the radius of the corners you want to make very limited (which is odd because plenty of GT6 tracks have way tighter corners), you also won't be able to make square corners like those found in the London circuit

-No over/under sections like bridges and tunnels, which means no figure "8" circuits like Suzuka

-The automatic scaling the app uses from .gpx/.kml seems to be wrong.
My local race track has a main straight with ~900meters (measured using google earth).
Using a .gpx file and trying to replicate the main straight the app tells me that it has no more than ~640 meters!

-Using a .jpg file from a real circuit and then trying to apply the real world scale on the app is somewhat difficult.

-Doesn't allow track sections to be "close" to one another when mimicking real world tracks, even though in real life those sections are 30+ meters apart!

- Forces tracks to have the same width throughout the whole track!
Real life circuits have sections/corners that are wider than others! They should allow 1-2 meters difference between sections up to the maximum width permitted.

-Limited track length, should be at least 25 kilometers.

-Limited themes to choose from and no dirt/snow themes.

-Limited items to ornament the sides of the circuits like road signs, trees, stands etc and no option tho choose between different types of walls like normal/invisible walls, guardrails etc

-Corner banking applies to the whole track and not corner by corner.

-You have no control over how bumpy track sections are. Tarmac is always smooth like brand new.

- You always have to draw everything from scratch, no predefined common track sections to choose from like chicanes, short/long S's, wide to tight corners and vice versa, hairpins etc
Even Mach Rider on my NES had this feature!

-Also, you've made an awesome track section and want to invert it and/or duplicate it elsewhere on the track and/or save it for use in another track?
Yes? Well, you're out of luck "amigo", you can't do that.

-You can only have 30 tracks to share at one time.

-No easy way to find, download, rate & share the best custom tracks... inside the app and/or inside GT6

-Somewhat annoying that the draw distance on user created tracks seems to be very limited, I haven't seen such limited draw distance since the early PS2 days!


I will leave out the fact that the app is tablet restricted (because I have a tablet) and the fact that there's always room for improvement in making the user interface more intuitive and easier to use.