Cut corner penalties: what rules should GTS adapt?

What should be defined as cutting corners in GTS across all circuits?


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United Kingdom
Hi everyone!

Excuse my frustrations over what is probably deemed a very small issue but I hate inconsistencies - in GTS's case it's how each circuit (even specific corner) feels like it has it's own rule book. If you want a competitive eSports game it has to be as consistent as possible. On some tracks for example you can completely leave the circuit in parts (Maggiore) and on some you get penalties just for taking too much curb, where part of the car is still in the boundaries (Monza).

I personally would like each circuit to class the boundaries as the white lines, and cutting the corner is where ALL of the car is outside of these boundaries. This rule is the same as the Blancpain series and allows good attacking and defending without an overly strict application of track boundaries.

How do you feel GTS should define a corner cut?
 
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In my opinion, the general consensus for corner cutting should be when all 4 wheels are over the white line.

There should be some exceptions (main one that springs to mind is sector one at Nurburgring GP) that should be clearly identified in some way so everyone is aware.

There are some tracks where I have received a penalty despite not having all 4 wheels off the track, I think the last left hander out of the Ascari chicane at Monza being one of them. Consistency of the penalties being applied is the main thing for me, at least you know circuit-to-circuit what is and isn't allowed.

Another thing that annoys me is where you run wide at a corner (and therefore lose time) and then get slapped with a penalty on top of the time you just lost...
 
How do you feel GTS should enforce corner cutting?

More than 2 wheels off the track as defined by the white lines. THEN each time a person does it it triggers a "black flag" then when 3 flags are triggered (maybe 5 for longer races) and a drive through penalty is issued and if not taken DQed.

This would work with small infractions. Then, if someone thinks they can do a huge cut to win a race e.g. drive through a chicane then a 30sec penalty (or something) Fine tuning this would include: if time is gained then deemed deliberate, if time lost through a spin or contact then the penalty would be squashed. Also this would stop people deliberately ricocheting off someone to get a corner cut to get and advantage - nullified by gaining time.

My $0.02 worth
 
More than 2 wheels off the track as defined by the white lines. THEN each time a person does it it triggers a "black flag" then when 3 flags are triggered (maybe 5 for longer races) and a drive through penalty is issued and if not taken DQed.

This would work with small infractions. Then, if someone thinks they can do a huge cut to win a race e.g. drive through a chicane then a 30sec penalty (or something) Fine tuning this would include: if time is gained then deemed deliberate, if time lost through a spin or contact then the penalty would be squashed. Also this would stop people deliberately ricocheting off someone to get a corner cut to get and advantage - nullified by gaining time.

My $0.02 worth

My question wasn't clear in context so I've cleared that up. What GTS defines as cutting the corner, and then how it enforces it would be a cool threat. I was focusing on what should be defined as a corner cut.

I would say that your idea on how it does this is good. iRacing counts the infractions and then enforces based on the amount of times, this at least gives an impression a repeat offender is doing it intentionally to gain time, where an odd infraction is probably a mistake, or being forced off through racing an opponent.
 
I feel as if using the curbing with at least 2 tires off and nothing more is good. It can allow recovery space and overtaking space when there seems to be none. Maybe it's because whenever I see it possible, I try to use the side grass and little inside space to overtake a car.
 
Whatever they do, it should be made clear. An assist that makes the actual boundaries visible as a bright red line.

I'm fine with using 2 wheels inside the white line. No more dive overtake attempts over the inside grass, which often results in me getting a penalty for following the racing line...
 
I agree but only in the race, in qualifying going off track should invalidate the lap and the next one too if in the final sector, just to prevent any corner cutting cheaters.

Think they do that in Forza, which is something they should do here.
 
Think they do that in Forza, which is something they should do here.

They probably do, it's the case in most games and was the case in Gran Turismo before they changed it to the exploitable system in this version.
 
I don’t see the big fuss, learn the track limits (Suzuka for example, different shades of green inside the kerbstones define the edge) and drive within them.

I find the penalties for cutting consistent - I tend to know if I’ve got a penalty before it pops up and each track had its own “tell” as to where you can go.
 
I agree but only in the race, in qualifying going off track should invalidate the lap and the next one too if in the final sector, just to prevent any corner cutting cheaters.
If you gain an advantage yes, but when you i.e. run wide on the exit of Galgenkopf you‘re already punished enough by not getting full speed on the Döttinger Höhe. If the game then invalidated the whole lap you threw away +5 minutes for nothing...
 
The penalties that bug me are the ones that don't make sense or the ones that peanlise you for going off as a result of bad driving.

I've repeatedly got penalties as a result of understeer or a bad line on the exit of T6 at Suzuka East barely touching the grass with 1-2 wheels. The issue here is that unlike most corner cut penalties that appear a second or two later, the game seems to issue the penalty for this one instantly, thinking I'm going straight and cut the left hander and doesn't allow me to finish the correction.

Most of the time these silly penalties hurt more as you've already lost time by going off in the first place (same as the wall hit penalties).
 
Another thing that annoys me is where you run wide at a corner (and therefore lose time) and then get slapped with a penalty on top of the time you just lost...

This, or even when you try to avoid somebody who just respawned on track (i never drive through ghosted cars)
 
how is "More than 2 wheels off track (defined by the tracks white lines AND curbing" winning this pole? That's not right... At least not in real life racing...
Because it's the GTP standard for online racing and leagues. If you look there, it's a clearly defined set of rules that is also used as a standard by many of the racing leagues posted here. Because of that, it's easy to share common ground by implementing these track limits that are similar to GTP's standard
 
Because it's the GTP standard for online racing and leagues. If you look there, it's a clearly defined set of rules that is also used as a standard by many of the racing leagues posted here. Because of that, it's easy to share common ground by implementing these track limits that are similar to GTP's standard

I also find the terminology a bit confusing, hence why in my original post I referred to it as 'all 4 wheels' off the circuit, it's more clear cut then. If you still have 2 wheels within the track boundaries (defined by the white line) then, in my opinion, you are not off track.
 
how is "More than 2 wheels off track (defined by the tracks white lines AND curbing" winning this pole? That's not right... At least not in real life racing...

Whilst I agree, the gripe is against the inconsistent ruling. If every circuit went by this rule then we all know where we stand and we're not having to figure out invisible/non-defined boundaries. My vote was the top one which is losing badly, and it more in-tune with GT racing rules.
 
There should be some exceptions (main one that springs to mind is sector one at Nurburgring GP) that should be clearly identified in some way so everyone is aware.

What do you mean?

That it should be ok to go way out of the boundary on the first left hander like some do?
 
What do you mean?

That it should be ok to go way out of the boundary on the first left hander like some do?

Personally I don't run too wide on that left hander, maybe occasionally over the green astro turf, but as long as it is pre-defined where the boundary exceptions are made, it makes it consistent for everyone. The main corner in Nurburgring GP sector 1 I had in mind is the right hander where everyone runs wide over the run-off on the exit, the corner before the split point.

Or all ambiguity could be removed by not having these great big tarmac run off areas, and go back to grass / gravel traps on corner exits, but that's down to circuit design and not penalty management. However that's going away from this thread's point :)
 
What do you mean?

That it should be ok to go way out of the boundary on the first left hander like some do?

That corner is just dumb at the moment, if you go slightly out there is a good chance you'll get a penalty but you can go way out without a penalty just fine, as if you drove around the penalty zone. :lol:

But we all know PD aren't going to change things anyway, so we'll just have to drive these stupid lines to stay competitive and explore where you can legally drive off track and where you can't and where it gains you time and where it doesn't. :indiff:
 
I do think it should be ok to leave the track if there is absolutely no clear advantage gained.

me too, but i think it's ok that the limits are sometimes conservative because people will always find novel and exciting ways to abuse whatever track limits there are
 
That corner is just dumb at the moment, if you go slightly out there is a good chance you'll get a penalty but you can go way out without a penalty just fine, as if you drove around the penalty zone. :lol:

But we all know PD aren't going to change things anyway, so we'll just have to drive these stupid lines to stay competitive and explore where you can legally drive off track and where you can't and where it gains you time and where it doesn't. :indiff:
Trial and error is a very important process in racing
 
I'm surprised this is winning...
More than 2 wheels off track (defined by the tracks white lines AND curbing)
Talk about blow through the chicanes...
 
Perhaps the boundaries and penalties assessed are consistent to real-world versus fantasy tracks? It seems the developers maintained the boundaries used in real world as boundaries in game. It also seems the fantasy tracks are more leniant, maybe because they at one point served an arcade function in the game and might again in future installments?

I have not noticed any inconsistency in enforcement when considering corner on an individual level. Real world tracks seem to have different but similar approaches; Lines = track boundary. The 'Ring seems to have easier penalty serving capability than Monza. But then again, the penalty serving looks dependant on your pace so slower paced drivers may find it easier to serve penalties than faster drivers.
 
I’d love to see some track limits info as a loading screen or part of the circuit experience. Make that more circuit training. In addition to some of the great ideas here I think Assetto Corsa is a good model for how to penalize track limit abuse.

Edit - forgot to add I’d like to see the limits as an option to set across the whole game, Campaign, Time trial, wherever.
 
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