demo physics discussion

  • Thread starter BLACK86
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please let us know what you think of the physics for gt5 demo.

havent played it much myself but from what i have i think the physics are more less forgiving than gt5p's

also even tho the tc is set to 7 it doesnt feel like it is, like with gt5p setting the tc to 7 you definitely know about it, but in this demo you can hardly tell, mind you ive only had two laps on it
 
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I think the physics are much improved, and I'm not just saying that.

Here's why: The bane of GT5P's physics engine, is that at low speeds the oversteer model goes weird, to the point it barely works. It's quite apparent, that the likes of doughnuts weren't possible.

If you tried to do a 180 turn in a RWD car from a stand still in GT5P, you got understeer, this isn't realistic. You should get oversteer, this is what you get in the demo.

There are other notable physics changes to the game, but I will leave them to other people to call out. For me, the improvement of low speed physics is a huge step in the right direction.
 
RWD cars now oversteer a lot more and underster less so i think its much more realistic,
 
Here's why: The bane of GT5P's physics engine, is that at low speeds the oversteer model goes weird, to the point it barely works. It's quite apparent, that the likes of doughnuts weren't possible.

The car is very twitchy, and I think that can be related to the very quick steering ratio and the quickness from lock to lock, and the R1s, as well as e braking into a corner at high speeds the car wants to squirm around instead of holding the angle. But Donuts in RWD cars still aren't possible (the same as GT5P) where you get kind of a wide circle then it cuts in close. But in GT5P, with AWD you could spin for days, I'm not sure if it would be the same with GT5D but I would imagine so. I can't test the power brake burnouts, since the brakes are affecting the rear too much to tell if it turns the opposite way the wheels are turning during a power brake
 
I also do like them better than the GT5 Prologue ones...

It doesnt matter to me if they call them Pro, Standard, Arcade, Superreal or anything else. For me it is important that they feel right.

And the demo`s physics in my opinion feel more right than the older ones.

Another thing I have noticed is that NOW I am able to correct oversteering (with my sixaxis that is) whereas in Prologue this was almost impossible.

And BTW... I think because of the "better feel" I enjoy driving a GT game again.

(FYI: I am one of the few players who enjoyed driving GT4 more than prologue because of their physics...)

Ahh.. another thing: The above (feel right thing) only applies to the "R" tyres. I still think there is something wrong with the "N" tyres because they still lack grip.. (Driving on icecream...)
 
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I never played around with ABS off in prologue, but I'm convinced that the demo has ABS off, because you can feel the car lock up (tyre squeal, car squirms) if you slam on the brakes fully. Then as you release the pedal you can feel the car regain traction. Threshold braking is very much needed.

Is this standard behaviour from prologue or have they changed things? Makes me want to go play around with ABS off in Prologue now....
 
Another thing I have noticed is that NOW I am able to correct oversteering (with my sixaxis that is) whereas in Prologue this was almost impossible.

I feel it's far TOO easy to correct oversteer in GT5D, GT5P was fine, and I know I could lose it, however now in GT5D if I'm losing it I can correct it, if I can't, I know I've really lost it.

Is this standard behaviour from prologue or have they changed things? Makes me want to go play around with ABS off in Prologue now....

If you played with ABS off in either, YOU'D KNOW. There is NO turning while braking, and you go straight. It's horrific
 
It is a lot easier to control drifting using the pad in the demo than GT5P. Almost too eas i'd say. It's almost like the game decides how much countersteer you want when you push the stick
 
It is a lot easier to control drifting using the pad in the demo than GT5P. Almost too eas i'd say. It's almost like the game decides how much countersteer you want when you push the stick

This is the way PD now implemented something that gives you FEEDBACK.

And FEEDBACK is the most important thing when it comes to computer simulated (racing) games.
 
I swear I'm playing something else, or on a different planet from you guys. This Time Trial is way harder to control drifting than it is with GT5P. The tuned 370Z jolts one way to another and the stock 370Z looses all power when you try and drift...because of Traction Control.

I actually prefer Prologues physics overall at the moment. Maybe I just need to get used to it more (45th overall in the rankings for the UK...@ 7:30pm) but in Prologue I tried the 350Z last night and it was a dream to use compared to this.
 
I swear I'm playing something else, or on a different planet from you guys. This Time Trial is way harder to control drifting than it is with GT5P. The tuned 370Z jolts one way to another and the stock 370Z looses all power when you try and drift...because of Traction Control.

I actually prefer Prologues physics overall at the moment. Maybe I just need to get used to it more (45th overall in the rankings for the UK...@ 7:30pm) but in Prologue I tried the 350Z last night and it was a dream to use compared to this.

Turn Traction Control off.

It feels amazing, much improved from Prologue, maybe they'll update Prologues physics?
 
Ive never been more pissed off in my life. The whole game is like driving on ice. I hate it!!!! Even with R1's its absolutely horrible.
 
I also do like them better than the GT5 Prologue ones...

It doesnt matter to me if they call them Pro, Standard, Arcade, Superreal or anything else. For me it is important that they feel right.

And the demo`s physics in my opinion feel more right than the older ones.

Another thing I have noticed is that NOW I am able to correct oversteering (with my sixaxis that is) whereas in Prologue this was almost impossible.

And BTW... I think because of the "better feel" I enjoy driving a GT game again.

(FYI: I am one of the few players who enjoyed driving GT4 more than prologue because of their physics...)

Ahh.. another thing: The above (feel right thing) only applies to the "R" tyres. I still think there is something wrong with the "N" tyres because they still lack grip.. (Driving on icecream...)

Well said 👍 although I think the Ns would probably feel right too, if we only were able to turn the stupid TC off. I don't get why they put it on 7?! :odd:
 
The physics are clearly changed. It appears that there is a much greater focus on 2 main areas:

1. Weight transfer and corner loading.
2. Surface contact of tires / traction.

In GT5:P it felt that the weight would only really transfer front to rear, in GT5:TT it feels as if each corner is treated separate and there is a more dramatic effect on the handling.

Surfaces and the contact with the tires also seems to have been adjusted. Tarmac has consistent grip, grass is very slippery, gravel bogs the car down. Try spinning through the grass and ending up in the gravel you'll be able to see how the surfaces have drastically different impacts on the movement of the car (I didn't try... it just happened :) ).

Those 2 areas combined are probably why some are saying that they are having a hard time coming to grips with the handling or complaining about the twitchy-ness of the cars.
 
:bowdown:370Z on N3

You can feel weight transfer and it is hard to drive but fun. Oversteer is more present than in GT5P and watch where you wheels are when you're turning because the grass can make you spin out easily, which is a good thing.. The tuned one is great to drive but I get more pleasure out of the stock 370Z.
Stop teasing us PD I want this game more than before I got a taste of the GT5 Time Trial Demo.:sly:

Overall, I'm very satisfied with this demo and I can't wait to play it with a G27. (7 days left :D)
 
It is a lot easier to control drifting using the pad in the demo than GT5P. Almost too eas i'd say. It's almost like the game decides how much countersteer you want when you push the stick

I think it's easier because the stick/pad are more sensitive now.. so when you tap the stick to counter the oversteer you'll put more of an effect on it. Before you'd have to move the stick a lot more than you do now.
 
you guys are noticing how easy it is to countersteer for a few reasons. First and foremost the tuned 370 is tuned incredably well, making it very predictable and balanced handling, secondly the tires are r1 so they are quite responsive, thirdly the physics seem more natural and familiar (maybe from driving my FC). I am loving the new physics, it is rediculously fun to drift :)
 
There's either too much understeer or oversteer, and nothing in between. It feels like the stock 370Z never has any grip (probably because of the N1 tires), which is fine for drifting, but terrible for everything else. I definitely need to get used to it, and I know I would probably enjoy it more if I had a wheel. But right now I'm not having any fun, just pure frustration. Guess I'm in the minority here.
 
After whole afternoon with both cars without be able to do even one single piece of drift with my G25, I just came to conclusion that they gone mad with physics. It's like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. Calm driving physics has now good feel and even that low speed switch to "sled" physics is gone. But this completely ends with the moment you go over limit, namely into first oversteer. There is no thing you can do which can hold the drift or return it to normal state. It's just over then. Even if you completely release the gas pedal or fully countersteer, rear wheels are on ice now and you can just make bye to your rear end.

They already made step into right direction with GT5P Spec III Professional physics and if they solved that low speed "sled" problem which perceived from GT4, that physics would be perfect for me. It had its inertia feel, understeer and oversteer exactly in situations according to real life driving and car were perfectly controllable, yet you could do whatever you could do with real car, really.

And now this? OMG, If the full game is anything like this, then NO, THANKS.

There are things that are better, but this little progress is dear-bought for many really bad things.

Even graphics are worse. The actual HDR lightning showed its weakness and looks especially horrible with this Indianopolis track. There are almost no 3D objects on this track, tribunes are from 2D constructions, there are maybe seven trees on the track and all of them are crossed cardboards with pixels instead of leaves, OMG! Nothing, really nothing looks real except two Nissans, that glass building next to start and the numbered tower with rusty sediments underneath. Everything else looks like aged hardcore PC sim from 90's.

PD lost themselves somewhere between their own uncertainty and lack of solid goals, content megalomania, forum fan cryings and unability to set the team from real specialists and get rid of those old friends with mind frozen in times of GT1. They try to do everything and nothing well. They fail in one department after another. It was obvious with car sounds and AI, now they are in the end even with physics and graphics. One and only thing better than competition now are car models. And that's really sad.

I feel in my bones that without any new blood and thinking, that whole big GT5 game will turn into universal fiasco. I have really fear of it now, guys. My poor GT...
 
I have trouble countersteering in GT5P as well as in the demo...
Could someone please help me with some pointers?

In a regular road car in real life I have no trouble countersteering, bear in mind that I'm not going in excess of 40-50 km/h when doing the "drifting". In GT even when driving along at these speeds I seldom manage to countersteer unless it's a real small drift.

The problem is that I don't "feel" the car oversteering in GT. I have a DFGT and I have tried to fiddle around with the FFB and stuff, but nothing seems to help.

Would you recommend to snap the wheel to the side or gently steer it? I realize that different methods should be used at different times, but in real life you always "feel" what's right!

Any help would be much appreciated!
 
After whole afternoon with both cars without be able to do even one single piece of drift with my G25, I just came to conclusion that they gone mad with physics. It's like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. Calm driving physics has now good feel and even that low speed switch to "sled" physics is gone. But this completely ends with the moment you go over limit, namely into first oversteer. There is no thing you can do which can hold the drift or return it to normal state. It's just over then. Even if you completely release the gas pedal or fully countersteer, rear wheels are on ice now and you can just make bye to your rear end.

They already made step into right direction with GT5P Spec III Professional physics and if they solved that low speed "sled" problem which perceived from GT4, that physics would be perfect for me. It had its inertia feel, understeer and oversteer exactly in situations according to real life driving and car were perfectly controllable, yet you could do whatever you could do with real car, really.

And now this? OMG, If the full game is anything like this, then NO, THANKS.

There are things that are better, but this little progress is dear-bought for many really bad things.

Even graphics are worse. The actual HDR lightning showed its weakness and looks especially horrible with this Indianopolis track. There are almost no 3D objects on this track, tribunes are from 2D constructions, there are maybe seven trees on the track and all of them are crossed cardboards with pixels instead of leaves, OMG! Nothing, really nothing looks real except two Nissans, that glass building next to start and the numbered tower with rusty sediments underneath. Everything else looks like aged hardcore PC sim from 90's.

PD lost themselves somewhere between their own uncertainty and lack of solid goals, content megalomania, forum fan cryings and unability to set the team from real specialists and get rid of those old friends with mind frozen in times of GT1. They try to do everything and nothing well. They fail in one department after another. It was obvious with car sounds and AI, now they are in the end even with physics and graphics. One and only thing better than competition now are car models. And that's really sad.

I feel in my bones that without any new blood and thinking, that whole big GT5 game will turn into universal fiasco. I have really fear of it now, guys. My poor GT...




The demo is to find a race car driver not a drifter. So I am not surprised you can't drift, the car is not set up for it. So you are giving up on GT?
 
After whole afternoon with both cars without be able to do even one single piece of drift with my G25, I just came to conclusion that they gone mad with physics. It's like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. Calm driving physics has now good feel and even that low speed switch to "sled" physics is gone. But this completely ends with the moment you go over limit, namely into first oversteer. There is no thing you can do which can hold the drift or return it to normal state. It's just over then. Even if you completely release the gas pedal or fully countersteer, rear wheels are on ice now and you can just make bye to your rear end.

They already made step into right direction with GT5P Spec III Professional physics and if they solved that low speed "sled" problem which perceived from GT4, that physics would be perfect for me. It had its inertia feel, understeer and oversteer exactly in situations according to real life driving and car were perfectly controllable, yet you could do whatever you could do with real car, really.

And now this? OMG, If the full game is anything like this, then NO, THANKS.

There are things that are better, but this little progress is dear-bought for many really bad things.

Even graphics are worse. The actual HDR lightning showed its weakness and looks especially horrible with this Indianopolis track. There are almost no 3D objects on this track, tribunes are from 2D constructions, there are maybe seven trees on the track and all of them are crossed cardboards with pixels instead of leaves, OMG! Nothing, really nothing looks real except two Nissans, that glass building next to start and the numbered tower with rusty sediments underneath. Everything else looks like aged hardcore PC sim from 90's.

PD lost themselves somewhere between their own uncertainty and lack of solid goals, content megalomania, forum fan cryings and unability to set the team from real specialists and get rid of those old friends with mind frozen in times of GT1. They try to do everything and nothing well. They fail in one department after another. It was obvious with car sounds and AI, now they are in the end even with physics and graphics. One and only thing better than competition now are car models. And that's really sad.

I feel in my bones that without any new blood and thinking, that whole big GT5 game will turn into universal fiasco. I have really fear of it now, guys. My poor GT...

So many things wrong with this post I don't even feel like splitting it up to argue with you. So I'll just ignore it.

Edit:
The demo is to find a race car driver not a drifter. So I am not surprised you can't drift, the car is not set up for it. So you are giving up on GT?

There's your answer.
 
Hey guys, I haven't played the demo yet, unfortunate for us here in the states, but I have been reading a lot of complaints about the stock Z physics. I remember reading an article on the 370Z in evo magazine and this is what they said:

"The trouble is that in the dry it’s not a terribly playful companion. When the roads are warm and tacky the 370 feels just a bit uptight and uneasy with itself, not helped by suspension that has slightly too much rebound in the damping. Grip at the rear is tenacious and, unlike the old 350, which used to almost lugubriously roll into oversteer, the new car needs a brutal stab of the throttle at high revs to get the tail to unstick. When it does break free from the Bridgestones’ hold it’s a bit of a scratch card as to what will happen. Sometimes the limited-slip diff stays locked for long enough to get the tail to a decent angle and hold it, other times it locks then starts slipping almost immediately, meaning a spinning inside rear wheel, a noisily revving V6 and no oversteer, which isn’t very satisfying."

From what I have been reading, most people have been complaining about how easy it is to spin the car around. Can it honestly be that they are driving that recklessly? Because from this article in evo, you really need to force this car to oversteer. If someone can elaborate please do. Till then I will patiently wait until the U.S. gets the update and I can try for myself.
 
I actually find it alot easier to control power oversteer in the demo, I can feel the rear tyres start to go much sooner than I can in Prologue, not that they let go sooner, just I get more warning they are about to let go.

I actually saved a big tank slapper which I would never have saved in a million years in Prologue, quite chuffed with myself !

But it does take a bit of getting used to, make no mistake about that, like I said in another post, for my first hour or so I couldn't get out of the 6000-5000 rank, just switched it off there now and am currently 45th in the U.K.

Just keep at it, thats my opinion anyway, I like what they have done with the physics.
 
The demo is to find a race car driver not a drifter. So I am not surprised you can't drift, the car is not set up for it. So you are giving up on GT?

I am not any fanatic fan of drifting, but this physics is really bad in whole oversteer department. Not bad, ugly and impossible. You should be able to do the same things like in real life. But you aren't.
 
Ive never been more pissed off in my life. The whole game is like driving on ice. I hate it!!!! Even with R1's its absolutely horrible.

Really? I can push the limits of the R1s and feel the insane amount of grip, almost like traction control was turned on to like .25 or .5. I just wish the TC was off for the Stock 370 to utilize the N3s

After whole afternoon with both cars without be able to do even one single piece of drift with my G25, I just came to conclusion that they gone mad with physics. It's like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. Calm driving physics has now good feel and even that low speed switch to "sled" physics is gone. But this completely ends with the moment you go over limit, namely into first oversteer. There is no thing you can do which can hold the drift or return it to normal state. It's just over then. Even if you completely release the gas pedal or fully countersteer, rear wheels are on ice now and you can just make bye to your rear end.

They already made step into right direction with GT5P Spec III Professional physics and if they solved that low speed "sled" problem which perceived from GT4, that physics would be perfect for me. It had its inertia feel, understeer and oversteer exactly in situations according to real life driving and car were perfectly controllable, yet you could do whatever you could do with real car, really.

From the sound of it you're going to be miserable. The physics are rgeat, but getting the car to slide is quite easy. YES the car isn't setup for it, but you can slide the tuned 370, I haven't tried to slide the stock 370 yet because of the traction control issue, but I know that's going to be even more fun.

I'm not sure if you're talking about ice on the N3s but the tuned 370 is planted. Counter steering though it almost telepathy and easy to catch or control a slide, too easy honestly.
 
I am not any fanatic fan of drifting, but this physics is really bad in whole oversteer department. Not bad, ugly and impossible. You should be able to do the same things like in real life. But you aren't.

What reality are you living in?

Because in the one I am currently in this demo feels, looks and is, AMAZING.
To be honest, I didn't even notice there were any trees around the track, I was too busy concentrating on getting a decent lap time!

Maybe thats the problem alot of people who aren't happy with the physics are having? Spending too much time looking at trees and ****?

How anyone can say this is worse than prologue is beyond me, well no, it isn't actually, let me guess, the complaints are coming from the people who are bottom of the leaderboards?

This traction control thingy must be just for the controllers?
 
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