Does a bunch of races justify being called a career?

[stb155]

And I disagree that times are only comparable if people use the same setup. It would be a better tell of the driver skill with that setup if they are all the same but that is all, some of us may like a loose car and drive it very well where others like a thighter car and do better with that. The freedom to set the car the way you want it is a good thing.

Thats true, i meant not "normal setups" but exploiting bugs/glitches in the setup and get unrealistic good results from them. (Setting maximum front ride hight and min rear to get less understeer, or 0 camber=max grip and such things)

People that don't go in forums or find those by accident have little chance to become "top of the board"

 

[tazz6969]

To give us part timers or amateurs a chance to go up the leaderboard, then any car used in timetrial should not able to change the setups. Simple as that

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

If the game part of Gran Turismo was fine no one would be upset right now.

Why have 1200 cars when you could probably complete GT6 career using only 1/32 of the list?

Why even have a Pit stop when we only run 3 lap races(Only in National A right now so don't know if it increases)?

Why even have the cars on the tracks if A.I is so dumb to the point that everyone has been saying they slow down to let you pass etc etc?

Those are just few of the things that leave me scratching my head and I'm sure many others too.

There are use of pit stops in S and online though in Online they do not work properly yet, needs to be fixed.

The point is that offline is so 1990s, I think the folks at PD realize that the focus needs to go on shorter offline and more indepth online. If they were to focus on the offline style of 20 years ago they would surely not do well in the sales department. No matter how good your AI is they are still just a scripted engine that is predictable and once you learn how they drive you can beat them every time. Humans adapt, they improve, they cheat, they do whatever it takes and the races are always different. Racing games need the online component more than most and they need leaderboards more than any other type of game.

I would not touch COD with a 10 foot pole but that has nothing to do with being able to race online with my friends being more fun than racing offline by myself or being able to post and compare lap times with friends and others.

As I said an event creator would be a great addition to the offline game as well as the online game, just throwing more and longer events in would not be the answer. Throwing in a calendar mode would do more harm than good.

To give us part timers or amateurs a chance to go up the leaderboard, then any car used in timetrial should not able to change the setups. Simple as that

And what about those of us that like to tune? Cars always do better with a proper setup. Why not have both stock and tuned? If only one could be done then it should be tuned cars allowed and those who do not want to invest enough time to getting the right set up will just have to understand that they will not be climbing to the top, though they would not get there even in stock cars without putting in the time anyway so it should be a non factor

 

[stb155]

Online track days and track weekends, I think could be fun.

e.g. Brands Hatch, max 400pp category and max 600pp category. Only available for the week or weekend. 4 different variations (dry and day, wet and day, night and dry, night and wet). Then same category racing available for the last day of the weekend or last day of the week. With points scoring for each position, maximum 8 races aloud, with the tally added up at the end, that then is included in a final leaderboard.

Then a different set of circumstances for the following week.

As part of career ?

I would not like that.
I explained before, replacing a few AI's with online friends* and do a "co-op" career race would be good, but it must be also possible to do it offline only against AI.

*maybe also random player if there is a good matching system, but i doubt that will work.
Not enough people will do the same race a the same time.

Edit:
When i think about it again maybe not so bad idea, as long as it is only 1-2 events at a time.
It would defeat the "not enough player do the same race" problem.
But it also would require a good matching system !

 

[Zuku]

There are use of pit stops in S and online though in Online they do not work properly yet, needs to be fixed.

The point is that offline is so 1990s, I think the folks at PD realize that the focus needs to go on shorter offline and more indepth online. If they were to focus on the offline style of 20 years ago they would surely not do well in the sales department. No matter how good your AI is they are still just a scripted engine that is predictable and once you learn how they drive you can beat them every time. Humans adapt, they improve, they cheat, they do whatever it takes and the races are always different. Racing games need the online component more than most and they need leaderboards more than any other type of game.

I would not touch COD with a 10 foot pole but that has nothing to do with being able to race online with my friends being more fun than racing offline by myself or being able to post and compare lap times with friends and others.

As I said an event creator would be a great addition to the offline game as well as the online game, just throwing more and longer events in would not be the answer. Throwing in a calendar mode would do more harm than good.


And what about those of us that like to tune? Cars always do better with a proper setup. Why not have both stock and tuned? If only one could be done then it should be tuned cars allowed and those who do not want to invest enough time to getting the right set up will just have to understand that they will not be climbing to the top, though they would not get there even in stock cars without putting in the time anyway so it should be a non factor

So 1990's really then so tell me why F1 2012 is able to do this so well, but GT can't? Heck F1 pretty much floors GT in about every category at this point, but Cars and Tracks(Number of though only).

My COD comments wasn't about it being any good or anything like that just saying in Call of Duty whatever game they make they can get by without having a Single Player Campaign because it's not needed anymore along with the fact most people hate COD anyways, but it also isn't their bread and butter.

As for the A.I explain that to folks that have played some PC racing games or even other Console racer. I think GT is the only racing game I could really remember that had Extremely Repetitive Dumb A.I/Chase the Rabbit.

I told you my experience so far with F1 2012 all on easy is that it's harder than GT ever tried to be on EASY! Yes that means any assists you can think of on.

Plus the way the career mode is set up I feel like I'm a driver for them in Gran Turismo feels like at least now playing a Hot Wheels play set. It's so bad I did the new seasonal on the Ascari Track I wanted to braf as that track feels FLAT! Yes! FLAT!

 

[tazz6969]

Maybe it would work offline as well, just a thought. Except for the last day of a 'track weekend' could involve 3 different types of races, in different weather conditions. maybe 3, 6 and 15 laps races. Once the weekend is over, then another weekend becomes available after about a dozen normal a-spec career races. Order of weekends could be: Bathurst, Suzuka, Indianapolis, Spa, Monza, Brands Hatch, Monte Carlo, Silverstone, Willow Spring, Nurburgring

 

[stb155]

Online track days and track weekends, I think could be fun.

e.g. Brands Hatch, max 400pp category and max 600pp category. Only available for the week or weekend. 4 different variations (dry and day, wet and day, night and dry, night and wet). Then same category racing available for the last day of the weekend or last day of the week. With points scoring for each position, maximum 8 races aloud, with the tally added up at the end, that then is included in a final leaderboard.

Then a different set of circumstances for the following week.

That could really be a good thing, and a "tutorial" for real online races if they do it right.

After you join the weekend you can do training offline, then a offline qualifying and depending on what settings you used and what time you did the game puts you in the actual online race with opponents that used same settings/did equal laptime.

That would also be a good way to meet new people with equal skills also.

 

[stb155]

So 1990's really then so tell me why F1 2012 is able to do this so well, but GT can't? Heck F1 pretty much floors GT in about every category at this point, but Cars and Tracks(Number of though only).

My COD comments wasn't about it being any good or anything like that just saying in Call of Duty whatever game they make they can get by without having a Single Player Campaign because it's not needed anymore along with the fact most people hate COD anyways, but it also isn't their bread and butter.

As for the A.I explain that to folks that have played some PC racing games or even other Console racer. I think GT is the only racing game I could really remember that had Extremely Repetitive Dumb A.I/Chase the Rabbit.

I told you my experience so far with F1 2012 all on easy is that it's harder than GT ever tried to be on EASY! Yes that means any assists you can think of on.

Plus the way the career mode is set up I feel like I'm a driver for them in Gran Turismo feels like at least now playing a Hot Wheels play set. It's so bad I did the new seasonal on the Ascari Track I wanted to braf as that track feels FLAT! Yes! FLAT!

I also think this way, it can be very challenging to race against AI.
And it's the only way for a quick race in between, going online , looking for a decent room or setting one up and wait for decent opponents takes way to much time.
And there is no guarantee that the real opponents you get are any better than AI too...

I even say that the AI in GT is/was not that awful as many people say.
It is only the combination of short race, start last, huge spread in opponent speed that makes all career races so awful.
(And the slowdown is the most stupid thing i ever saw)

 

[Zuku]

I also think this way, it can be very challenging to race against AI.
And it's the only way for a quick race in between, going online , looking for a decent room or setting one up and wait for decent opponents takes way to much time.
And there is no guarantee that the real opponents you get are any better than AI too...

I even say that the AI in GT is/was not that awful as many people say.
It is only the combination of short race, start last, huge spread in opponent speed that makes all career races so awful.
(And the slowdown is the most stupid thing i ever saw)

That's pretty much one downfall with online if you're racing me I'm not going to be ashamed to say I'll like to keep most of the stuff ABS, SRF, and etc turned on instead of off.

If I do ever get the guts to race someone that wants all that turned off I look like a complete fool out there I did that just a few days ago. Just slipping and sliding all over the track.

Only problem is too if I want to race against real people not those that act just as dumb as A.I well I almost have no where to go for the most part.

 

[stb155]

That's pretty much one downfall with online if you're racing me I'm not going to be ashamed to say I'll like to keep most of the stuff ABS, SRF, and etc turned on instead of off.

If I do ever get the guts to race someone that wants all that turned off I look like a complete fool out there I did that just a few days ago. Just slipping and sliding all over the track.

Only problem is too if I want to race against real people not those that act just as dumb as A.I well I almost have no where to go for the most part.

It's possible to filter online races by SRF on/off (pretty much the only useful filter) so that should not be the issue.

But this is exactly what i mean, online is a pain because there is no matching and no proper filters.

I bet there are so many people playing online that it should be no problem to find players with equal interest and skill.
But there needs to be a preselection of whom gets on which server.

Things like ABS and tires are bad, someone who usually drives all cars with race softs and ABS1 will not be happy in a room limited to ABS0 and sport hard. Same for damage and realistic grip.

 

[Tenacious D]

So, about that post. Could be big.

To start with, what I really want are two sides to Gran Turismo. GT Mode, and Simulation Mode. GT Mode would be that sandboxy thing we're all used to, where there is a basic progression in "GT Life" from easy races in low powered cars, all the way up to league style racing in pure racing or Rally machines. And every race is for prize cash and cars as always. With Arcade Mode there to give you a quick race, time trial or drift challenge with a large number of available cars. Throw in an Event Maker useful both off- as well as online, allowing you to create your own events, series and championships, and share them with others, along with courses you make or take from others in the Course Maker.

Now for the fun side, Simulation Mode. On this side, you pick one car and then deal with the three basic sections, doing events in it to their completion. There are no cash or car prizes, only trophies.

Championship: a series of events based on championships in both GT Life and the other Sim Mode sections. Also, create your own in Event Maker. Pick a car suitable from a list our your GT Life garage, and do a series of races for points to accumulate for winning of the championship. Each track has its own time of day and weather conditions.

Season: this is a full racing season in a league of your choice, with its own special events and a calendar to follow, though the calendar is purely for you to sense the progression through the racing season. Select a car from a list or one from your garage, apply a livery, pick a racing number, and off you go. Car damage can be repaired, but if you total your car, it will have to be replaced for at least one event.

GT Academy/Career Mode: this is my dream game.

This mode tracks a more realistic path than GT Mode, from the beginning steps of a race car driver to the professional leagues of your choice, rather like Nissan's GT Academy. The point here isn't to grind races for prize money and cars, but to live out the dream of a Lucas Ordonez by migrating up the foodchain of low to pro level racing leagues. You'll have one car per league, perhaps two, but this is serious racing now, for points, cash, sponsors, and the right to enter the racing league of your choice.

Each level is a "racing season," each one longer and more challenging, in which you try to win the Championship. If you chose, rather than progress, you may stay within your current level and try to better your performance. Moving to the higher levels puts you in more powerful race cars, until you win the rights to enter the pro racing league of your choice.

Beginning

• Start in Kart racing for a brief season of a certain number of races, say six to eight. Based on your standings at the end of the "season," you are awarded a credit prize to purchase a sports car, new or used. Used cars will be cheaper, but can include modifications, though will also be worn down to one extent or other.
• License Test. Meet the qualifications to enter the enthusiast league like America's SCCA.
• Enter races (possible entry fee). Use prize money won to upgrade and maintain the car. Courses are rather simple, bots are competitive but beatable with a reasonable effort. Good performance attracts sponsors, better sponsors pay more, and provide support. Paint/livery optional, but decals will be mandatory at this point.
• The "Bush" League at this level is loose with regulations, but there are certain rules, and care must be taken or you can be disqualified. You must complete a certain number of races and garner points for the championship in order to progress to the next level.
• If you so choose, you may do as many stints in this level of racing, winning as many championships as you want.

Semi-Pro Class (SCCA)

• License Test and qualify.
• Buy a race car appropriate to the class of racing you choose. Select a livery and apply decals, your name, national flag, racing plate and your number.
• Classes run from a scale like Forza's E through B. E Class will be like the Miata Cup, B Class will be Vipers, Corvettes and Ferraris. In-between will be hot-hatches such as the VW GTI or Honda Civic, sports sedans such as the WRX, sports cars such as the Supra and Mustang, higher performance sedans such as BMW and Mercedes, and so on. You'll have to meet the class restrictions for your car.
• Coming from the beginner league, the most likely range you'll be able to afford will be in the E or D Class, but if you did well, B Class can be yours. D Class will offer higher rewards but be more challenging, and require more expense to maintain, C and B Class even more so. You'll have a mechanic and crew, possibly with the option to spend some of your own money to hire a better group. This option would give you better pit performance and slightly cheaper maintenance cost. Better performance means the interest of a few more and more supportive sponsors.
• The different classes of racing will have their own level of challenge from both the bots and the cars. The "season" of E, D, C and B Class will be the same, and the tracks the same, but this one will be a little longer. You'll have to hone your skills well and stay sharp to progress to A and X Class and run with the big dogs. But once again, you can choose to remain at this level for as many championships as you want.

Professional Class (SCCA)

• Once again, License Test and qualify.
• The cars in A and X Class racing are serious racing machines and will cost a lot more. You know the drill by now, race well, collect points through good finishes or victories, and be successful if you want to keep your sponsors happy, and win the championship. There is a much longer series of races this time, but the prizes are much larger, and your sponsorships more valuable. This is hard work but very rewarding, and you could choose to remain here and live out the rest of your racing career if you so desire, winning championships till you decide to quit or retire. But by now, you're primed and ready for the serious professional leagues of the world.

Professional Racing Leagues

• Yep, License Test and qualify. Normally, you would first choose a league, but if you want to, you can test for as many as you like. Choose from WRC, BTCC, E/WTCC, FIA GT, ALMS, Super GT, DTM, Formula GT, whatever GT6 provides.
• Do the racing. This is for a real season now, and runs through many months. At the end of it, if you do well (or choose), you can opt to migrate to another league, after an appropriate license test, unless you already passed the test earlier. Or you can continue in this league if it suits you for as many seasons as you want, racking up a case full of trophies.

Something boiled down from this could be in GT6, as a GT Academy series, which sort of culls the best of GT6's Career events, in a sensible progression of course, along with properly coded bots which behave more like the polite but more competitive bots in PC sims. There is room on the GT6 menu for all kinds of event entry points like this, as it can span as far down and across as they want.

I think that would make a lot of people happy. It would make me ecstatic.

 

[Tornado]

As for the VIP and car pack related this was very much targeted to get players to spend more money as you could not race in them unless you paid for the VIP membership and/or bought each car pack.

Why would they allow people access to events for DLC they didn't buy? Online events I can see the argument for allowing regular players access to DLC, especially after how poorly PD handled track DLC with GT5; but why is giving you something to do with the DLC you purchased now some sort of fleece attempt to get you to buy it?

The point is that offline is so 1990s, I think the folks at PD realize that the focus needs to go on shorter offline and more indepth online.

This is such a pretentious comment; one that isn't at all supported by what PD have actually brought to the table since GT4. GT5's (and to a lesser extent, GT6's) offline mode's sole problem wasn't lack of events. It was lack of care. Random cars at random tracks masquerading as being some sort of theme no matter how unsuitable they came together; with certain tracks and many cars outright ignored by the game itself. So where's anything to show that it is a result of them putting more effort into the online mode? Promised online functionality in GT5 never actually made it into the game (not to mention how long it took for them to restore pretty major features that Prologue had), and some actually huge improvements to racing games as a whole that were promised for GT6 still haven't made the jump to actually being in this game either.


Coupled with the fact that towards the end of GT5's run with the hacking it became patently obvious how easy it was to make quality races offline because the ability to do it was always there but simply hidden from the player, and all PD's PS3 run has shown are regressions from the classic offline GT formula present in the first 4 games; ones that stick out all the more because of how much more potential PD had with GT5 and GT6 that they completely squandered. They had more cars and more tracks and more officially licenced racing cars/series than (if I had to guess) any other racing game made without user made content to play with, and they spent most of GT5's regular offline mode (and almost all of GT5's Seasonal Events) simply repeating the same cars at the same tracks over and over again. In GT6 they have at least a third of the track list with full weather and most of those with full time change as well, so of course there are no endurance races; and of course even though all of the races are sprints now they would use the chase the rabbit formula so hated from the Seasonal Events for pretty much every race in the game.



The point is, now we have an increasingly gimped offline mode for no real reason, and an online mode where people have to do most of the heavy lifting themselves to get the most out of it (but, to add insult to injury, now only after they play through a good portion of that gimped offline mode).

I would not touch COD with a 10 foot pole but that has nothing to do with being able to race online with my friends being more fun than racing offline by myself or being able to post and compare lap times with friends and others.

As he said above, people buy CoD games for the multiplayer component; to the extent that the increasingly implausible and overwrought stories in single player are ignored outright. The importance of online in shooters is so lopsided that EA's attempt at revitalizing the Medal of Honor series as a CoD competitor was literally developed as two separate games (with the single player taking a massive beating as a result), as have most of their shooters released since Bad Company 2. Modern Warfare redefined the entire genre (for consoles, at least; PC shooters had obviously already been pretty targeted in that regard for the most part) as an online multiplayer focused one. PD have done nothing of the sort with Gran Turismo; nor has the genre evolved to support the point that they should be chasing after such focused gameplay (even in PC titles) anyway.

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

Why would they allow people access to events for DLC they didn't buy? Online events I can see the argument for allowing regular players access to DLC, especially after how poorly PD handled track DLC with GT5; but why is giving you something to do with the DLC you purchased now some sort of fleece attempt to get you to buy it?

The fact that you can only enter these events if you buy the VIP and/or the DLC. It is surely a marketing scheme to get you to buy the DLC and VIP. Given that each DLC give one free car they could use that one for the DLC event and everyone could run it [they did do this once] but instead they usually pick the car that requires you to buy the entire pack before you can enter into it.

They also have a habit on including a car that is faster than anything in the base game or previous DLC packs which climbs straight to the top of the leaderboards which also seems to be a means of getting more people to buy the pack.

I stick by what I said about the online and leaderboards being more important than A-Spec. We have a decent single player experience and if they were to add an event creator I would be totally happy with the offline mode. The online mode needs work and should be the focus point, not only in GT6 but in all modern racing games

 

[Tornado]

The fact that you can only enter these events if you buy the VIP and/or the DLC. It is surely a marketing scheme to get you to buy the DLC and VIP. Given that each DLC give one free car they could use that one for the DLC event and everyone could run it [they did do this once] but instead they usually pick the car that requires you to buy the entire pack before you can enter into it.

And? No 🤬 they treat it as an exclusive benefit to buying the DLC. They want people to buy the DLC. You're still not explaining how giving people who bought the DLC something to do with it that they couldn't do unless they bought the DLC (because otherwise what would be the point) can be considered a bad thing other than by pure spin attempt. I'd truly hope if PD actually releases any DLC for GT6, they make an effort to integrate it into the game at least as well as Turn 10 did; as opposed to it being so functionally useless in comparison to the stuff in the base game that they had to patch in the ability to remove the cars you bought from your garage (and even that wasn't done right), or all of the tracks being a waste of money because no one could play them online after the grace period was over (or never offered in the first place) and there was never anything to do with them offline.


And hey, I can do that too: PD allowing access to Spa for that one GT5 Seasonal Event as well as briefly allowing others to race with them online made it so people who bought the Spa DLC were ripped off. Giving people the various Stealth cars as they did for various events ripped people off who preordered the game at the right location or bought the Extra Special Edition. Giving the Nissan GT-R Black Edition to people who competed in GT Academy ripped those people off.

They also have a habit on including a car that is faster than anything in the base game or previous DLC packs which climbs straight to the top of the leaderboards which also seems to be a means of getting more people to buy the pack.

I love conspiracy theories being pushed as proof of intent.

 

[Milouse]

@stb155, leaderboard = player rankings.

 

[zujca]

Well I would definitely love some cut-scenes just for the sake of it.

 

[BWX]

Don't Edit my posts to express your views, calling people that race online dumb is immature..

If you read my post properly, my point is that all games are going the online way and Gt is going to follow suit, so less effort will be put into the "proper game". (made sure I bolded it, so you didn't miss it this time )

I don't understand how the online seasonals aren't like the calendar events people have mentioned, o.k. you don't get to see in advance what's coming up and they're timetrials and not races, but on gt5 every other week they put a new race up, so why won't they be doing this in 6?

There are plenty of dumb people on-line. If you cannot see that... well, not sure what to tell you.

People smash into the back of me when I brake at the correct spot, people slam into the side of me because they cannot control their line, people drive around backwards trying to ram people for "fun".. People leave the room when you are winning because they are poor sports, people cheat and use hacked cars because they are lame and feel as though they cannot compete unless they have a huge advantage, people sit on a straight and try to ram people as they go by.. All these these things are dumb, and done by dumb, immature people..

Also, it doesn't even matter because on-line multiplayer is not a substitute for a good career mode anyway.

Also seasonals are not a substitute for a good career mode, the fact that you can't understand why, proves to me that you don't even know what a good career mode is.

About editing post.. What, did I hurt your feeling? I fixed the quoted part, so you don't report me to the forum masters. Sensitive much? People do it all the time by the way, nothing to cry about.

The fact that you can only enter these events if you buy the VIP and/or the DLC. It is surely a marketing scheme to get you to buy the DLC and VIP. Given that each DLC give one free car they could use that one for the DLC event and everyone could run it [they did do this once] but instead they usually pick the car that requires you to buy the entire pack before you can enter into it.

They also have a habit on including a car that is faster than anything in the base game or previous DLC packs which climbs straight to the top of the leaderboards which also seems to be a means of getting more people to buy the pack.

I stick by what I said about the online and leaderboards being more important than A-Spec. We have a decent single player experience and if they were to add an event creator I would be totally happy with the offline mode. The online mode needs work and should be the focus point, not only in GT6 but in all modern racing games

Not many people would buy GT6 if only the online MP part existed.

Plenty would buy it if only the online part was gone.. (Look at GT 1 to GT4)

So I think your conclusions about online MP being more important than career mode are misguided..

 

[Squanto]

All these these things are dumb, and done by dumb, immature people..

don't forget the 6 year old ... who got GT6 from Santa ... who got trained on MarioCart ...they just don't know how to behave. it's not their fault ... they just need to be separated from the veterans ... that's why we need a licensing system so badly ... and it should be a mature licensing system based on experience not mileage ...

ByTheWay : I love this thread! 👍

 

[INEEDNAWZZZ]

I don't understand the title of this thread. It's a racing game; of course a 'bunch of races' was going to be the career mode. No matter whatever faux-'moving through the ranks' system other games have (like Forza, or Shift), at the end of the day, you're still finishing a bunch of races, because, you know, that's the basis of the game.

It seems to me the OP is just complaining for the sake of complaining. He may argue that it lacks depth or realism, I personally argue it just cuts the BS and gets to the point. I'm not saying GT6's career is perfect; it was way too short, certain car types could have had fun events made for them (bringing back the Wagon Cup would be awesome, as another user said) and the removal of enduros just baffles me. However, it finally goes back to being simple; just like GT1, 2, 3 and 4, you can just go to a menu and jump straight in, and not really have to worry about the order you do them in.

PD needs to stop worrying about the 1% of the audience who want a strict, unadulterated sim game and instead put the focus back on fun. Do I really care about aeeing my in-game avatar starting from a racing school and working his way up to be super racing champion of the world? No. Hell, the game starts you in a Fit, and you can end up driving a Red Bull. Does that not count as 'rising through the ranks'?

/rant.

 

[VBR]

Does a bunch of races justify being called a career?

No it doesn't. And besides, there are no races in GT6, just a lot of driving on different tracks whilst avoiding mobile chicanes & having the win handed to you. It's so Lame!

 

[jimipitbull]

A bunch of races. A cluster of special stages. A flock of drift.

Three different career paths.

 

[Zuku]

There are plenty of dumb people on-line. If you cannot see that... well, not sure what to tell you.

People smash into the back of me when I brake at the correct spot, people slam into the side of me because they cannot control their line, people drive around backwards trying to ram people for "fun".. People leave the room when you are winning because they are poor sports, people cheat and use hacked cars because they are lame and feel as though they cannot compete unless they have a huge advantage, people sit on a straight and try to ram people as they go by.. All these these things are dumb, and done by dumb, immature people..

Also, it doesn't even matter because on-line multiplayer is not a substitute for a good career mode anyway.

Also seasonals are not a substitute for a good career mode, the fact that you can't understand why, proves to me that you don't even know what a good career mode is.

About editing post.. What, did I hurt your feeling? I fixed the quoted part, so you don't report me to the forum masters. Sensitive much? People do it all the time by the way, nothing to cry about.





Not many people would buy GT6 if only the online MP part existed.

Plenty would buy it if only the online part was gone.. (Look at GT 1 to GT4)

So your I think your conclusions about online MP being more important than career mode are misguided..

With that bolded part it's sad to think back at GT4 everyone is upset with no online, and then we finally get it, but rest of the game goes in the crapper.

In fact that's what ends up happening with most games either online focused or single player focused with crap online or offline. With some exceptions.

 

[skazz]

To everyone pronouncing the importance of online: The devs of the PC game Assetto Corsa have been quoting some research they have been doing on how many players actually participate in online racing. It's generally no more than 10-20% of the player base. The scary thing is there are some PC race sims without an offline AI capability which still show a large portion of the player base never joining online races (presumably just hotlapping).

As a result, Kunos is building a career mode and programming AI for Assetto Corsa. The scary thing is that their little 10 man team already has better AI up and running than Gran Turismo 5 or 6

Project CARS is doing the same thing: Comprehensive offline career mode. Their current ideas include the whole "moving through the categories" type of build up discussed here. They have a huge track list with many good real life tracks, and the set of cars will allow around 6-7 different series/classes. Assuming pCARS makes it to consoles, it'll be interesting to see how the final game is appreciated. No doubt a tiny amount of sales compared to GT or Forza.

On the other side of the fence: I've not played 5, but Forza 4 has reasonable AI (sadly not fast enough even on the max setting, but bearable), with standing starts and close racing as long as you don't pick a too powerful car within a class. But grids are small, you always start near the back and have to barge through the field in a few laps. The longest races consist of 2*6 lap races instead of a single 12 lapper which irritates me considerably! There is a huge list of races against the AI, based on a per car/manufacturer specification. I got through around 50% of the list in 2 years, but could only stomach a few races at a time due to the mediocre track list.

I don't mind calling what GT6 has a career mode. You progress from slow to fast cars, earn credits, build a garage, tune the garage. Nothing remotely ground-breaking but not awful either. However, I have had trouble wanting to progress through GT6 "career" mode due to the slow-down-and-let-them-win AI and the fact that in IA and higher you often have to sit for an hour and work through 5 races in one go: Would it be so awful to be able to pause a series and go do other things in game before resuming it?!?

 

[GTP_Jonjig]

About editing post.. What, did I hurt your feeling? I fixed the quoted part, so you don't report me to the forum masters. Sensitive much? People do it all the time by the way, nothing to cry about.

No, I just wanted you to man up and insult people without standing behind me..

Not many people would buy GT6 if only the online MP part existed.

Plenty would buy it if only the online part was gone.. (Look at GT 1 to GT4)

So your I think your conclusions about online MP being more important than career mode are misguided..

Your crazy..
People bought Gt1 because it was revolutionary, Gt2 because it was the sequel to a revolutionary game,
Gt3 was a terrible game, all about the graphics , physics were rubbish compared to 2, the career mode was awful, 5 levels of the same races just with increases in laps..
Gt4 was when they started getting it right again..

For me you can ditch career mode, IMO there is no skill to it, how do you learn good race-craft racing AI? the only way I get a half decent race in career mode is to race with 100pp less and worse tyres than the AI, and I still just out brake them into corners to win, easily..

I'd like to call it a training mode but Career mode isn't even that, forced aids in licences and challenges, you have to undo your learning once you've completed it..

I don't want an exclusive online Gt game, but the online part of the game (not just multiplayer) IMO is head and shoulders above the offline content.. rant over.

 

[Tenacious D]

On the other side of the fence: I've not played 5, but Forza 4 has reasonable AI

I don't find Forza's bots to be very reasonable. Seriously though, if you don't like being rammed by Gran Turismo's bots, you won't like being slammed off the road in Forza. They often drive like brats.

I have been pondering both P CARS and Assetto Corsa, but the whole PC sim thing kind of leaves me cold. Sims are notoriously dry, clinical, technical and lacking in soul, plus the bots are almost always rather bland, polite things. In addition, every car feels like a loaner, or at least they do in most sims. Maybe P CARS and AC will offer us the tools to edit liveries and create our own identities with them rather like Shift and GRID, and P CARS allow us to modify street cars in GT and Forza-like ways to take it even further.

Let me stress that while I like the finicky physics of PC sims, I really don't think they're all that better than what we have in Forza 4 and GT6, which are incredibly advanced, both of them. In fact, I've witnessed car dynamic behavior in Forza 4 that I've only seen among sims in Live For Speed. F4 and GT6 aren't perfect, but they're amazingly close to reality.

Of course the topic is about an in-game career, and that I'm a bit curious about, though I have a feeling that it follows the TOCA model, which is okay. In Gran Turismo though, Polyphony already has their own GT Academy to use as a pattern, and I wish they would. I've only proposed it a number of times, which is the basis for my own Career Mode essay above.

 

[Master Gator]

Let's face it, this game is a piece of crap! I've never beaten a GT game 100% in my life and I've been playing since GT1. That is until GT6 came along. I've beaten GT6 100% completed and it's only a little bit over a month old. That's ridiculous! GT5 is over 3 years old and I still have not finished everything in that one. I have no reason to buy a 2 million dollar formula gt because there is no formula gt championship race. What's the deal? The career races were boring and the only one I found interesting was the rainmasters.

 

[GTP_Jonjig]

I have no reason to buy a 2 million dollar formula gt because there is no formula gt championship race.

You will have a reason when PD release a seasonal race for it ( be it a TT or Championship ), which is why I think people are crazy when they don't realise Gt is taking a more online route, same as every other game..

 

[Master Gator]

Gt is taking a more online route, same as every other game..

That's why PD f'ed up. You can't expect everybody to have internet and want to play online. That's not why people buy home consoles. If I cared so much about playing online I'd buy a pc and a real racing sim. Gran Turismo just isn't what it used to be. I have no good reason to even play it now because I've won everything you can win offline. I guess all I can do with it now is let it sit around until they actually get around to finish making it.

 

[ShiftingGears]

Makes you wonder what that "human drama" nonsense was about.

Human Drama = Player Outrage

 

[Tornado]

Gt3 was a terrible game, all about the graphics , physics were rubbish compared to 2,

The physics were barely different.