Does "clean" mean anything anymore?

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Tower Turn 13

Tower Turn 13

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I was reading another thread about online racing and it got me thinking. The good random rooms supposedly say "clean" in the title. Yet, maybe the host and one other person actually race clean. And none of the others are kicked.

I had a somewhat bad experience, one of many, the other night--

I entered a "clean" room, thinking, okay, I have a shot at placing at least mid-field in a full room. I'm not bad, not the fastest either. I'm usually a mid-field position, occasionally podium, rarely first. But I'm okay with this. I start mid pack randomly and expect the other racers to work for their passes. I hold my lines, never swerve in front of someone on a strait away and give them room when they've got the pass.

Yet, everyone else tries to pass me in the first corner, slamming me in the process as they lunge up the inside and steal the position away. No one backs off when I take my lines into corners regardless if they're far behind; they just brake late and block my apex. Then many of them swerve across the straits sideswiping me when I pass, and when I brake before a corner SLAM into the back of me.

They're all on mics I can barely hear slamming each other with racial slurs so when I type messages it's impossible to communicate with them.

This is why I rarely enter the random room and champion the GTP system, where series are fair, shared by lovers of racing who want to win cleanly and by skill, not strong-arming their way around the track.

What do you guys think? Are clean rooms actually clean in your experience?
 
I've seen rooms that claim to be 'clean' at the Ring, only to have one guy swerving in front of me on every single straight preventing me from passing for the ENTIRE race. This happens all the time, and NASCAR rooms can normally be ruined by one idiot who wants to cause an accident.

Like you said, these are the reasons I join GTP series. It's organized, fair and majority of GTP'ers are awesome guys :gtpflag:
 
Its easy to get worked up about this kind of stuff. But you got to remember, 90% of the time these people arent 'dirty' drivers. They are just *not good*. Clean driving comes with skill and experience. I know the first thing you think of is 'HE DID IT ON PURPOSE!!!' but thats rarely true.

I deal with this all day long at Spa. people passing me right before eau rouge, and try to go through it side by side, ends up taking us both out. What do I do? I lift, let them go ahead of me and draft them on the straight. I'm a *good* driver, so I'm *clean*

Most of these guys come from a-spec mode which really teaches you to mash the gas pedal, and smash your way to victory.
 
I don't look for rooms advertising clean, I look for rooms that look clean.

Restrictions, a clear room description, lack of SRF, and I typically like rooms without mics. Heavy damage and lack of penalties are also good to have. Though recently I'm not online as much. I just don't have the time now.

The GTP system is great, but it can be hard fitting things into an uncertain schedule, so random online races still dominate my online experience. Occasionally, you find a bad one, but must I find are pretty good.

I did plan, and still plan on holding, some scheduled events (mostly stand alone endurance races) when I get a chance. Organized races are better just because you have so much more control over them (as a host) and because they're usually better thought out.
 
Let the host know who is dirty and they will usually kick them. As the host its hard to keep track of all the drivers, so help them out by pointing out the dirty/unskilled drivers.
 
No, in my experience, the word "clean" means absolutely nothing, 90% of the time. Most hosts are either unwilling or afraid to monitor or police anything, even when there are constant complaints about individual drivers. Usually only if they themselves are in an incident is anything done, that's what they really mean by clean.

I'm not sure what the answer is but long ago I mused about an artificial "collision avoidance" system, that would allow minor contact, but would somehow allow the race to proceed with some kind of progressive penalty system, that progresses from race to race. If the onus was placed on the following car I don't think it would be too difficult to design and implement similar to the collision penalty system now, which is far from perfect and too penalizing, often on the wrong driver.

Something along the lines of the program detecting that the following car is going faster than the car in front, collides with said car, and as long as the car in front is not swerving to cause the collision, the following car is at first slowed in pace for a second or two, second time longer, third time longer, and then maybe fourth time automatic ejection. The lead car would be unaffected by this collision at all, either in pace or balance.

If contact is made side by side in a corner then the car that entered the corner last, the following car, automatically has the onus on it to hold it's line and avoid collision. Should contact occur the system could automatically mitigate the effect of the contact on the lead car, with a small penalty on the following car, just a slight slowing in pace, enough that the lead car holds position.

It can be done, just a matter of PD wanting it done and committing to it.
 
I think an even easier solution would be to mimic iRacing's safety rating system. If your safety rating (based on collisions, spins, off-tracks, course-cutting, etc.) is lower by a certain amount than the room host permits, you aren't allowed in.
 
As mentioned above, look for rooms that will contain clean drivers first.
* PP restriction
* Tire restriction

Most newbs and bad drivers only get ahead by racing on RS tires. Find a room that restricts to SS or SH, or CS tires with a specific PP or hp/weight restriction and you'll have better luck. Lower PP rooms will offer more wheel-to-wheel racing and fewer visits to the sand pit. I would never race above 500pp in a public lobby simply because there aren't enough drivers out there (aside from GTP members) that can handle the speed and still race clean lap after lap.

Also, there are ways to adjust your driving style to prevent others from ruining your race. You should always hug the inside line of turn 1 on lap 1. No matter where you start, get inside and leave no room. Also take the first few turns at a speed that will leave some grip to spare should someone ram you from behind. When approaching a turn with someone in your draft take the inside line and leave plenty of room to your outside. If you don't, they will have no where to go when they miss their braking point. It also helps to tap the brakes early but with less force. It gets your opponent ready to brake sooner, reducing the likelihood of them punting you. In general, the best racers can run clean laps at the limit but can also run defensive laps to prevent others from passing or bumping their car off the track.

Picking the right track helps too. Nurburgring is not a track to race with pubbers. Everyone knows how to hot lap the track, but few know how to set up passes. The track is simply too narrow to pass unless someone makes a mistake in front of you. Monaco and London have similar issues. Everyone barrels into the turns without regard for the stacking affect that occurs when multiple cars brake into a turn.
 
Tower Turn 13
I think an even easier solution would be to mimic iRacing's safety rating system. If your safety rating (based on collisions, spins, off-tracks, course-cutting, etc.) is lower by a certain amount than the room host permits, you aren't allowed in.
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Thats a stupid idea. This would mean i and some other drivers can't enter because of a lower skill
 
Tower Turn 13
I was reading another thread about online racing and it got me thinking. The good random rooms supposedly say "clean" in the title. Yet, maybe the host and one other person actually race clean. And none of the others are kicked.

I had a somewhat bad experience, one of many, the other night--

I entered a "clean" room, thinking, okay, I have a shot at placing at least mid-field in a full room. I'm not bad, not the fastest either. I'm usually a mid-field position, occasionally podium, rarely first. But I'm okay with this. I start mid pack randomly and expect the other racers to work for their passes. I hold my lines, never swerve in front of someone on a strait away and give them room when they've got the pass.

Yet, everyone else tries to pass me in the first corner, slamming me in the process as they lunge up the inside and steal the position away. No one backs off when I take my lines into corners regardless if they're far behind; they just brake late and block my apex. Then many of them swerve across the straits sideswiping me when I pass, and when I brake before a corner SLAM into the back of me.

They're all on mics I can barely hear slamming each other with racial slurs so when I type messages it's impossible to communicate with them.

This is why I rarely enter the random room and champion the GTP system, where series are fair, shared by lovers of racing who want to win cleanly and by skill, not strong-arming their way around the track.

What do you guys think? Are clean rooms actually clean in your experience?
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Screw em man,get aggresive
 
noisiaturismo
Thats a stupid idea. This would mean i and some other drivers can't enter because of a lower skill
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Your skill and how clean you are don't necessarily go hand in hand, you can be slow as hell but still race clean. It doesn't take much skill to lay off the gas and let a faster driver through or avoid crashing into every car you come across etc.
 
noisiaturismo
Thats a stupid idea. This would mean i and some other drivers can't enter because of a lower skill
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Speed and skill don't really have anything to do with it. But it would force us to be better drivers because we would know that pushing the car too hard and spinning would have real consequences. Then people would make fewer mistakes and drive appropriately for their skill. Then we have cleaner racing. Just my opinion.
 
Clean is over-rated, and boring. With dirty your actually not snoring and staying part of the race, finding ways to survive the endless crashes and cars flying all over.
 
klassykid9801
Clean is over-rated, and boring. With dirty your actually not snoring and staying part of the race, finding ways to survive the endless crashes and cars flying all over.
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That's just a poor excuse, but if you feel that way then join or create dirty lobbies. Clean racing is about pushing yourself to the limit without going over it, respecting the cars around you, and true racing. It is a very exhilarating feeling when finishing a race that had good clean battles.
 
mcfizzle
That's just a poor excuse, but if you feel that way then join or create dirty lobbies. Clean racing is about pushing yourself to the limit without going over it, respecting the cars around you, and true racing. It is a very exhilarating feeling when finishing a race that had good clean battles.
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A poor excuse for what, dirty racing. Clean racing is an excuse for not wanting to have to be a sliver into the grass or so you cant get smashed into. I just like racing hard rather than driving in a straight line.
 
I avoid going into rooms that have clean in the description. They seem to be the opposite of clean. Last experience in a room with clean in the description meant being overtaken by someone who cuts the final corner completely. After that I said: You know that green stuff is not asphalt right? He responded, but I couldn't read it because it were all ************* and then he send a message in german to the german host and I was kicked:D
 
No it didnt say what i typed in. Along with that i said: those are the rules for gtp not gt5. It didnt show up. And yea it is klassy thank you very much. Look at the post and youll see its not typing in
 
I actually have to agree, I have been in several online rooms that say they are clean but really have lots of hitting and cutting off going on. I try to play all races clean, its a challenge... Anyone can push their way to the front and win (ok, sometimes I do this in Seasonal - dont need to in A-Spec 90% of the time) but I prefer to try not and even touch another car and keep my car on the track.

I have noticed over the years (over 10 now... since GT1) I have grown from looking 5 cars in front of me to looking at the 2 cars in front of me... I use the car in front of the one I want to pass to help see my line around the car in front of me.... This makes racing more like the good ole AA saying "One Car at a time..." instead of thinking "Can I pass all 7 cars in front of me on this next corner?"

At the end of the day "clean" is more "simulation" to real life... In real life there are consequences to hitting another car, it will ruin your aerodynamics, possibly cause mechanical damage and at the end of the race (if you drive like that all the time) the owner of the car will fire you! And if you are the owner you will go broke...

I have however (as we all do) made mistakes and rear-ended the car in front of me online in clean... it was a mistake, the instance I am mentioning here, the guy got mad and thought I did it on purpose and saying I was a bad driver... as the race progressed he changed his mind some, but like real life - mistakes happen...
 
I like clean races. But most of the Time this means: Don´t touch the Host !

If you have issues with other drivers most of the hosts don´t do anything although their lobbies are stated clean.
The most clean lobbies are just lobbies where the host wants more people in. Clean is a magnet somehow.
=> Trial and Error for open Lobbies

I do like dirty Lobbies too because its major fun.
 
klassykid9801
A poor excuse for what, dirty racing. Clean racing is an excuse for not wanting to have to be a sliver into the grass or so you cant get smashed into. I just like racing hard rather than driving in a straight line.
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The OP is asking about people who ignore clean in the title of room not whether clean is better than dirty, you comment that clean racing racing is boring. To me it sounds like you go into clean lobbies and race dirty so you have more fun, ruining the lobby for people who are trying to race.

And what does any of that mean that you just said?
 
Clean rarely is but then again blame is placed just as accurate as the driving. I got kicked the other day because of someone elses driving... Its just part of being online.
 
Kent
I got kicked the other day because of someone elses driving... Its just part of being online.
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This has happened to me numerous times unfortunately. I'll follow behind someone, they hit the brakes on a corner, just as I expect them to, so depending on the corner, I'll either lightly brake or get off the throttle before the driver ahead of me and the driver behind me rams into me, causing me to ram the driver in front spinning them out or taking them off their line and I'm kicked. As stated, It's a part of being online.
 

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