Does PD Want us to "Cheat"?

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I think you guys need to remember the majority of GT players will be nowhere near your level of ability.If the game catered primarily for you guys quite simply you wouldnt have a game,as nowhere near enough units would be sold.
I'm currently trying to play without aides sometimes it just doesnt work,straight off .Sometimes after a couple of laps they get dropped.I've also started playing with a wheel and made the jump from auto to manual as well.So for me as much as i dont want to use the aides there are times when i need them simple as that.
Now if you want to complain about cheating have ago at the glichers and dupers now tha truely is cheating.
 
I can't say I've had the urge to cheat in GT5. I've never had the need to wall ride, or use the AI as bumpers to get through a license test or special event. I have pushed the limits of overtaking a few times. I've dive bombed into some corners to block the AI, but I'd say that's just inconsiderate, not cheating. I don't want to push it any further, because I'd just be cheating myself. I am trying to enter into races and championships with comparable cars to the field as well, to add to the fun. It keeps me interested.
 
as a (what i would call) senior player of 10plus years, and someone who uses a DS3 exclusivley i do use aids, only abs though as its harder to use the brake on the trigger than the throttle, compared to a wheel
 
I think it is a great feature. It makes things winnable and challenging for everyone. We can discuss naming (in gt5p it was "physics std/pro"), and the difficulty in particular races, but as a whole I find it great.

I always drive with SRF off, but I imagine how hard it would be to start racing without it.

Yes it is a community divider, but a fine one. If you are good enough it is a simple way to sort out all the idiots that just want to roll ram smash and crash their cars. While for someone who gets hooked on racing it provides an incentive to improve his skills, to one day be able to turn it off.

People just have to accept their skill level, and not see it as a cheat. It is just like learning to ride a bike. You know you can have those helper wheels for kids' bikes so they can not fall. Some think they are good because the kids do not get hurt as much. Others think they are bad because the kids do not learn balance. Decide for yourself, I do not care if someone choose to use those wheels.

PS. I for one would love a rewind button, it just has to invalidate your lap time. Don't know Forza3 or how they have made it.
 
The problem is not that Skid Recovery makes driving easier, but that it makes it faster for everybody who uses it, since it magically increases grip without drawbacks. It's not a realistic driving assist. It defies physics.
 
I honestly don't see the problem....

Who cares if someone reaches level 40 faster than you because he uses assists..
He payed the same amount of money for the game as you did, let him enjoy it the wayhe wants to.
You can make the game as challenging as you want. The best reward you get is furfillment.

I love the seasonal challenges even though I can't gold them but I'm overjoyed and very pleased with my self if I get silver on them:)
That is doable even for me. I consider myself a slightly above average driver (if you include the casual gamers:sly:) but nothing more than that.
 
SHIRAKAWA Akira
The problem is not that Skid Recovery makes driving easier, but that it makes it faster for everybody who uses it, since it magically increases grip without drawbacks. It's not a realistic driving assist. It defies physics.
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I will say it again:

If game would deduct percentage of XP/Cr winnings based on assists-usage everything will be fine. You still get your Gold Trophy for the 1st place, but for the full XP/Cr amount you need to have all assists-off.

Even the 20% would be fine, no real need for hard-core handicap.

But the difference in winnings would certainly push some people to discover the beauty and real challenge of non-assist driving.

And would prolong the re-playability of Events too.

Win-win.
 
Now what exactly does skid recovery do that ASM or Steering Assist not do?

Besides give you magically more grip out of thin air. It makes the car easier to drive, yes. But that is the point of the other two assists, and TCS, and ABS.
 
As others have said, this was actually in GT4. You got up to 200 A-spec points for a race depending on your car's strength compared to the others.

Unfortunately you would never know the A-spec points of a race before you started it, it was often really hard to hit somehwere reasonable, lots of time wasted going back to your garage to find another car or tune.

But that was just a bad implementation, the idea is good.

It would work great if:
- You could set a general difficulty level, which would influence the opponents chosen. The higher the more difficult opponents, and the more cr/xp.
- When selecting a car for a race (in the garage and tuning setup), the game should show you what rewards this car with this tuning would yield.
- Always show rewards before loading the track and starting race.

Really, it should not be that difficult.
 
I think the problem is lots of people go for a totally overpowered car that destroys the opposition, when playing in A-spec. When these seasonal events appear, which demand genuine skill and technique to be used, its the end of the world. Give yourself a chance by fighting for your win, it will make you better.
 
It's about time PD added levels in a GT game!!!!!!

You can't cater to both casual/novices and hardcore/pro players and not alienate both camps.... Because that's exactly what GT5 feels like, a mish mash.

The AI is way too slow for anyone with a wheel, decent driving skills and good track knowledge. It's almost a joke how slow they are, like PD is trolling us :(
 
CoolColJ
The AI is way too slow for anyone with a wheel, decent driving skills and good track knowledge. It's almost a joke how slow they are, like PD is trolling us :(
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Exactly, its not a race. Its a case of, given equal hardware can you blow the pants off the AI?

Why certianly PD - best ones for me to show this are DTM and JGTC races in extreme. I mean they are in extreme right, so why are they so slow? Are they extremely bad drivers is this why they are here?

I was on online yesterday and the day before racing JGTC and GT300 cars and its amazing what kind of racing you can have, wheel to wheel in same weight/bhp cars...Just not in singple player im afraid.
 
CoolColJ
The AI is way too slow for anyone with a wheel, decent driving skills and good track knowledge. It's almost a joke how slow they are, like PD is trolling us :(
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I will not agree with you here.

Go to Arcade races menu, select Professional, propper tyres, depletion/wear on, no assists, heavy damage, real trackside reduction, take 10 laps of any track, put HUD off - and prepare to be amazed.

Heavy damage will significantly change the way you drive, tackle the opponents and cope with the track.

It is the hard-core of hard-core. Best AI and driving ever in video games.

Races like that can't happen in A-SPec because 90% of players would never finish them and would be alienated from the game, but you have the hard-core option at your fingertips. Try it and come back to share the impressions.

It would be nice if those races would give us small amounts of XP/Cr - I know - but since it is a personal/subjective challenge just go ahead and bite it for the sake of own driving pleasure.
 
People don't enjoy a challenge! They just expect a win button. You don't need platinum trophies, gold trophies should be the hardest to get, if your not good enough to get them just practice. Getting a gold trophy shouldn't be a divine right, its suppose to be hard to get.
 
CoolColJ
The AI is way too slow for anyone with a wheel, decent driving skills and good track knowledge. It's almost a joke how slow they are, like PD is trolling us :(
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Ever thought about downgrading tyres and chosing the "250 points A-Spec equivalent" car, like in the good old GT4 days?

The AI isn't that bad either and will put you into a wall if they must 👍
 
amar212
I will not agree with you here.

Go to Arcade races menu, select Professional, propper tyres, depletion/wear on, no assists, heavy damage, real trackside reduction, take 10 laps of any track, put HUD off - and prepare to be amazed.

Heavy damage will significantly change the way you drive, tackle the opponents and cope with the track.

It is the hard-core of hard-core. Best AI and driving ever in video games.

Races like that can't happen in A-SPec because 90% of players would never finish them and would be alienated from the game, but you have the hard-core option at your fingertips. Try it and come back to share the impressions.

It would be nice if those races would give us small amounts of XP/Cr - I know - but since it is a personal/subjective challenge just go ahead and bite it for the sake of own driving pleasure.
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Still too slow for me. Video I made a few days back, showing the AI.
All these cars are faster than my MX-5 in a straight line, 181hp 935kg, medium sports tyres.....
Pro level, no aids, no ABS, tyre wear and fuel depletion, full damage, DFGT Wheel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaZefXyrT0k


And starting from last place and working your way up is not racing!
Need more options. An AI level out of 100 would work better instead of just 3.
Number of opponents, qualifying or set place on the grid, choose the cars to drive against, their tyres etc etc :indiff:

All very basic stuff, that should not be asked for :guilty:


Mind you the Pro level AI is faster than the AI in A-Spec....
Why can't I have a nice hard battle on the FR cup races in the earlier halls? It should not be just for begineers!
Club racing has good drivers too in real life
 
CoolColJ
Still too slow for me. Video I made a few days back, showing the AI.
All these cars are faster than my MX-5 in a straight line, 181hp 935kg, medium sports tyres.....
Pro level, no aids, no ABS, tyre wear and fuel depletion, full damage, DFGT Wheel.
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And, I guess, custom suspension besides the wing?

I'm all for competitive AI races, but after all you brought a tuned car to presumably a stock AI opponents race.

Speaking just for myself, I'm going through the races as fast as I can on my first go. After cash and the desire to buy all the cars I want is satisfied, I plan on doing selected events again and again with different cars and see how much handicap I can cope with. The true beauty in GT lies, to me, in the endurance races, because the stakes are high (my spare time) and for the first couple of runs the outcome should be anybody's guess.

Of course, a "event creator" would be great, but I think that was not the topic here.
 
I think skid recovery force needs to be out of the game or have some drawback that makes it slower than realistic physics. I personally find driving to be more enjoyable with SRF off, but I often race with it on just because I want to win. Hopefully PD will patch this in the near future.
 
Being that not everyone is a game freak and has a seat wheel set up in their house and dedicate their lives to playing a game, I don't think assists are cheating, it's a damkn video game relax you sound like this is a major thing in your life.

sorry but it's just a game and should be enjoyable not impossible.
 
ItsHim
And, I guess, custom suspension besides the wing?

I'm all for competitive AI races, but after all you brought a tuned car to presumably a stock AI opponents race.

Speaking just for myself, I'm going through the races as fast as I can on my first go. After cash and the desire to buy all the cars I want is satisfied, I plan on doing selected events again and again with different cars and see how much handicap I can cope with. The true beauty in GT lies, to me, in the endurance races, because the stakes are high (my spare time) and for the first couple of runs the outcome should be anybody's guess.

Of course, a "event creator" would be great, but I think that was not the topic here.
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I just chose a car from my favourites list in arcade and started a race.
The cars I'm racing against would be faster than my MX-5 in real life, and are so in the game as well, if I was driving them myself
 
I am not a GOD player by any means, but I am %99 certain that RX7 seasonal event cannot be completed without RSF no matter what you do to the car. The other one for example, the Special Stage R5 one, I managed to win without any adds easily enough and not much tuning done to the GTR spec-V 09 that I used. In this one I would want it to be a tiny bit more challenging, while RX7 one just drives me crazy, the car is just not fast enough around corners as it is with RSF and so then you manage to win. PD is like using a trial and error system here, ok this one will be like this and that one like that, but in reality one is challenging enough, or less and the other one is impossible. But if you look at RSF like at a tyre upgrade more or less then it's not that much of a cheating.
 
PD wants us to enjoy a game, and with patch 1.05 they have made new steps in completing this goal.

You shouldn't have to do things that you don't like (grinding, spending tons of hours just to drive the cars you like) in a game. PD sees that finally to some extent (there is still much work to do before they really complete this goal).

If you enjoy by grinding and such, then do it, no one stops you.
 
Same AI on Gran turismo 4, dumb & slow. But with weight & power reducing. Im always setting it to the maxium Weight 10? or 20%? and -20% Power with reduce top speed. And that makes me feel im challenge. But with this features remove in gran turismo 5, i can no longer enjoy racing with AI.
 
CoolColJ
It's about time PD added levels in a GT game!!!!!!

You can't cater to both casual/novices and hardcore/pro players and not alienate both camps.... Because that's exactly what GT5 feels like, a mish mash.

The AI is way too slow for anyone with a wheel, decent driving skills and good track knowledge. It's almost a joke how slow they are, like PD is trolling us :(
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Good players with a controller are as fast as people with a steering wheel on many tracks. Even faster on some tracks (for example monaco). There are a few tracks in which a steering wheel really benefits you because of the required precision instead of the fast steering response (especially with the wheels being 900 degrees instead of 360 degrees, like in most real racing cars, exceptions left out)
 
It would be funny, if PD makes an event that is definitly not winnable without SRF.

And then wait and watch the forums and see all the posts where people say "no big deal", "easy..." etc..

This could be a big field test by PD how people react to different challenges.
 
carlosy
It would be funny, if PD makes an event that is definitly not winnable without SRF.

And then wait and watch the forums and see all the posts where people say "no big deal", "easy..." etc..

This could be a big field test by PD how people react to different challenges.
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They already did.

Haven't you noticed the Ford Focus seasonal event?
 
I did not read the whole thread but since skid recovery, gold is nothing special in GT5 anymore :/

In GT4 you can say "wow (s)he golded everything"... In GT5 you will never know how (s)he did...
 
The problem I have with the A-Spec races is, that its damn hard to find a fitting car.
There is no good way to find out how your car compares to your opponents.

I don't understand why they didn't keep the system from Prologue. Sure, it needed some improvements but it was a good way to compare cars and set up competitive races.
 
I have no idea what SRF does. I always assumed it was something that let you reset your car so that you appear back on the track if you spun out. But apparently it's suppose to give you more traction? Not sure because I never used it and I'm an amateur level player.

Also I really hate it when people get upset at GT, so to start insulting it they start calling it NFS. NFS? Really? Do you really have to go there? I took a 90 degree turn at over 100mph in a NFS game.. I don't think PD not penalizing people for cutting corners or using assist qualifies this as a NFS game.

Just because you can do something doesn't mean you have to.

Edit:
opladener
The problem I have with the A-Spec races is, that its damn hard to find a fitting car.
There is no good way to find out how your car compares to your opponents.

I don't understand why they didn't keep the system from Prologue. Sure, it needed some improvements but it was a good way to compare cars and set up competitive races.
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Actually in all A spec races you can see your typical opponents you will race up against. It's right up there next to entry requirements.
 

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