Draft of Proposed BC5 rules - please read and comment
- Thread starter Duke
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- GTP_Duke
Sorry, I don't. tontonfredo is the one who PMed me their round proposals; his location is listed as "Lyons" so I'm assuming he's French.
On another note, as we get close to removing the DRAFT and putting up FINAL, I'd like everybody to review Paragraph 3.9.2 which discusses penalties. The draft rules allow a little more leeway on offs and contact in the longer races than the usual Zero Tolerance policy. Discussion touched on this briefly earlier in the process, but I would like to get a more official consensus now that it is time to finalize the rules leading up to the 1 September start date.
On another note, as we get close to removing the DRAFT and putting up FINAL, I'd like everybody to review Paragraph 3.9.2 which discusses penalties. The draft rules allow a little more leeway on offs and contact in the longer races than the usual Zero Tolerance policy. Discussion touched on this briefly earlier in the process, but I would like to get a more official consensus now that it is time to finalize the rules leading up to the 1 September start date.
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- eggmann_gtbn
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- Small_Fryz
Also what is the rules for concrete, cobblestones and paved areas that are NOT tarmac?
are we running the rules to gt.de standard?
are we running the rules to gt.de standard?
- 24,344
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- GTP_Duke
If somebody would enlighten me about what the gt.de rules are, I'll review them. My take is that anything outside the cones or rumble strips is NOT TRACK, anything inside the cones or rumble strips IS TRACK, regardless of the paving surface.
Case in point - the acres of paving to the left of the first downhill turn at Infineon Stock Car track. It's quite easy to drive on, and quite clearly outside the intended line of the track.
And, bobkart, are you going to share that with the class?
Case in point - the acres of paving to the left of the first downhill turn at Infineon Stock Car track. It's quite easy to drive on, and quite clearly outside the intended line of the track.
And, bobkart, are you going to share that with the class?
Hmmm, I thought I just did . . . oh you mean the details!DukeAnd, bobkart, are you going to share that with the class?
Okay, I tried this for myself to be sure. At the start of an Arcade Mode race replay, it gives the car, power, and tires information, along with the phrase Single Race. At the start of a GT Mode race replay, at least the one I tried, it gives that same information, except with the phrase Event Race at the end instead of Single Race.
Unfortunately both Arcade Mode and GT Mode hot laps use the term Practice. So the presence of installed Nitrous Oxide (or something) must still be used to tell these two situations apart. Strange because the default replay file name for Arcade Mode is Time Trial, they could have easily use that term instead of Practice for Arcade Mode laps. I guess they just didn't have us in mind when they designed how that all worked.
And I now understand what my driver has been trying to tell me since he heard about this Nitrous Oxide verification technique: You can't load an Arcade Mode hot lap replay as a ghost in GT Mode and vice-versa. I have confirmed this to be the case. This allows verification that a hot lap was done in whichever mode, without resorting to the Nitrous Oxide verification technique.
So it would seem that we can do without the Nitrous Oxide verification technique.
So it would seem that we can do without the Nitrous Oxide verification technique.
But using NOS is an instant verification contrary to your load-ghost method where you have to verify the replay itself and then try to load the ghost in the proper track to see if it has been done in either Arcade Mode or GT Mode. I'll stick to NOS technique. For those who are going to watch every single replay from everyone racing here, it's a huge waste of time if they use the ghost for every replay they've watched.
Well, nothing is "instant" about any of this. And yes, it does add an extra step to the verification process. The upside is that it prevents the possibility of someone using laughing gas on the straight prior to crossing the starting line, and thus gaining some time over someone who doesn't do that. Such usage can't be detected as long as they don't use enough to change the readout. If it weren't for that potential hole in the verification technique, I'd be happy with it.Mistral
Yeah I'm talking about use of the gas prior to the start of the lap and therefore prior to the start of the replay, not use during the lap that the replay shows. This would allow someone to cross the starting line with more speed than would otherwise be possible. Thus reducing their lap time even though they did not use the gas during the lap itself.icemanshooter23
Think about how much time it took in GT3 to check a replay for hybrid parts, which had to be done on top of the normal visual verification. Now contrast that with the effort required to check that the replay can be loaded as a ghost in the appropriate mode. About a minute or two. My position is if there is verification that can be done, it should be done. The minute or two is a small price to pay for knowing 100% certain that the right mode was used, AND there is no possibility of a slight use of the laughing gas.
GT3 :bobkart
- Recieve the replays (mail, IM, whatever...).
- Load the replays on your memcard. *Loading*
- While it's loading on your memcard, load one-by-one every replay in GT3gEdit.
- Then look if it's hybrid or not.
GT4 :
- Leave Replay Theater. *Loading*
- Go to the right zone : World, Original, City or Rally.
- Choose the right track. *Loading*
- Load the replay as a ghost.
(You dont wanna be the guy who while take a look at about 50 and more replays. It's a real pain in the @$$ IMO. In about 20 days, these guys will have 100+ replays to verify.)
That was so much easier in GT3 to proceed in such verification. And what about multi-lap races? We can't load any ghost from that and the only way to be sure it has been really done in GT Mode is by installing Nitrous Oxide.
You missed the earlier post of mine where I point out that for races, the replay shows the difference right when it starts up (Event Race versus Single Race).Mistral
And yes, I've already acknowledged that it takes a minute or so more time to do this check. I feel it's worth it.
Where is Duke . . . ?
This isn't about Hybrids. I've quoted the relevant post that started all of this about a dozen posts ago. It's about the fact that forcing installation of Nitrous Oxide on GT Mode cars, but disallowing it's use (which can't be enforced prior to the Starting Line on hot laps) as a means of verifying that the run is indeed in GT Mode, is not necessary now that we know these two things:bobkart
1) Race replays distinguish between GT Mode and Arcade mode (Event Race versus Single Race at the start of the replay).
2) GT Mode hot laps replays cannot be loaded as a Ghost in Arcade Mode and vice-versa.
The only counterargument I'm hearing is that it takes another minute or so to do the Ghost check. I feel that's a small price to pay for knowing with 100% certainty that someone didn't get on the button on the straightaway leading up to the starting line of a hot lap.
How hybrids might have gotten brought up is that I compared the minute or so to do the Ghost check with the many-minute process we used to have to confirm that the car was not a hybrid, that all the parts were legal and their settings. So anyone who claims that the minute or so to do the Ghost check is too much time, their argument would also apply to the MK check as it took considerably longer to do, and we don't have to do that now (can't actually).
My position is that if there is ANY way to check something 100%, that way should be used, rather than rely on some mechanism that leaves a hole, as the Nitrous Oxide mechanism does. The Nitrous Oxide mechanism was conceived of PRIOR to knowing those two things above that make it unnecessary. If the Nitrous Oxide mechanism didn't have that one hole in it (use prior to the start of the lap) I would be happy with it. But it does so I'm not.
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