Driving without ABS - Is it really slower?

[Hig-GT]

So I've been driving without it for ages now and I'm starting to wonder if there really is a huge amount of difference. For example, I have golded all of the licenses without ABS and I even beat some of my previous gold times by a few tenths aswell.

On the Nurburgring I can do a 6.05 in the ZR1 RM and I can do a 6.19 on the Castrols Toms Supra. I have also outpaced friends online even with lower powered cars so is there really a huge amount of difference?

I can appreciate that your braking zones increase slightly but I'd argue it can give you more flexibility in corner entry and can sometimes put you on a better line for the corner.

Anybody had any similar experiences? (Please only people who drive regularly without ABS be the ones responding to this ... I don't want those who drive with ABS on 1 commenting really.

Thanks!

 

[phil bell]

Depends on the car and it's setup.I was 5 seconds slower (abs off) on the nurburgring 24h with my track prepped Viper ACR.But I than drove a C6 Z06 on the high speed ring and found my runs (abs on then off) to be within tenths of each other.It helps that the high speed ring is a shorter less demanding track but overall I think it's about the car's setup and how much confidence and preference that setup gives you.

I am not sure about flexibility as I so most of my braking in a straight line and with regards to trail braking on corner entry my viper seems pretty similar,just less stable without abs.The Z06 and various TVR's though do seem to improve this flexibility with the abs off.Again,it's all in setup imo.

I can see why you put the last sentence,no abs is really a massive difference to me.Need alot more pedal modulation.

Generally though I believe abs on will be faster for most car's,a human simply can't match a computers instantaneous reflexes.ABS on some car's are also very advanced nowadays and actually encourage trail braking and flexibility when cornering.

 

[mr_VOLCANO]

When you learn to use no ABS then I thinks its pretty even. Problem for me is consistency without ABS. I was in a online race a few days ago on nordscleife, it was 8 laps one make race. I won , but 2.place only 7sec behind and that with no ABS.

 

[liQster]

if you have a fanatec with clubsports, you´ll be as fast as with abs turned on, mby even faster, i guess.

if you have a g27 like me you do not want to turn off abs (set on 1) because pd screwed up support of the pedals on this one..

if you use ds3 i cannot say anything to this topic since i never used it.

 

[phil bell]

if you have a fanatec with clubsports, you´ll be as fast as with abs turned on, mby even faster, i guess.

if you have a g27 like me you do not want to turn off abs (set on 1) because pd screwed up support of the pedals on this one..

if you use ds3 i cannot say anything to this topic since i never used it.

How did they screw up the support?Just curious.Pedal travel or software?

 

[Morphisor]

I've started trying to use ABS 0 with a DS3 for about a week now, driving a few different cars, although all below 500 hp.

Need a really low brake balance (usually 3/1 for road cars), because getting the exact right amount of brake pressure is next to impossible; I need to be able to start braking full power, modulating it by lifting off for a split second a few times during heavy braking.

 

[DA__dogg]

I use the controller and I need to have abs on because if I don't then everytime I brake they lock up and then I spin out. I set abs to 3. I tried to make the L2 button for braking but it isn't comfortable to hold the controller that way so I use square to brake and R2 for gas.

 

[TenEightyOne]

In real-life ABS gives a longer braking distance.

That said in GT5 the aural feedback isn't good enough to allow you to hear the beginning of the tyre squeal... and the the wheels lock pretty quickly.

That means that in this game ABS is almost certainly quicker (and as stated by another poster more consistent) than direct braking.

 

[blown540ci]

I've been running no ABS for some time now and in my experience it does not suite all cars.
Some of the cars are a real pig to get a grips with (like the lotus Elise) and are definitely easier / faster with ABS on .
I would say that my first brake set up to try any car without ABS would be 2 on the front and 0 on the back and take it from there.
The only advantage i have found is the fact that you can turn in and brake at the same time.

The other problem is when running races with mixed brakes ABS - ON/OFF because of the earlier braking points for no ABS , You more often than not get a bit of bumper tapping going into the corners from the person behind that is using ABS.

 

[JJ72]

ABS off is faster....just set your brake bias to a reasonable level (3:1, 4:2) etc and there you go.

And those who argue human can't match a computer....just think about how traction control slows you down, human can adapt and drive beyond what the computer thinks is the limit, I personally don't find consistency or braking distance to be any problem with ABS off.

 

[phil bell]

ABS off is faster....just set your brake bias to a reasonable level (3:1, 4:2) etc and there you go.

And those who argue human can't match a computer....just think about how traction control slows you down, human can adapt and drive beyond what the computer thinks is the limit, I personally don't find consistency or braking distance to be any problem with ABS off.

I point to the traction system on the 2010 Corvette ZR1.It's called performance traction management and it is faster on with le mans racer Justin Bell behind the wheel by a considerable margin.It's proven.The Ferrari 458 also has a similar system.The traction control in GT5 is WAY too intrusive though and does not give good simulation of today's modern systems.Computers can make adjustmants humans can't.

 

[JJ72]

let's stick to the aids in GT5 for now, comparing it to a real life system is just comparing apple and oranges, and not so much relevant to the real topic.

The same reason that makes GT5's traction control intrusive can also happen with the ABS, and for one I feel it already impedes my ability to trial brake and rotate the car on entry, which translate to time lost.

 

[phil bell]

Well opinions are opinions,personally I don't feel much even though I set my car's up with abs off.Maybe this is also true for car types and setup.

 

[Hig-GT]

Well I find that ABS off is easy enough to drive with ... But yes please let's only make in game comparisons, real life comparisons are pointless as it is just a game after all lol.

 

[Hig-GT]

Oh and can I just add in ... Does anyone else agree that we should have the option to restrict the use of ABS online like we can with SRF and traction control?

 

[TheTechnobear]

In general I use don't use abs - with clubsport pedals.
And have no issues , on most cars there are one or two exceptions.
But, as someone else mentioned, I do always play with brake bias as well.
(perhaps this is where I gain back any loss that I have by not using abs?)

I think though, using no abs rather depends on your controller, I'm sure it take less skill on my part, than for someone trying with a DS3.
So should you allow forcing no abs, well makes it unfair for some...
But perhaps allow abs 0 or abs 1 would be reasonable
( one could argue similar limits for tcs ?)

 

[phil bell]

Given some people want to set up a realistic race series where the race car's do not have abs,why not restrict it.It's the option,those who want to drive without abs join and those who use abs can always find another room.So im all for the option to restrict it.

 

[phil bell]

Well I find that ABS off is easy enough to drive with ... But yes please let's only make in game comparisons, real life comparisons are pointless as it is just a game after all lol.

Yes it is.And yes,but he said no matter what computer's can't outdo humans and will slow us down so I was just using an example.No comparison intended.

 

[Yev]

In real-life ABS gives a longer braking distance.

That said in GT5 the aural feedback isn't good enough to allow you to hear the beginning of the tyre squeal... and the the wheels lock pretty quickly.

That means that in this game ABS is almost certainly quicker (and as stated by another poster more consistent) than direct braking.

What he said.

 

[TheTechnobear]

Given some people want to set up a realistic race series where the race car's do not have abs,why not restrict it.It's the option,those who want to drive without abs join and those who use abs can always find another room.So im all for the option to restrict it.

True...
Actually, I wish we just had a single option, which limited assists to what the real car has - including gear/clutch options

 

[ChadSpeed]

Oh and can I just add in ... Does anyone else agree that we should have the option to restrict the use of ABS online like we can with SRF and traction control?

I agree 100%. I love running the online races in FM3 that have all aids off, including ABS. In GT5 so far I can't be consistent with the ABS off, i thinks its a combination of trigger feel and the non linear way that it is applied like the throttle, i.e. 80% trigger pull gives you 100% throttle in game. Also its hard to get used to when you have to go and re tune every single car just to be able to not use ABS. The cars should not have a 50/50 brake force split.👍

 

[DA__dogg]

I turned abs off today and tried braking with the L2 button. Still way to inconsistent to have decent lap times. Unless you are very good with a controller, abs is a must imo.

 

[Hig-GT]

I did drive without ABS when I was using a controller and I managed it ok, it all depends on your brake bias as to how easy ABS off is when using a DS3

 

[DA__dogg]

What settings did you use for a controller? I had been using 5 front and 2 rear. My problem is the people I race against regularly use wheels and they are so much faster than me especially before turns. That and I use up my tires too soon without abs.

 

[Hig-GT]

1/0 is what I use on all my cars, I sometimes change up to 3/2 but if you use 1/0 it will help with consistency.

I do try and set my cars up to stay balanced / keep the weight at the back as much as possible just to reduce any chances of the rear locking up.

I mainly drive JGTC and Super GT cars now though so I never have a problem with no ABS.

 

[ObfuscateFreely]

(Another controller user here)

The first thing I do with any new car is set the brake bias to 5/2 or 5/3. Some cars require further tweaking, but it's a pretty good starting point in my experience.

I enjoy the challenge of driving without ABS, even though a lot of the cars in the game probably have undefeatable ABS systems in real life. The default 5/5 brake bias has made some of the licenses and Special Events more frustrating, though (I've yet to gold the 0-1000Km or wet stopping tests).

 

[Hig-GT]

I golded those with no abs and a 1/0 brake bias ... They're the easiest of the licenses.

 

[DA__dogg]

Thanks. I'll give the 1/0 setting a try later on today.

Quick question: when you shift weight to the back without adding any extra weight, does that actually move weight or do you have to add some to move some?

 

[Hig-GT]

I just use the suspension settings to control how the weight transfers ... Sometimes I add ballast but I don't think that does much tbh.

 

[liQster]

How did they screw up the support?Just curious.Pedal travel or software?

braking pedal is very sensitive i think, can´t explain it technically, but if you hit the brake smoothly the tires immediately stall with abs @ 0.