Easiest way to fabricate engine mounts?

[JCE]

If one were to say want to swap an engine from another car into a project car you own what is the best way to get the new engine mounts fabricated? Lets say for argument the engine you want to swap in is actually has less cylinders and much less displacement (obviously). Also your project car is RWD and the engine wanting to be swapped in was both used in FWD and RWD applications.

Few specific questions...

• What do you need to get started?
• What and how would you measure?
• How would you give this information to a machine shop to make the mounts?
• Should you just pay for someone to do it for you and save the headache if you have zero skill in this area?

This is assuming you already have an adapter plate that will allow you to use the existing transmission and thus use the engine drive line back from the transmission. I'm just asking about engine mounts here but what else should one worry about in the engine bay in regards to the fitment?

There is a good reason why I'm asking this question...



















I want to swap the LSJ I4 supercharged engine from the Solstice/Sky/Cobalt SS into my Camaro.

 

[Eric.]

You're not going to be able to do that on your own. That's a ton of work for even a shop to do. They're gonna need the motor and trans, be able to test fit, etc etc.

With the amount of work involved, go for the turbo motor.

 

[JCE]

You're not going to be able to do that on your own. That's a ton of work for even a shop to do. They're gonna need the motor and trans, be able to test fit, etc etc.

With the amount of work involved, go for the turbo motor.

There is an adapter plate that bolts the LSJ/LNF engine to my Camaro's 700R4 (or a newer 4L60) transmission. That solves that issue. Since the Solstice and Sky both are RWD and there have been V8 conversions of those I know it is possible to fab mounts from I4 to V8 but I'm hoping I can do the other way around. And my engine bay in the Camaro is quite a bit more massive than the Solstice/Sky. Plus the LSJ supercharged Ecotec is about as fast as my 305 and the LNF turbo Ectotec would be as fast or faster than the 350 assuming I installed the stage 1 kit.

I'm just curious really on how to do the whole fabricating the engine mounts thing. I really want to put a Ford 302 in my Camaro so fabricating mounts is something I'm going to need to do anyway regardless--I was just curious about adapting the I4 to my engine bay. I wouldn't be opposed to doing the Ecotec swap if it was easier than the Ford 302 and didn't cost a huge amount more.

 

[Eric.]

That's not the point, you're also going to have to be sure that the engine is positioned EXACTLY where it has to be for everything to line up. Does the transmission stay placed just how it would be normally our does it have to be moved? If it stays in place, that will make positioning the engine that much easier.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

You're not going to be able to do that on your own. That's a ton of work for even a shop to do. They're gonna need the motor and trans, be able to test fit, etc etc.

With the amount of work involved, go for the turbo motor.

C'mon man. It's not the case. Clearance won't be an issue here so really the best way to go is to put the engine/trans where you want it and then from there figure out what needs to be done for the mounts. There's no way of knowing what the "easy way" is going to be until the engine's already sitting in the bay.

 

[JCE]

Looks like if I chose an Ecotec I might go with an LE5 Ecotec then swap over the supercharger system. There has already been an Ecotec swapped in an '83 S-10 from a Cavalier. So a RWD swap has been done with this type of engine. This could be fun.

 

[BrutherSuperior]

If one were to say want to swap an engine from another car into a project car you own what is the best way to get the new engine mounts fabricated?

If I were doing what you're doing, I'd use a piece of wood.

You can cut it, sand it, and use back strap to get creative with 2 pieces if you have to. After you hack & whack your way to fabricating a 2x4 into a faux motor mount; hand it to a machine shop and ask them to make that out of something not biodegradable.

First, I'd see if there would be a way to link the OE engine motor mount to something that would attach to where it would normally do so. Like an extension you'd have welded and gusseted to meet with the new engine. Or, go in reverse and see if it is feasible to have an extension fab'd and bolted to the engine that would use the motor mount the original engine would.

Camaros are flexy, especially the front end. Even something as simple as a strut tower brace changes the handling and performance...for the worse though. I'd try my hardest to use the factory mounting points instead of trying a "Shortest distance from Point A to B" or "whatever is cheap" method.

I've swapped engines in previous cars, but I never tried an engine that was not available for that car or something from a different OEM. Have fun trying to get the steering to work (you're probably going to need a custom PS Pump bracket machined for your swap) and I'd also be weary of getting the A/C to work too.

If your 305 is tired or has a hole in the oil pan/block big enough to throw a cat through, I'd just toss another small block Chevy between the fenders. You can even get nuts and cam the hell out of it with a Holley sitting on top. If you want to cross-pollinate from one OEM to another, a 302 from an Explorer & a used T5 would be the ticket. (the 700R4 is a turd)

But the I4 from the Cobalt SS? Not exactly the most refined engine out there and coupled with the long gearing in the 700r4, it'll probably accelerate at a snail's pace. The engine harness and PCM for the turbo Chevy engine would probably cost more than a 350 short block. My biggest fear with this sort of swap is that it would seem cool until you mashed on the pedal. You're not going to get the V8 noise or low-end grunt. Instead, you're going to get a stack of bills and a car that will probably perform no better.

 

[Duke]

Considering the number of people putting LSXs and 5.0s into Miatas, I can't imagine why you would want to go the opposite way with your Camaro.

If you're trying to get better fuel economy, look for an LSX/6 speed combo. That thing is just ticking over at highway speed and gives very good mileage... But it will still haul ass without having to make 2 trips.

As an added bonus it is probably a cheaper and easier swap.

 

[JCE]

Considering the number of people putting LSXs and 5.0s into Miatas, I can't imagine why you would want to go the opposite way with your Camaro.

If you're trying to get better fuel economy, look for an LSX/6 speed combo. That thing is just ticking over at highway speed and gives very good mileage... But it will still haul ass without having to make 2 trips.

As an added bonus it is probably a cheaper and easier swap.

I don't want a GM V8. I dont care for a lot of power and MPG doesn't matter really. I want to do something different. I'm tired of seeing the same set of engines put in these cars regardless of the reason. Dont care about money really either because this is a long term project. I found a site that sells adapter plates for any Ecotec engine to bolt up to my existing 700R4 transmission. Thats huge actually. That means my only real obstacles are the engine mounts, fabbing up the exhaust manifold back and wiring up after market gauges.

 

[Eric.]

Just realized you are hooking this up to an auto. That's gonna be a dog with those long gears.

 

[CodeRedR51]

I think this swap would be cool IF you went built motor with a big turbo.

 

[Eric.]

Unless for some reason JCE has access to a supercharged motor, the turbo one is such a better option.

 

[Azure Flare]

Easiest way to fabricate engine mounts?

Get someone else to do it.

 

[Duke]

I don't want a GM V8. I dont care for a lot of power and MPG doesn't matter really. I want to do something different.

It'll be different, all right, and not in a good way. That little 4 (either turbo or S/C) is going to flog itself to death trying to pull around a Camaro.

But hey, it's your car, your money, and your effort.

 

[CodeRedR51]

It'll be different, all right, and not in a good way. That little 4 (either turbo or S/C) is going to flog itself to death trying to pull around a Camaro.

Depends no the power output. Like I said, built motor + big turbo = no problem.

 

[Eric.]

Well the turbo motor with a tune makes 290hp and 340tq, so that should move along just fine.

 

[CAMAROBOY69]

Motor mounts would be the easiest part of this project. And your best bet for a project like this is to do it yourself. Get a good welder and some scrap metal. Set the engine and tranny into the car as a mock up and go from there.

Funny you mention this because in a couple months we are swapping in a Chevy V8 into our 67 Fastback Mustang that had a straight 6 Ford engine. I am guessing we will have it all swapped in a weekend and have it running. Maybe even drivable. I have done much more crazy things than this. In fact our Fastback mustang used to be a coupe. Swapped it from a coupe to fastback in about 8 hours. Yes I cut both cars in half. There is nothing I cant do with metal or cars.

 

[Azuremen]

Depends no the power output. Like I said, built motor + big turbo = no problem.

Unless you happen to want the car to move under a few thousand RPM.

 

[GT5Junkie]

305? 87-92 Camaro? Just buy a better car.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Unless you happen to want the car to move under a few thousand RPM.

Not that big. A 3071 or equivalent will do just fine. 👍

 

[JCE]

Motor mounts would be the easiest part of this project. And your best bet for a project like this is to do it yourself. Get a good welder and some scrap metal. Set the engine and tranny into the car as a mock up and go from there.

Funny you mention this because in a couple months we are swapping in a Chevy V8 into our 67 Fastback Mustang that had a straight 6 Ford engine. I am guessing we will have it all swapped in a weekend and have it running. Maybe even drivable. I have done much more crazy things than this. In fact our Fastback mustang used to be a coupe. Swapped it from a coupe to fastback in about 8 hours. Yes I cut both cars in half. There is nothing I cant do with metal or cars.

I've had a couple of blokes already recommend setting the engine in and connecting it to the trans then use cardboard to get an idea about form. Either way I need to get the engine in the bay.

Unless you happen to want the car to move under a few thousand RPM.

I've driven turbo cars, VTEC cars and my Focus. They all have higher rpm power, not that big of a deal to me to have all my power down low.

305? 87-92 Camaro? Just buy a better car.

Dude get the hell out of my thread with your worthless drivel.

 

[nk4e]

A 240sx way to make motor mounts.

 

[JCE]

A 240sx way to make motor mounts.

Holy crap this is brilliant. But, I wonder if this would actually work with my project and if the bolt offsets for the mounts on each of the blocks aren't near each other I'd have to figure out a way to make that work. If I choose the Ecotec I4 engine (and it is a strong possibility that I will) I would have to make an adapter to attach to these homemade mounts. If I can get that to work this would significantly help me and make the process much cheaper and quicker.

If I choose the Ford 302/351 it might be easier using this homemade method versus the I4 idea.

I might even have an additional suggestion on this guide. Wrap the thread of the bolt in heavy duty box tape or saran wrap so you don't get the threads covered in that stuff. 👍

 

[The Outlaw]

305? 87-92 Camaro? Just buy a better car.

This. IMO if you're going to go through the hassle of swapping in a new motor, why on the earth would you start with such a crap platform (that doesn't do anything well...and to most is far from the most aesthetically pleasing car around).

 

[JCE]

This. IMO if you're going to go through the hassle of swapping in a new motor, why on the earth would you start with such a crap platform.

Again, people like you need to get the hell out of my thread with your worthless comments. There is no reason to come in to this thread just to post your disliking of the vehicle I've chosen. I asked for information regarding the subject not to ask for your worthless opinion.

THANKS.

 

[The Outlaw]

Out of curiousty, what are you looking to achieve with your project, and what in particular do you like about 87-92 Camaro's? (which handle like complete arse and have the torsional rigidity of a shopping cart).

 

[Duke]

Again, people like you need to get the hell out of my thread with your worthless comments. There is no reason to come in to this thread just to post your disliking of the vehicle I've chosen. I asked for information regarding the subject not to ask for your worthless opinion.

THANKS.

It's your car and your thread, but turning an aggressively deaf ear to people who may disagree with you or see holes in your chosen plan is a great way to waste a metric ton of money and effort.

 

[GT5Junkie]

Again, people like you need to get the hell out of my thread with your worthless comments. There is no reason to come in to this thread just to post your disliking of the vehicle I've chosen. I asked for information regarding the subject not to ask for your worthless opinion.

THANKS.

If you don't like people chiming in with their opinions, you might want to stay away from the internet.

99.99% of engine swaps talked about on the internet don't ever get done. And I really don't see what the point is in this case. Just to have something different? You're going to spend thousands and thousands of dollars and a massive amount of effort and end up with something that's probably going to perform worse than a stock 4th gen in every way possible, plus is ugly as sin (I know beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but come on, almost everyone thinks they're ugly) and has a wretched interior.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

@Duke: I'm sorry but I don't quite understand...

JCE's not getting mad at people saying the swap won't work out etc etc... It's those coming in just to bash his car choice.

We get it, the 3rd gen Camaro is the worst car on earth blah blah blah blah blah. At least they look decent (which can't be said about most 4th gens) and aren't awful enough in any one way to stop them from becoming decent performers in any given discipline. If you don't like the car someone's chosen as their project it's not really any concern of yours now is it?

 

[The Outlaw]

I think some of us are just trying to make some suggestions (we haven't gotten very far with that yet) before he gets his feet wet with this project and there is no turning back. I guess my whole thing is - does the OP know what to expect with the end result, and just how much effort, time and money it will cost him? I mean if he is doing this project because he really has a thing (looks wise particularly) for the 87-93 Camaro and wants to do the swap because he is really passionate toward that type of car, then that's perfectly understandable! But to try and and take a Gen 3 Camaro and throw a turbo 4 banger into it, to simply be different...makes no sense whatsoever, especially if you know what you are in for (in terms of the work required to complete the swap) and how poorly the car will drive compared to a newer car (with a similar investment) when you are done.

Looking at the car, it doesn't seem to be in too good of shape to begin with. First of all, the car needs a paint job (unless you plan on driving around looking like a hillbilly) which is a couple of grand to do correctly, especially with all that rust. Just the body work and paint on this car alone would turn me off big time, especially when you consider that there are plenty of other rolling chassis donor cars out there (that are quite arguably MUCH superior platforms - of course aesthetics is a matter of opinion) with decent paint, in much better condition that can be had for quite a reasonable price ($2-3g..the price of a cheap paint job). Some cars that come to mind are, E30-E36 BMW, S13-S14 Nissan, FD3S Mazda, SN95 Mustang, etc.

By the time you're done with the OP's project, if you actually were to do a quality job, you could easily spend $10-$15k (the price of a nice, used C5 corvette), and be left with a outdated car that won't do anything well other than maybe go in a straight line at a decent clip. With that type of mileage the suspension will be totally shot and a horrible design to begin with, the brakes are crap, the interior is an absolute joke (in all regards), etc.

I don't think we're trying to offend the OP - rather just give him some perspective from a realistic standpoint (that it really wouldn't be worth it, unless you REALLY have a thing for Gen 3 Camaro's).

If you don't like people chiming in with their opinions, you might want to stay away from the internet.

99.99% of engine swaps talked about on the internet don't ever get done. And I really don't see what the point is in this case. Just to have something different? You're going to spend thousands and thousands of dollars and a massive amount of effort and end up with something that's probably going to perform worse than a stock 4th gen in every way possible, plus is ugly as sin (I know beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but come on, almost everyone thinks they're ugly) and has a wretched interior.

I agree, particularly with the bold.