Elise in america without the dam rover engine

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bengee

bengee

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For all that are interested and hopefully do not yet know, the lotus elise 111s is headed for america hopefully, and the espirit is on its way out... The elise will have a toyota celica gts engine with vvtl... with 190hp and 133 pound torque... The estimated cost is 39k and everything else will be little changed from the uk model... I donot know about you all but the elise sounds like a fantatic platform, and even with a toyota engine, (which doesnt sound too bad of a choice after reading more about it) it seems that this should be a car after my own heart. I am pretty dambed excited... The unvieling is at the january la auto show for all interested... i live in sf and i will be there...

BTW the uk model will retain the rover in teh elise and obtain the toyota in the exige...
 
Originally posted by bengee
The estimated cost is 39k and everything else will be little changed from the uk model...
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:lol: We finally get the Elise - exactly what the buying public wants - and they charge $13k more than a top-range Miata. Completely incompetent market positioning.
 
That is estimated lol...

Hell its smaller than the miata so should cost more right... Its definitely a whole lot better than the miata, but i am also not sure if its worth 40k... Does anyone know how much the espirits cost in the us??? I have seen one at a jaguar dealership...
 
Originally posted by Rumple Foreskin
Interesting choice of engine. I am pretty sure it is only 180 hp though.
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The stock engine is 180hp, the one in the Lotus will be slightly tuned by Lotus to 190hp, or so they said in road and track.

It is pretty pricey, I guess that's what happens with the hand built cars though.
 
Hmmm...
I am getting different info from a lot of sources regarding the 2ZZ-GE.

"The 2ZZ-GE puts out 140 kW (190 bhp) at 7600 rpm and 180 N•m (133 lb•ft) at 6800 rpm on a raised 11.5:1 CR with premium unleaded fuel."

If thats the case then why is the Celica GT-S rated at 180hp when they are stateing 190 there?
 
Lol.......So an elise will be nothing but a modded MRS with a facelift? Because people have been swapping VVTI Celica engines into MRS's for a while now..And I know the weight diff couldn't be THAT Much..
 
Ahhh but the chassis will be completely different... the chassis is the essence of the elise... i too was kinda dissapointed by the choice of engine by lotus of USA... but i have some ideas that could transform this car into a true super car as lotus should have done...

trust me driftster... the lotus chassis is infinitely better than a dam mrs...Anyways, the reason for my excitement is that we will be recieving the elise, which gives us in america the opportunity to feel one of the most amazing chassis ever developed in my opinion... If lotus basically took the toyota drivetraina nd did some small modifications... how hard could it be to put one of your own in there... hehe that is why i am particularly excited...

It doesnt seem right to be placing a japanese engine into a british car now does it...
 
Originally posted by bengee
Does anyone know how much the espirits cost in the us??? I have seen one at a jaguar dealership...
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Esprit was pulled from the US when they realised nobody was stupid enough to actually buy it - it started around $91000 new before it was canned.
 
Yeah, in houston, we only sold around 8 a year. The elise is not made to be an everyday driver's car to compete with the MR2. Its made for people who like to drive and take their cars to the track. At star motors, there are currently 58 people who have put down deposits on the new elise...and thats about as much as that dealership will be recieving per year. Also, if you dont like the engine, perhaps you should try the s2000 engine. That would probably go quite nicely with it.
 
Originally posted by retsmah
The stock engine is 180hp, the one in the Lotus will be slightly tuned by Lotus to 190hp, or so they said in road and track.

It is pretty pricey, I guess that's what happens with the hand built cars though.
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Its not hand built.
 
Originally posted by bengee
It doesnt seem right to be placing a japanese engine into a british car now does it...
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Well, the front drive Elan did run with an Isuzu (of all companies) engine. Oh yeah, and Lotus are owned by Malaysian car company Proton.

So, call it an international car!
 
I don't get why people are pouring crap on the Toyota engine - I'd take it over the Rover motor any day of the week.

Although, the Type R conversion from PunkRock's link does trump it considerably...
 
Originally posted by vat_man
I don't get why people are pouring crap on the Toyota engine - I'd take it over the Rover motor any day of the week.
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It's a motor that needs revs... but that doesn't get them, thanks to Toyota's ECU mapping.
 
Originally posted by PunkRock
It's a motor that needs revs... but that doesn't get them, thanks to Toyota's ECU mapping.
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Are you saying that that's a problem in the new car? Because I know Lotus completely remapped the ECU.

As for the differences that are present in the US version, as opposed to the UK one: (off the top of my head)

-Stereo system
-A/C
-Exhaust pipes moved to a central dual position to accomodate the new rear marker lights
-Drive swap (obviously)

I think that's it
 
Originally posted by Takumi Fujiwara
Are you saying that that's a problem in the new car? Because I know Lotus completely remapped the ECU.
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I'd have been surprised if Lotus hadn't, given the work they did on the Rover motor before sticking it in there.
 
the significantly lighter weight and remapped ECU should make this engine a far better motivator than as it is in the celica.
i think the stereo, carpet and airbags are going to be standard for all american cars. its a blaupunkt IIRC.
 
Originally posted by ShobThaBob
Not all of the American cars are coming with a Stero. Its an option.
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Stereo as an option????:confused:

A stereo in an Elise? What for? Like the driver can hear it?

Over here, we only get air-con, manual windows, nothing else.
 
The Toyota engine is a better long-term bet. The Rover K-Series engine is getting a bit long in the tooth now, and Lotus struck a deal with Toyota for the engine and attendant 6-speed manual box. It has had its ECU massaged by Lotus, yes.

And Doug, the Elise is something like £8k more than the MX-5 here in the UK also.

You're getting a completely different car (ignore Driftster's MR-S comments, he's talking rubbish). Anyone who knows anything about cars who could afford an Elise would not buy an MX-5.
 
Originally posted by GilesGuthrie
The Toyota engine is a better long-term bet. The Rover K-Series engine is getting a bit long in the tooth now, and Lotus struck a deal with Toyota for the engine and attendant 6-speed manual box. It has had its ECU massaged by Lotus, yes.

And Doug, the Elise is something like £8k more than the MX-5 here in the UK also.

You're getting a completely different car (ignore Driftster's MR-S comments, he's talking rubbish). Anyone who knows anything about cars who could afford an Elise would not buy an MX-5.
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I don't understand why people (maybe it's just Mr New York) compare the Elise to the MX-5 in the first place. They're obviously two totally diffirent breeds of cars.

The Elise being a cool car, and the MX-5 being st00pid.

Duh?
 
Originally posted by ShobThaBob
Not all of the American cars are coming with a Stero. Its an option.
Click to expand...

If it's an option at $39000 I will go into the Lotus dealer and point and laugh at every single employee. If I don't see the official price soon I think I'm going to have a heart attack!

I don't understand why people (maybe it's just Mr New York) compare the Elise to the MX-5 in the first place. They're obviously two totally diffirent breeds of cars.
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People need to start drawing better comparisons between cars - family sedans, for example, shouldn't be compared to only family sedans, because when a family's in to buy a car, maybe they're looking at a sedan, and a wagon, and a midsize SUV - which is why it should be about comparative value. Which brings me back to the Miata and the Elise. Comparative value. Is the Elise truly worth $20000 more than a base Miata? With that money I could have the Miata plus any other Mazda product excepting the RX-8. Ouch
 
Thats just the thing, it isnt meant to be something you can drive every day everywhere. There will be no floor mats, it wont come standard with electric this and that...its a street legal race car with 190hp...that can keep up with corvettes. Why can it keep up with corvettes? Because it skirts all the 'refinement' issues.
 
Originally posted by M5Power
If it's an option at $39000 I will go into the Lotus dealer and point and laugh at every single employee. If I don't see the official price soon I think I'm going to have a heart attack!

People need to start drawing better comparisons between cars - family sedans, for example, shouldn't be compared to only family sedans, because when a family's in to buy a car, maybe they're looking at a sedan, and a wagon, and a midsize SUV - which is why it should be about comparative value. Which brings me back to the Miata and the Elise. Comparative value. Is the Elise truly worth $20000 more than a base Miata? With that money I could have the Miata plus any other Mazda product excepting the RX-8. Ouch
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Your obsession with price and relative value is quite amusing. A lot of owners don't take the stereo in an Elise because it adds 5Kg to the weight, and they never use it anyway because it's a car to go thrashing around the countryside in. Also, people who buy Elises like to take the car to a car stereo shop and fit their own specialised stereo system.

Your second paragraph seems to defeat itself. Are you really claiming that people should compare cars across classes, and then, in the same breath, saying that two two-seat roadsters should not be compared with each other? It's like saying that a 3-series is a better car than a Caterham (because, hey, you get a stereo as standard), but that it isn't valid to compare a 3-series with an A4.

An an Elise being worth $20,000 more than an asthmatic, slushy, base-model MX-5? Absolutely. No question.
 
Was reading Evo magazine the other day, they have tested a S2 Exige with the Celica lump in and liked it a lot. They said that the lack of weight in the elise did indeed mean that the engine worked much better than in the Toyotas. They also mentioned that Lotus remapped the ECU to change response rather than increase power.

Interestingly, the reason given for using the Toyota engine over a Honda one (they were the two top choices) was that Lotus and Toyota have 'historical links dating back to the early '80s'. Personally I think the engine change will be a sucess, for a start you get a 6 speed 'box now which should help keep the engine revving not to metion all the Lotus tweaks. Only time will tell though.

P.S, those complaining about the cost difference and lack of radio don't seem to get this car. It's designed for handling, not cruising being both lighter and more advanced than the MX-5 for instance. Ok, so no radio may be a bit off putting but when you consider this as a second rather than primary car, which I would imagine it would be in many cases, it doesn't matter anywhere near as much.
 
They really have history... strange i have never heard of this before... I have read about the company attempting to raod legalize the elise for the us with the s2000 and integra type r engine... I do not know about you guys but the s2000 engine seemed a fairly good choice to me... However, i believe i read somewehere (possibly the lotus company page) that it got something like 40 mpg on the freeway... that is dam good and possibly something they were considering...

Even if the engine isnt something to die for... the chassis is and that is the real reason that we should be estatic that this car is coming to the us... i am just sad that i will not be able to afford one for quite some time...
 

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