Failures of Motorsports - Car Designs, Team Mistakes and More

  • Thread starter Panoz
Stellar response.

I have no idea exactly what your complaint is - the post you're whining about not being convincing and needing more explanation is more complete than your own (many of your own) - and you don't appear to be able to articulate it. It just seems like you've got an axe to grind for some reason, and I suggest you take it somewhere else.

And that's not a literal suggestion. Pack it in.

Edit: Weird that you're finding the time, two weeks later, to go back and poop my posts - but still not actually explain what's not convincing or incomplete about a post that contains all the information necessary regarding an incident, or what more information you need...

It all smacks of a vexatious complaint because the user in question suggested your own fire-and-forget one-liner posts didn't have enough information so you're returning it - and that's a waste of everyone's time.
I was trying to apologize but obviously I didn't find the right words or explain myself all that well. Those are just some of the difficulties I have as a result of having a learning disability.

Besides, anyone remember the 1997 British Formula 3000 Season? Probably not, because it lasted for just a single race at Brands Hatch in which only three cars took part, they even sent out the safety car for no reason other than to try to make the race more exciting! No wonder the season ended there and then and the series collapsed soon after.
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The Monte Carlo 001-Cosworth

Or the Life L190 of International Formula 3000. In the hands of Fulvio Ballabio, the car's sole outing at Imola in the 1986 F3000 Season saw it not only fail to qualify but it was also bog last of the 36 entrants. Its fastest time? 3 minutes, 4.8 seconds! 1 minute, 25 seconds off the pace of the March of pole-sitter (and eventual Champion) Ivan Capelli, 1 minute, 11.5 seconds off the pace of the Dollop Racing Marches (i.e. a team that only made the F3000 grid once in two years of trying, and on this occasion, were slower than everyone else). The car is said to have suffered from gearbox problems but still, similar things could be said about the Life at the same circuit four years later! Not surprisingly, Ballabio and the Monte Carlo made no further appearances, though it has been said that the team's transporter crashed down a ravine and caught fire on the journey home from Imola, thus ruling out further appearances anyway.

Though having said all of the above, the car's performance (or lack thereof) can be explained by the stories behind it. For one, some stories claim it was originally intended to race in the 1985 F3000 Season so it was already a year old before its appearance at Imola. Also, the car had its origins in the unraced Dywa 010 F1 car, which was originally designed in 1983 (although some stories suggest it was 1980), which in turn, was the successor to the Dywa 008 that pulled out of the only race it ever entered after qualifying (The 1980 Gran Premio Della Lotteria at Monza) after Piercarlo Ghinzani's fastest time was 36.5 seconds off the pace of Emilio de Villota's RAM Racing Williams and nearly 21.5 seconds off the pace of a trio of Formula 2 Chevrons that were the next slowest qualifiers!

All in all, that's what you get for basing your car on a chassis that was already several years out of date but was also based on a car that was described as "a relic from an O-level metalwork class" and put together by a team that "lacked professionalism", according to their driver. After all, this is the same Piercarlo Ghinzani who felt it was better to be in F1 at the tail-end than not in F1 at all! To me, that's even worse than the "interesting flowerpot" that the FIRST F189 was described as before it was reborn as the Life L190!
Having said that, since the Monte Carlo only entered one race, that would make it the MasterCard Lola of International Formula 3000.
If we're going off that metric, you might as well throw Richard Childress and Zak Brown in there while you are at it. Pretty sure there are many others. Not sure I'd count Toto though considering its hard to classify this as a "Failure":


And yes, that is Toto Red Bull Colors. Let that sink in..
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If we're going off that metric, you might as well throw Richard Childress and Zak Brown in there while you are at it. Pretty sure there are many others.
Does Michael Andretti also fit? Sure, he has Indycar Championships, but his career at Indy and outside of IndyCar was largely a failed one.
Does Michael Andretti also fit? Sure, he has Indycar Championships, but his career at Indy and outside of IndyCar was largely a failed one.
Definately wouldn't count Micheal either considering he's brought home major championships so far from a failure. At best, cursed at Indy (Like alot of drivers honestly).
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What about Yamaha as an F1 engine supplier? Especially 1989 with Zakspeed, 2 DNFs, 30 DNPQs, one destroyed single seater career of a future DTM legend, one lost sponsor that doesn't reappear until 1997 thus precipitating in the team's demise despite briefly appearing in pre-season testing for 1990 and Yamaha taking a year out.
I am prone to misinterpretation and misunderstanding as well as difficulties with articulation, explaining things, stringing sentences together and finding the right words as these are all part and parcel of my having a learning disability as I am on the Autism Spectrum. These difficulties are particularly prominent when I am excited or frustrated or both as was the case with watching Mikey Doble blow his first BTCC pole position before the race even started as mentioned earlier in the thread.

Back on subject.

Zakspeed is an interesting case. They certainly failed in F1 with their own turbo engines (only a single twice-lapped 5th place to show for 4 seasons worth of trying) but the Yamaha OX88 engine they used in 1989 really let them down.

Mind you, Yamaha engines only ever yielded two podiums in 7 years of trying from 1991-1997, including Damon Hill's near-miss at Hungary in 1997.

(I will admit my main influence was F1/GP Rejects)
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Well, that name was all a plan... FA1L/FAIL... Come on, they couldn't have thought of it!
Strictly speaking, it should have been called the FA1J as their 1987 car was the FA1I.

They were using an Alfa Romeo chassis and engine that dated back to 1983 and therefore were now 5 years old.
Does Team HARD in the BTCC count now that they've folded? Only 1 Win (In the wet and in a reverse-grid race) in over a decade of trying, at least this makes them not as bad as Peugeot in the Supertouring era in this respect, but not much better either.
Any racing program ever run by Colin Kolles, and to a certain degree, his father Romulus.

• In 11 years of trying with 14 entries, his team has never finished in the top 5 at Le Mans, despite taking part in the top class each time

•He allegedly never paid for the Audi R10’s he got from Audi.

•2023 extended his team’s record of 12 consecutive Le Mans races without finishing a single one

•He literally took the name of an old British manufacturer and was then sued before the team even took to the track

•Team Vanwall were so bad during the 2023 FIA WEC season they were literally rejected a spot for 2024. they scored only 10 points during the entire season.

Not to mention running a team that used two-year-old Audis in the DTM from 2006 to 2009 and never scored a point. Other 2 year old cars got into the points during the same period, Paul di Resta in 2007 anyone?

Also their 2005 F3 Euro Series entry, never finished any higher than 6th all season and only scored 15 points and finished the lowest of all the teams who did the full season.

The only real success of any team involving the Kolles family is Pierre Kaffer scoring 4 wins and finishing 4th overall in the 2001 German F3 Season and could have been champion with better luck.
The Dallara 3087

International Formula 3000 is one of the few single seater categories (besides F1) that Dallara never managed to conquer. Their one attempt at a F3000 car was used by the EuroVenturini and Forti Corse teams in the 1987 Season, with only the latter sticking with the car for 1988. It only ever scored a single point at Spa in 1987 thanks to Marco Apicella being classified 5th as only half-points were awarded after the race was stopped and abandoned following an accident involving Luis Perez Sala and Alfonso de Vinuesa.

The car also appeared at the 1988 Brazilian Grand Prix, converted to F1 regs in the hands of Alex Caffi as the BMS Scuderia Italia/Dallara collaboration's first F1 chassis was not yet ready to race. Given its F3000 performance, and the fact that it was a year old, it was slowest in pre-qualifying. It was nearly 3 seconds off the pace of Gabriele Tarquini in the Coloni and nearly 9 and a half seconds slower than Andrea de Cesaris in the Rial. The F1 chassis was ready for the following race in Imola and only failed to make qualifying (and indeed the grid) once thereafter in Canada with the gap to Tarquini down to just 4 tenths of a second! At least the 3087 did better in its one F1 appearance than the Life L190 of two years later ever would.