FF cars... your opinion

[K1]

I enjoy racing with some FF's.

My Vitz and Spoon Civic are great to race. I tuned them very well (with some help from Neon Dukes settings), and was able to get amost nuetral, or even oversteering FF's.

and not the goofy sliding oversteer, but the kind where you can fling the front of the car into the corner, and floor it from the apex + outward. very fast, but a little tough to control (wheel).

FF's are quite fun though, especially in the type R race, Civic vs NSX! that is enjoyable.

 

[Street Fighter]

The only way any Civic could be used to win against a properly tuned NSX is with ALOT of horsepower to pass it on the straights.

Even then, the horsepower could be a detriment in the corners, which is the NSX's strong point, thus leading to slower entry/cornering/exit speeds.

You'd spend twice as much buying and tuning a Civic as you would buying an NSX and tuning it lightly and you'd end up with half the car that the NSX is.

Honda makes safe, reliable family cars. FF isn't a drivetrain built for speed. It's built for idiot commuters who floor it/stomp the brakes when they go into a spin, resulting in death. All front wheel drive does is prevent the car from spinning so the dumbass speeding to work in the rain can predict where the car is going to crash and prepare for it when he goes sliding off the road after speeding into a corner way too fast.

The NSX and S2000's are Honda's sport models, and they are two really great cars that surpass all of Honda's other vehicles when it comes to performance and potential.

 

[milefile]

Just my opinion, but I don't care for them. FR and MR for me.

 

[Frmr97GXE]

Street Fighter,

Nobody is claiming that Spoon CTR is faster than a fully tuned NSX, but it does beat AI NSXs in the Type R series. And it can more than hold its own against 3-series and Altezzas, despite not having a materially better power-to-weight.

 

[FuryX21]

I love the Acura Integra, it's my dream car (well dream car if the category only allows actual attainable cars). I wish I had one (in real life). Actually I do but its the first generation model (I still love it though). I'd love the Acura Integra Type-R.

Getting on topic, the FF cars aren't bad. Clearly they can't match the performance potential of rear-wheel drive cars and 4wd cars due to numerous factors, one being that so much weight is put over the front of the car and the car will always be "pulling" (as opposed to rear-wheel drive cars' rear wheels "pushing" them around the track). However, once properly set-up, they can be quite apt competitors. Thats not to say that you'll ever be able to completely eliminate the understeer, but they are capable. During an OLR series held awhile back, I used a fully tuned 'Teg to defeat the likes of the 787B and GT-One in a 3-lap race at Seattle. Sure GT's AI sucks, but hey....

 

[F.Zamataki]

AWD/4WD DOMINATES ALLLLL OFF YOUUUUUUUUUU

COWER IN FEAR AT IT'S ABILITY TO PUSH, ANNNDD PULL THROUGH A CORNER!!!

the mighty 4wd/awd, properley tuned with more power distribution to the rear wheels is the definitive grip, and drift car.
not to mention its SHOCKING acceleration capabilities.

 

[Driver X]

Originally posted by Frmr97GXE
Street Fighter,

Nobody is claiming that Spoon CTR is faster than a fully tuned NSX, but it does beat AI NSXs in the Type R series. And it can more than hold its own against 3-series and Altezzas, despite not having a materially better power-to-weight.

Do you mean computer controlled Altezzas and NSXs?
If you do, either the AI sucks worse than I thought, or you simply have way more power than they do.

The Altezza is better than the Supra in sports terms, unless the Supra is HEAVILY modified and stripped of it's rediculous weight, and the NSX is a masterpiece. The Civic can't touch those cars if the power is somewhat even. The EG/EK could even have a slight power advantage but the latter cars would still be able to defeat it.

FF's can prove to be formidable opponents, but only up to a certain level. Beyond that level, the MR's and FR's reign. Maybe even a GC8, but AWD is beyond me.

 

[Frmr97GXE]

Originally posted by Driver X
Do you mean .....

Spoon CTR is more than a second faster around Laguna than Altezza (both fully modded, on T3s). TRD Celica is slightly faster as well. All I'm saying is that top FF cars are a good match for the likes of 328/Altezza/Silvias in the game.

While we are on the subject - Supra TT is much faster than Altezza because of hp advantage. And NSX in the game is a huge disappointment, made even more so in light of the brilliance of 3400S.

 

[Driver X]

Are you suggesting that all of the cars you listed are in comparison after purchasing all of the most expensive parts?

 

[miata13B]

Since this is a opinion thread over FF cars I think I am going to do a review on the RSX Type-S

Full Suspensiont/Drivetrain/ lightweight and T8's
HP around 258 to 264hp

Handling - This is an interesting FF car to run. I found although not as nimble as the Spoon or the Xsara, this car is a great competitor for handling. I actually think as a FF car you can get this car to handle almost like an AWD car with the proper tweaks. There are few incidents I ran into where I had understeer really hinder me. This car can be made to handle on rails.

Acceleration - Not the strongest part of this or any FF cars in general, but if it was only FF cars I would rate this in the top 6 accelerating FF cars. You do have to keep the revs high in this car because you do feel the power decrease gradually pending on shift point and where the revs catch in next gear. This car is a bullet leaving turns though

Braking - the proper setup on any car will give you great braking, but with the lightweight on a FF NA car in general you can get these thigns to stop on the dime. The RSX has great weight shift for going into turns with the setup I put on it. I found a lot of times I could actually spin the car in turns like an over-powered Rwd car with braking too hard into the tuirns.

Will it take on the Pro FF challenge - Hard to say, I did not get a chance to check on the tire wear of this car, but if I could get some T4's to last 10 laps, I believe this car could take the Spoon and TRD, but the Xsara is what I am scared of. . .

Final rating out of only FF cars I this car an 88/100 There are a few things I would say would improve this car would be a decrease in HP by about 10 horses and an increase in Torque at the same time to give a little better mid-range power. I haven't tried tire wear on this car yet, so I can't rate it high then this until I see how fast it chews those rubbers up. If this car does not chew through them fast I would rate this car closer to a 91 or 92.

 

[Frmr97GXE]

DriverX,
Yes, all fully modded, all tuned, all on T3, all run by the same driver on the same track (Laguna). Time - best of 5 laps. ITRs and FTO run times equivalent to 328, which is a couple of secs off Spoon CTR/ TRD Celica/Altezza times. Silvias S13 (1800)/S15 that I have are just slightly faster.

 

[Darin]

Originally posted by F.Zamataki
AWD/4WD DOMINATES ALLLLL OFF YOUUUUUUUUUU

COWER IN FEAR AT IT'S ABILITY TO PUSH, ANNNDD PULL THROUGH A CORNER!!!

the mighty 4wd/awd, properley tuned with more power distribution to the rear wheels is the definitive grip, and drift car.
not to mention its SHOCKING acceleration capabilities.

You are greatly mistaken. So, you worship AWD/4WD, huh? Okay, I'll do a alittle comparo now. Hmm....lets put a Tommy Kaira ZZ-II and a Toyota GT-one road. You know what will come out of top? You said right, the ZZ-II will come in second by a minute and 5 seconds. Now the 4WD/AWD is out, the GT-one road againest a Vitz 1.5RS. You know which one will when in looks!? Indeed, the PINK MONSTER VITZ would kill the GT-one in looks. Even the GT-one......er........would kill it on the course. That was pointless.

But, seriously, you are greatly mistaken. The 4WD/AWD cars are ment for offroad useage. On the Road, they are not great. They are harder to turn because of the shaft that connects to the back. That weight hurts the cars performance. Even though you are packing 500 horsepower, The weight still would contain alot of your cars real true power. Anyone, feel free to correct me if im wrong.

 

[Street Fighter]

Maybe I should be posting on an automotive forum because if any of you agree with the way Frmr97GXE tunes his cars, this forum is not for me.

Having all the most expensive parts can actually make the car slower than it could be, and if Frmr97GXE can't recognize this, maybe he should be playing a game like NFS:U or something equally oversimplified..

 

[Frmr97GXE]

Originally posted by Street Fighter
Maybe ......

Brilliant, now would you be so kind to enlighten me as to which of th "most expensive" parts I put on Altezza or 3-series make the damn thing slower?

And one more thing - don't tell me which games to play, and I won't tell you where to go, deal?

 

[Frmr97GXE]

Darin
So things like 911 Turbo, Gallardo, Murcielago, RS6 are meant for off road use? Or FTO LM ans ZZII to keep it within the scope of the the game?

 

[Street Fighter]

I didn't say that adding the most expensive parts would make the car slower. I said that the most expensive power parts can make tha car slower than it could be, say, with less expensive parts.

If GT3 had a dyno tool or anything like that, just to take the guess work out of tuning (yes, tuning, not just upgrading), I would be able to prove this point to you.

 

[BreakerOhio]

Originally posted by Street Fighter

A key technique in driving FF cars to their limit is left foot braking should you understeer into a corner. You can keep the revs up with the accelerator and shift weight forward to counter the understeer, at the same time. However, it seems there are no PS2 wheels that allow this, unless GT4 devises a way to accept up and down analog right input at the same time.
:\

I don't know what wheel you have tried, but the logitech wheels let you do left foot braking. You can gas and brake at the same time and its verified by seeing the bars in replays. I use the GT4 wheel.

 

[Frmr97GXE]

Originally posted by Street Fighter
I didn't say that adding the most expensive parts would make the car slower. I said that the most expensive power parts can make tha car slower than it could be, say, with less expensive parts.

If GT3 had a dyno tool or anything like that, just to take the guess work out of tuning (yes, tuning, not just upgrading), I would be able to prove this point to you.

What are you talking about? Do you mean Turbo3 being faster than Turbo4 for some cars or something else? Because if it's the latter you are dead wrong. Considering that we are working with close ratio 6-speed transmissions, peak hp is a practically perfect approximation of the relative areas under hp curve over those ~2500rpm that we use.

If it's the former, you are still wrong. There are only 3 normal street cars in the game that are slower with Turbo 4 than with Turbo 3 in my experience - Supra, Espirit, Chaser (then there are Cobra and Zonda, but they are special cases). Altezza is not one of them as it doesn't have nearly the same level of hp as those 3 do.

 

[Street Fighter]

Whatever man. Tuning isn't some general thing that can be applied to every track. Try to get all technical on my ass... wtf is that.

Bring your 1000 horsepower Supra to Cote d'Azur and battle my 330hp MR-S and see who wins.

 

[Frmr97GXE]

Dude, seriously, do you even know yourself wtf you are talking about?

 

[Street Fighter]

Yes, but you aren't even reading what I type, so I'm not going to bother anymore.

Welcome to GTP

 

[ving]

Frmr97GXE

the is only one problem with you arguement d00d. this topic is supposed to be discusing FF cars and afaik the altezza is FR?

 

[Frmr97GXE]

I'm just using Altezza as a benchmark for FFs 'cause it has a similar power/weight and lap times.

 

[Street Fighter]

Enough said...

 

[Duke]

Why is there "enough said"? I have nothing against FWD drag cars, but do you realize how much cheaper and easier it is to reach the same times/traps with a RWD car?

 

[miata13B]

Originally posted by neon_duke
Why is there "enough said"? I have nothing against FWD drag cars, but do you realize how much cheaper and easier it is to reach the same times/traps with a RWD car?

For the amount of money you would spend on a mid 90's civic or something and the amount of mods done to it. . . you would be looking in excess of 10 grand to get it running decently during a drag race. . . with half of that you can get yourself an F-body and all-motor which is the important fact get it running the same times if not faster

 

[TurboDrift]

...........................back to the subject....
I recently won the spoon civic, that thing is awesome, I wish my civic revved to 17.5k RPM!!! even with less horsepower I was easily able to put down better lap times than with my ITR. Definately my favortie FF car!!

 

[neuspeed]

Spoon CTR is the bomb..