FIA opens F1 2011 new team selection

[Ardius]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/81991

Formula 1's ruling body will re-open the selection process for a potential 13th team to join the sport in 2011, the FIA said on Thursday.

The governing body has taken the decision after US F1, which had the 13th slot for the 2010 season, failed to be ready to compete in this year's championship.

The American team had requested that the FIA delayed its entry for next year.

However, the FIA has decided to re-open the selection process for the final slot, meaning there is likely to be a significant number of candidates hoping to race next season.

Lola, Epsilon Euskadi, Prodrive and N.Technology were among the teams to have applied for an entry for this year.

The governing body also said US F1 could face sanctions for its absence.

"With regard to the USF1 team's non-participation in the 2010 championship, the world council mandated the FIA president, in full compliance with the new code of practice for disciplinary matters, to take forward the most appropriate action," it said in a statement.

So, what do people think? Which teams should be let in this time around and why?

Personally I think Prodrive should be finally let in as a proper entry, its about time. I don't think I need to explain why they are a suitable entry - highly successful in all series entered, Richards has experience as team principal of Benetton and running BAR. They also have backing from the Middle East and the tempting Aston Martin brand to use.
Lola would be a great choice too, or Epsilon and RML.

 

[Tired Tyres]

I'm hoping for Prodrive.

Perhaps anyone who wants to enter can do so and then they have a race off to see which team gets the 13th slot.

 

[Dijital Majik]

Prodrive, Lola and RML should definitely get a look in, in that order.

 

[TheCracker]

If USF1 can get their act together, i think they should get the slot. If not, Stefan GP are obviously chewing at the bit for an entry and already have a car, or almost have a car. I would like to see Prodrive have a shot at it, but i don't know if they're interested any more.

 

[Sureboss]

Stefan GP was a massive fraud.

 

[waggles]

I'd love to see Penske have a go-even though they are showing no interest.

Epsilon Euskadi would be great too.

However, the dream-Triple 8 Racing.

 

[Famine]

If not, Stefan GP are obviously chewing at the bit for an entry and already have a car, or almost have a car.

Not to mention that they we recently outed in the German press for fraudulently obtaining the Toyota car and factory (by lying about involvement in aeronautical and space vehicle projects), have no drivers or sponsors, have a company turnover of 40 Euros, a company value of 500 Euros (split 80:20 between the Stefanovic brothers) and one employee and were essentially just in it to take sponsorship money and run like crazy to the back end of Serbia?

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I'm against Prodrive. I think Dave Richards mismanaged his 2008 entry as badly as USF1 did theirs this year. The FIA might have failed to get customer chassis legslation ratified, but Dave Richards wanted to buy a McLaren chassis and a Mercedes engine. There's nothing wrong with that, but given that he had no backup plan to put in place in the event a customer chassis deal failed, it clearly didn't occur to him that other teams - like Williams - might have issues with the fact that he could buy the best chassis and the best engine on the grid and have success because of his deep pockets rather than based on his racing credentials.

 

[TheCracker]

Stefan GP was a massive fraud.

Not to mention that they we recently outed in the German press for fraudulently obtaining the Toyota car and factory (by lying about involvement in aeronautical and space vehicle projects), have no drivers or sponsors, have a company turnover of 40 Euros, a company value of 500 Euros (split 80:20 between the Stefanovic brothers) and one employee and were essentially just in it to take sponsorship money and run like crazy to the back end of Serbia?

Oops, must have missed that memo.

Although it does sound like a very retro 70's F1 story.

 

[Blitz187]

+1 for Prodrive.

 

[Only_in_f1]

Not to mention that they we recently outed in the German press for fraudulently obtaining the Toyota car and factory (by lying about involvement in aeronautical and space vehicle projects), have no drivers or sponsors, have a company turnover of 40 Euros, a company value of 500 Euros (split 80:20 between the Stefanovic brothers) and one employee and were essentially just in it to take sponsorship money and run like crazy to the back end of Serbia?

Have you seen the AMCO corp site?

http://www.amco.st/

On the Gallery page theres a photo with Mr Stefanovic in, the logo is photoshopped onto the wing.

 

[Famine]

Have you seen the AMCO corp site?

http://www.amco.st/

On the Gallery page theres a photo with Mr Stefanovic in, the logo is photoshopped onto the wing.

This one?

You couldn't make it up.


Although they did. And Toyota believed it.

 

[magicalgin]

I'd like to see Lola, Epsilon or Prodrive. The rest is... meh

 

[peterjford]

I wouldn't mind seeing a USF1 entry, as long as all the people at the top were replaced. Since that isn't going to happen, Prodrive, Lola, or Epsilon.

 

[Ardius]

I'm against Prodrive. I think Dave Richards mismanaged his 2008 entry as badly as USF1 did theirs this year. The FIA might have failed to get customer chassis legslation ratified, but Dave Richards wanted to buy a McLaren chassis and a Mercedes engine. There's nothing wrong with that, but given that he had no backup plan to put in place in the event a customer chassis deal failed, it clearly didn't occur to him that other teams - like Williams - might have issues with the fact that he could buy the best chassis and the best engine on the grid and have success because of his deep pockets rather than based on his racing credentials.

Or perhaps it didn't occur to you that such a backup plan was not possible for Prodrive because:
1. Designing, building and developing their own chassis would cost a serious amount of money - more than Richards could find.
2. Using their own chassis was no guarantee of success and would likely take many years to become competitive, assuming sponsors would fund it that long.

Combined with the FIA telling them they could use the customer chassis, you can't blame Richards for attempting to join, even vainly hoping Williams & others would accept it.
Then the FIA turned a blind eye to the Toro Rosso and Super Aguri's.....ok, admittedly it wasn't the same as a customer McLaren but still.

Its interesting you compare it to USF1 - which one still exists today? If Prodrive are such bad managers...how did they take BAR to the top in 2004? How is taking the sensible route and attempting to be competitive from the start but without a backup plan the same as a team mismanaging their funds and destroying themselves?

I still don't understand what you have against them, it just seems to me you are opposing them purely because they are a fan-favourite, because I've yet to see you give a reason why Prodrive is a bad entry compared to say a team led by a Serbian con-man or a team with no race experience and two daydreamers.
Its like arguing against Ferrari being a good entry because they have too much politics despite having the very obvious successful racing history and experience. If you were arguing that success in other series doesn't translate to F1 necessarily, I would agree, but this wouldn't make them a bad entry still.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Prodrive are not a bad entry per se. I just get the sense that they quit at the first sign of trouble. What was wrong with out-sourcing development of a chassis to a design studio? It's far cheaper than developing your own design from scratch.

I can't help but think that Prodrive got the grid entry and the gave up on it when one of the twenty-one other bidders could have made it on their own.

 

[Ardius]

Maybe, maybe not, who else was bidding for the spot? I would have thought most entries at the time would have been banking on customer cars as well.
Fair point about outsourcing it, though that again doesn't get around the problem of the car still potentially being uncompetitive.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

The only one I know of for certain was F3 and WSR team Carlin.

 

[Rennsport]

+1 for Prodrive

 

[Jim Prower]

I say anyone with a car that meets the regs and shows up at the track should be allowed to race. so long as they arent' dangerous.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I say anyone with a car that meets the regs and shows up at the track should be allowed to race. so long as they arent' dangerous.

I'm afraid you've got three problems there, Jim:

1) While circuits like Bahrain, Shanghai and Abu Dhabi could most likely hold thirty or even thirty-two cars comfortably, Monaco can only hold twenty-six safely. Therefore, the grid is effectively capped at twenty-six cars, unless you want to drop Monaco.

2) If you were to cap the grid at twenty-six but allow anyone to show up, you'd have to go through pre-qualifying. The problem here is that teams cost at least forty million dollars to establish and run. Nobody in their right mind is going to invest that much money if there's a realistic chance they won't even get to race. So you'd effectively only get twenty-six cars showing up.

3) If you invite just anyone, you're going to end up with a grid full of cars that are twenty seconds off the pace and so we'd all be better off watching GP2. And, of course, you're going to get Andrea Modas and QADBAKs and Stefans showing up - the kind of people who will only damage Formula 1's reputation.

 

[zed300]

F1 will be all the more, for world based teams. U.S. should get behind and sponsor on a world level.They might not think they need it, but it couldn't hurt, surely.
USF1 should exist in the greatest motorsport of all.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

F1 will be all the more, for world based teams.

Let's see ...

England: McLaren, Virgin, Williams
Italy: Ferrari, Scuderia Toro Rosso
France: Renault
Germany: Mercedes-Benz
Austria: Red Bull Racing
Switzerland: Sauber
Spain: Hispania
Malaysia: Lotus
India: Force India

The Formula 1 grid is already represented by teams from nine nations - and drivers from twelve (sixteen if you count test drivers). It's true that most of these are based in England, but that's just the nature of the sport: Heathrow Airport is the single most accessible airport in the world, hence it is easier for teams to be based in England. There's also a much higher concentration of people with the skills and know-how in Europe.

 

[Ardius]

Let's see ...

England: McLaren, Virgin, Williams
Italy: Ferrari, Scuderia Toro Rosso
France: Renault
Germany: Mercedes-Benz
Austria: Red Bull Racing
Switzerland: Sauber
Spain: Hispania
Malaysia: Lotus
India: Force India

The Formula 1 grid is already represented by teams from nine nations - and drivers from twelve (sixteen if you count test drivers). It's true that most of these are based in England, but that's just the nature of the sport: Heathrow Airport is the single most accessible airport in the world, hence it is easier for teams to be based in England. There's also a much higher concentration of people with the skills and know-how in Europe.

Its not just the airport
Its the fact that motorsports has been focused in so called "Motorsports Valley" for well over 50 years now. All the infastructure is based there, with the chain of suppliers, windtunnels, experienced staff, engine manufacturers and so on all being based in one area.
Same with Faenza, thanks mainly to Ferrari but also Minardi and the other Italian teams (as well as Le Mans teams, etc), there is a solid infastructure there that has been built up over many years.

This is why basing your team even outside of these two areas is giving yourself more problems than you need. Ask Toyota about that . This was also why I wasn't surprised to see USF1 still sourcing out electrical work to England after their speech about how America makes everything anyway . The one thing you need most in F1 is time, so using up your time waiting for Cosworth and other suppliers to ship the parts over (as well as the added cost) is not helpful. Not to mention making it harder for such suppliers to liaise with the team and sort out technical issues. There's loads of other factors too, like having to move experienced staff away from their homes to work for you, like if USF1 hired Adrian Newey, he may not want to move to America.
Sauber is one of the few to have successfully built up their own network, though they probably still rely on some suppliers in Italy or the UK.

Anyway, countries don't need teams to become interested. We have learnt time and again that its the drivers that garner support and interest. Get a good US driver into F1 and if he manages good results, the interest will come.

 

[yeti]

I vote Prodrive... mainly cos David Richards has 2 first names.

C.

 

[SaberFire]

Stefan GP. There is simply not enough cloak and dagger in F1 these days

 

[yeti]

On a more serious note - I'd be all for having whoever turns up able to Qualify - and the top 26 race...

That way *new* teams could prepare their cars for the following year by getting proper practice and track time in on the actual tracks etc...

C.

 

[Ardius]

But I still think the 107% rule should be re-instated, although only applying to each session (so the "pole" time set in Q1, etc) so that teams aren't disadvantaged by changing track conditions moving the pole time forward.

 

[yeti]

But I still think the 107% rule should be re-instated, although only applying to each session (so the "pole" time set in Q1, etc) so that teams aren't disadvantaged by changing track conditions moving the pole time forward.

Yeah - I agree with this too...

OOC - who would've qualified under this rule today?

EDIT

1 5 Sebastian Vettel RBR-Renault 1:55.029 1:53.883 1:54.101 14 
2 7 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:55.313 1:54.331 1:54.242 16 
3 8 Fernando Alonso Ferrari 1:54.612 1:54.172 1:54.608 20 
4 2 Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:55.341 1:54.707 1:55.217 19 
5 4 Nico Rosberg Mercedes Benz GP Ltd 1:55.463 1:54.682 1:55.241 13 
6 6 Mark Webber RBR-Renault 1:55.298 1:54.318 1:55.284 13 
7 3 Michael Schumacher Mercedes Benz GP Ltd 1:55.593 1:55.105 1:55.524 15 
8 1 Jenson Button McLaren-Mercedes 1:55.715 1:55.168 1:55.672 17 
9 11 Robert Kubica Renault 1:55.511 1:54.963 1:55.885 17 
10 14 Adrian Sutil Force India-Mercedes 1:55.213 1:54.996 1:56.309 16 
11 9 Rubens Barrichello Williams-Cosworth 1:55.969 1:55.330  12 
12 15 Vitantonio Liuzzi Force India-Mercedes 1:55.628 1:55.653  13 
13 10 Nico Hulkenberg Williams-Cosworth 1:56.375 1:55.857  14 
14 22 Pedro de la Rosa BMW Sauber-Ferrari 1:56.428 1:56.237  13 
15 16 Sebastien Buemi STR-Ferrari 1:56.189 1:56.265  14 
16 23 Kamui Kobayashi BMW Sauber-Ferrari 1:56.541 1:56.270  13 
17 12 Vitaly Petrov Renault 1:56.167 1:56.619  14 
18 17 Jaime Alguersuari STR-Ferrari 1:57.071   6 
19 24 Timo Glock Virgin-Cosworth 1:59.728   7 
20 18 Jarno Trulli Lotus-Cosworth 1:59.852   6 
21 19 Heikki Kovalainen Lotus-Cosworth 2:00.313   7 
22 25 Lucas di Grassi Virgin-Cosworth 2:00.587   7 
23 21 Bruno Senna HRT-Cosworth 2:03.240   6 
24 20 Karun Chandhok HRT-Cosworth 2:04.904

So - with the 107% rule - the two HRT's would've been dropped...

107% of 1:54.612 = 2:02.635
(Alonso was quickest in Q1)

C.

 

[Ardius]

Ok, I have no idea how to work out 107% haha. Maths fail.