Formula 1 Lenovo Austrian Grand Prix 2026Formula 1 

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I'm surprised it wasn't a red flag.
 
This might be a bit premature to say but I'm glad to see that Ferrari is not way behind the Mercedes here. This track is very much a power track so to see them this close to the Merc means they might not just run away with it and we will have a fight at the front.
 
I'm surprised it wasn't a red flag.
Same, especially considering where Max went off. That could've easily turned into a nasty situation if another car lost its rear in the same fashion as Max.

George Russell keeps the pole. George was shown a single yellow and lifted sufficiently, and was still able to take pole by 2 tenths. Objectively, George delivered a monster of a lap, so congrats to him on that front, but otherwise, this is sounding like another fail on the side of Race Direction, given the circumstances.

With the heat in Austria, I think that tomorrow is still going to be at least a little bit spicy. Since Mercedes has been having issues with their batteries overheating, I think Ferrari will still be the favorites here, especially if Leclerc and/or Lewis can get in front of Russell on the start.
 
MotoGP uses the painted line, as can clearly be seen here from last years race:
View attachment 1547255
Yes! That's what it seems to be, good find :D

I'm surprised it wasn't a red flag.
Leaving it as a single yellow with only 4 cars to cross the line seemed to be the plan. In the end, the car was so far off the line it technically wasn't a danger to any driver who obeyed the yellow flags. It wasn't exactly parked broadside on the racing line. This is what yellow flags are for, to tell drivers where to slow down and let them carry on racing.
Same, especially considering where Max went off. That could've easily turned into a nasty situation if another car lost its rear in the same fashion as Max.
Why should anyone crash in the same spot, there was a yellow flag out? It was yellow before any other car went off and the crash was clearly driver error rather than something on the track surface, so any further crashes would be entirely on the driver. The entire point of a yellow flag is "don't crash here", so nobody understands any circumstances should find themselves hitting the Red Bull in the tyres far away from the track lines.

In the end, Russell did lift off enough to count as significant under single-yellow and kept his lap. The fact that he was slow for 1 corner and 5-tenths up in the other 9 is amazing though so it must have been a truly epic lap otherwise. We will see what the fallout is though.
 
Why should anyone crash in the same spot, there was a yellow flag out? It was yellow before any other car went off and the crash was clearly driver error rather than something on the track surface, so any further crashes would be entirely on the driver. The entire point of a yellow flag is "don't crash here", so nobody understands any circumstances should find themselves hitting the Red Bull in the tyres far away from the track lines.
It's more of a concern that Turn 9 at Red Bull Ring is a very high-speed, downhill corner, and that you have other drivers on track squeezing quite literally everything out of their cars to steal whatever lap time they can at that moment. If one of the other drivers had a similar off for similar reasons, which is not outside of the realm of possibility, then you have another car careening out of control in the same general area of Max and his car, which can create a nasty situation real quick.

Because of that, I was surprised a Red Flag, or at the very least a consistent double-yellow, wasn't called.
 
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It's more of a concern that Turn 9 at Red Bull Ring is a very high-speed, downhill corner, and that you have other drivers on track squeezing quite literally everything out of their cars to steal whatever lap time they can at that moment. If one of the other drivers had a similar off for similar reasons, which is not outside of the realm of possibility, then you have another car careening out of control in the same general area of Max and his car, which can create a nasty situation real quick.

Because of that, I was surprised a Red Flag, or at the very least a consistent double-yellow, wasn't called.
Why would anyone have the same crash under a yellow flag? That is the entire point of a yellow flag. If it's a fast or a blind corner, then why go through there fast? Drivers have to take responsibility for their actions as well you know.
Single yellow - don't crash
Double yellow - don't crash
 
Why would anyone have the same crash under a yellow flag?
Because it was a single yellow, which only requires a relatively small reduction in speed to be within the rules. That means that drivers can and will attempt to take advantage and try to carry as much speed as they can through the affected section (as we saw George do today), which can still create a dangerous situation if someone has an off in a high-speed corner like Turn 9, with there already being a car off the track. A double-yellow takes that possibility off the table.

Drivers indeed do have to take responsibility for their actions, but Race Control and the safety teams they command also play a role to keep things safe. Fair play to George, he took advantage of the situation and stayed within the rules, but Race Control imo dropped the ball given the greater circumstances.
 
Soo, apparently the stewards deleted the lap time for George, but they also ruled no further action for the double-yellow infringement, so at the moment, it's looking like George Russell is keeping his pole position.

It seems like it's going to come down to is what the actual lap data says for George vs. the timing of the stewards waving the double yellow. This is...a bit of a mess, to say the least. :boggled:
Looking at the documents, the deleted lap "times" were all the inlaps after the session had already finished. Not sure why it was necessary to delete anything there.
 
Looking at the documents, the deleted lap "times" were all the inlaps after the session had already finished. Not sure why it was necessary to delete anything there.
Yeah, that was an odd one, for sure. Definitely feels like FIA wasn't all there today.
 
Because it was a single yellow, which only requires a relatively small reduction in speed to be within the rules. That means that drivers can and will attempt to take advantage and try to carry as much speed as they can through the affected section (as we saw George do today), which can still create a dangerous situation if someone has an off in a high-speed corner like Turn 9, with there already being a car off the track. A double-yellow takes that possibility off the table.

Drivers indeed do have to take responsibility for their actions, but Race Control and the safety teams they command also play a role to keep things safe. Fair play to George, he took advantage of the situation and stayed within the rules, but Race Control imo dropped the ball given the greater circumstances.
Do you even understand what a Yellow Flag means? There are different levels to show off the danger of the incident to the next drivers coming into the zone, which I explained above. Regardless of single or double, both mean don't crash. The time within a session matters not to the level of flag to be shown locally.

Bear in mind I have been a marshal for now 17 years, I know what I am talking about here. Unless you can tell me you are John Yellow Flag who invented the yellow flag rules, or have similar officiating experience, perhaps you should try to understand what I am saying and why.
 
Finding two-tenths under yellows is fishy to me. If he did lift to the extent of the rules, this Mercedes is far too OP.
 
What a hectic quali finale...I was expecting to see George have his pole rescinded by the time we made it back to the hotel but it seems he's gonna keep it?
Ironically, George came out for the final stint just as Max was starting a flyer, and I yelled (jokingly) "Get in his way again George!" We all know the history between these two. And yet it ended up being Max who would've cost George pole. Except apparently not?
Either way, surely that's a pit lane start for Max. If so, will be exciting to see him slice his way through the field tomorrow!
 
Their 1 driver and 2 red cars... :P
There is indeed a noticeable difference in reaction between Lew and Charl. Even when Charles pipped Lewis for provisional pole, the cheers weren't as loud. Crazy just how quickly the tides can shift in this sport.
 
Indeed, Max not having a great season either, and some of his fans screaming that the other cars are too fast, with little understanding of how things work.
 
Bear in mind I have been a marshal for now 17 years, I know what I am talking about here. Unless you can tell me you are John Yellow Flag who invented the yellow flag rules, or have similar officiating experience, perhaps you should try to understand what I am saying and why.
I know, I've seen you mention it here whenever safety calls come up. It's why I'm kinda surprised that you're seemingly not factoring in other aspects at play here, namely the corner itself, the nature of Max's incident, and the risks and likely outcome in the event of another car having a similar off at that same high-speed corner.

If another driver made a mistake and has an off at Turn 9 right after Max, and they were still maintaining a relatively high speed because it was only a single-yellow in that section, and therefore only needed to have a relatively small lift, where do you believe they are likely to end up? That's why I've been arguing that a double-yellow at minimum would've been the ideal call.

Also, I don't get why you're being hostile all of a sudden. I've been totally cordial with you in this discussion.
 
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I thought the rule was you weren't allowed to improve on a yellow flag affected all?
 
I know, I've seen you mention it here whenever safety calls come up. It's why I'm kinda surprised that you're seemingly not factoring in other aspects at play here, namely the corner itself, the nature of Max's incident, and the risks and likely outcome in the event of another car having a similar off at that same high-speed corner.

If another driver made a mistake and has an off at Turn 9 right after Max, and they were still maintaining a relatively high speed because it was only a single-yellow in that section, and therefore only needed to have a relatively small lift, where do you believe they are likely to end up? That's why I've been arguing that a double-yellow at minimum would've been the ideal call.

Also, I don't get why you're being hostile all of a sudden. I've been totally cordial with you in this discussion.
Apologies. I have just seen a lot of seriously dumb takes from people in the fallout from this incident and yours, though nowhere near "seriously dumb" seeming to insinuate that drivers should still drive in a manner that they can crash while in a single yellow was a bit of a breaking point for me, so I'm sorry you took the brunt for it.

Look, F1 for many years has tied itself into knots with yellow flag rules because they don't want to properly penalise or enforce an actual numerical reduction of speed beyond "discernibly reduced speed" within the regulations. It keep flip flopping from craziness like Hungary 2016 where Rosberg drove flat out through a Double Yellow zone (objectively wrong) and kept his lap, which brought in the Double Yellow lap deletion rule, to Verstappen also getting pole in Imola 2022 because he wasn't going faster in the yellow zone (objectively correct). But this seems to flip in the races as Norris in Qatar and Hadjar in Canada where they get a 10-second stop/go for not having a momentary lift in yellow flags in the race. Something isn't being conveyed well if it's the harshest penalty possible for the infringement in the races but allowed to stay in qualifying.

F1 actually asks for a reduction in Yellow Flag waving in qualifying sessions, and to only ever put them out when absolutely necessary, as they don't want to be deleting laps. Confusion for running a different set of rules in one session compared to the rest of the season will always cause chaos.

Regardless, that crash is still a single yellow. Single Yellow means slow down, no overtaking and keep full control of the car as you are entering a section where danger has occurred. The only thing Double yellow adds is be prepared to dramatically change direction. As much as Max hit the wall, there was no need for cars to dramatically change direction as it was far away from the track. That incident wouldn't be upgraded to double yellow until people started walking trackside at any normal event.

The learnings from this is F1 needs to be very clear what they expect to be single or double yellow flag in qualifying sessions, and they need to make it clear to drivers and fans what drivers are required to do in these situations. Bear in mind this decision has to be made by a marshal in less than a second and it can be hard to determine whether a car has stopped or hit a wall through a cloud of smoke or dust. Genuinely a few weeks ago the clouds of dust thrown up by cars in the gravel trap were so bad it took us a full minute for anyone to determine that there was a car stopped in the gravel trap. The answer is not to throw yellows "just in case", as false flags like that can be just as dangerous in a boy-who-cried-wolf situation. There is a careful balance there.

In the end, Russell (who I have often criticised for being one of the worst offenders for yellow flag infringements) did slow down enough for the flag he saw displayed for the stewards to not delete the lap. It turned a 0.5s pole gap into 0.2s as data printouts show the reduced speed until the green flag was visible. Whether that's how the FIA want it to be going forwards this is now the point they must decide.
 
I thought the rule was you weren't allowed to improve on a yellow flag affected all?
You cannot improve in the yellow flag affected mini sector if it's a single yellow. If it's a double yellow the whole lap is deleted.

The rest of George's lap was just that good
1782591312660.webp
 
You cannot improve in the yellow flag affected mini sector if it's a single yellow. If it's a double yellow the whole lap is deleted.

The rest of George's lap was just that good
View attachment 1547304

Ah it's the double yellow rule I was thinking of. Thanks.
 
The learnings from this is F1 needs to be very clear what they expect to be single or double yellow flag in qualifying sessions, and they need to make it clear to drivers and fans what drivers are required to do in these situations. Bear in mind this decision has to be made by a marshal in less than a second and it can be hard to determine whether a car has stopped or hit a wall through a cloud of smoke or dust. Genuinely a few weeks ago the clouds of dust thrown up by cars in the gravel trap were so bad it took us a full minute for anyone to determine that there was a car stopped in the gravel trap. The answer is not to throw yellows "just in case", as false flags like that can be just as dangerous in a boy-who-cried-wolf situation. There is a careful balance there.

I'm in agreeance with this bit for sure. Maybe in that specific situation, tools need to be improved to tell you the status of a car, I imagine you got access to live timing? Maybe something from the car to alert a marshall that a car is at a standstill. Tailor it to your specific part of the track as well. Just thinking out loud mainly, you may already have seen stuff like this.
 
Single yellow - don't crash
Double yellow - don't crash
They could wave them in the first three corners today after the start to keep it safe
vector-design-emoticon-silly-eyes-silly-eyes-emoticon-110819990-Photoroom.webp
 
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62°C track temperatures is crazy, especially for being halfway up a mountain in Europe!
 
No Lap 1, Turn 3 murders?! 😮
 
Man the drone cam is bad
 
Cadillac should start producing barbecues
 
Another car on fire.
 
Perez Retires
Smoke apparently
 
The heat is definitely not being kind to these cars today. Lawson was reporting some kind of fire earlier.
 
Wonder how much longer Max can follow Lewis for.
 
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