Gran Turismo 7: How Trial Mountain Has Changed

Definitely not a fan of the changes, honestly. The final chicane in particular looks like a harsher version of the Suzuka's Casio Triangle, which imo is already a very un-fun chicane. I can see a good number of pileups happening in that section. The old chicane was fun because you had a couple options on how to navigate it, but nailing the corner would let you keep a good bit of speed and cement a good lap time. Also, I can't say for certain without actually driving around the track, but it looks like the tarmac all around is significantly wider as well.

I'm sure that the changes were indeed made to make the track more friendly towards E-sports and to facilitate bigger grids, and the FIA might've had some input as well, but imo it seems like the track has ended up becoming much more noob-friendly as a result. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but I personally feel like it's quite removed from the Trial Mountain of the past, nor do I think that these change have made the track better. It really does look like PD gave it the Tilke treatment. I don't absolutely despise the revisions, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't at least a bit let down.
 
NotThePrez
Definitely not a fan of the changes, honestly. The final chicane in particular looks like a harsher version of the Suzuka's Casio Triangle, which imo is already a very un-fun chicane. I can see a good number of pileups happening in that section. The old chicane was fun because you had a couple options on how to navigate it, but nailing the corner would let you keep a good bit of speed and cement a good lap time. Also, I can't say for certain without actually driving around the track, but it looks like the tarmac all around is significantly wider as well.

I'm sure that the changes were indeed made to make the track more friendly towards E-sports and to facilitate bigger grids, and the FIA might've had some input as well, but imo it seems like the track has ended up becoming much more noob-friendly as a result. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but I personally feel like it's quite removed from the Trial Mountain of the past, nor do I think that these change have made the track better. It really does look like PD gave it the Tilke treatment. I don't absolutely despise the revisions, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't at least a bit let down.
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I wonder if PD can do what they did with Fuji Speedway in GT4, and have several different versions of the track, from different eras. That way they could keep the new E-Sports friendly variant, whilst also giving us the older, more flowing layout to enjoy.
 
Usually it's the first turn that will cause mayhem. That final chicane will be one for the ages.


Jerome
 
Duphman
Is it safe to say the course changes are due to the FIA certification process? I do remember Polyphony stating that their tracks needed to be certified. I could see the FIA having some concerns with the original design.
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An actual person from the FIA said they have nothing to do with PD's original Circuits. The tracks referred to were likely the Real Circuits, something that was bragged about with the Partnership Announcement when Silverstone was shown off in GT6.
 
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RACECAR
An actual person from the FIA said they have nothing to do with PD's original Circuits. The tracks referred to were likely the Real Circuits, something that was bragged about with the Partnership Announcement when Silverstine was shown off in GT6.
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This makes me think maybe the changes because of GT Sport physics. Imagine Kaz testing on it and the car spinning then he asked the team to extend the straight road. lol. (Sorry I'm a bit joking).
 
RACECAR
An actual person from the FIA said they have nothing to do with PD's original Circuits. The tracks referred to were likely the Real Circuits, something that was bragged about with the Partnership Announcement when Silverstine was shown off in GT6.
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So Polyphony have butchered the final chicane in the name of realism...yet they're perfectly happy to have trees wide out in the open for you to hit. Colour me confused. :lol:
 
I like how they made it a bit longer, but The track looks alot flatter with less Elevation change and that the removal of the last chicane is a big No No for me.
 
mustafur
I like how they made it a bit longer, but The track looks alot flatter with less Elevation change and that the removal of the last chicane is a big No No for me.
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I suspect the physics of GT Sport is the reason these tracks weren't included in the game.
 
Keep in mind that this track will also be run in reverse configuration.

The ‘final’ chicane is not just the last part of the track. It also is the first turn in the reverse direction.

The decision was likely to keep from 24 cars funneling into the (only) racing line through that chicane in the old version at the very start and causing a disaster.

Now the first turn offers double-file driving and multiple lines; stuck outside in turn 1? You’ll have the inside line coming out of turn 2. I imagine the penalty system could make more logic of accidents at the start of a race in here with this new layout too.

Personally I have no problem with the changes, this is far more minor than revisions of tracks in real life with far more history.
 
KinLM
Keep in mind that this track will also be run in reverse configuration.

The ‘final’ chicane is not just the last part of the track. It also is the first turn in the reverse direction.

The decision was likely to keep from 24 cars funneling into the (only) racing line through that chicane in the old version at the very start and causing a disaster.

Now the first turn offers double-file driving and multiple lines; stuck outside in turn 1? You’ll have the inside line coming out of turn 2. I imagine the penalty system could make more logic of accidents at the start of a race in here with this new layout too.
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I'm not sure. Tight opening corners, especially tight opening corners that are chicanes, tend to cause more accidents. Not less. It seems every year at the Canadian GP there's chaos of some sort at the first turn. And then there's this infamous cluster:censored: from the Oschersleben in Germany...

 
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Famine
:D

I made this one, but didn't use it:

View attachment 930394
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The final chicane changes reminds me of the Bus Stop Chicane changes in Spa Francorchamps, its too damn sharp.

And it's not even have a runoff area on the outer side.

Funnily enough the new final chicane at Spa is basically the real life version of the "jumping corner" ala the old Trial Mountain.
 
SlimSlidey
I'm not sure. Tight opening corners, especially tight opening corners that are chicanes, tend to cause more accidents. Not less. At least, that's my personal perspective. It seems every year at the Canadian GP there's chaos of some sort at the first turn. And then there's this infamous cluster:censored: from the Oschersleben in Germany...

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:lol:
 
SlimSlidey
I'm not sure. Tight opening corners, especially tight opening corners that are chicanes, tend to cause more accidents. Not less. At least, that's my personal perspective. It seems every year at the Canadian GP there's chaos of some sort at the first turn. And then there's this infamous cluster:censored: from the Oschersleben in Germany...

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I don’t disagree with your theory but disagree in this application. I think that the previous version would be worse since it literally only has 1 realistically viable racing line.

And if it’s too tight, like Monza or Oschershel-whatever, it causes cars to bunch up too much.

But I think this is a happy middle ground, where it allows for people to make a proper racing maneuver and defend against it, at least in theory.

I think that’s why so many people are saying it feels like it’s from a “Tilke” circuit; because as boring as many of his circuits are, they *are* designed to allow for better side-by-side racing (Korean GP circuit had some good examples of this) even if the cars in F1 aren’t the best at taking advantage of it.
 
KinLM
Keep in mind that this track will also be run in reverse configuration.

The ‘final’ chicane is not just the last part of the track. It also is the first turn in the reverse direction.

The decision was likely to keep from 24 cars funneling into the (only) racing line through that chicane in the old version at the very start and causing a disaster.

Now the first turn offers double-file driving and multiple lines; stuck outside in turn 1? You’ll have the inside line coming out of turn 2. I imagine the penalty system could make more logic of accidents at the start of a race in here with this new layout too.

Personally I have no problem with the changes, this is far more minor than revisions of tracks in real life with far more history.
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Good point about the track needing to work as much as possible in both directions. Which makes me think of the start/finish of Lago Maggiore which has a similar layout. I wonder if they considered that when looking at the design for Trial Mountain.

I, honestly, always thought the old final chicane felt "arcadey" and unrealistic. This layout seems more real to me, especially with the longer straights added as well, so I've no complaints.

Ultimately, the proof of the pudding will be when people get to drive it. I'd like to see this in a future World Tour race, pre release, as this would be the ultimate test of it's new layout.
 
Not sure why they changed it. Its a fantasy track. If FIA are stepping on Gran Turismo's own fantasy tracks then I say thats too much. The last corner was iconic.
 
Sureboss
The chicane at the end used to be great because of the speed of it, it challenged people, there were different lines and massive consequences for getting it wrong. The above just looks like a generic slow chicane, I hope to be proved wrong.

The extra length of the circuit is inevitable, no issue there.
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karelpipa
Tilkedroming Trial Mountain's last chicane is a murder on the race track.

Lets add some DRS zones, shall we?

Also, i really mind the lenght of the back straight. This track used to be mid speed track. Now it has 2 very long straights :(
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I agree with both these sentiments, It would be nice to have the old variant in the game too, but i'm just glad its back, one of my favourite Original tracks in the game
 
GT7mebe
Not sure why they changed it. Its a fantasy track. If FIA are stepping on Gran Turismo's own fantasy tracks then I say thats too much. The last corner was iconic.
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@RACECAR spoke about this a few posts back...

RACECAR
An actual person from the FIA said they have nothing to do with PD's original Circuits. The tracks referred to were likely the Real Circuits, something that was bragged about with the Partnership Announcement when Silverstine was shown off in GT6.
Click to expand...
 
KinLM
I don’t disagree with your theory but disagree in this application. I think that the previous version would be worse since it literally only has 1 realistically viable racing line.

And if it’s too tight, like Monza or Oschershel-whatever, it causes cars to bunch up too much.

But I think this is a happy middle ground, where it allows for people to make a proper racing maneuver and defend against it, at least in theory.

I think that’s why so many people are saying it feels like it’s from a “Tilke” circuit; because as boring as many of his circuits are, they *are* designed to allow for better side-by-side racing (Korean GP circuit had some good examples of this) even if the cars in F1 aren’t the best at taking advantage of it.
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It had one racing line but it was hard to nail and provided an overtaking opportunity for both sides after.
 
I did not disapprove of the shape of the new chicane. But I am concerned about the absence of run off area, which should be located in the two areas of tangencies. If it stays that way, there will be a lot of collision, especially when starting in the reverse mode of Trial Mountain. Perhaps, to prevent damming and collision, could do this:
chicane.jpg
 
BrunusCL82
I did not disapprove of the shape of the new chicane. But I am concerned about the absence of run off area, which should be located in the two areas of tangencies. If it stays that way, there will be a lot of collision, especially when starting in the reverse mode of Trial Mountain. Perhaps, to prevent damming and collision, could do this:
chicane.jpg
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Totally agree with you!!!
 
SlimSlidey
So Polyphony have butchered the final chicane in the name of realism...yet they're perfectly happy to have trees wide out in the open for you to hit. Colour me confused. :lol:
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Well it's the very first public build, I doubt they will leave it like that for the final product.
 
with the almost launch of the GT7, the bad thing is the loss of interest in the previous game, and with the new PlayStation coming, the other model will start to become obsolete.
and devaluation will occur, and the new console will come to almost 5 thousand reais in Brazil!
 
This reminds me of what Kaz said about Deep Forest in the end of 2017:

The problem that we had with some of the older tracks from previous Gran Turismo games was the scale being off in certain places. The size of the trees are very large, or the width of the curbstones, etc. There were curbstones that were wider than cars! If we want to bring that into the quality of GT Sport now, there is a lot that we have to redesign, and it is not that easy.
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I think we should expect redesigns for all of the classic original tracks. Some of those haven't been touched since GT4, like Grand Valley Speedway, and looked very outdated in GT6.
 

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