Group A Touring Cars

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Torana XU-1

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Hi everybody! :)

I have been lurking for a week or so, but have just registered now and this is my first thread.

I tried looking through the search facility and couldn't find anything matching.

One of my all time favourite racing classes is FIA Group A Touring, which was popular throughout, Europe, Asia & the pacific in the 1980s. I have only been able to find one Group A touring car in GT4, the Calsonic R32 Skyline. Are there any others?

I have decided to build a couple as project cars. I bought an AE86 Levin, DR30 RS and HR31 GTS-R from the '80s used car lot. I then dug up my old touring car books to see precisely what the specs of these cars were in Group A trim, so i can copy them as much as possible with what the tuners allow/make available.

Does anyone else try to build cars in GT4 that are based on real cars? I have noticed there is a lot of talk about game completion and mission and licence accumulation, but not so much talk about project cars.

I am waiting for the red '69 Nissan Bluebird 1600 (510) to appear in the used car lot, so i can build a copy of a car I used to race.
 
You should use the SS Trueno if you want to make a slightly more realistic copy. Since it has a version of the engine used in Group A. :)
 
the cars you mentioned (DR30 RS and HR31 GTS-R) what are they, i don't have a clue about what these are, it's kind of difficult for people not in the know :)
 
i try to make cars like btcc & wtcc cars:crazy: nissan primera,is200,integra type r,civic & others:crazy: n.a. cars with max.2.0l & min. lenght of 4.20m.ff cars 1110 & 1140 kg & fr cars 1140 kg & 1170kg(with driver)thats how i do it
 
Scaff
Here's one example of a discussion thread on building cars to various BTCC regulations.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=80721&highlight=btcc

That one was great fun.

Regards

Scaff

BTW - you may get a lot more interest if you actually post up the Group A regulations, that way others can have a shot at putting some together.
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Thanks Scaff, I just replied to the BTCC thread and will have a go at building a Super Touring Primera, though I'd love to do an E36 320i.

Group A was for mass produced (5000 units) Production Touring Cars. The fundamental element of the class was a sliding scale of minimum weights and maximum wheel widths determined by the engine size. I'll try and find a copy of the minimum weights list.

The cars ran standard bodywork with no roof lining or floor covering or passenger seats. Bodykits were prohibited unless they were factory homologated for that model. Engine capacity and location, transmission location and number of gears were as per standard. Slick tyres were allowed and brakes were virtually free, though ABS was banned. There was a lot of freedom in the suspension componentry, but the design could not be altered.

Below is a list of the cars I have found in GT4 that were homologated for Group A. I have checked all of my old touring car books, an out of date Australian equiavlent of your RAC/MSA blue book and the ETC online history resource. I have added the minimum weights of these cars, as per my understanding of the weight limit table and also added max power figures which have been quoted, somewhat colloquially.

Nissan DR30 Skyline RS 340hp 1035kg
Nissan HR31 Skyline GTS-R 450hp 1100kg
Nissan R32 Skyline GT-R 650hp 1260kg
Toyota Corolla AE86 180hp 800kg
Toyota Celica/Supra 2800 ???hp 1035kg
Toyota Supra 3.0 turbo ???hp 1420kg
Mercedes 190e 2.3 16 ???hp 960kg

I'll add others if I find them.

For GT4, i would say, Oil change, Stage 1 weight reduction, no wings, R1 tyres, race exhaust, chip, race suspension, race brakes, brake balance controller, race flywheel, triple clutch, LSD & fully customisable transmission, but remember that most cars had only 5 speeds.
 
The two GT4 cars that popped in my head right away:

- "Mercedes-Benz AMG Mercedes 190E 2.5-16 Evolution II Touring Car 1992"
- "Alfa Romeo 155 2.5 V6 TI Race Car 1993"
 
Wolfe
The two GT4 cars that popped in my head right away:

- "Mercedes-Benz AMG Mercedes 190E 2.5-16 Evolution II Touring Car 1992"
- "Alfa Romeo 155 2.5 V6 TI Race Car 1993"
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They may not be Group A cars, they might be DTM cars instead, or FIA Class 1 as they were known at the time.
 
The following is a list of cars that raced in Group A, that don't apear in GT4.

Holden Commodore VK
Holden Commodore VL
Holden/Isuzu Gemini ZZ
Nissan S12 Silvia FJ20DE
Toyota Corolla AE82
Toyota Corolla AE92
Mitsubishi Starion turbo
Ford Sierra XR4i
Ford Sierra XR4Ti
Ford Sierra RS Cosworth
Ford Sierra RS500
Ford Escort Mk3
Alfa 33
Alfa 75 turbo
Maserati biturbo
Alfa GTV6 2.5
BMW E30 M3
BMW 635 CS
BMW E30 323i
Ford Mustang 5.0 '83/'84
Volvo 240T
Fiat Uno turbo
 
Torana XU-1
They may not be Group A cars, they might be DTM cars instead, or FIA Class 1 as they were known at the time.
Click to expand...

DTM used Group A until the 1994 season. Both of those cars were in DTM prior to that year.
 
Torana XU-1
Some Group A cars that i haven't been able to find in GT4 follow. If you have found them in the game, please let us know.
Click to expand...

Sounds like you need to consult the classifieds section of the:

OFFICIAL GTPLANET CAR LIST

I didn't give much more than a glance at the list you posted there. But as I hovered past it the only cars I saw that I can say for certain are in the game are the Starion (albeit a rally model), and S12 Silvia (in different trim than what I think youre looking for).
 
Boundary Layer
Sounds like you need to consult the classifieds section of the:

OFFICIAL GTPLANET CAR LIST

I didn't give much more than a glance at the list you posted there. But as I hovered past it the only cars I saw that I can say for certain are in the game are the Starion (albeit a rally model), and S12 Silvia (in different trim than what I think youre looking for).
Click to expand...

I just went right through the complete car list and wasn't able to find any Group A donor cars other than the ones i listed earlier.
 
Torana XU-1
The Alfa 155 race car in GT4 is definitely an FIA class I car, check the specs.
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I guess it is a Class I car, but I don't know how you could tell from the GT4 specs -- the only real differences between Group A and Class I were the relaxation of bodykit/homologation rules and the allowance of more electronic aids.

However, the 190E is most certainly Group A.
 
Wolfe
I guess it is a Class I car, but I don't know how you could tell from the GT4 specs -- the only real differences between Group A and Class I were the relaxation of bodykit/homologation rules and the allowance of more electronic aids.

However, the 190E is most certainly Group A.
Click to expand...
Group A cars had to use the same drive configuration, engine capacity, number of gears and engine block as standard.
 
Torana XU-1
Group A cars had to use the same drive configuration, engine capacity, number of gears and engine block as standard.
Click to expand...

I take it you're well-familiar with the road-going 155's, then? (I'm not..or I guess I should say, I wasn't before tonight)

'Cause all of that goes under the "relaxation of bodykit/homologation rules" difference that I just mentioned.
 
Torana XU-1
Some Group A cars that i haven't been able to find in GT4 follow. If you have found them in the game, please let us know.

Holden Commodore VK
Holden Commodore VL
Holden/Isuzu Gemini ZZ
Nissan S12 Silvia FJ20DE
Toyota Corolla AE82
Toyota Corolla AE92
Mitsubishi Starion turbo
Ford Sierra XR4i
Ford Sierra XR4Ti
Ford Sierra RS Cosworth
Ford Sierra RS500
Ford Escort Mk3
Alfa 33
Alfa 75 turbo
Maserati biturbo
Alfa GTV6 2.5
BMW E30 M3
BMW 635 CS
BMW E30 323i
Ford Mustang 5.0 '83/'84
Volvo 240T
Fiat Uno turbo
Click to expand...

Maserati Biturbo, that car had to be one of the biggest POSes ever made.

Nope, I have not seen any of those cars in GT4.
 
well the touring cars do go fast when souped up to max potential and then opening the last gear for great top speed will definitely win u the race. P.S. Don't open it to much or there will be lots of wheel spin.
BlueRoyal
 
The Alfa and the Opel Calibra were 2 cars in the ITC these were definately not group 1 cars as these cars were virtually F1 cars with roofs on and less power these then morphed into what is now known as the DTM
 
TheBigMan045
The Alfa and the Opel Calibra were 2 cars in the ITC these were definately not group 1 cars as these cars were virtually F1 cars with roofs on and less power these then morphed into what is now known as the DTM
Click to expand...

In the early '90s ITC/DTM cars were officially known as FIA Class 1, not to be confused with the old Group 1 from the '70s.
 
Torana XU-1
Nissan R32 Skyline GT-R 650hp 1260kg
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if your taking these from the atcc then thats wrong,the r32 gtr's were limited to 550bhp iirc and they weight in at around the 1500kg mark,even so johnsons sierra which is said to have had near enough 700bhp at the end of the '92 season couldnt keep up :lol:
 
Holdenhsvgtsr
if your taking these from the atcc then thats wrong,the r32 gtr's were limited to 550bhp iirc and they weight in at around the 1500kg mark,even so johnsons sierra which is said to have had near enough 700bhp at the end of the '92 season couldnt keep up :lol:
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Ding ding ding ding ding give that man a lollypop!

Seriously though, 550bhp was the limit as I found on some website that I lost again when FF crashed. And Johnson could have had 7,000bhp and still not been able to catch up, Dick couldn't drive!
 
Holdenhsvgtsr
if your taking these from the atcc then thats wrong,the r32 gtr's were limited to 550bhp iirc and they weight in at around the 1500kg mark,even so johnsons sierra which is said to have had near enough 700bhp at the end of the '92 season couldnt keep up :lol:
Click to expand...

I believe 1260kg was the FIA homolgated weight for an R32 GT-R. CAMS handicapped them with ballast in an attemt to even up the ATCC.

Power figures vary from one dyno to the next and no race team is ever going to tell the truth, but i fail to see how DJ could get 700hp out of a single turbo 2 litre if the Nissan Motor Company could only get 550hp out of a twin turbo 2.6.
 
http://www.thegodzilla.com/race-history-of-the-godzilla.php

have fun reading :)

i think its something along the lines of the twins are gonna spool alot quicker than a single turbo.you need to remember ALOT of people werent happy with the GTR's to say the least(podium at the 92 bathurst race ring any bells :lol: ) so im guessing the scrutineers payed very close attention to the liners,so johnsons idea might have been to put up the boost meaning he will loose up in the slower corners but down the straights he can haul them down.if you have the 1992 race watch it for the first few laps,youll see down the straights the rs500 had the edge,but at the top of the mountain the skyline had it.when the skyline over took the rs500 in i think the 4/5 lap youll see on the corner exit the R32 pulled away but further up mountain straight johnson hauled it in,but wasnt enough to get passed :) and the rest they say is history.
 

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