GT5 Latest News & Discussion

  • Thread starter Thread starter gamelle71
  • 76,879 comments
  • 10,791,473 views
TokyoDrift
Using photo-mode is hardly comparing the in-game engine, and I'd hardly call the difference like being in the 8bit era :rolleyes:

He does have a point - every time I see GT4 (either in person or videos), I'm always super-impressed - probably more so than I am when I see GT5 in relative terms. Sure, GT5 looks all hi-res and amazing, but that fact that it isn't a million miles away from GT4 just shows what they achieved with that console. I don't think they are pusing the PS3 anywhere near as much as they pushed the PS2.
Click to expand...

👍👍👍
 
Justin
If GT5 doesn't heavily return on their investment you can look forward to seeing Kaz get fired.
Click to expand...

I presume you have no idea about what you're talking about :D

60 million investment has already been paid in advance by worldwide sales of GT5: Prologue and GT PSP.

Taken that into account, all revenue from GT5 will be pure profit for both SCE and Polyphony Digital.

Numbers:
http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/list.html

Average GT5: Prologue price - 20$ (started as 40$ - notice that prices in the world differ, in Europe Prologue made almost 2,8 million in sales with the price of 35 euros = more than 45 $) x 4,7 million = almost 100 million $ in revenue.

Mind that good percentage of Prologue sales was made via PSN as digital download, where there is no costs such as "normal game" - but with the same price - so actual profit rate from each game is much higher.

Average GT PSP price - 20 $ (everything same as above) x 1,8 million = 36 million $ in revenue.

Combined 136 million in revenue. Now presume that Polyphony Digital has pretty much unique status in SCE, they probably have special treatment regading licencing, development tools and such, and they probably get enourmous amount of revenue as their profit.

Notice that whole development of Prologue is actually the part of 60 million of GT5 budget, while development of GTPSP probably costed just a tiny fraction of the budget becuse all assests were derrived from GT4 and all PSP engines and libraries are on PD's disposal for ages now.

In conclusion, every Gran Turismo game so far was already payed-off with its predecesstors and you really do not have to worry that Kazunori or Polyphony Digital will EVER become short of moneyz.

;)
 
CoolColJ
...


I came across the up and coming book - hella expensive it is too!



51eTmiAUyYL._SS500_.jpg
Click to expand...

What!? Shouldn't the book be published after GT5?? Somebody tries to make easy money :sick: :yuck: .
 
Justin
I know GT5P sold well, but you can't predict the future based on past success.
Click to expand...
Uh... sure, whatever. ;)

The head of any developer would give body parts to have the interest GT5 has on the nets. But, there is a chance that GT5 might not sell several million copies.

If the world economy died, or there was a nuclear war, or an asteroid hit the earth...
 
Justin
I know GT5P sold well, but you can't predict the future based on past success. This is why I'm not even going to say there will be a GT6 because GT5 could flop and Kaz could be fired. We just can't tell.
Click to expand...
You are absolutely right. If I had won the lottery last week, the odds of me winning it again this week are no better (or worse for that matter). However, sometimes a bit of common sense prevails.

No major release of Gran Turismo has sold less than 10,000,000 units. When they made the jump from PS2 to PS3, that number rose to almost 15,000,000 units. It's fair to say then, that based on sales of GT5P (which incidentally eclipsed those of GT4P by a factor of 3.4x), and the fact that this will be the first major Gran Turismo release on PS3, we can comfortably expect lifetime sales in the region of 10,000,000. I'm sure that first week sales will break a few records too, even if only in relation to past releases.

As for that book...fair play, if they can publish that and make money, kudos to them! It's always the others who have the ideas and make money who seem to get the flack. Don't like the book? Disagree with the ethics of it? Don't buy it!
 
What about Le Mans 24 hour race, can we expect some demo with LM prototypes and La Sharte circuit... Maybe PD will take license for Le Mans and show as on race day!💡
 
TokyoDrift
As for that book...fair play, if they can publish that and make money, kudos to them! It's always the others who have the ideas and make money who seem to get the flack. Don't like the book? Disagree with the ethics of it? Don't buy it!
Click to expand...

What is inevitably going to happen now, is someone out there is going to buy the book to see what the fuss is about, or just out of pure curiosity.

So whoever posted that image either wrote the book themselves, or is giving the author a free advertisement on what is probably the biggest GT fansite on the net. :lol:

AleksandarSRB
What about Le Mans 24 hour race, can we expect some demo with LM prototypes and La Sharte circuit... Maybe PD will take license for Le Mans and show as on race day!💡
Click to expand...

They're keeping it under wraps. We know there is going to be a couple of them at least. The ones which were also in GTPSP are likely too. But obviously we aren't going to get Porsche, and we haven't heard anything about Peugeot, Aston Martin etc.

We know Circuit de la Sarthe is going to be in the game. and there are hundreds of cars not yet identified/accounted for in the 950-1000 car total, so we may well see quite a few new Le Mans prototype and GT class car additions. I doubt they will release a demo with LMPs in it, but they may show LMP cars in a trailer, they can't use WRC and SuperGT all the time, it's getting old.
 
Seismica
What is inevitably going to happen now, is someone out there is going to buy the book to see what the fuss is about, or just out of pure curiosity.

So whoever posted that image either wrote the book themselves, or is giving the author a free advertisement on what is probably the biggest GT fansite on the net. :lol:
Click to expand...
Yup, and I'll say it again, kudos to them! :lol:
 
C`mon, that book is a daylight robbery.
 
Tenacious D
Uh... sure, whatever. ;)

The head of any developer would give body parts to have the interest GT5 has on the nets. But, there is a chance that GT5 might not sell several million copies.

If the world economy died, or there was a nuclear war, or an asteroid hit the earth...
Click to expand...

I'd still buy GT5, 'Id hold the case horizontally like a F1 wheel and make MEHHHHHHHH< MEH MEH MEH MEHHHHHHHHH, sounds pretending it's whatever cars are on the back cover.

As if a stinking asteroid would stop me , muahahahaha.

AleksandarSRB
What about Le Mans 24 hour race, can we expect some demo with LM prototypes and La Sharte circuit... Maybe PD will take license for Le Mans and show as on race day!💡
Click to expand...

Ahahahaha, sorry man I know EN is not your first language, but I couldnt help cracking up when I saw that.

This is why: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=shart
 
AleksandarSRB
What about Le Mans 24 hour race, can we expect some demo with LM prototypes and La Sharte circuit... Maybe PD will take license for Le Mans and show as on race day!💡
Click to expand...

I expect those Pescarolo cars to be fully covered with a livery showcasing the final release date whether fully visible ( and so obvious we probably don't even notice ) or small and cryptic with all sorts of hidden messages we have to put together whilst they go 200 Mph on the Mulsanne straight................;)
 
Justin
If GT5 doesn't heavily return on their investment you can look forward to seeing Kaz get fired. In other words the game will have to have at least $120,000,000(double the supposed $60million budget) in profit or Kaz will be on the hotseat. Sony won't wait 5 years to barely break even.
Click to expand...
Out of curiosity, do you think that GT5 will sell at least as many copies as Prologue? If so, that already doubles your figure above when considering $60 a copy.

GT5 would only have to sell 2 million copies to hit that $120,000,000 figure you pulled out of thin air.


And all of this is ignoring the point Amar made regarding Prologue.
 
amar212
I presume you have no idea about what you're talking about :D

60 million investment has already been paid in advance by worldwide sales of GT5: Prologue and GT PSP.

Taken that into account, all revenue from GT5 will be pure profit for both SCE and Polyphony Digital.

Numbers:
http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/list.html

Average GT5: Prologue price - 20$ (started as 40$ - notice that prices in the world differ, in Europe Prologue made almost 2,8 million in sales with the price of 35 euros = more than 45 $) x 4,7 million = almost 100 million $ in revenue.

Mind that good percentage of Prologue sales was made via PSN as digital download, where there is no costs such as "normal game" - but with the same price - so actual profit rate from each game is much higher.

Average GT PSP price - 20 $ (everything same as above) x 1,8 million = 36 million $ in revenue.

Combined 136 million in revenue. Now presume that Polyphony Digital has pretty much unique status in SCE, they probably have special treatment regading licencing, development tools and such, and they probably get enourmous amount of revenue as their profit.

Notice that whole development of Prologue is actually the part of 60 million of GT5 budget, while development of GTPSP probably costed just a tiny fraction of the budget becuse all assests were derrived from GT4 and all PSP engines and libraries are on PD's disposal for ages now.

In conclusion, every Gran Turismo game so far was already payed-off with its predecesstors and you really do not have to worry that Kazunori or Polyphony Digital will EVER become short of moneyz.

;)
Click to expand...

Thats far off from the truth, and furthermore we don't know what the actual costs of GT5 stands at right now. The sales of GT5: P weren't all revenue, it costs companies money to manufacture things. The main costs i assume are the blu-ray disc and the packaging. The Publisher Sony would take care of all the distribution and promotion which also costs money and is taxed. Revenue also doesn't equal cash flow, they still have employees to pay and if they outsource anything i'm pretty sure the partner company doesn't want to wait six years to get paid.

In conclusion unless PD's financial statements are made public then we don't know their financial situation.
 
amar212
they probably get enormous amount of revenue as their profit.
Click to expand...

I do think amar made a very good point there.

To avoid confusion for the less instructed, it is the formulation above that I would like to seen more something like:

"they probably will be able to generate an enormous amount of profit from the revenue due to the large profit margins (low development and distribution costs compared to revenue)."

The argument that GT5p has paid GT5, should be immediately used that GT5 will have to pay GT6 (prologue??), ....

Just some other points:
* there are quite some statements that the PS3 introduces a loss with every unit sold, the software is what makes SONY survive this and keeps them in this business (+ promoting 3D, Blue Ray, etc...)
* money is rarely an issue in software, once you sell enough:
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/fundamental/04/042804.asp
software industry has a gross margin of about 90%
Click to expand...
* It is a normal investment business, there is always risk, more risk is only justified if you have an outlook on high profits, risk means you need to diversify to spread your risk and to be able to take some blows (like a global crisis).
 
GMTN
Thats far off from the truth, and furthermore we don't know what the actual costs of GT5 stands at right now.
Click to expand...
Kazunori Yamauchi himself said it was $60 million in an interview. You can check the News page here at GTP to find it. If you think it is even more then we are looking at one of the most expensive game ever.

The sales of GT5: P weren't all revenue, it costs companies money to manufacture things. The main costs i assume are the blu-ray disc and the packaging. The Publisher Sony would take care of all the distribution and promotion which also costs money and is taxed.
Click to expand...
Even if you figure they only made 50% off each copy as profit that still knocks out the GT5 costs between Prologue and GTPSP.

Revenue also doesn't equal cash flow, they still have employees to pay and if they outsource anything i'm pretty sure the partner company doesn't want to wait six years to get paid.
Click to expand...
All of these expenses were likely figured into KY's $60 million figure. I know if my cost estimates at work left things like that out I wouldn't have a job.

In conclusion unless PD's financial statements are made public then we don't know their financial situation.
Click to expand...
While this is true, what information we do have is enough for us to make educated guesses, and even the most pessimistic guess makes it obvious that money is not an issue due to Prologue and GTPSP.
 
Sony losing money off every console is also the wrong way to say it. They are selling the console for less than its worth counting that for every console sold the consumer will buy a first party sony product whether it be Blu-ray or a game. When you keep that in mind, Sony isn't losing money at all.

Example PS3 costs 420 to make and they are selling it for 400.
Consumer buys PS3 and then purchases MLB 2010. Sony makes a GR of 460.

Its just smart business, the same reasons why cell phone companies are always trying to shove those three year contracts down peoples throats. Get a good phone for dirt cheap and end up paying 50$ a month for three years.
 
GMTN
Its just smart business, the same reasons why cell phone companies are always trying to shove those three year contracts down peoples throats. Get a good phone for dirt cheap and end up paying 50$ a month for three years.
Click to expand...

But MicroSoft charges every month, not Sony. And PS3's play blu-ray, so it is the good phone for dirt cheap, and no monthly cost.
 
All of these expenses were likely figured into KY's $60 million figure. I know if my cost estimates at work left things like that out I wouldn't have a job.
Click to expand...
I doubt they would include operating costs into the development of the game. Also the 60 million was a long time ago, they added new staff and started working on new tech. more $$$.
 
GMTN
Thats far off from the truth, and furthermore we don't know what the actual costs of GT5 stands at right now. The sales of GT5: P weren't all revenue, it costs companies money to manufacture things. The main costs i assume are the blu-ray disc and the packaging. The Publisher Sony would take care of all the distribution and promotion which also costs money and is taxed. Revenue also doesn't equal cash flow, they still have employees to pay and if they outsource anything i'm pretty sure the partner company doesn't want to wait six years to get paid.

In conclusion unless PD's financial statements are made public then we don't know their financial situation.
Click to expand...

The sales from gt5p were all revenue, but profit is another thing. Do not confuse Revenue with profit. Profit I = Revenue - Direct Cost, or Contrubution margin I, Profit II = CM I - Indirect cost , or Contribution margin II.
 
GordonS
8 bit era? Oh come on! GT4 is still a very beautiful game.
Click to expand...

Yes it's amazing!!!Especially 60fps replays...(more impressions than GT5 replays).No doubt.But to see difference you really need to do a little research.
That's why i mentioned that you have to compare your shots to official gt5 shots.You need to find the truth - it's not like "opinion" - it's like "no doubt".

(sorry i don't want to begin discussions about it - its my personal experience.one day i think that tokyo in GT5 is same as in GT4.Then.One night in Photo Mode and all starts clear!Even tracks in GT5 looks AMAZING!!!)
 
IsmokeGT
Actually, your odds stay exactly the same.
Click to expand...
Well, that's technicaly incorrect because last week I only bought one lottery ticket, but this week I bought two, so I just improved my odds of winning.

But seriously, all things being equal, do you really think I did not know that?! Re-read what I wrote.
 
TokyoDrift
Well, that's technicaly incorrect because last week I only bought one lottery ticket, but this week I bought two, so I just improved my odds of winning.
Click to expand...
Actually, your odds are the same per ticket, even if you won last week, or you bought 1,000 tickets last week and lost on every one.
I wasn't argueing, dude.
 
Last edited:
But MicroSoft charges every month, not Sony. And PS3's play blu-ray, so it is the good phone for dirt cheap, and no monthly cost.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, but what i really meant is that all companies do this. Where they take a product and sell it lower than its actual costs to produce to encourage the consumer to buy it knowing that they can sell the consumer something additional to make up for the "loss".
 
dzidza
The sales from gt5p were all revenue, but profit is another thing. Do not confuse Revenue with profit. Profit I = Revenue - Direct Cost, or Contrubution margin I, Profit II = CM I - Indirect cost , or Contribution margin II.
Click to expand...

I didn't confuse them, i just didn't use the proper term. my error.
 
GMTN
I doubt they would include operating costs into the development of the game.
Click to expand...
I hope they do, or their accountants must be cussing up a storm. Operating costs are a part of development costs. That is necessary to be factored in order to determine how many units at what price point need to be sold to turn a true profit.

Also the 60 million was a long time ago, they added new staff and started working on new tech. more $$$.
Click to expand...
That was from SEMA in November. I have not heard about new staff and new technology since then.

And as I said, based on the information we have. That is the best we have.
 
GMTN
I didn't confuse them, i just didn't use the proper term. my error.
Click to expand...

Yes and because of that error your argument doesn't work anymore, like others have pointed out the budget for a game takes everything into account. Amar wasn't talking profit like you mistakenly did when referring to revenue, so his numbers still work. We don't know how much profit there is, but when your total revenue is more than double your budget I think its safe to say there was a fair bit of profit made.
 
Back