GTP Alternative Cool Wall: 1949-present AK-47

1949-present AK-47


  • Total voters
    79
  • Poll closed .
I interpreted your post to mean all guns are meant to kill, which isn't even true of military weapons. As far as symbols go, what you said -that any person would associate guns with killing/war - sounds grossly exaggerated. Plenty of people realize the utility of guns in sport, hunting, and defense and I'm sure they'd be used to seeing them occasionally in public on soldiers or police. That doesn't stop many from thinking as you say they do however.
 
As far as symbols go, what you said -that any person would associate guns with killing/war - sounds grossly exaggerated. Plenty of people realize the utility of guns in sport, hunting, and defense and I'm sure they'd be used to seeing them occasionally in public on soldiers or police. That doesn't stop many from thinking as you say they do however.
I agree, it was an exaggeration on my part. But even though widely used for sport, that is not what guns made their name as to be. Wars and conflicts always were the main consumers of and the driving force for weapon development, thus naturally attaching a strong association between the two. And that's what they, especially the more powerful ones as the one being polled, in my opinion, symbolise the worst trait that us, humans have - despite being so smart and intelligent and being proud of that, we still feel the need to crack eachothers heads open over disagreements.
 
I agree, it was an exaggeration on my part. But even though widely used for sport, that is not what guns made their name as to be. Wars and conflicts always were the main consumers of and the driving force for weapon development, thus naturally attaching a strong association between the two. And that's what they, especially the more powerful ones as the one being polled, in my opinion, symbolise the worst trait that us, humans have - despite being so smart and intelligent and being proud of that, we still feel the need to crack eachothers heads open over disagreements.
That is a bit one sided though. War isn't just petty fighting. You can fight for self defense. War shouldn't be looked down on just because it can be violent. It's not necessarily something that anyone wants to do, but it's also not something that is never worth doing. The alternative to fighting back against someone who is more interested in themself than you is to let them have their way and that can easily lead to far more suffering than fighting back. If there was simply nothing important in life, your view of fighting would make a lot of sense, but I think that just about everyone finds some good to life and would rather not be trampled on.

People invented weapons in part because they hate fighting and weapons help prevent fighting by making it even less attractive than it was already. There will be some selfish people who will use weapons at the expense of others, but they were always there. Fighting because an old song has been past down for longer than anyone remembers telling you that someone's else's land belongs to you is very different from fighting because the enemy wants to kill your entire family unprovoked. Reason, intelligence, and compassion are all going to prompt you to pick up a weapon in the latter case and the AK-47 or anything similar would serve well. Possibly well enough to prevent anyone for being killed at all.
 
I voted sub zero because I like AK's and this is one of the best looking Kalashnikov designs in my opinion, but I've reconsidered since.
It is an outdated design. It's about a pound heavier than the AKM for no reason and fires an outdated round. Newer intermediate cartridges like 5.45x39mm or 5.56x45mm are better at just about everything.

Overall verdict: Meh
 
That is a bit one sided though. War isn't just petty fighting. You can fight for self defense. War shouldn't be looked down on just because it can be violent. It's not necessarily something that anyone wants to do, but it's also not something that is never worth doing. The alternative to fighting back against someone who is more interested in themself than you is to let them have their way and that can easily lead to far more suffering than fighting back. If there was simply nothing important in life, your view of fighting would make a lot of sense, but I think that just about everyone finds some good to life and would rather not be trampled on.

People invented weapons in part because they hate fighting and weapons help prevent fighting by making it even less attractive than it was already. There will be some selfish people who will use weapons at the expense of others, but they were always there. Fighting because an old song has been past down for longer than anyone remembers telling you that someone's else's land belongs to you is very different from fighting because the enemy wants to kill your entire family unprovoked. Reason, intelligence, and compassion are all going to prompt you to pick up a weapon in the latter case and the AK-47 or anything similar would serve well. Possibly well enough to prevent anyone for being killed at all.

I'm all for defence and jumping out with a hippy flag against someone pointing a rifle at you is not something I'd advice or do. But when there's a need for defence that means that there's offence in the first place. And that's my point, the fact that there are humans who are willing to use force against others for their own benefit. It maybe was acceptable for cavemen but in my opinion, we with our skyscrapers, spaceships and nanotechnologies should know better and became less (self-)destructive. And that's what firearms, due to their widest application, symbolise.

It would be a nice uthopy if we actually didn't need weapons to use them against eachother. Not happening though and I do understand and support the necessity of being prepared to defend yourself/your community. Still, not enough to drag guns out of seriously uncool for the reasons posted above.
 
10364202_319108548238744_4593561908501587786_n.jpg
 
I'm all for defence and jumping out with a hippy flag against someone pointing a rifle at you is not something I'd advice or do. But when there's a need for defence that means that there's offence in the first place. And that's my point, the fact that there are humans who are willing to use force against others for their own benefit.
That all makes sense, but then why dislike the guns? They're not contributing to people being selfish at all. It's like reaching to find a problem with them. I guess you could do that, but I feel like this is being done to weapons and not really to anything else.

Gun > not doing anything bad by itself > used by criminal sometimes > associated with criminal

Car > not doing anything bad by itself > used by criminal sometimes > no one cares

Where does the difference come from?

It maybe was acceptable for cavemen but in my opinion, we with our skyscrapers, spaceships and nanotechnologies should know better and became less (self-)destructive. And that's what firearms, due to their widest application, symbolise.

I don't have numbers in front of me, but the widest application of firearms is probably self defense, which is the opposite of self destructive. They are acquired to prevent violent people from being violent by taking away or reversing advantages in strength the violent may have.

Obviously guns can be abused by criminals etc, but that this becomes the symbol associated with guns is very strange given that it's only a part of gun use (and one that only exists people of the people behind it) and that it's probably a minority of gun use.

We have skyscrapers, spaceships, etc, but none of that changes what we are. If you want to solve violence and crime, looking at weapons is a waste of time. It's the source of the problem that need investigation.
 
Gun > not doing anything bad by itself > used by criminal sometimes > associated with criminal

Car > not doing anything bad by itself > used by criminal sometimes > no one cares

Where does the difference come from?
Gun > Usually designed for assault purposes
Car > Designed to look like a baller in the late 1800s and pretty much the future of transportation
 
I have a red automatic one. Sure is fun to go mow down a bunch of beer bottles and pop cans on a Saturday afternoon out in a field somewhere. I'd vote sub zero for all of its properties but the poll closed.
 
That all makes sense, but then why dislike the guns? They're not contributing to people being selfish at all. It's like reaching to find a problem with them. I guess you could do that, but I feel like this is being done to weapons and not really to anything else.

Gun > not doing anything bad by itself > used by criminal sometimes > associated with criminal

Car > not doing anything bad by itself > used by criminal sometimes > no one cares

Where does the difference come from?
Gun - Made to be used as a weapon.
Car - Made to be a means of transportation.

If there were no criminals, we wouldn't need weapons to use them against others at all. As when there's no offence, there is no need for defence. Correct? What comes first always leaves the lasting impression though. In this case guns symbolise the presence of offence whether used for it or against it.

I don't have numbers in front of me, but the widest application of firearms is probably self defense, which is the opposite of self destructive. They are acquired to prevent violent people from being violent by taking away or reversing advantages in strength the violent may have.

Obviously guns can be abused by criminals etc, but that this becomes the symbol associated with guns is very strange given that it's only a part of gun use (and one that only exists people of the people behind it) and that it's probably a minority of gun use.
Again, if you use a gun for self-defence that means that there is offence present in the first place. Most likely by someone else behind another gun.

We have skyscrapers, spaceships, etc, but none of that changes what we are. If you want to solve violence and crime, looking at weapons is a waste of time. It's the source of the problem that need investigation.
And the latter two sentences are what my point is. Nowhere did I say that we should get rid of/ban all the guns. It's the fact that we, as humanity as a whole, actually need them. The thing that we have skyscrapers and spaceships should be a good indicator that we should be intelligent enough to realise that violence and crime is a self-destructive activity for us on the large scale.
 
Gun > Usually designed for assault purposes
Car > Designed to look like a baller in the late 1800s and pretty much the future of transportation

Assault as in unprovoked attacked? I'd say it's the opposite. The AK-47 specifically was a response to an assault from an insane and aggressive government.

Again, I don't really see what something being designed for has to do with it anyway, but I've already touched on that a few times.

Gun - Made to be used as a weapon.
Car - Made to be a means of transportation.
That leads me to ask why weapon is looked down upon and it's neither a good or bad thing.

If there were no criminals, we wouldn't need weapons to use them against others at all. As when there's no offence, there is no need for defence. Correct? What comes first always leaves the lasting impression though. In this case guns symbolise the presence of offence whether used for it or against it.

Here is one answer to that thought above, but weapons are just being lumped in like baggage. The existence of criminals is a completely separate issue.

I'm not sure what you mean by "what comes first". Is that referring to original gun use or that criminals existing is the "original problem".

Again, if you use a gun for self-defence that means that there is offence present in the first place. Most likely by someone else behind another gun.
What makes you say most likely another gun?


And the latter two sentences are what my point is. Nowhere did I say that we should get rid of/ban all the guns. It's the fact that we, as humanity as a whole, actually need them. The thing that we have skyscrapers and spaceships should be a good indicator that we should be intelligent enough to realise that violence and crime is a self-destructive activity for us on the large scale.
I'm not talking about the banning of guns, but their association with this and that. No doubt they are liked by criminals for their utility in some cases, but this is no different from anything else. We need defense because we're still the same species we've always been going back to long before we had the inventions of today. Biologically, there's a chance that someone is inclined to steal or kill and no amount of skyscrapers will impact that. Outside of that we're not yet at a state where we can solve all the world's problems. There are limited resources and a lot of people. On the whole we're doing alright managing it all, but some places do occasionally run out of important resources for a time (possibly an extended time) and this leads to problems. The number of spaceships we have doesn't necessarily correlate to those issues. We do realize as a whole that violence and crime is bad, thus guns. That doesn't mean we can solve the whole issue.
 
Assault Rifles are designed to be good at killing people. End of.

What they're actually used for or why they were designed to be good at killing people doesn't matter. The fact that they were designed to be good at people is enough to make them seriously uncool.
 
Assault Rifles are designed to be good at killing people. End of.

What they're actually used for or why they were designed to be good at killing people doesn't matter. The fact that they were designed to be good at people is enough to make them seriously uncool.
Assaut rifles are designed to be used by a military, and in a military, rifles are just a small part of the equipment. A simple mechanism, a tool that allows the soldiers, let's say, perform their tasks. The army itself may be used for very various purposes - good and bad. You respect the army protecting you, right? Those rifles let them do their work.

Protection doesn't only involve fighting. An enemy will not want to try attacking if he knows that your army is able to fight back properly. Military power brings peace, and automatic rifles are essential unit of the modern infantry, which is an essential part of an army (not only modern).
 
Protection doesn't only involve fighting. An enemy will not want to try attacking if he knows that your army is able to fight back properly. Military power brings peace
As long as the balance of power is maintained. As the rest of that is pretty much pure realism I am assuming that is the line you take.
If one country has more guns than the other then you get war a lot of the time according to realists.

Oh btw. Count the swastikas on google maps in this are of Japan.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place...2!3m1!1s0x600107303d405341:0x8628f60ffe050cda
 
Last edited:

Latest Posts

Back