GTP Cool Wall: 1999-2006 Honda Insight

[Wiegert]

I always thought it was only made a couple years.

The ones that came in that sickly Citrus Yellow were.

Now they're the most collectable of all Insight's, given how few models actually came in that factory colour (apparently).

 

[DK]

It makes knuckle-dragging "MOAR V8s!" people butthurt. That bumps it up to a sub-zero for me.

 

[niky]

I mean, this car is to the hypermilers what an Alfa 8C is to us petrolheads. They adore it, which means this happens:

Sorry, I'm odd. I think that the fact that you can actually perform a performance modification to your car that increases both your top speed and fuel economy with nothing more than discarded building materials totally hilarious.

I mean, I did it for a laugh and a web article:

And it's the most fun I've had in a drive for ages.

Next week, I'm thinking of doing a pick-up bed swimming pool. Just have to measure out a bed to see what will fit.

 

[Xilor]

The M3 is not good enough at either job.

So to you, a car isn't worth a damn unless its the absolute best at one particular aspect?

The Insight is extremely good at the job of doing the driving you have to do rather than the driving you want to do. You know, commuting and the occasional long distance home-to-somewhere else schlepp where fun occurs at the destination.

Once again, why can't there be an acceptable balance? Why can't a car be both efficient AND fun to commute in? Really this argument is going in circles now, lets call it a truce.

 

[Bopop4]

Why can't a car be both efficient AND fun to commute in?

You mean like the Insight?

No truces now, you stole his purple.

 

[Famine]

So to you, a car isn't worth a damn unless its the absolute best at one particular aspect?

Sure, why not.

I mean, I never actually said that or anything approaching it but if you want to pretend that for some reason, go right ahead.

Once again, why can't there be an acceptable balance? Why can't a car be both efficient AND fun to commute in?

It can be.

There was this odd little electric-assisted Honda in the 1990s. Fun to look at, neat little LCD dash, got 80mpg real world and it didn't have turbos, stupid grabby brakes, a 600lbft clutch or rock hard suspension. I think they called it the "Insight" or something - I'd have to look it up.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Except you don't. I've owned mine for about six ten weeks now and done around 2,500 miles. Given my job, almost every one of those miles has been on the way to test some brand new car or other (or many, as was the case yesterday - one of which had four times more cylinders and about six and a half times more capacity). And not once have I climbed into it at the end of the day and thought "oh god, this thing again". I can't stand the thought of owning a boring car, so I don't buy boring cars.

But that's a fantastic example of a blanket statement you've just provided, after claiming you don't make them

And thank you for clarifying why I called it like it was. @Automobilismo I implore you to take note, though I doubt you'll heed in anyway because your set in your thought and not here to actually learn from what others with more insight (see what I did there) have to say.

Read what I said again and you'll realize that I did not make any such blanket statements.

Is it a fact that the Insight is adored by hypermilers? Yes. Does that mean every Insight owner is a hypermiler? Of course not, just like not every single E46 M3 owner is a douchebag, yet that didn't stop the majority for voting it SU for that reason when it was being polled a month ago.

Yeah you did make a blanket statement

I'm not the majority so focus on me not that logic to propel an argument because I voted uncool on the BMW for a few reasons.

Also if you can show evidence that it is a fact for example 5 out 7 hypermiler enthusiast pick the Honda Insight as their car to achieve this in or some other fact proving criteria I might believe it's an actual fact.

Here is this too help you understand further so you don't have to go back

Yes, I agree with this, but before I say anything further it should be noted that it is a tool used to judge not the only criteria those of who use it base everything from. That is what I think the hang up is for those who seem to be so utterly heart broken over this car being put so low on the cool wall.

If you want to stack up opinions I'd say to those who are mad at us voting it uncool or less (I was one of them so have at it ), then simply compare this thread to the M5 E39 that was voted cool and you'll see why this car of the same era lost to it's bigger sibling in cool factor.

 

[Xilor]

There was this odd little electric-assisted Honda in the 1990s. Fun to look at, neat little LCD dash, got 80mpg real world and it didn't have turbos, stupid grabby brakes, a 600lbft clutch or rock hard suspension. I think they called it the "Insight" or something - I'd have to look it up.

But its all subjective. If you really want to know my full opinion on the Insight, I don't think its fun to look at in any way. In fact, it reminds me of a modern take on a Citroen DS done by some Chinese manufacturer. And I'm not at all a "POWARR" guy, so please don't lump me in with W&N on this one, but 73hp, even in a car this light, is so little that it can actually be hazardous in certain driving situations, such as when merging on a highway through a very short on-ramp (quite prevalent here). But I am not saying that its a bad car, or that people who drive it are all hypermilers or anything of the sort.

And despite all of that, I kind of like this car in a way, it appeals to the gadget geek inside of me. But is it cool? Not in my opinion. Is it a good enough balance between efficiency, style, and fun? Not in my opinion.

Its all subjective, and a matter of personal opinion. And if @LMSCorvetteGT2 and others want to paint me as a narrow-minded fool because my opinions don't coincide with those of other well established and respected members of this forum, so be it.

 

[Famine]

But its all subjective.

Welcome to the actual point of the cool wall.

And I'm not at all a "POWARR" guy, so please don't lump me in with W&N on this one, but 73hp, even in a car this light, is so little that it can actually be hazardous in certain driving situations, such as when merging on a highway through a very short on-ramp (quite prevalent here).

This isn't subjective though - and it is absolute tripe. It's no slower from rest to 60 than any other 1.6 litre hatchback, probably because it has 104lbfft in that 875kg aluminium body, with the battery providing a chunk of that (31lbfft) at 0rpm - in 2nd gear that's a 580lbfft peak.

Not that you should be doing 0 at the bottom of an on-ramp. Coincidentally, I overtook @homeforsummer on an on-ramp merging onto a dual carriageway just yesterday. He didn't seem to have any trouble with it whatsoever.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

.

Its all subjective, and a matter of personal opinion. And if @LMSCorvetteGT2 and others want to paint me as a narrow-minded fool because my opinions don't coincide with those of other well established and respected members of this forum, so be it.

Yeah that's the point, but when you start doing blanket generalizations and then get defensive because I tell you to back them up, that's your fault. Because people will ask you to show criteria on it that shows it as fact or proof positive, I never said any of those things you claimed I'm indirectly calling you. You getting like this as a knee jerk reaction because of your bad wording is going to do what exactly?

 

[Xilor]

Yeah that's the point, but when you start doing blanket generalizations and then get defensive because I tell you to back them up, that's your fault. Because people will ask you to show criteria on it that shows it as fact or proof positive, I never said any of those things you claimed I'm indirectly calling you. You getting like this as a knee jerk reaction because of your bad wording is going to do what exactly?

Well, lets go over it; this is what I've said in my first post in this thread:

I honestly kind of like this car, but there is absolutely no way it can be anything other then Seriously Uncool.

I mean, this car is to the hypermilers what an Alfa 8C is to us petrolheads. They adore it, which means this happens:

Is it a fact that hypermilers love the Insight? Yes. Is it a fact that its a car very often modified in ridiculous ways to squeeze out more MPGs? A quick Google search will confirm that. Is it a fact that hypermiling is deeply uncool? In my opinion, yes, but if you can prove otherwise I'm all ears.

The only blanket statement I've made in this thread is when I compared driving an Insight to drowning in wallpaper paste. And I'll gladly admit it was a stupid remark, but what's done is done.

Everything else I've said was well argumented, at least from my perspective. And my debate with Famine and HFS stemmed from a difference in opinions.

 

[The Stig Farmer]

We're not rating the modified cars... we're rating the original.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Well, lets go over it; this is what I've said in my first post in this thread:



Is it a fact that hypermilers love the Insight? Yes. Is it a fact that its a car very often modified in ridiculous ways to squeeze out more MPGs? A quick Google search will confirm that. Is it a fact that hypermiling is deeply uncool? In my opinion, yes, but if you can prove otherwise I'm all ears.

The only blanket statement I've made in this thread is when I compared driving an Insight to drowning in wallpaper paste. And I'll gladly admit it was a stupid remark, but what's done is done.

There you go again *taps mic* is this thing on? A quick google search will reveal that tons of people like waffles too is it a fact that all of Quebec does...no. Just like it's not a damn fact unless you can prove it. Also it's not a fact that hypermiling is uncool, because as we've already found out coolness is subjective. And subjectivity is not objectivity. Also I don't have anything to prove because I'm not declaring a fact. I think you don't understand how the burden of proof works.

Also no you've made more than one and others have pointed it out to you. If you want to keep acting blind that's all you but you'll find it a uphill battle with many.

 

[CarBastard]

Yikes. Tough one.

It's an eco-friendly car from the time they were built as something radical and not as huge metal blobs of beige. It actually looks interesting. Not sub-zero, but a hefty cool.

But it attracts the hypermilers crowd, and that's one of the most seriously uncool crowds you can associate a car to, close to the Subaru BROOOOOOOOOOOS and the BMW M Regional Managers of ass. Borderline seriously uncool.

BUUUUUUUUUUT...like most of you said, instead of leaving a cloud of CO2 as you go past it leaves a cloud of butthurt of epic proportions from "HURR DURR VEE ATEEEEEEE 'MUUUUUUUURICA" orangutans, and that's very cool! Plus I imagine that if you had to daily commute in a car like this, the savings in gas could allow you to have a pretty epic fun car for the weekends. Sub-zero, for the lulz

 

[MatskiMonk]

Hypermiling is not totally uncool. It leaves more money for Black Jack and hookers.

edit, this is not a cool car though.

 

[Turtle]

Worst car ever, doesn't have a V8.

Wait, no, that's not right. Definitely cool, these remind me of the Citroen DS, because of the covered rear wheels and spaceship-like design. Any car that reminds me of the DS has to be cool.

 

[AlvaroF]

Ugly, but a brilliant little thing. Definatly cool.

 

[Danny]

Driven exclusively by jerks. Uncool.

 

[Xilor]

There you go again *taps mic* is this thing on? A quick google search will reveal that tons of people like waffles too is it a fact that all of Quebec does...no. Just like it's not a damn fact unless you can prove it. Also it's not a fact that hypermiling is uncool, because as we've already found out coolness is subjective. And subjectivity is not objectivity. Also I don't have anything to prove because I'm not declaring a fact. I think you don't understand how the burden of proof works.

Also no you've made more than one and others have pointed it out to you. If you want to keep acting blind that's all you but you'll find it a uphill battle with many.

Are you serious?

Did I say that all hypermilers love the Insight? No. But saying that hypermilers, in general, love the Insight is like saying that petrolheads, in general, love to tinker with their cars. Not all of them do, but most. Hence its a logical and accurate generalization, rather than a blanket one.

Concrete proof comes from the fact that the Insight is a car with which you can get massive MPG gains through hypermiling. Its a car that is very often modified for MPG gains (more so then any other car), its a very popular and loved car on places like Ecomodder, etc.

Is that what you were looking for, or is there something wrong with my proof as well?

 

[homeforsummer]

Not that you should be doing 0 at the bottom of an on-ramp. Coincidentally, I overtook @homeforsummer on an on-ramp merging onto a dual carriageway just yesterday. He didn't seem to have any trouble with it whatsoever.

And you didn't overtake me quite as quickly as I thought you might

Driven exclusively by jerks. Uncool.

Bought that PT Cruiser yet?

Why can't a car be both efficient AND fun to commute in?

Mine is, to me. Not that fun has much to do with anything when you're sitting at 60-80 mph on a motorway, which is what about 90% of my driving in it has been so far - something the Insight does very well indeed (while costing very little to do, and being an interesting vessel in which to travel).

Now if, say, your commute took in a twisty mountain road, then there are certainly better cars for the job, which would be a great deal more fun. Though all the ones I can think of would still cost me about 150% more to fuel. Many of them a lot more than that. Would I be prepared to spend the extra? Depends on the car. Though I'd have to abandon the aforementioned Le Mans trips, cross-country US road trips and that sort of thing. Which would kind of suck.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Are you serious?

Did I say that all hypermilers love the Insight? No. But saying that hypermilers, in general, love the Insight is like saying that petrolheads, in general, love to tinker with their cars. Not all of them do, but most. Hence its a logical and accurate generalization, rather than a blanket one.

Problem is you didn't specify most, some, those who live in the north or south do it whatever. You said "Is it a fact that hypermilers love the Insight? Yes." Which can easily be conceived as all since there is no denotation that says contrary.

Concrete proof comes from the fact that the Insight is a car with which you can get massive MPG gains through hypermiling. Its a car that is very often modified for MPG gains (more so then any other car), its a very popular and loved car on places like Ecomodder, etc.

Yeah that's all great but it doesn't prove it's any more popular than the Prius for hypermiling or a yaris or a Golf TDI or whatever economy saving car you want. No one denied it is modified, I just don't see how you can say very often because you typed it in to a google search as if that's some scientific way of proving yourself.

Is that what you were looking for, or is there something wrong with my proof as well?

Well I said a few post ago there was something wrong with your proof it's not proof, not sure if your mind if fickle or what...[/quote]

 

[Xilor]

Yeah that's all great but it doesn't prove it's any more popular than the Prius for hypermiling or a yaris or a Golf TDI or whatever economy saving car you want. No one denied it is modified, I just don't see how you can say very often because you typed it in to a google search as if that's some scientific way of proving yourself.

Its a very suitable platform for hypermiling. Like I've said massive MPG gains can be obtained by using hypermiling techniques, and doing shoddy, ridiculous, but cheap modifications like I've posted on Page 1.

That's why a lot of these cars end up in the hands of people interested in hypermiling, and why its adored by the hypermiling crowd. Hence why I associate it with hypermiling.

If its not as popular as a Civic or Yaris, its only because it was more expensive when new and didn't sell in very large numbers. But then again, I never said it was more popular than anything else.

Mine is, to me. Not that fun has much to do with anything when you're sitting at 60-80 mph on a motorway, which is what about 90% of my driving in it has been so far - something the Insight does very well indeed (while costing very little to do, and being an interesting vessel in which to travel).

That's great for you. I never said it couldn't be a fun car, since what turns you on in a car is purely subjective. I just know for me it wouldn't quite cut it since I like cars that can throw me into the back of the seat when I put my foot down, even if I don't get the chance to put it down very often.

 

[homeforsummer]

I just know for me it wouldn't quite cut it since I like cars that can throw me into the back of the seat when I put my foot down, even if I don't get the chance to put it down very often.

It's worth mentioning - so do I! And I'll even concede that once or twice since I've owned it, I've wished I had a little more power. But the huge majority of the time, and for the sort of driving I do (almost exclusively 150+ mile trips on motorways) I'd have gained very little, if anything, by having a quicker car. But I'd have burned a heck of a lot of money for no good reason doing so.

Though it's also worth mentioning, the fact it doesn't swallow all my money isn't why I think it's cool

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Its a very suitable platform for hypermiling. Like I've said massive MPG gains can be obtained by using hypermiling techniques, and doing shoddy, ridiculous, but cheap modifications like I've posted on Page 1.

Indeed it can no one said it couldn't, what is under scrutiny is your whimsical use of the supposed fact that most do or somehow being an exclusive hypermiling car. I already agreed long ago that a few people do it obviously.

That's why a lot of these cars end up in the hands of people interested in hypermiling, and why its adored by the hypermiling crowd. Hence why I associate it with hypermiling.

That's fine it's a subjective view point but not a fact that most people buy it for that reason that would require one to actually go out and measure it. Just like you stated prior it isn't a fact that most people who buy an E46 are jerks or morons that think they have money.

If its not as popular as a Civic or Yaris, its only because it was more expensive when new and didn't sell in very large numbers. But then again, I never said it was more popular than anything else.

Well saying that the majority of hyermilers buy it or that most who own it are, can be thought of as because it more popular due to its attributes. People don't have to directly say things all the time for certain ideas to be drawn, just so you know.

 

[Sage Ages]

We need a rating between "meh" and "cool". I fail to identify this as any of the available options.

 

[Dennisch]

I'd buy one in a heartbeat, but none of them are for sale here. I love it for all the reasons already mentioned. And for pissing off the anti hybrid/v8 everything crowd, who gives a rats ass about their opinion anyway?

Solid cool, scratching Sub Zero's butt.


Hnnnggggg. 4 of them are for sale in Germany.

 

[JAHHAJ]

I don't like then but it was so clever for its time so I voted cool.

 

[MoLiEG]

Seriously Uncool.

It's uglyness is over 9000.

 

[Downhill Dino]

It's a Honda. It's a hybrid. Technology! Oh so terrible! Sub-zero.

Great little car, and just about any car that upsets enthusiasts (whether they truly are or not) is cool in my book.

 

[Cano]

Seriously Uncool.

It's uglyness is over 9000.

Not the beautiful wall, dude.