GTP WTAC Week 49 : FR Challenge presented by red ice

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Detroitbb

Detroitbb

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GTP WTAC Week 49 : FR Challenge presented by red ice​


*** These two Front engine/Rear wheel drive cars were selected by our very own red ice. We haven't seen him around lately (I'm assuming that he's very busy working in Doha, Qatar), but we all miss him and hope he's doing well. I look forward to the day when he is able to return to the WTAC - he's a VIP as far as I'm concerned! So please join me in celebrating our friend by racing his car combo for Week 49! ***




1. Track : Trial Mountain (reverse)


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2. Cars : Nismo 270R '94 & Jaguar E-Type Coupe '61

nismop.jpg
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jagl.jpg



IMPORTANT ! This is a combined times challenge: you'll need to run both cars; rankings will be made based on your combined times.

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3. Cars specifics:

- Transmission: either
- Tires: S2 / S2
- TCS : at your disposal
- ASM : off
- Active Steering : off
- Driving Physics : Professional

All in-game quick-tune options are at your disposal (Press Triangle when selecting your car to add the car to your favorites and tinker with any available settings).

Hybrid cars, the use of CFW tuning or any other way of cheating (such as the Action Replay for PSP) is forbidden...

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4. Duration of the challenges : this challenge will start Monday April 25th 4:00 pm GMT+2 and will end Monday May 2nd 3:59 pm GMT+2 (one week !)

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5. Time submission :

You'll have to post your Ghost Replay Data + Photo before Monday May 2nd 3:59 pm GMT+2. If you miss the deadline, your laptimes won't be in the website.

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6. Rules :

You'll have to follow the Host and Compete in a GT Planet Time Attack Challenge (GTPTAC) You'll have to follow the Host and Compete in a GT Planet Time Attack Challenge (GTPTAC) ! Just to remind you :
Clean or Dirty lap :
- Colliding with or using walls, fences, cones or other obstacle is forbidden. All times submitted must be 100% wall free.
- Two wheels (except when airborne, where the vertical projection of the car onto the track counts) must be in contact with the tarmac which does not include all green/grassed/sanded/graveled areas.
- NO SPARKS! (this does not include 'bottoming' the car out on the tarmac or rumble strips; but does include walls/barriers)
Rumble/ripple strips :
- having two wheels/tires on a corner's inside rumble strips and two off track is considered unclean
- having two wheels/tires on a corner's outside rumble strips and two off track is considered clean.


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7. LeaderBoards

The leaderboards will be on the website


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8. Current session points leaders:


Place - Competitor - Points

1st #l-l Dan360######.l8
2nd #-l pvr77########7
3rd #l-l easyasashii###&l6
4th #l-l Detroitbb#####ll5
5th #l-l vaughan#####$l4


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:gtpflag:
 
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Trial mountain! My favorite track!

Jaguar: 1'50.885
Nismo: 1'49.826

Both cars slide a lot, so i needed to turn the TCS high.
 

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Can I go out of or turn in from the outside of the white line to use the width of the road when across Turn A and B? I'm confused again...:indiff:

Is it regarded as an unclean one in Turn K of Jaguar since all four wheels are on the outside of the white line inside the apex?
ucus98632114260291379.jpg


Tough challenge for me to find a right driving line and to avoid unnecessary wheel-spin. Found so many sparks made by Jaguar and the ground when it's on the upgrade. Suppose it's easier to control than the Nismo with a TCS 5.:)

What's the meaning of sign "T" on the track chart ? And the grey sectors ? Thanks.
 

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The 'T' signifies where the timer takes a reading for each sector. You'll see the sector times only when watching the replay through the Replay Theater. The gray things on the map are the tunnels through the 'mountain'.

In the photo above, I consider that to be clean. Your left two tires are still on the tarmac - if just one more tire was on the light gray part on the right side, then that would be unclean.

I should also mention that you can go right up to the wall at the start/finish line and just after turn 12/B. Just don't scrap the walls! Another section you can use is the yellow striped lines at F/8 and 7/G.

I also noticed the Jaguar bottoming-out on the track in a few different areas. Because of that, I closely watched the speed of my car when the sparks happen and it seems to me that the car briefly stops accelerating as it scrapes the tarmac. But since it happens so quickly, I'm not 100% sure that it actually does stop the acceleration (if even for a millisecond). Tuning the Jaguar will be very interesting for this challenge!
 
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Thanks for clearing up the rules for this track for us, Detroit. I remember racing the Mazda 1800 in TAC here almost a year ago but couldn't remember what rules we used.

No respectable times from me yet.
 
Detroitbb
if just one more tire was on the light gray part on the right side, then that would be unclean.
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Light grey part? I regarded it as also tarmac...I'll check it again for not breaking the rules in future.

Detroitbb
Tuning the Jaguar will be very interesting for this challenge!
Click to expand...
Share with us when you done:dopey: What I thought is just to strengthen the strings and dumps to avoid sparks...
 
Some first times from me...

270R - 1'45.5xx 1'43.6xx
E-Type - 1'47.4xx

This Jaguar is impressing me so much! It's a blast to drive!
 
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I wonder what i do wrong that i have laptimes at about 3 seconds slower then other people. I guess braking does make a big difference.
 
noisiaturismo
I wonder what i do wrong that i have laptimes at about 3 seconds slower then other people. I guess braking does make a big difference.
Click to expand...

You're not slower than me:dopey: I guess NOT braking somewhere also made that difference. Anyway they're very fast, as you can see, they have been racing for years!:scared:
 
noisiaturismo
I wonder what i do wrong that i have laptimes at about 3 seconds slower then other people. I guess braking does make a big difference.
Click to expand...

noisiaturismo
Both cars slide a lot, so i needed to turn the TCS high.
Click to expand...

You have a piece of answer just here ! We found out that by using TCS you'll lose too much traction and thus time ! So except for few very high HP cars - LMP or others- or extremly excitable cars, we just keep it turned off.

This is the part where everything is becoming difficult : how to make the car less excitable while using no TCS ? :
1. Practice
2. Practice (yep, practice again ;))
3. Patience
4. Tuning
5. Luck ;)

So big problem is "Tuning" !!! I'll give you two technics :bowdown: Lion-Face
gave us on how to start your tuning process :

Race Cars (L-F tuning)
Aoero max
Spring + Damper default settings divided by 2
All other settings set to 0 (including TCS)

Stock Cars (L-F Stock Tuning)
Spring default settings x3
Damper default settings x4
All other settings set to 0 (including TCS)

Run at least 80 laps like that before trying some tuning !

(For already tuned cars -eg Nismo- I usually only set Toe to 0 instead of +0.20 default setting)

Hope this is helpfull !

My first 20 laps (Default Settings, Toe 0) with the Nismo gave me a 1'44.805 : the car is still unstable so I'll have to try out some tunings.

:cheers:
 
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easyasashii
You have a piece of answer just here ! We found out that by using TCS you'll lose too much traction and thus time ! So except for few very HP cars - LMP or others- or extremly excitable cars, we just keep it turned off.

This is the part where everything is becoming difficult : how to make the car less excitable while using no TCS ? :
1. Practice
2. Practice (yep, practice again ;))
3. Patience

Run at least 80 laps like that before trying some tuning !
Click to expand...

Haven't done that much even the last week ... suppose I should practice harder with clam nerves.:grumpy:
 
noisiaturismo
... I guess braking does make a big difference.
Click to expand...

When practicing I always spend a lot of time finding the optimal breaking point, for me breaking is one of the trickiest (and most important) aspects of driving. One thing I've never understood is how to avoid locking up your breaks.
 
I got the 270 R down to 1'42.5xx

This track is a bigger challenge than I thought it would be, every time I think ''ok, now I know this track'' something pops up. Really difficult track to tune for.
 
Hi guys, sorry for not being able to compete last week. Got sick last weekend and some truck broke my internet line so dont have internet at home Ill see how to post my times this week. Did run some lap last night with the Jaguar... 1,44.7xx. typing from the psp this an adventure! ha! ha!
 
MVR08
Hi guys, sorry for not being able to compete last week. Got sick last weekend and some truck broke my internet line so dont have internet at home Ill see how to post my times this week. Did run some lap last night with the Jaguar... 1,44.7xx. typing from the psp this an adventure! ha! ha!
Click to expand...


You typed that on the PSP? It must have taken you a couple of hours!
 
I always can't use a full throttle with Nismo! What should I do if not set TCS? I feel a better controllable only with TCS set to 5...
 
pvr77
I got the 270 R down to 1'42.5xx

This track is a bigger challenge than I thought it would be, every time I think ''ok, now I know this track'' something pops up. Really difficult track to tune for.
Click to expand...

Yes it is !!! I ran one hour yesterday and I'm down to 1'43.484 with the nismo, I see where I'm too slow, I'm aiming a high 1'42, will be hard for me to be in mid 1'42 before deadline and I still haven't tried the Jag' !

vaughan
I always can't use a full throttle with Nismo! What should I do if not set TCS? I feel a better controllable only with TCS set to 5...
Click to expand...

Do what you think is best for you ! But I wouldn't set more than 1...

You also have to figure out when she loses grip and try to correct your driving line according to it by going slightly left-right-left-right or tap-tap-tap on throttle.

It's hard to explain when or how to avoid sliding but as general rule a sudden change of direction + full throttle with an easy oversteering car will increase your chances to slide (so try to push on throttle when your tires are straight).

You also can play with the gear : a high 2nd might make you slide while a high 3rd might not -for almost same speed.

That being said in the same track I'll use all of these technics : play with the direction while turning + full throttle, wait for my tires being straight before pushing X, at some corner a high 2nd with playing with direction will help me to be faster whereas at another corner a 3rd will guarantee me to have a clean lap even if I might lose a little bit time !

Trial Mountain is very very tricky, easy to lose half a second for one tiny late braking or different driving line !!! So only practice will help you thanks to "try" and "miss".

I also usually run some races first : I let the being clean + sector times aside to focus on winning the race and pushing the car's limits... Then I do TT.

But well, I'm not the fastest so it is just my opinion... H

I can give you my actual slight tuning (1'43.484) :

TCS 0
Ride Height : -3 0 (hope to give a tiny little bit more downforce to the rear)
Springs 4 4 Damper 4 4
Toe 0 0 Camber : 1 0.5

But you have to know that I am a very bad tuner, I'm trying to learn so don't take this tuning like something you should do nor try to understand it, I just read lots of things (I also put a tuning guide link in my signature if it can help you) and sometimes I'm not thinking too much, just try and if faster = good, if slower/less smooth = bad !

MVR08
Hi guys, sorry for not being able to compete last week. Got sick last weekend and some truck broke my internet line so dont have internet at home Ill see how to post my times this week. Did run some lap last night with the Jaguar... 1,44.7xx. typing from the psp this an adventure! ha! ha!
Click to expand...

Glad to know you still here -even if that means I won't see the podium for a while from now on ;)-

:cheers:
 
I had a pretty good (and lucky) run last night with the Nismo 270R: 1'43.1xx

My Jaguar time also improved, but not as much as the other car: 1'44.9xx



vaughan - I'm not sure that I can help any more than what easyasashii said, but I'll add my thoughts. I don't use TCS at all. When I joined the TAC, a very fast racer named Glubags convinced me not to use it as it slows down the car (to make it manageable on track). Instead, he directed me to try and change my driving style to maximize speed/control-ability. Namely, not giving the car full throttle until it is pointed straight down the track. He said to TAP-TAP-TAP the throttle going around a turn so I don't spin out. The tighter the turn, the longer you wait between taps... as the turn starts to straighten out, you can increase the tapping until you are straight - then you give it full throttle. It's a technique that takes practice (and it's slightly different for each car and each track), but it will improve you times! Also, as easyasashii said, tuning is important. Unfortunately, I am also not a good tuner. I've lowered my Nismo's front end to -5 and the rear to -4 (for a little bit of positive rake); raised the spring rate to 6 for both the front and rear; I have the dampers both set to 5; my toe settings are both 0; and my camber is 2.5 for the front and 1.8 for the rear. I have similar (but not exactly the same) setup for my Jaguar as well. As I go along and run laps, I change things here and there in the tuning setup to fit my car, the track, and my personal driving style.
 
^ :lol: !!!

I was about to post the fact that I went for stiffer Spring + Damper to 5 (should try Spring 6 to see ;)) and I lowered the car (I kept 2 points difference -5 -3) and increased camber 1.7 1 (7 points difference too !!!) 1'43.089 !

:cheers:
 
Yesterday i improved my 270 R time by .5xx, think I'm gonna submit that time 'cause I haven't really touched the Jag yet.

My current tune for the E-TYPE is...

RH -10/-8
SR 8/8
Dmpr 7/7
Toe -20/+20
CA 1.5/1

But I'm a bit of a pleb when it comes to tuning :lol:, usually it feels as if it's luck when I eventually get a good tune for a track.

Why do you guys always set your toe to 0/0 ? :boggled:
 

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