Here's something for you to chew over... Decision made!

  • Thread starter Thread starter GilesGuthrie
  • 110 comments
  • 6,801 views

So, which car for Daddy GeeGee?

  • BMW F10 M5

    Votes: 25 34.7%

  • Audi S8

    Votes: 2 2.8%

  • Jaguar XJ L Supersport

    Votes: 11 15.3%

  • Mercedes E63 AMG

    Votes: 10 13.9%

  • Porsche Panamera

    Votes: 8 11.1%

  • Jaguar XFR

    Votes: 8 11.1%

  • Maserati Quattroporte

    Votes: 7 9.7%

  • Audi S6

    Votes: 1 1.4%
  • Total voters
    72
ExigeEvan
Because I studied aerodynamics at degree level and was very, very interested as to why you saw the need to mention Cd.
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He had a point to be fair - good aero makes for a quieter cabin, which is kind of a USP for cars like these. Aero isn't all about fuel efficiency (though of course it helps). And bringing up the F1 car was pretty irrelevant.

However, it may have helped had he mentioned an actual trim level rather than just saying "W212 E-Class". And since the E63 has already been mentioned, it'd be redundant anyway.
 
E63 is on the list, don't worry. But they're fairly thin on the ground within budget.
 
[some time later...]

So, I drove the Jaguar. Wow, what a lovely car. Simply unbelievable ride quality. Great power. Definitely an object of desire on every level. Unfortunately the test drive was a little short, and some eejit on a tiny motorbike prevented me from exploring the handling. Feels like a big car, but it went where I pointed it. The only things slightly amiss were a really grabby brake pedal (probably something to get used to, and also the car was only 8 miles old), and the fact that looking at the TFT screens would be a bit distracting. Again, just something to get used to though.

My wife was all for buying it there and then.

Went immediately after to a BMW garage, and crawled over an M5 again. Overriding impression of the BMW was "small". And - whilst feeling a bit better made - a bit lower-rent. Booked a test-drive in the M5 for this coming Sunday that has - due to the salesman being my son's godfather - become a case of picking it up on Saturday morning and dropping it back Sunday afternoon.

Yep, I've got an M5 for the weekend!

Probably going to buy the Jaguar though.
 
I'm getting another go in the Jag in a few Fridays time, which I'm rather excited about. Don't blame you at all for liking it. Can't remember what I thought of the brakes last time but as you point out, with so few miles they might just need bedding in.
 
Having seen the inside of a current Merc E, BMW 5, Jag XF and Jag XJ, I'd say the requirement for carrying three potential six rooters in the rear bench will be best met by the XJ... And yes, she does drive quite sweetly (and not at all harshly) for a big barge....

Can't you get the interior in a customized trim? Rather than wood, you can get it in brushed aluminum and carbon fiber. I know, I know... Ech, CF... but it's more understated and tasteful than you'd think...
 
niky
Having seen the inside of a current Merc E, BMW 5, Jag XF and Jag XJ, I'd say the requirement for carrying three potential six rooters in the rear bench will be best met by the XJ... And yes, she does drive quite sweetly (and not at all harshly) for a big barge....

Can't you get the interior in a customized trim? Rather than wood, you can get it in brushed aluminum and carbon fiber. I know, I know... Ech, CF... but it's more understated and tasteful than you'd think...
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I'm assuming that by "rooters" you meant "footers"?! Yes, that's indubitably so.

The Jag we're looking at is a specific car. It's unregistered, just done a couple of short demos, so the spec is as-built. The wood trim in it is OK, but we'd probably have gone for piano black.
 
I've always wondered what makes someone choose one of these mega engined big saloon/estate cars - I just can't see what advantage they offer over the top end diesel versions other than the ego boost of saying you have 'an M5' (or AMG/Supersport).

They aren't any faster in the real world, they are significantly more expensive to buy, significantly more expensive to run, depreciate like a stone, you can't use but a fraction of the performance 99.9% of the time, yet they don't offer anymore of a rewarding driving experience.

No one's going to get up early to hoon in an M5 for example... they are far too big, far too heavy to use on the sort of road you can have a quiet blast on (ie; B roads), and you need to be going at license losing speeds before you'll get any sort of feedback.

May as well save yourself a packet and buy a well optioned 535d/E350d/XJ 3.0d and a proper sportscar.

I do think the XJ is a thing of immense beauty though... black on black, 20's... perfect.
 
Stotty
May as well save yourself a packet and buy a well optioned 535d/E350d/XJ 3.0d and a proper sportscar.
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Or an Alpina D5. 345bhp, 516lb ft, 0-60 in 5.1sec, 171mph, and 47.9mpg.
 
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homeforsummer
Shhhhhhh! If people don't buy them now I won't be able to buy them in 20 years time! :sly:
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Very true... but cars like the M5 and E63AMG will be money pits in 20 years time. These cars are soooo complex nowadays that when something goes wrong it's going to be 2nd mortgage time to fix them. I suppose this will be balanced by how cheap they will be as I doubt many people will want them when petrol is £20 a gallon plus and more modern cars at that time will be doing 100mpg plus.

daan
Or an Alpina D5. 345bhp, 516lb ft, 0-60 in 5.1sec, 171mph, and 47.9mpg.
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Can't agrue with the way Alpina's get down the road, but I always think the body kits look a bit stuck on.


I think the new 6 Series Granturismo is just about the best looking BMW I've seen in a long time... personally, I'd rather have a 640d MSport than an M5.
 
Stotty
I've always wondered what makes someone choose one of these mega engined big saloon/estate cars -

[snip]

May as well save yourself a packet and buy a well optioned 535d/E350d/XJ 3.0d and a proper sportscar.

I do think the XJ is a thing of immense beauty though... black on black, 20's... perfect.
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I don't think that buying an M5 or an XJ SS is on any real level a "sensible" choice. But we talked over the notion of buying a sportscar, and it simply wouldn't get used. So we wanted something "ultimate", that could cart the family round, and which would get used. Your point about not getting up early to take an M5 for a backroad blast is valid, but then the M5 would get use in other occasions. It wouldn't be like a Caterham that required me to get up early to get any use at all.

So, let's explore the "ultimate" nature of that statement. What is it? Is it the big engine? The massive spec? The bragging rights? Is it that I want a really fast car, even though your points regarding the accessibility of that performance are valid? Sure, I'm not going to be able to explore the performance (inc handling) envelope of either car with any sort of regularity. But then, would I be able to if I bought a sportscar?

For me, buying an M5 or XJ SS is about having that arsenal of weaponry with me whenever I'm driving, should the opportunity to use it arise. It's not about finding myself on an empty country road in an E350 and then realising I brought the wrong car/too many children on this trip.

And it's about overtaking. A 530d is 300bhp. An M5 is 550bhp. That extra 250bhp turns short straights into overtaking opportunities in a way that a simple 0-60 benchmark can't fully convey.

But it's also about it being my family's 40th birthday present to me. I fully concede that there's no real rational explanation for it, and I don't really care about that.
 
Stotty
Very true... but cars like the M5 and E63AMG will be money pits in 20 years time. These cars are soooo complex nowadays that when something goes wrong it's going to be 2nd mortgage time to fix them. I suppose this will be balanced by how cheap they will be as I doubt many people will want them when petrol is £20 a gallon plus and more modern cars at that time will be doing 100mpg plus.
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Know what you mean on the fuel thing, but not so sure about them being money pits - at least no more than their equivalents of 20 years ago. We're at a stage where stuff like the M5 or XJ SS is built to such a standard it'll likely go on forever mechanically, and I don't doubt that electronic bits and bobs will be easy to come by in 20 years time.

I'd actually have far less faith in a modern diesel being affordable that far down the line, what with DPFs, common rail systems, dual-mass flywheels etc to go wrong. That, and rumblings that diesel rationing could be in place in as little as a decade...

Maybe my money in two decades would go on a Tesla Model S instead...
 
Whilst I don't have the same point of view, I do understand where you're coming from... sometimes you just have to have something.

Nice present to give yourself for your 40th 👍

homeforsummer
Know what you mean on the fuel thing, but not so sure about them being money pits - at least no more than their equivalents of 20 years ago. We're at a stage where stuff like the M5 or XJ SS is built to such a standard it'll likely go on forever mechanically, and I don't doubt that electronic bits and bobs will be easy to come by in 20 years time.

I'd actually have far less faith in a modern diesel being affordable that far down the line, what with DPFs, common rail systems, dual-mass flywheels etc to go wrong. That, and rumblings that diesel rationing could be in place in as little as a decade...

Maybe my money in two decades would go on a Tesla Model S instead...
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Hmmm... wonder how much a turbo is for an F10 M5? I suspect it might be quite expensive!

And yes, modern diesels will (would) be even more risky... but then I very much doubt we'll be driving diesels in 20 years. Most likely we'll be in Hybrids, but personally, I'm hoping they find a way to make hydrogen work in cars.
 
Mhmmm... V8 or V6 diesel... a few thousand to replace each turbo when eventual coking seizes up the fragile variable geometry mechanisms... then a couple of hundred each for the high-pressure injectors and pumps when they finally (and inevitably) fail.

I'd still buy one. Those new diesels are manic... and there's enough torque to make passing a gas. Keep it a few years, then sell it before the fuel system blows due to the lack of lubrication from EUROXVIII-level diesel...

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"Rooters"... pardon my iPad. I type too fast for it to follow... :dopey:

-

I'd always imagined my "gift" car (in about twenty or thirty years) to be something subtle, understated and fitting my automotive tastes. A metallic pink E39 M5... with gold chrome wheels... :p
 
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Well, the decision has been made...

I intend - subject to agreeing a final price - to purchase the chosen car this evening.

Anyone going to guess what I'm going for?
 
Tradition dictates that if you drive the BMW first, you compare everything to it and end up getting the thing that drives nearly as well that gives you some other things that are better - but if you drive the BMW last, you buy that because it drives so damned well that you can cope with some other things being nearly as good.
 
I hope you went for the Jag. The current XJ, in the right spec, is a very imposing looking car on the road. And to para-phrase a character from Saxondale.

'500bhp will still put your bowells in your back pocket.'
 
Well, I guess that's a rare instance of Famine not being right! :p

I went for the Jaguar in the end. The M5 was utterly tremendous, especially at going very very fast, but it was too busy, the ride was too harsh, and somehow its electronics didn't really fit with what I wanted. The Jaguar achieves the same goal of transporting us around in luxury and with massive gobs of pace on tap, but does it rather more serenely.

In summary, the Jaguar was more relaxing, more charming, larger, and just plain nicer.

And we pretty much stole it.
 
Famine
That's how you go fast. All the manufacturers are doing it, so they must be right.

[/In before James May]
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Well quite. But it doesn't bode well for a £70k investment when you want to hand the demonstrator back after 10 hours because you're tired of it.
 
Ten hours? The ride pretty much becomes unbearable for anyone not behind the steering wheel after thirty minutes.

Congratulations. Now we need a picture with your driver's license and proof of theft to rat you out to the police. :D
 
niky
Congratulations. Now we need a picture with your driver's license and proof of theft to rat you out to the police. :D[/B]
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And a picture of the car with a handwritten note that says, "Daddy GeeGee of Gee Tee Pee".
 
He's buying a big, posh, Jaaaag. It'll be a packet of pate fois gras, what.
 

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