Honda VTEC

  • Thread starter Thread starter k20a1emcivic
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JNasty4G63
Big deal. So its taken them 15 years to get half of the work done. I'm all about advancement, but I would surely not call the Mustang "high tech" now. I mean, Sentras, some Hyundais, and even some Kias, just to name a few, have CVT in their cars now. Its nice to have, for sure, but its by no means "high tech" in a car today.

Ughhh (yes I started another response with uhh) CVTs have nothing with the engine. A CVT is a continuously variable transmission.
 
xcsti
Ughhh (yes I started another response with uhh) CVTs have nothing with the engine. A CVT is a continuously variable transmission.
CVT = continuouslly variable valve timing

It can mean both, but in the discussion we were having, I was referring to the cylinder head tech, not the trans tech. Sorry I missed putting a "C" in there, to make it say CVVT instead, I was trying to shorten it :irked: :irked: . I know what the hell a CVT trans is.

Hilg
 
For k20a1 calling me an "As*clown" and saying my car was "bullshi*"

k20a1emcivic
It's funny how you all have VTEC Hondas. That's bullshi*... As*clown.[/B]<-- for guy w the NSX, DEL SOL AND PRELUDE

Alright, for you, mr. miami vice civic. If you know anything about local AutoX'ing clubs then you've heard about Martin Sports Car Club in Orlando, and you know they've been around since the 60's.

Here's my results from the April 2004 Mini-Prix at Gainesville International Raceway,

Martin Sports Car Club Final Results, MSCC Event #4 - April Mini Prix - 04-10-2004

Cross-check my R.L. GTP profile name with the name in those race results, (My del Sol was in GP-G Prepared class).

And here's a photo from that very event of me staging for a run, complete with car number and class.

34236%3B2723232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2339%3D826%3D366%3DXROQDF%3E2323686%3B858%3C9ot1lsi


> Check out the whole Mini-Prix Album here <

Sorry everybody for going way off topic. I just have to stick up for the Real Car / Real Racing / G.T. fans that I know enjoy these forums.
 
20b is a 2L twin turbo engine just in case u didnt no, out of the mazda cosmo. the main reason a rotary is not used for top fuel dragsters is because mazda is not going to waste its time building a 8L rotary engine to use in a car so if u want a big displacement rotary ud have to make it urself and use several rotary housing and manafacture an eccentric shaft, intake manifold etc. the rotarys used for drags which i have mentioned are from cars and modified to handle big horsepower. it is uncomon to see a rotary use methonal but it is possible there are a few in aus. also how u said rotarys sound awful, are u kiding me, they sound awesome. rotarys rule
 
Good lord what happened to this thread? I was all ready to talk some VTEC and the odd DSM here and there and then it turns to full on domestic-import battle. 👎

getting back on topic, I don't think the engines sounds were really all that great for the majority of the cars, not just the VTECs. They were alright, like you could recognize a motor but the WRX for example didn't sound like a boxer should.
 
Civicbus
Good lord what happened to this thread? I was all ready to talk some VTEC and the odd DSM here and there and then it turns to full on domestic-import battle. 👎

getting back on topic, I don't think the engines sounds were really all that great for the majority of the cars, not just the VTECs. They were alright, like you could recognize a motor but the WRX for example didn't sound like a boxer should.

dude you are right...the boxer engines didn't sound right. all the engine recordings were strange. you could definatly tell the engines were under 0 stress. i really hope PD fixed that. go VTEC....and DSM :sly:
 
BadBatsuMaru
I honestly don't know what it is that you guys are going on about with this "VTEC sound" crap.
....
To hear you guys talk, I would think that a Honda should have some loud noise as the cam shifts, then the engine goes from whisper quiet to a deafening roar. That's just not the way it works. Sure, you can pick out the VTEC changeover, but it's not some huge difference. It's really not even noticable on my Del Sol.

Maybe this only applies to the guys who put in new cams and remove their muffler.

it doesn't take any significant mods to experience the blast of VTEC engagement. Honda does a good job of quieting it down from the factory with a resonator, but thats all that is between you and audio bliss :)


The sound change under the hood comes from the big jump in intake valve lift & duration, and ESPECIALLY from valve overlap. On the high cam, you have a fair amount of time in the engine's revolution during the exhaust stroke that both the intake and exhaust valves are at least partially open. What happens is that the sound of internal combustion not only goes out the exhaust, but back through the intake manifold.

You will see that DOHC VTEC honda motors have elaborate, complex, and restrictive resonators under the airbox. This muffles the sound of the high cam from the factory. You don't have to 'rice' out your car to hear the big change. On the prelude VTEC I can speak from experience, removing the stock instake system makes the high cam sound like a monster. Infact, I like the sound of an H22 with an aftermarket instake, and a STOCK exhaust, because you can hear the engine hammering away under the hood at WOT and its not drowned out by the exhaust sound.

With an aftermarket intake AND a loud, straight exhaust, the VTEC crossover is actually not quite as pronounced as a car that just has the modified intake system w/ the stock exhaust. The exhaust note does not change drastically when VTEC engages, as most of the internal combustion sound is already going out the exhaust, and that doesn't change much when VTEC engages.

Either on the H22 or the NSX, remove the top portion of the airbox, and stick a K&N cone filter on the stock intake rubber pipe. At WOT, the sound the car will make switching from the low cam to the high cam will drop your jaw, guaranteed. Its SUCH a huge difference from stock. I had a non-VTEC prelude that was all 'riced' out (the automotive taste of a 16 year old isn't always above par), and had quite a bit of experience wioth loud strange noises... I sold it, bought a '94 VTEC prelude - first thing I did was put a complete aftermarket intake on it, and removed the stock resonator... I took it for a test drive, and was laughing like a school girl to the sound of VTEC. It sounds like a MONSTER, and I would encourange you to at least give it a try. If you like it, you can remove the stock intake pipe & resonator from inside the fender, and replace it with a true aftermarket system. If not, the airbox is not hard to put back on.

Also, the degree of sound change depends on throttle position, as the throttle plate acts as a muffler.
 
greyout is right <8- ) a friend of my brother has a 2004 RSX type S. that thing is so loud once it hits vtec. he just has a AEM V2 cold air intake its it like night and day vs. stock. its a obvious sound with just the intake. he is getting his new headers (jackson i think) and a tanabe exhaust. it can already keep up with a turbocharged accord with a big DSM turbo on the highway had to cut it off at 120 <8*-(

my brother has a 91 DSM too with highflow exhaust stuff (downpipe, cat-back.)
 
blargonator
greyout is right <8- ) a friend of my brother has a 2004 RSX type S. that thing is so loud once it hits vtec. he just has a AEM V2 cold air intake its it like night and day vs. stock. its a obvious sound with just the intake. he is getting his new headers (jackson i think) and a tanabe exhaust. it can already keep up with a turbocharged accord with a big DSM turbo on the highway had to cut it off at 120 <8*-(

my brother has a 91 DSM too with highflow exhaust stuff (downpipe, cat-back.)

man u crazy....RSX can't keep up with a DSM...we got so much more torque than VTEC engines. before i moved out to DC for college, there was a dude back in Cincinnati with an RSX Type-S...had exhaust, intake, carbon hood, tires, rims, and some other work on it...basic stuff.....my Eclipse had nothing on it but tires, rims, intake, BOV, stock turbo, intercooler piping, intake manifold, turbo timer and boost controller. i beat the snot out of that RSX at a stop light and got followed onto the highway....tried to catch me and i lost him after a quick drag. i could here some VTEC behind me but thats where it stayed. VTEC = no torque.... Turbo 4G63 = more torque than HP....idk man....either your bro's friend fiddled with that RSX a little more seriously or you met some ***** DSM drivers... :dopey:
 
lol you did not read it did you? turbocharged ACCORD with a jdm turbo. lol yeah dsms make a ton of power with just a few parts. oh and the RSX is definetly not slow <);- )
 
The Reason VTEC is heard is because DURATION and LIFT.

The VTEC lobes don't function until oil pressure sends a pin through all thre rockers. That's when you hear the VTEC, because the added LIFT and DURATION.

Stock ITR's come with 10.5mm bumpsticks on both IN and EX.

Toda's on the other hand are very nice cams. For example the Spec B cams profiles I have here have three profiles. The 250's, 285, and the 295 mean the DURATION. The 11.0 and 12.0 are the LIFT in mm.


TODA SPEC B Profile 1 Profile 2 Profile 3
IN 250 (11.0) - 295 (12.0) - 250 (11.0)
EX 250 (11.0) - 285 (12.0) - 250 (11.0)
 

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k20a1emcivic
DSM= Diamond Star Manufacturer
DSM = Diamond Star Motors

And, it could actually have a DSM turbo. The DSM's, depending on year, used a couple of very common sized turbos. The t25 in the 2G, while being small for a DSM, would be a pretty nice turbo on a turbo Honda application. So, I'm not sticking up for the guy, but Mitsu makes a lot of turbos. So, maybe he was off in his description, but he could indirectly be close.

Hilg
 
RSX may not be that slow but i have yet to see it take a DSM...someone show me a video! one of my other friends drives an RSX and its stock....its not too bad...pretty balanced out too....however the feeling riding in an Eclipse just so much more satisfying....oooohhhhhh and my friend's ITR is soooooo much fun to ride in too....i'd love to own one!
 
...this thread is stupid...it's just people arguing over what car is better or yada yada. Point blank if you mod a car it'll be better than a stock car. This is stupid to argue about a modded car being "better"...it's modded...only compare stocks when saying what's better.

And in reference to VTEC...why does everyone feel they have to prove their point or prove they are right? There are too many who know too little, and too few who know too much...just give yourselves a rest.

If PD did what I think they did, you won't hear VTEC, because you don't really hear it much STOCK. Modded, yes, you'll hear it, STOCK? Not really.

I just don't see why this thread keeps going...it's almost as bad as the forza threads.
 
k20a1emcivic
BTW you probably didn't read it either. It said the Accord had a DSM turbo.

DSM= Diamond Star Manufacturer
heh im the one who wrote about that in the first place. i was saying the turbo in the accord came off a jdm eclipse or whatever they have ( the fto?) its definetly not a 16g but yeah its probably the little one off the 2nd gen. i do know what a dsm is too. my brother has one...........anyways back to the original topic. vtec is sort of a hard sound to get right because it changes so much from part to part. i just hope they get it close <8- )
 
Hi guys I'm Soman's friend and a big enthusiast of Honda. My first car was Honda CRX 1991, 1.6 16v 127 Horse Power. Then I had a Civic 3d 1996, 1.6 16 V-Tec 148 Horse Power (after chipping 172 HP). Now I have a Honda Prelude 1997 2.2 V-tec 185 Horse Power (with sport filters and sport exhaust & muffler). I would like to say that the Honda V-tec motors are being constructed on the Formula 1 technology. They can go on very high rpms but they are weak on the low rpms. One thing more the motors V-tec has been produced in about 3.5 millions exemplars and none of them had manufacturing problems. You guys are also talking about the engines in the CRV or Accord. You must know that the engines in those cars are called i-VTec. That’s because they are not supposed to be fast they are supposed to be economical. That’s the reason the engines doesn’t go up in so high rpms. Ok last thing. Please don’t compare Mitsubishis engines with Honda because they are not the same and the loud is different (I mean the clean sound of the engine not engine combined with sport muffler)
 
Soman
Hi guys I'm Soman's friend and a big enthusiast of Honda. My first car was Honda CRX 1991, 1.6 16v 127 Horse Power. Then I had a Civic 3d 1996, 1.6 16 V-Tec 148 Horse Power (after chipping 172 HP).

I'm not here to call anyone a liar or whatever, but you did not get 24 extra ponies out of an ECU mod. Not out of a 1.6L 96' 16 valve engine, with only a pre-programmed fuel map.

Even on a 2.2L H22a you won't see anything near that, hell it takes just about an entire exhuast system, as well as a nice air intake to push 25 additional horses out of that engine, even if it has bigger displacement.

Not knocking you, but maybe you switched a number. I've been a Honda enthusiast for sometime, and I know for a fact that you did not throw down 24 additional ponies from a "chip".
 
To tha_con:

Hi it's nice that someone else also likes the Honda cars. Greetings to ya dude :-)

About the engine 1.6 16v V-tec in Civic, CRX. In the Civic model the same engine have different amount of horse power depending of the producing year of the car (model). The Civic from 1995 with the same engine had 158 HP. Did ya know why? Its simple the car producer lowered the power in the newer model to minimize the fuel consumption. But it’s still the same engine. The engine has the capacity to produce 172 HP. Trust me :-) In normal cases of the engine you have totally right that’s not possible to take out 24 horses more. Example : Opel astra 1.6 16 v 107 HP - after chipping aprox gains with about 5-7 % more HP. In my car I have now (Prelude 2.2 V-tec engine BB8 185 HP) its not a problem to do with chipping about 205 HP (I'm not doing it because my Tiptronic gearbox wouldn’t handle that and can take damage - although I putted in the double oval sport filter and changed the exhaust system and muffler so it goes up on the torque what is the weak side of the V-tec engines. The chipping is not only giving the HP but even better torque and that’s important.

With Greetings - BAT the crazyassdriver :)
 
Soman
To tha_con:

Hi it's nice that someone else also likes the Honda cars. Greetings to ya dude :-)

About the engine 1.6 16v V-tec in Civic, CRX. In the Civic model the same engine have different amount of horse power depending of the producing year of the car (model). The Civic from 1995 with the same engine had 158 HP. Did ya know why? Its simple the car producer lowered the power in the newer model to minimize the fuel consumption. But it’s still the same engine. The engine has the capacity to produce 172 HP. Trust me :-) In normal cases of the engine you have totally right that’s not possible to take out 24 horses more. Example : Opel astra 1.6 16 v 107 HP - after chipping aprox gains with about 5-7 % more HP. In my car I have now (Prelude 2.2 V-tec engine BB8 185 HP) its not a problem to do with chipping about 205 HP (I'm not doing it because my Tiptronic gearbox wouldn’t handle that and can take damage - although I putted in the double oval sport filter and changed the exhaust system and muffler so it goes up on the torque what is the weak side of the V-tec engines. The chipping is not only giving the HP but even better torque and that’s important.

With Greetings - BAT the crazyassdriver :)

Now that you've mentioned prelude...I own one. I built it for the most part. 1993 Honda Prelude Si, JDM H22a engine swap, adjustable cam gears, greddy header, test pipe, greddy sp exhuast, fidenza flywheel, and right now it's an AEM, but soon to switch back to Type S intake box. While I see where you are coming from with the chip...it is still not possible. You're prelude is making 195 HP to the crank, and around 165 to the wheels. If you chip it, all you are doing is readjusting the air/fuel map, and with just ECU it does it throughout the entire powerband, and you do not benifit with large gains. Any Import tuner will tell you that even with an engine management system, pulling out 20HP is just not possible. You have to upgrade a lot more in order for a chip to even be benificial. If you adjust fuel maps, it doesn't help you if the car cannot deliver more fuel, or air, for that matter, so again, a chip will not give you that much power. It's myth that it will, but no. I've been working on hondas too long. I know.

Ask greyout, he will tell you, you will not get that power out of a chip.

and as for your Civic statement about it making 170hp, unless you swapped your engine for a JDM engine, or assuming you live somewhere other than state side, then no you do not make that power, and no they are not toned down to make different power in different years. I really don't want to argue with a fellow honda tuner, but unless you have proven dyno sheets to show me you gained nearly 20hp on just a chip...I won't believe it.

And your tranny will handle upto about 220hp with stability, assuming you do not street race or drag and other things. While it is notorious for break downs, it usually isn't from power overload, it's just poor design. Go upgrade your exhaust system so you can let the car breeeathe :)
 
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