How to stop Logitech Driving Force GT oscillation problem

[Hig-GT]

If the X1 does fly everywhere I'm going to guess that FFB should be lowered to a very low setting with no vibration. From steering wheels I've used you can have this problem just because the FFB & the vibration is just too much for such a car and it over reacts wayyy too much! Logic here being that you are in the dead zone, you hit a bump at high speed, the FFB causes you to move the wheel slightly and you jerk, as soon as you do that the wheel is feeding you the feedback from the turning of the wheel, which causes more movement and so on, just try reducing set ups and see how you get on

(The gym idea is a stupid idea btw)

So from what I'm reading the general concensus is that the DFGT is a very good wheel? Am I right in saying that? I ask that because I have an £80 DFGT on reserve waiting for me to collect it late this week so please re-assure me lol!

 

[RacecarBMW]

It actually depends on the car and the speed you are going at. Also how high is your FF set at

 

[Gerseph]

Pardon the poor quality of the picture but the DFGT is wonderful.

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

One thing that I found will help is instead of trying to hold the wheel dead center try holding it just to the right or left of the center then very slowly ease toward the center. It's because there is no dead zone (the place in the center where the FFB is not pulling left or right but is off) is the problem.

 

[Darktuna]

one thing that i found will help is instead of trying to hold the wheel dead center try holding it just to the right or left of the center then very slowly ease toward the center. It's because there is no dead zone (the place in the center where the ffb is not pulling left or right but is off) is the problem.

+1

 

[Dinø]

Holding onto the wheel doesn't solve the issue. Anyone who's saying just grip the wheel didn't even read my whole post. Even if I **bolted** the wheel to its base, it would still oscillate because of the amount of play in the wheel and because of the lack of ability to set a dead-zone.

I don't think the problem is necessarily with the wheel. But since we only bought the wheel for GT5, and my 9-year-old son hates using, the combination of wheel & game is a complete disappointment.

 

[Dinø]

One thing that I found will help is instead of trying to hold the wheel dead center try holding it just to the right or left of the center then very slowly ease toward the center. It's because there is no dead zone (the place in the center where the FFB is not pulling left or right but is off) is the problem.

People, I'm an adult and I know how to mitigate the problem somewhat. My 9-year-old son does not. My question is how to adjust the game and/or wheel to avoid the problem. I'm not looking for a band-aid.

 

[caladina]

One thing that I found will help is instead of trying to hold the wheel dead center try holding it just to the right or left of the center then very slowly ease toward the center. It's because there is no dead zone (the place in the center where the FFB is not pulling left or right but is off) is the problem.

yep, you are actully turning the car slightly causing it to lean on its suspension, therefore settling it, you have now discovered a big + the wheel has over the pad, you can feel the car settling on its suspension. using this will help you know when you can and cant make fast turn stick

you want the cars weight to be leaning on the outside of the turn, that way it stays very settled, if its neutral or worse rocked over to the inside the weight transfer will be wild and spin you out unless you know its comming

you can use this to your advantage and flick a car into a corner, although its more for the rally sections and tight corners

when i get a bad tank slapper or the wobbles i hold the wheel tight with both hands and it kills the wobble pretty quick, i doubt you can do that with the pad, or maybe the pad doesn't have the weight transfer wobble within the game?
dunno not played 5 with the pad

 

[Hig-GT]

GT5 is very simple to play with a pad, sure you get some feedback which I think is good for a pad, but maybe not as good as a wheel? i don't know but i'll know soon

 

[suprtrukr425]

First off let me say I love my DFGT! It seems to me the oscilation varies depending on the car/road surface. I do think an adjustment would be good, but I have no problems holding the wheel steady enough to stop it. That for me was the answer, a steady stern hand. Stregnth is not everything, the wheel stops fighting when your hands don't let the force feedback turn the wheel anymore, untill the road upsets it again. By the way, I love the X1 as well, it is a thrill to drive, and is SUPPOSED to be challenging. What part of driving a 300 mph supercar did you think was supposed to be easy?

 

[HumanDestroyah]

10 & 2 bro 10 & 2.

 

[Minty]

You should test this IRL to see if you're right.

Bring your car up to 150mph on an uneven road, and let go of the wheel and gas pedal. Let me know how that turns out.

Seriously though, just grip the wheel tighter, I see no reason why you would even let go of it completely.

 

[Rich S]

I'm in the process of looking at wheels to buy right now, I'm on level 32 A spec-34 B spec.
I am seriously affected by the OP since I will eventually own multiple X1s and regularily race the F1 cars in GT5. I want a controllable X2010 along with all the other race cars. Otherwise paying $200.00 on stuff, along with the electricity bill isnt worth it.

For those who say you need to hold onto the wheel at 200 mph, thats total BS. Watch Sebastion Vettel with a very very high downforce Red Bull F1 car on the super long straight at Shanghai Circuit. He's hardly touching it. Watch some of the Lewis Hamilton pole laps, the steering is very smooth and not figity at all. I've illegally driven 120+ mph in my car numerous time and I can tell you on a long straight you can let go of the wheel totally. As long as your car isnt out of line, lol.

 

[dj-smurph]

F1 cars have a speed based powersteering system. Basically the faster they turn the steering wheel the more steering lock is applied. As most f1 tracks a smooth ashphalt the cars seem glued to the track but watch tracks like spa or monza the cars move side to side but the drivers have absolute belief in the car to drive that fast. Now the x2010 is a different animal the car is unstable, it has to be to turn that fast. To cope with the instability the used a fan to boost the ground effect employed in the design.

 

[zqxwjv]

"People, I'm an adult and I know how to mitigate the problem somewhat."

I don't think the DFGT (and other logitech wheels) has any adjustment for deadzone, center spring, or damper. All of these can be adjusted on the fanatec wheels and I think that makes for an easier transistion from controller to wheel.

Going price for DFGT seems to be $129 vs $179 for the GT3 RS V2 in case you decide to try it as an alternative.

 

[goukipau]

Do *not* waste your money on a Logitech wheel to play with GT5 until they fix this!

We got a new FF wheel for Xmas and the experience has been complete garbage with GT5. When you try to drive in a straight line, the slightest movement off-center causes the force feedback to jerk the wheel excessively in the opposite direction, which then causes the wheel to get jerked back in the other direction.

If you simply let go of the wheel and gas pedal, the wheel will start to oscillate back and forth more and more until your car fishtails and slides to a stop. This is completely absurd. Real cars don't behave this way.

I tried one of the arcade mode tracks where its raining with the Evolution X last night. At high speeds, no matter how tightly I tried to hold the wheel in the center, it would still oscillate. There is enough "slop" internally that even though the wheel you grip isn't moving, the shaft and gears inside are still twitching back and forth.

Why does GT5 suck? In previous GT titles, I thought you could tune things like the dead-zone in the middle, which would probably help alleviate this problem. Is there some hidden settings screen I haven't found yet? The wheel came with a disc, but I think those are just drivers for Windows.

I had a much older Logitech wheel for my PC that was cable driven. That wheel was great when playing NFS Porsche for windows, back in the day. It's too bad it was PC-only. I finally tossed it in the garbage a few months ago.

Another problem with the Force GT is the single, cheap electric motor. Often when turning the wheel slowly, you can feel "notchiness" in the feedback due to either the gears, or the fact that the motor has only 3 poles (meaning the torque it can produce varies a lot depending on the armature's orientation)

I have bought this Logitech Driving force GT and I think personally its a great wheel.

Have you tried either:
- settings/hy house, options , steeringcontrollers, to adjust:
* realism
* powersteering
* power of force feedback
Wheel settings, Driving Force GT (1) to set: standard?

Maybe it solves the problem for you??

 

[JeronimoM]

10 & 2 bro 10 & 2.

3/9 is better IMO.

 

[n00kz]

You should try driving with your hands . If you can't even hold the damn wheel, it's a good sign you should start going to the gym.

 

[Niop]

This gets really annoying. No body is letting go of the wheel, Dino was simply doing that to explain the extreme of the problem. But like most people in racing, it would be nice to relax a bit on the straights. But in this game, for some reason, you have to work harder in the straights. It's just not right. That being said, I'll take this DFGT wheel 10 times over a controller.

 

[zeroscout]

I think that the issue with the oscillation is created by a feedback loop since the feedback channel output and steering channel input both utilize the same component. Not like a controller that has separate components, the vibration motors and the analog stick, where the signals will remain segregated.

I had noticed this problem in GT5P as well. My theory is when you take your hands off the wheel and the game simulates an imperfection in the road, when that feedback signal is reproduced in the steering wheel without your resistance, the steering wheel sensor accepts the movement as steering input, instructing the game to move your vehicle, which generates a feedback signal opposite of the steering input turning the wheel the other direction, which the steering wheel sensor sees as more movement generating feedback and moving the steering wheel opposite direction. Just like a microphone that gets close enough to a speaker, you get a feedback loop.

Also, I am pretty sure the reason real F1 race cars don't start wobbling when a driver takes his hand off the wheel is because of the downforce. Like they say, an F1 car can theoretically drive upside down on the ceiling of a tunnel.

Otherthoughts. a single PS3 is limited to how close it can simulate the real world. Heck, even the most powerful super-computer running multiple petaflops cannot simulate the real world. Sidenote, there was a recent experiment of a supercomputer that hit some 7 petaflops and part of it was comprised of PS3's.

 

[zqxwjv]

"This gets really annoying. No body is letting go of the wheel, Dino was simply doing that to explain the extreme of the problem. But like most people in racing, it would be nice to relax a bit on the straights. But in this game, for some reason, you have to work harder in the straights. It's just not right."

Yeah that's exactly how it was for me with the logitech G25. However, with the Fanatec GT3 I completely relax on the long straights and that with FF set to 100%. The oscillation is nulled out by using the on-wheel settings. Specifically for GT5: Dft = 0, Spr = -3, Dpr = -3.

 

[Ruta]

Do *not* waste your money on a Logitech wheel to play with GT5 until they fix this!

Ok, I'm going to start off with this - no wheel is plug and play, not even the wheels officially approved by PD for GT5. You need to do a little adjusting.

We got a new FF wheel for Xmas and the experience has been complete garbage with GT5. When you try to drive in a straight line, the slightest movement off-center causes the force feedback to jerk the wheel excessively in the opposite direction, which then causes the wheel to get jerked back in the other direction.

I initially had this issue too, but I looked into it carefully. Actually if you do a search and look at a few threads here, you can get a clear picture of the DFGT. What it sounds like to me is that the software is initiating the "unintended" counter-steer function for this wheel through the force feedback. (Note: Yes, I know Logitech says that there is no counter-steering in the DFGT and that the setting shouldn't matter in GT5. There is obviously a discrepancy here.) My bets are you have your wheel set to either Amateur or Professional settings. I noticed this "counter-steer" when I had it on those settings, with an uncontrollable wheel jerk when set on Amateur. In the options menu, set the wheel to the Simulation setting, and this problem will go away. You'll still get force feedback (I have my ffb strength setting at 6) from the road, and as long as you don't drive like a maniac, you'll soon learn to control the car by steering and counter-steering on your own.

I tried one of the arcade mode tracks where its raining with the Evolution X last night. At high speeds, no matter how tightly I tried to hold the wheel in the center, it would still oscillate. There is enough "slop" internally that even though the wheel you grip isn't moving, the shaft and gears inside are still twitching back and forth.

Yep, your wheel is not set up properly. With a 4wd car especially, I can easily get it such that if I get the car setting in a straight line, even above 120 miles/hour, I can let go of the wheel and not have the wheel oscillate at all until it hits a bump in the road. If the road is smooth, the wheel stays still. If you can still feel that oscillation going on like that while gripping the wheel firmly on a straight, there's a problem with your wheel setup. Just go into options and set it to "Simulation" setting and whatever force feeback strength you feel comfortable with.

Why does GT5 suck? In previous GT titles, I thought you could tune things like the dead-zone in the middle, which would probably help alleviate this problem. Is there some hidden settings screen I haven't found yet? The wheel came with a disc, but I think those are just drivers for Windows.

Hopefully stuff like that will be patched. In the meantime, though, the game is still plenty fun. A good friend of mine who has run his modded Lancer in racing conditions in real life says the game is pretty close to what he sees in real life with the force feebdack on the wheel.

Another problem with the Force GT is the single, cheap electric motor. Often when turning the wheel slowly, you can feel "notchiness" in the feedback due to either the gears, or the fact that the motor has only 3 poles (meaning the torque it can produce varies a lot depending on the armature's orientation)

It's only $125. You get what you pay for.

 

[YouichiHophop]

We got a new FF wheel for Xmas and the experience has been complete garbage with GT5. When you try to drive in a straight line, the slightest movement off-center causes the force feedback to jerk the wheel excessively in the opposite direction, which then causes the wheel to get jerked back in the other direction.

Ignore the idoits in this thread.

Take your wheel back and get another one. I bought one, that did exactly this, it was immpossible to drive in a straight line, even in a Nissan Micra !

My replacement one is fine, seems to have a much bigger dead-spot in the middle.

 

[ZSPaulus]

I have the DFGT too. When i let go of the wheel it does wobble back and forth a little but the car never spins out.. All i have to do to stop the wobble is put my finger on the wheel.

The problem is caused by the game having deadzones and the modern wheels practically dont anymore..

If its a big problem for you id return the wheel to Logitech and ask them to look at the problem.

@everyone saying the DFGT is a fantastic wheel; i dissagree. But thats another topic yo...

 

[JCoop]

I got my first X1 and Bob has been having a blast and so is my bank. Today I thought I'd do a little grinding at Indy and Wow! Had a workout with this oscillation but only above 206 mph. I had to pause and unplug the power supply to finish the race! I tried to make adjustments to suspension, etc. but same thing happens. Never had a problem with all my other cars...
So I read that GTPlanet news had a fix? What was it?

 

[RUFFSTUFF]

I've got the magic panacea for fixing the oscillation issue with my DFGT!

You ready for it?

Really?

Here it is!

I hold on to the wheel.

AMAZING!


This seems so low on the totem-pole of what's wrong with this game that it barely merits mentioning.

Good to see that I wasn't the only one with some sense...

 

[JackC8]

Yeah, thanks for informing us that a wheel that millions of us have been using and enjoying for years is actually complete crap.

 

[goukipau]

Yeah, thanks for informing us that a wheel that millions of us have been using and enjoying for years is YOU ACTUALLY SUCK with this wheel and are actually complete crap.

I enhanced your text

 

[LeMAD]

I enhanced your text

It is normal to suck with a wheel that's not working as it should.

The problem is truly irritating and needs to be fixed. If I knew this I would have bought a Fanatec wheel instead.

 

[goukipau]

If a wheel doesnt work as it should be, return it, because then theres a faillure to the wheel. I have the Driving force GT as well and dont have any problems with it.