Mazda sticks with rotary power

  • Thread starter Pebb
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Every time Mazda bring up the rotary...
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Instead of a new RX model, just save the money and spend it on developing the engine for use in the MX-5 and charge an extra $5k or something for the option. Maybe make it a fixed roof coupe, for $30-35k
 
MidFieldMaven
Instead of a new RX model, just save the money and spend it on developing the engine for use in the MX-5 and charge an extra $5k or something for the option. Maybe make it a fixed roof coupe, for $30-35k
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I've always liked this idea. Call it the MX5-RE or MX5 Spirit R or something. The RX8 and NC were very close cousins under the skin, so it's not that much of stretch to see the possibility.
 
Personally I have never understood why Mazda never made this connection the mx5 is without a doubt the car they are best known for in recent years and with good reason , it's a brilliant little car . And the rotary engine IS MAZDA .
Production costs aside, I dare say it's not a cheap engine to produce, it would become an icon overnight .
 
desmodan
Personally I have never understood why Mazda never made this connection the mx5 is without a doubt the car they are best known for in recent years and with good reason , it's a brilliant little car . And the rotary engine IS MAZDA .
Production costs aside, I dare say it's not a cheap engine to produce, it would become an icon overnight .
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I'd say it's not quite that simple. Simplicity, reliability, efficiency, and durability are as important to the MX-5 ethos as fun and involvement. Remember the MX-5 was the answer to the fragile and unreliable European roadster. Putting a rotary in the MX-5 would likely compromise its universal appeal, and even damage the car's reputation. That would be catastrophic for Mazda, as the MX-5 is a core product, unlike sports cars from other mainstream manufacturers.

From an enthusiast point of view, I like the idea as I stated before. It's not so easy to call from a marketing & business point of view.
 
Eunos_Cosmo
I'd say it's not quite that simple. Simplicity, reliability, efficiency, and durability are as important to the MX-5 ethos as fun and involvement. Remember the MX-5 was the answer to the fragile and unreliable European roadster. Putting a rotary in the MX-5 would likely compromise its universal appeal, and even damage the car's reputation. That would be catastrophic for Mazda, as the MX-5 is a core product, unlike sports cars from other mainstream manufacturers.

From an enthusiast point of view, I like the idea as I stated before. It's not so easy to call from a marketing & business point of view.
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And there in lies the rub .
In modern times car manufacturers are more inclined to follow the financial line rather than pushing the boundaries of experimentation and individualism .
Just ask anyone who's had the fortune to drive a Miura . We all look past its one overiding fault, it was a complete dog to drive at high speed ( allegedly ) . But do we all start to dribble at the mere mention of its name ?
 
desmodan
And there in lies the rub .
In modern times car manufacturers are more inclined to follow the financial line rather than pushing the boundaries of experimentation and individualism .
Just ask anyone who's had the fortune to drive a Miura . We all look past its one overiding fault, it was a complete dog to drive at high speed ( allegedly ) . But do we all start to dribble at the mere mention of its name ?
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You skipped over the reliability and simplicity points. A used car salesman warned against me buying a RX-8 and my brother heard someone at the same dealership on a different another day telling another perspective buyer there's only one mechanic certified to work on rotaries in the province and he splits his time between Calgary and the States.

Jeez, despite reading up on it multiple times I still keep forgetting what you have to do on while starting it to avoid accidentally flooding the engine.
 
Eunos_Cosmo
I'd say it's not quite that simple. Simplicity, reliability, efficiency, and durability are as important to the MX-5 ethos as fun and involvement. Remember the MX-5 was the answer to the fragile and unreliable European roadster. Putting a rotary in the MX-5 would likely compromise its universal appeal, and even damage the car's reputation. That would be catastrophic for Mazda, as the MX-5 is a core product, unlike sports cars from other mainstream manufacturers.

From an enthusiast point of view, I like the idea as I stated before. It's not so easy to call from a marketing & business point of view.
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In all fairness, the first gen rx7 was built with the same exact ethos. So much so in fact, that many SA/FB enthusiasts see the Miata as the more natural progression of the rx7 than the FC. The only reason Mazda keeps running into reliability issues is because they keep coming up with stupid ideas to fix emissions problems. IE starving the rear rotor during deceleration or turning off the omp under some conditions.
In truth, I can't see them going wrong with making a limited run, labeled something like you suggested, Spirit R or something. It would give the rotary enthusiasts a car back to the roots of the original rx7, but keep it from becoming a car that becomes common enough to make any sort of impact on the brand.
 
Drop it in the MX5 and the 2, really push the driver appeal of both and offer something unique in the market.
 
bremics
You skipped over the reliability and simplicity points. A used car salesman warned against me buying a RX-8 and my brother heard someone at the same dealership on a different another day telling another perspective buyer there's only one mechanic certified to work on rotaries in the province and he splits his time between Calgary and the States.

Jeez, despite reading up on it multiple times I still keep forgetting what you have to do on while starting it to avoid accidentally flooding the engine.
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I didn't skip over them they were a given .
Modern cars are complicated things that can't be fixed with a half inch spanner and a hammer .
And as far as reliability is concerned , much of that is caused by ignorance on the part of the driver and fear of the unknown from the dealer . Ask any owner of a limited run sportscar , treat it like a focus and it will break down and it will turn the engine to scrap metal .
 
Eunos_Cosmo
Stumbled upon this randomly. I don't even know where to begin honestly....Ferrari, Pagani, Koenigsegg? What?

Global Automotive Rotary (Wankel) Engine Market 2017-2021 - Key vendors are Ferrari, Mazda Motor & Porsche - Research and Markets

Technavio's analysts forecast the global automotive rotary (Wankel) engines market to grow at a CAGR of 15.50% during the period 2017-2021.

What's going on here?
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That makes me think that someone somewhere made a decent enough breakthrough with the rotary that warrants further development.
 
R1600Turbo
Range extenders?
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That's an interesting idea. Low torque engines can be efficient in steady state conditions. I'm a 2-cycle guy, and have always thought a light, efficient, clean (they are already being made, don't start with the 2 strokes are dirty stuff) 2-cycle engine used in a hybrid system would be a great fit for small vehicles. Torque off the line combined with high rpm power. Rotaries are similar.
 
superwally
That's an interesting idea. Low torque engines can be efficient in steady state conditions. I'm a 2-cycle guy, and have always thought a light, efficient, clean (they are already being made, don't start with the 2 strokes are dirty stuff) 2-cycle engine used in a hybrid system would be a great fit for small vehicles. Torque off the line combined with high rpm power. Rotaries are similar.
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http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ick-drive-mazda-demio-ev-with-range-extender/
 
Mazda has patented a door assembly that looks quite similar to the doors of the RX-Vision concept car. At this point, considering the patent for the revised-configuration rotary engine, and the concept itself, I'm fairly convinced this is actually happening. Whatever the case, it is clear that the idea of a new rotary engined car is in the hearts and minds of the highest levels of Mazda, not to be easily discarded.

Kiyoshi Fujiwara, senior managing executive officer of research and development:

I am now 57-58 years old, 30 years later I will die. This rotary engine is my dream and also our chief designer, he also has the same dream, therefore I have some years left to make this dream come true. Therefore, 10 years or 20 years, no, I died [sic]. Before I retire, that’s my dream.
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Was there doubt other than them saying it wasn't looking like a sure thing, because I thought that the supposed 2017 Tokyo Auto Show reveal was still on? If so then I believe this car will be a 2019/20 production affair.
 
Besides the CEO saying no rotary back in December, no. The current run of rumors seems to be coming from the same person that started them back in tail end of 2015. Fujiwara.
It's cool patents are going out, but that is just as easily correlation. Technologies in part from concepts are the typical norms. So certain things about the door they may use eventually, but not necessarily on an rx9.
I personally would love to see an rx9 come around, especially since I may be in a position to buy one. But.... I haven't heard anything official from Mazda proper, or of CEO approval. As such, I am still on skeptical side of I'll believe it when I see it.
 
I still stand firmly in the I'll believe it when I see it corner, but.... This happened...
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Mazda just plunked that down on their website. Seems they plan on introducing this car at the TMS at the end of the month.
So, given previous suggestions from those on the rotary dev team a year or so ago, this would coincide with the timeline they projected. 2017 is the Mazda Rotary's 50th anniversary, and the year they said a new rotary powered car would be announce. 2020 being Mazda's 100 year anniversary is the year the new car was said to be going on sale.
While I really hope we see a a Skyactiv-R, and not just another piston engine, its got to be said, that is a good looking 4 door, from what can be made out.
 
I'd say that's a preview for the new 6 if you ask me. Showing the RX-Vision and then deciding to give us a 4-door Rotary similar to the RX-8 instead would be a bit disappointing.
 
R1600Turbo
I'd say that's a preview for the new 6 if you ask me. Showing the RX-Vision and then deciding to give us a 4-door Rotary similar to the RX-8 instead would be a bit disappointing.
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A very probable assumption, and as I said, I am in the need to see it first group. However, those lines look very reminiscent of the RX concept, and the coincidence of the rotary anniversary lends just a touch of hope.
As for being 4 door. I've been in enough really fast cars to know that number is arbitrary.
 
The body shape is virtually identical to the RX-vision. Count me into the "eagerly anticipating" group.

Also, I'm not sure they would preview the new 6 with such a radical concept car. The 2017 CX-5 was updated without anything like that, and the CX-5 is arguably the more important car for Mazda. Maybe its a Cosmo?
 
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Rallywagon
A very probable assumption, and as I said, I am in the need to see it first group. However, those lines look very reminiscent of the RX concept, and the coincidence of the rotary anniversary lends just a touch of hope.
As for being 4 door. I've been in enough really fast cars to know that number is arbitrary.
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I still highly doubt they would just jump from a coupe concept to a 4-door and be like "surprise, this is what you're getting instead". All we know is that it's a preview for their design direction. It probably won't even turn into anything more than that.
 

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