Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes/The Phantom Pain

[prisonermonkeys]

I'm around 141K, but I haven't updated since October-November.

 

[sesselpupser]

This is the breakdown of how much my 'Operation Massive Kidnap' loadout costs:

It's not as much as you guys, but this is only when I want to go around stealing people and resources. As such, the materials cost kind of matters to me (not so much the plants since each one you find gives you 20), especially the precious metal because you never really find very much of that.

I have to say, I like having three additional FOBs (in my defence I only paid for half of them, I had some trading card money saved but liked having two so much I spend £8 on the third!) because I can do all the online combat deployments and still have three teams left over for offline stuff. That way I'm getting stuff while I'm at work which has definitely improved the game for me, if I was stuck with what I could do with the time I actually have I'd make basically zero progress. But wow, the strut development is expensive. To get from 3/4 to 4/4 on a strut (except the command strut) on the free FOB costs 720,000 GMP and 72,000 materials, to go from 2/4 to 3/4 on the second FOB is 1,280,000 and 64,000 materials, the same upgrade for the third FOB is 2,420,000 and 208,800 materials and to go from 1/4 to 2/4 on the last FOB you can have is 3,549,000 and 41,600 materials... I have no idea what the 3/4 to 4/4 upgrade on the last FOB will cost but it'll be big. The first upgrade for the command strut on the last FOB is 15,525,000 GMP and 225,000 materials!

 

[Jawehawk]

Why do you even bother with brining in items such as Pentazemin and the like?
And I think my deplotment costs are high when they are at 30-40.000 GMP.

On a sidenote. The problems with microtransactions isn't that you yourself is spending money on them. It's that you are giving them money for something that is already in the game, and shouldn't cost money. It's an artificial barrier that exists to make them extra money. Won't be too long until we have to spend real world money to unlock single player campaign missions in games... All because consumers are allowing the devs and publishers to get away with this stuff.

 

[sesselpupser]

Why do you even bother with brining in items such as Pentazemin and the like?
And I think my deplotment costs are high when they are at 30-40.000 GMP.

On a sidenote. The problems with microtransactions isn't that you yourself is spending money on them. It's that you are giving them money for something that is already in the game, and shouldn't cost money. It's an artificial barrier that exists to make them extra money. Won't be too long until we have to spend real world money to unlock single player campaign missions in games... All because consumers are allowing the devs and publishers to get away with this stuff.

I pretty much just forget I've got them in my inventory, but Noctocyanin is handy for FOB invasions when you can't bring DD.

And people have been saying we'll be paying real money in order to finish games, etc. since DLC first became a thing, that still hasn't happened. The FOBs don't allow you to do anything you can't do without them, they just speed things up by letting you have more recruits instead of better recruits and they allow you, as I mentioned, to do more combat deployments at once which speeds up recruit, material and GMP collection rate. As far as microtransactions go they're quite innocuous, basically now that "my time to game:income" ratio has inverted itself I can justify the cost so I don't mind.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Why do you even bother with brining in items such as Pentazemin and the like?

For sniping. Long range sniping. As in such a long range that if I tranq a guard and cross the gap from me to him, he's so far away that by the time I get to him, I have to CQC him to knock him back out.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Here I though 20k-30k GMP per deployment is a lot, I usually used tranq sniper with medium silencer, tranq gun ( the cheapest one on resources ), smoke or sleep grenades ( if needed ) and Quiet on tranq sniper or D-Dog with stun for even cheaper GMP.

Usually kidnapped 20-30 soldiers in a sortie, do one or 2 side ops, then go back ( on 1k GMP chopper )

 

[Jawehawk]

So my FOB got invaded while I was doing a mission, and I decided to take on the invader. I don't think much of the online FOB gameplay, because frankly, the attacker barely has a chance, but I must admit, defending is quite fun.

As I made my way to him, I spotted him via my rifle scope as he was trying to spot people with his binos. I start firing on him, followed by the rest of my security team. As I cross the bridge to him, one of my guys gets on a 20mm Vulcan, and starts hammering away. Looking so friggin awesome with night vision on, and he must've felt real small at that point. He popped smoke, and tried to run away. But I climbed to the high ground (the small defensive building that sits after each bridge), and equipped my single shot grenade launcher armed with stun grenades. And this is kind of the problem. I hit in his near vicinity, and he passes out, leaving me to extract him. I don't get what the attacker is supposed to do to counter such methods? I mean, I have numbers on my side. All he has is the element of surprise, with few ways to cross from one platform to another.

 

[sesselpupser]

@Jawehawk the only real defence an attacker has against being killed by a player is to not get spotted, because then there won't be an alert and the defender will never know they're under attack.

It's a good system. Attackers either definitely win or probably lose, defenders either definitely lose or probably win.

 

[Jawehawk]

It's an unbalanced system. It's near impossible to succesfully sneak through the platforms if your opponent has proper security.

 

[sesselpupser]

It's near impossible to succesfully sneak through the platforms if your opponent has proper security.

Yeah, but if you pull it off you get given personnel, materials, GMP AND the defender can't get it back because they don't get a retaliation wormhole. If it was any easier people would complain that it's too difficult for defenders, and frankly it is often pretty easy until the defender shows up because some people (like me) don't care enough to improve their security. One time I did a 4/4 base development platform, got right to the end without being seen but got cocky and was spotted right at the exit door by a camera, I tried to hide but the defender spawned in and killed me instantly. Being spotted is only really a guaranteed loss if the defender doesn't respond to the alert, too, but the game still gives the intruder a fighting chance anyway, even though it's extremely likely they'll lose - just like how you could fight through alerts in MGS, but if you dig in you will eventually run out of ammo or rations and die, but that is an option should you wish to try it.

Just take Noctocyanin, it's a big help especially if you're used to having DD or Quiet with you, or even DW's scan mode does the same I think. It seems like most people who do FOB invasions also enable reflex mode, too, I don't but I imagine that's a huge boost as well. If I ever complete all the single player stuff and get into FOB missions maybe I'll re-enable that myself... But for now I'm happy to take the easy, guaranteed progress route until I can afford to waste materials on fruitless invasions.

 

[Jawehawk]

Backup, Back Down. I.... I don't like this. This makes me sad face.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Backup, Back Down. I.... I don't like this. This makes me sad face.

Any particular reason?

If you're trying to get all of the vehicles, the EMP snare works well. There's a narrow valley just north of Yakho Oboo that works well as an ambush point. After you get the seven vehicles, call in a rocket launcher to take out the Black Hawk. You can get the tanks through some simple sneaking.

If you're trying to get the prisoners, deploy to the landing zone east of Lamar Khaate. You'll find the first prisoner approaching the LZ; night vision goggles help. Head north, and you'll find the second in the river heading south; you have to be quick because they can leave the area. Take out one of the vehicles to meet the requirements of the mission, then sprint south. There's a narrow path between the landing zone you used and a checkpoint south-west of Wakh Sind; it's also used for a mine-sweeping Side Op. You'll find a team of guards there - take them out for an extra objective - and you'll find the third prisoner; once again, you have to be quick because the guards will find and kill him. The fourth prisoner is in Wakh Sind, in the same room where you found the bionics specialist in "Over the Fence". The fifth prisoner is in the back of the jeep heading south; if you're quick getting the first four, you'll have enough time to catch your breath and set up an ambush. The sixth and final prisoner is in one of the holding cells at Lamar Khaate. The time limit is tight, but it can be done in about thirteen minutes. The mission actually plays really well this way; it's like "Lingua Franca" if you try to listen to all of the interrogations.

 

[Jawehawk]

The mission is just so stressfull if you're trying to A, get all vehicles, and B, get an S rank. I usually always use the narrow valley you talk about, however, I wanted to do something different yesterday, as I found that getting the last two IFV's requires you to high tail it from that narrow valley, to north east of Yakho Oboo Supply Outpost, which isn't easy. It's doable, but your working on very little time. So I tried to instead set up ambushes just east of Yakho Oboo the entire time, but I guess a vehicle actually spawns at the Supply Outpost, because I swear one vehicle got by me out of nowhere as I was rescuing the prisoner in the 4X4.

So in the end, I ended up with 6 vehicles extracted, which meant that the tanks didn't spawn, and that I didn't get the optional objective for taking them all out without asking for a supply drop. Okay then. I'd go for the remaining prisoners then, as I don't have that objective. I get the one in the river, and then make my way to the one in the mountain pass, only for the enemy soldiers to find and kill him just before I got to him. Frustrated, I exfiltrated having achieved none of my goals.

I can get the IFV's without being spotted easily enough, but the last two are just such a pain when using the narrow valley. But I think using that place is the only way you can possibly get all 7. I don't like how stressfull it is from start to finish, nor do I like how it's near impossible to actually achieve all the objectives in one playthrough of the mission.

But I thank you for the tips. I think I'm taking a break from the game again, as I spend more time being frustrated than I do having fun. That's the downside of forcing certain playstyles for the S ranks...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I guess a vehicle actually spawns at the Supply Outpost, because I swear one vehicle got by me out of nowhere as I was rescuing the prisoner in the 4X4.

Yes and no. It spawns in the quadrangle, but it's there the entire time. Extracting the prisoner in the jeep will reveal its location, but you can find it all on your own. After you take out a few vehicles, it will move on its own.

I like how it's near impossible to actually achieve all the objectives in one playthrough of the mission.

Not near impossible - absolutely impossible. But like I said, the mission plays completely differently if you go for the prisoners instead of the vehicles, and there is no penalty so long as you get one vehicle.

"Backup, Back Down" and "Pitch Dark" are the only two episodes where you cannot complete all objectives on one play-through.

I get the one in the river, and then make my way to the one in the mountain pass, only for the enemy soldiers to find and kill him just before I got to him.

Sprint, and make sure you start east of Lamar Khaate. The only way to get all six is to do it in the order I posted. It helps if you set waypoints as you fly in. Put one at the junction to the mountain track.

That's the downside of forcing certain playstyles for the S ranks...

A cheap way of doing it is to deploy east of Lamar Khaate, and head to the road leading north. Find a spot between the palace and the checkpoint north-east and set an EMP snare. Fulton the first vehicle, then leave the area as quickly as possible.

 

[sesselpupser]

I love how intensely easy Root Cause is if you've done it already, that's the one where you have to extract a Mother Base agent who, if you're not quick enough, will have an accident. I did it a couple of times last night because I needed the other objectives and a truck, but I forgot to extract the truck the first time.

Also, the Fulton Ballista. Incredible piece of technology, that... I used it to good effect grinding Skull Face for CCCP Type C WGs. I wish DW had a railgun, I feel like it needs a long range sniper-like weapon. Also, the ability to launch empty magazines from the Ballista for long range sniper distraction.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Also, the Fulton Ballista. Incredible piece of technology, that... I used it to good effect grinding Skull Face for CCCP Type C WGs. I wish DW had a railgun, I feel like it needs a long range sniper-like weapon. Also, the ability to launch empty magazines from the Ballista for long range sniper distraction.

I might need to look into it, then.

 

[sesselpupser]

So I finished the game last night, the ending wasn't quite what I was expecting. Am I to take it that

Spoiler

the Big Boss Snake kills before MGS (I can't remember if it was MG or MG2) is Spoiled Crab, er, I mean Venom Snake and the one who miraculously reappears at the end of MGS 4 is Naked Snake/Vic Boss/Big Boss/etc.? I get that it's an enormous retcon to make it appear that Big Boss wasn't resurrected after all, but it makes the whole 'gib Big Boss' corpse' thing from MGS and MGS 4 pointless, since Ocelot knows the original Big Boss is still alive and the dead one has nothing to do with Big Boss, Solid or Liquid Snake in terms of genes.

Also, the game does imply there were more than three Enfants Terribles, right? I like to imagine one or two fell by the wayside and ended up as really, really good accountants or bankers or something.

 

[Omnis]

So I finished the game last night, the ending wasn't quite what I was expecting. Am I to take it that

Spoiler

the Big Boss Snake kills before MGS (I can't remember if it was MG or MG2) is Spoiled Crab, er, I mean Venom Snake and the one who miraculously reappears at the end of MGS 4 is Naked Snake/Vic Boss/Big Boss/etc.? I get that it's an enormous retcon to make it appear that Big Boss wasn't resurrected after all, but it makes the whole 'gib Big Boss' corpse' thing from MGS and MGS 4 pointless, since Ocelot knows the original Big Boss is still alive and the dead one has nothing to do with Big Boss, Solid or Liquid Snake in terms of genes.

Also, the game does imply there were more than three Enfants Terribles, right? I like to imagine one or two fell by the wayside and ended up as really, really good accountants or bankers or something.

Yes and No.

Spoiler: MGS series Plot spoilers

Venom Snake is the Big Boss that Solid Snake kills in Metal Gear. The real Big Boss appears in that sequel. The big picture is that Big Boss and Ocelot rebel against the Patriots. It's the story of their splintering off from Zero's ideological group. Big Boss and Ocelot had Venom become the replacement face for the "Legendary Soldier" that Big Boss was to the Patriots. Since Zero resorts to operating behind the scenes, so do Big Boss and Ocelot. What follows from this bigger picture is that the Zero faction gets rolled into an AI scheme such that it is perpetuated and eventually becomes overwhelming as technology advances. The AI patriots overtake the conflict, such that Zero and all the other characters are inconsequential or incidental accessories. With Big Boss in a coma post-Zanzibar Land, Ocelot realizes that the only way to fix things and restore Big Boss's vision of The Boss's legacy is to destroy the new AI-comprised Patriots. Remember, Ocelot is loyal only to Big Boss, who is comatose and kept hidden underground just like Major Zero.

Liquid Snake comes into the role of the new alpha-soldier Patriots-puppet after Venom dies. His only motivation is wrath, so he's a perfect pawn for the Patriots. Because Solid Snake was able to defeat Venom Snake, Big Boss, and Liquid Snake, Ocelot knows that Solid can perhaps be the one to destroy the Patriots. He uses the Liquid Ocelot ruse to keep the Patriots acting as if they still had Liquid Snake in the field. In other words, Ocelot works as a double agent to make the Patriots AI behave as if it is still observing the Solid vs. Liquid conflict, when in reality Ocelot is maneuvering through the Big Boss vs. The Patriots conflict by proxy. We, as Solid Snake, are the proxy. The Patriots AI does not act upon the Solid vs. Liquid conflict as it has already observed Solid's past victory. This gives Ocelot the strategic advantage to be able to guide events accordingly. The ironic part is that the Patriots and their FOXALIVE nanomachines already set into action a Mutually Assured Destruction cascade. Solid Snake winds up destroying the Patriots, but also everyone ever associated with them. The Boss's legacy is finally realized when a single, solitary soldier takes down the entire war machine, so that finally he and the world find peace.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Spoiler

What follows from this bigger picture is that the Zero faction gets rolled into an AI scheme such that it is perpetuated and eventually becomes overwhelming as technology advances.

To build on that:

Spoiler

The Phantom Pain makes it pretty clear that Zero loses control over the Patriots. Skull Face infects him with something that is completely debilitating (most likely a weaponised parasite), allowing a faction - implied to be led by Sigint - to seize control over the Patriots, and at that point, events are set in motion that will lead to Sons of Liberty.

A large part of The Phantom Pain is about legacies. The characters have spent the better part of two decades fighting to shape the future of the world. But somewhere along the way, they lose sight of their path. They stop fighting for the future of the world and start fighting to preserve a place in history that they assume they are entitled to - Kaz lets the ideological model of MSF become corporatised, and lashes out at everyone around him rather than accept responsibility; Huey comes to see Diamond Dogs as being no better than the Soviets and uses that to justify the parasite outbreak; Zero grows complacent and ignores the threat from within his own organisation; and Big Boss becomes no better than the government he is so distrustful of, turning Venom into his unwilling instrument. Quiet is the only character to accept her fate of being forgotten by history, and while she is erased from the world, she also breaks free of the spiral that drags everyone down into the madness that engulfs them.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I just updated for the first time since October-November, but I can't find any of the new content - just the nameplates. Where and how do I get access to the Grade 7 and above gear?

 

[Crashbroke23]

I just updated for the first time since October-November, but I can't find any of the new content - just the nameplates. Where and how do I get access to the Grade 7 and above gear?

There is a extra file that needs to be downloaded via the Playstation Store, kinda like how you had to download the MGO data from the start.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

There is a extra file that needs to be downloaded via the Playstation Store, kinda like how you had to download the MGO data from the start.

I'm on the XOne. I'm assuming that there's a similar setup, but I can't find anything in the XBox Store - but I don't know what I'm looking for.

 

[Crashbroke23]

I'm on the XOne. I'm assuming that there's a similar setup, but I can't find anything in the XBox Store - but I don't know what I'm looking for.

It's called "Metal Gear Solid V Game Update Ver 1.00" on the PS4 side of things, about 420MB worth of data. I would presume it would be under downloadable content alongside the other various add-ons, but it has been a while since I've dealt with the Xbox Store so there isn't much I can do.

The other thing is that the Level 7 and up development items, which are developed in real time rather than game time, might need that constant internet connection and have Level 5 or above equipment completed in order for it to be visible in the development menu. Sorry if I haven't really helped, it's been a good month since I was really big into the game. I spent way too many hours getting into the top 1500 on PS4 for Espionage and FOB Rankings...

 

[sesselpupser]

I'm on PC so I didn't need to do anything, but I was able to see the additional content before developing grade 5 stuff. Just like before you can see a couple of grades after the highest you've developed, after that there's a cell with question marks in it and anything after that is invisible until you've developed the next grade, I think.

Also there were a few weapons announced that I don't think anyone has yet; the sleeping gas pistol, an even bigger sniper rifle than the LRS and a grenade launcher that does... Something (I don't know what) and a wormhole mine thing that lets you teleport back to wherever you placed it. I think they are FOB event awards for an event that hasn't happened yet (either that or I've been reading old news, which is possible) and they don't appear in the development tree.

There's a Geist P3 carbine which was in the last update so if you can see that, you're up to date.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I was able to see the additional content before developing grade 5 stuff. Just like before you can see a couple of grades after the highest you've developed, after that there's a cell with question marks in it and anything after that is invisible until you've developed the next grade, I think.

No, I can't see anything like that.

 

[Jawehawk]

Omg. There's 7500 unprocessed fuel, just sitting there, unguarded. Must resist urge to try and Fulton it.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

No, I can't see anything like that.

Okay, found it.

Must resist urge to try and Fulton it.

I'm more curious to see you try.

 

[sesselpupser]

On Saturday I couldn't really be bothered to trot around Angola/Zaire to find Digitalis Purpurea, so I decided to try FOB invasions. I thought I'd check out the current event and boy have I been wasting my time! You can earn points that you can use to buy S++ rank recruits of any unit, though it'll take a little time (three runs) to get enough for that. In addition you can get a decent chunk of materials and pretty decent GMP per invasion, so I think I'll just do that for a while - four invasions over maybe half an hour was all I needed to boost my medical team up twice to level 88. In addition the positions of guards never change so you can speedrun them.

Does anyone know if it's possible to get better soldiers with unique skills? Like, can I get an S-rank Malak?

 

[Jawehawk]

I don't know if there are exceptions, but I've Fultoned mission specific targets that were higher rank than they were on my original playthrough of the given mission.

Sadly, you remain at the mercy of the RNG gods to some extend.

 

[sesselpupser]

I'm well on my way to stamping out the scourge that is <S-rank staff so I am going to need to reacquire a few staffers with special skills, if possible. I don't actually know who or how many just yet though.

Also I'm now able to develop a good selection of really high-level stuff now, last night I started development of the Macht 37 and MRS-4R with high durability suppressors, I wonder if either can actually withstand an entire 30-round magazine. It's thoroughly satisfying seeing so many gold items in my R&D tree, each one with some special feature or another, I didn't think I'd end up playing enough to actually unlock these things... Even though none of them are strictly necessary or useful, but they're fun to have.