now THIS ticks me off...

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Ouch,.. thats one I never thought would come around,.. a spell checker.

I've been dreading the day someone finally had the wits to corret my spelling for me,...

...cause you know,.. spell check doesnt kill people, pot kills people.
 
I'm the official enforcer of the AUP. And by official I mean unofficial.

I'm just doing my job. And by doing my job I mean annoying you for the hell of it.

Remember kiddies: if you mix your commas in with your periods incorrectly you could die.
 
Originally posted by Ghost C
I think Klos's point was that you should learn how to spell before you insult someone else's intelligence.
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Your right,... calling people stupid isnt insulting their intellegence.






{go ahead,.. keep diggin,. I got all day here}
 
Uh, I called people who think banning guns will solve the problem of gun-related crime stupid. I also know how to spell, and can form sentences above the level of a third grader.

You, however, cannot spell, or form sentences above the level of a third grader. You calling someone stupid is, well, stupid.
 
I'll let someone else tackle it becuase I'm a nimrod. And I have a needle in my ass.

Later!

{i hope i havent ofended you,... if i have,.. to bad}
 
Yes, but if it was an M-16, it was 5.56x45mm, which is a "high velocity" (also known as "piece of ****") round. It also has no penetration power through anything harder than, say, tupperware. You can, in fact, out-duck an M-16.
 
Originally posted by Ghost C
Yes, but if it was an M-16, it was 5.56x45mm, which is a "high velocity" (also known as "piece of ****") round. It also has no penetration power through anything harder than, say, tupperware. You can, in fact, out-duck an M-16.
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I have to disagree with you about the .223 (5.56mm) round being crap, Ghost.
1. When the M-16 was first introduced the rifling was a 1:12 twist.
It was changed to 1:14 after testing because it was determined that the round was too destructive to human flesh.
2. I'm pretty sure the 5.56 X 45 is not the round used in the '16. I believe that round is for the Kalashnikov designed AK-47. The M15/16 round is longer (5.56 X 54 i believe).
Either way, the AK is considered an extremely competent, reliable, and very lethal weapon, and it uses bullets weaker than the .223 round used in the M-16.
3. I looked up some old data on the .223 Loads. A 55 gr. bullet has a muzzle velocity over 3200fps. (You won't be ducking that!) At 500 yards you are still looking at a projectile velocity of 1200 - 1600fps with drop of less than 5 inches at 250yds. This while still putting 300+ ft/lb on target at 500yds.
In comparison. The .45 ACP which is considered to be a 90% "one shot stopper" with a 185 gr JHP bullet has a muzzle velocity of about 1000fps with only 370 lb/ft energy on target at point blank range. At 200 yds the energy of the .223 projectile equals that of a .357MAG/110gr JHP at point blank range.
I said all that to say this: The 5.56 is an awesome round. In the right hands it can be shot to within 6MOA at 500yds. The early M-16 was a very finicky weapon. And it's issues were mostly related to keeping the weapon clean. But almost everything else that will shoot .223, will do it accurately and quite lethally.

I also stand by my first post in this thread. If you are confronted by a person with a gun. Do not attempt to disarm the weilder of the gun unless you are prepared to be shot, prepared to have the shooter inadvertantly shoot someone nearby, or you are 125% sure you can accomplish disarming the geek with the gun.
That is disarming him w/o getting him, you, or any one else hurt.
 
Originally posted by Gil
I have to disagree with you about the .223 (5.56mm) round being crap, Ghost.
1. When the M-16 was first introduced the rifling was a 1:12 twist.
It was changed to 1:14 after testing because it was determined that the round was too destructive to human flesh.
2. I'm pretty sure the 5.56 X 45 is not the round used in the '16. I believe that round is for the Kalashnikov designed AK-47. The M15/16 round is longer (5.56 X 54 i believe).
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Nope, 5.56x45mm=.223 Remington/5.56 NATO. AK's are chambered for 7.62x39mm and 5.45x39mm.

Either way, the AK is considered an extremely competent, reliable, and very lethal weapon, and it uses bullets weaker than the .223 round used in the M-16.
3. I looked up some old data on the .223 Loads. A 55 gr. bullet has a muzzle velocity over 3200fps. (You won't be ducking that!) At 500 yards you are still looking at a projectile velocity of 1200 - 1600fps with drop of less than 5 inches at 250yds. This while still putting 300+ ft/lb on target at 500yds.
In comparison. The .45 ACP which is considered to be a 90% "one shot stopper" with a 185 gr JHP bullet has a muzzle velocity of about 1000fps with only 370 lb/ft energy on target at point blank range. At 200 yds the energy of the .223 projectile equals that of a .357MAG/110gr JHP at point blank range.
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Yes, like I said, 5.56x45mm is a "lightweight, high velocity" round. It has a high muzzle velocity, but not alot of bullet weight. The wind will effect it much easier than a 7.62x39mm bullet, and it definitely won't hit with the same amount of impact at the same distance.

Now on the other hand, give me one of those .50 Beowulf converted AR-15's and I'll gladly hand over my Kalishnikov. You don't get much better stopping power than being able to seperate a person's torso from the rest of their body in one shot ;).
 
Originally posted by Ghost C
Nope, 5.56x45mm=.223 Remington/5.56 NATO. AK's are chambered for 7.62x39mm and 5.45x39mm.

Yes, like I said, 5.56x45mm is a "lightweight, high velocity" round. It has a high muzzle velocity, but not alot of bullet weight. The wind will effect it much easier than a 7.62x39mm bullet, and it definitely won't hit with the same amount of impact at the same distance.

Now on the other hand, give me one of those .50 Beowulf converted AR-15's and I'll gladly hand over my Kalishnikov. You don't get much better stopping power than being able to seperate a person's torso from the rest of their body in one shot ;).
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I never said it was a better round than the .308Nato. Just that it wasn't a bad round. Besides, for CQB (Close Quarters Battle), I would prefer something a little less unweildy, like a short barrelled pump shotgun (like the Mossberg 800) or the worlds favorite room clearing tool, the H & K MP-5.
For LONG distance and power I'll take a Barret .50cal.
 
Originally posted by Gil
I never said it was a better round than the .308Nato. Just that it wasn't a bad round. Besides, for CQB (Close Quarters Battle), I would prefer something a little less unweildy, like a short barrelled pump shotgun (like the Mossberg 800) or the worlds favorite room clearing tool, the H & K MP-5.
For LONG distance and power I'll take a Barret .50cal.
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I've never been fond of the 9mm MP-5's, they lack the penetration power to actually clear rooms. I don't have any experience with the 10mm versions, but I'm sure they'd be much better.

If I ever needed to clear a room, I'd probably just use my AK, mostly because I don't have anything else, but it does have a folding stock, so it is relatively easy to carry around inside. I've also had good experiences with Tec-9's, despite most people insulting them.
 
Originally posted by Monster7
Because Tec's are garbage. The Mac 11 on the other hand, will not fail you.
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My grandpa has one of those, works like a charm for fending off his garden. He also keeps an AK ready "just in case".
 
Tec's aren't garbage. People who don't know how to properly care for Tec's think they're garbage. Guns are mechanical tools, they require proper maintenance to perform at their best.
 
Originally posted by Ghost C
I've never been fond of the 9mm MP-5's, they lack the penetration power to actually clear rooms. I don't have any experience with the 10mm versions, but I'm sure they'd be much better.

If I ever needed to clear a room, I'd probably just use my AK, mostly because I don't have anything else, but it does have a folding stock, so it is relatively easy to carry around inside. I've also had good experiences with Tec-9's, despite most people insulting them.
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A coupla things...
With the MP-5 in 9mm or 10mm or .22 for that matter, a Head shot, is a head shot is a head shot. And a head shot ends the fight. Plus, with the FMJ bullet the 9 is more likely to over penetrate due to the velocity, and the fact that an FMJ doesn't open up like a JHP. Also for most full-auto capable weapons, JHP is not an option because it won't feed reliably. Plus, it is possible to slow down a 9mm round enough for it to be used in a noise suppressed weapon. And it is still fairly effective.
The bullet speed of an AK round will make noise, even if the gun can be suppressed. The speed of the bullet breaking the sound barrier will be loud on it's own merit.

As for clearing a room with an AK vs. a Shotgun...
A shotgun can be used to clear a room, or stop a riot in a non-lethal fashion. Just aim at the ground in front of the peeps you want to suppress. The ground will drop the velocity of the buckshot, and ricocheting it into the lower extremities of the "advancing horde." You just can't do that with an AK.
 

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