perhaps GT6 is falling behind.

[TokoTurismo]

Ok then, what's the point on redoing stuff again? And whats the point on leaving out old content, if, in the end, most people want old content and old tracks to keep being there to be played? Just watch the suggestions section, many of the most voted tracks are old original GT tracks.

Y... You can't be for real, right? Also, you misunderstood my post. Old content like the standard cars and standard tracks will need to be dropped, because there content ported from GT4 to GT5 and into GT6. And for the suggestions part, that has nothing to do with what I said.

 

[NixxxoN]

Y... You can't be for real, right? Also, you misunderstood my post. Old content like the standard cars and standard tracks will need to be dropped, because there content ported from GT4 to GT5 and into GT6. And for the suggestions part, that has nothing to do with what I said.

So basically you are saying that everything must have great graphics or simply not exist.
You are one of those who prefer poor quantity of content but great shiny graphics... I'd rather have much more content but less graphics. Because you know, the problem is, the more complex and detailed the graphics are, the longer it takes to developers to do it... Thats why I freaking HATE the graphics mania of nowadays.

There is a thing called updating and evolving. can you tell me why some stuff need to be dropped and can't simply be updated?

 

[Madertus]

Quantity is better than quality in terms of fun and gameplay. Nuff said. Graphics are only presentation. But the essence of the fun in the games is certainly not in the graphics.
I blame the stupidity of todays new gamers who give way too much importance to the graphics and not enough to the story and the gameplay.

My apologies, NixxxoN, but I've never seen a statement I could disagree more with, unless I misunderstood you.

If quantity is better than quality in terms of gameplay, I should never even turn off GT6. Meanwhile, I haven't even launched it for the past 3 weeks. If a game has quality gameplay, I should find no difficulties in sticking to it for well over 100 hours (which is actually pretty sad ) overall. If a game has quality gameplay, I should be happy to come back to it.

Quality just doesn't exist in this game. Aside from improved graphics and better physics, I can't see any improvement over GT5. I've said it before and yes, I'm going to say this once again - GT6 is a good racing game, but it's an utterly terrible Gran Turismo which makes me want to never give money to PD ever again. Ever.

 

[Imari]

I feel for you guys who are just so hard to satisfy.

Thanks.

It's tough trying to judge whether each game was actually worth the money spent on it sometimes. Particularly when my judgement is clouded by rosy memories of playing GT1 with my brother, or GT3 and GT4 with housemates. Those were good times.

So basically you are saying that everything must have great graphics or simply not exist.
You are one of those who prefer poor quantity of content but great shiny graphics... I'd rather have much more content but less graphics. Because you know, the problem is, the more complex and detailed the graphics are, the longer it takes to developers to do it... Thats why I freaking HATE the graphics mania of nowadays.

How do you feel about consistent graphics?

I made a post not long ago in a different thread suggesting that a game at GT4 level of graphics with HUGE amounts of content would be quite interesting, and I maintain that it would be. I could even extend this to PS1 era graphics, although I think the difference in workload between PS1 and PS2 era cars with todays tools is not enough to make it worthwhile.

On the other hand, I don't think many people want to see PS1 era graphics on their PS4 alongside premium models, because the disconnect is jarring enough to remove any suspension of disbelief.

If graphics are consistently poor, the brain can work around it, just as the brain works around seeing through a dusty windscreen. After a while, you don't really even notice. But if excellent and poor graphics are placed side by side, it's pretty distracting to most gamers, like half a dozen dead flies on an otherwise pristine windshield.

 

[Eks]

Quantity is better than quality in terms of fun and gameplay.

Can't say I agree with this. I'd take 500 high quality cars over 1000 poor quality ones.

 

[TokoTurismo]

So basically you are saying that everything must have great graphics or simply not exist.
You are one of those who prefer poor quantity of content but great shiny graphics... I'd rather have much more content but less graphics. Because you know, the problem is, the more complex and detailed the graphics are, the longer it takes to developers to do it... Thats why I freaking HATE the graphics mania of nowadays.

Okay so GT will never improve and will forever be stuck in the 90s then. Oh hey, maybe those pixelated cars will satisfy you too. PD should have like 1500 cars and 100 tracks with PS1 graphics and inconsistent framerate for PS4. It will soooo beat other racing games when it comes to quantity... Sarcasm.

 

[MXH]

Quantity is better than quality in terms of fun and gameplay. Nuff said. Graphics are only presentation. But the essence of the fun in the games is certainly not in the graphics. I blame the stupidity of todays new gamers who give way too much importance to the graphics and not enough to the story and the gameplay.

PD set the bar themselves. But hey, pardon me for expecting graphical consistency across the board.

 

[NixxxoN]

If quantity is better than quality in terms of gameplay, I should never even turn off GT6. Meanwhile, I haven't even launched it for the past 3 weeks. If a game has quality gameplay, I should find no difficulties in sticking to it for well over 100 hours (which is actually pretty sad ) overall. If a game has quality gameplay, I should be happy to come back to it.

Quality just doesn't exist in this game. Aside from improved graphics and better physics, I can't see any improvement over GT5. I've said it before and yes, I'm going to say this once again - GT6 is a good racing game, but it's an utterly terrible Gran Turismo which makes me want to never give money to PD ever again. Ever.

GT6 has a good quality gameplay... although the CPU is crap, and the online has some bugs, but other than that, it has quality. If you try some more you'll notice it.

How do you feel about consistent graphics?

I made a post not long ago in a different thread suggesting that a game at GT4 level of graphics with HUGE amounts of content would be quite interesting, and I maintain that it would be. I could even extend this to PS1 era graphics, although I think the difference in workload between PS1 and PS2 era cars with todays tools is not enough to make it worthwhile.

On the other hand, I don't think many people want to see PS1 era graphics on their PS4 alongside premium models, because the disconnect is jarring enough to remove any suspension of disbelief.

If graphics are consistently poor, the brain can work around it, just as the brain works around seeing through a dusty windscreen. After a while, you don't really even notice. But if excellent and poor graphics are placed side by side, it's pretty distracting to most gamers, like half a dozen dead flies on an otherwise pristine windshield.

I feel you have some strange issue about this. You care to much about graphics detail and not enough about the gameplay itself. When I play the game all I care is to drive as fast as possible, and not search for graphic inconsistency or graphic mistakes.

Can't say I agree with this. I'd take 500 high quality cars over 1000 poor quality ones.

What about a bit of both? GT6 has both. I would hate to see the standard cars be dropped because there are sooo many great cars among the standards.

Okay so GT will never improve and will forever be stuck in the 90s then. Oh hey, maybe those pixelated cars will satisfy you too. PD should have like 1500 cars and 100 tracks with PS1 graphics and inconsistent framerate for PS4. It will soooo beat other racing games when it comes to quantity... Sarcasm.

GT7 should have a good balance of quantity and quality. I for example would gladly accept the semi-premium quality (example: RUF's, SEAT Ibiza quality) to replace the standard quality of GT6. We would survive with no-interior cars. Only graphics maniacs find no-interior cars unacceptable. You can still drive them perfectly and in the end, the car dashboards are only useful for the dials but nothing else... the rest is decoration

 

[pyrates]

GT6 has a good quality gameplay... although the CPU is crap, and the online has some bugs, but other than that, it has quality. If you try some more you'll notice it.

Could you please elaborate on that a little bit? What constitutes good quality gameplay for you? As I see it the single player is a joke. Randomly thrown together races with rubber banding AI that lets you win by default. No tire/fuel wear even in Arcade Mode, rather random grids etc. The list of faults is long. I am really wondering where you see the silver lining in terms of gameplay quality.

Online does work fairly well even with the bugs but it is very basic in its functionality. Certainly nothing that would make me think GT6 has great online features.

 

[Eks]

What about a bit of both? GT6 has both. I would hate to see the standard cars be dropped because there are sooo many great cars among the standards.

Some of my favorite cars are Standards, and I would love to see those along with countless others upgraded to Premiums, but if PD aren't going to do that, then I'd rather see them removed.

 

[TokoTurismo]

GT7 should have a good balance of quantity and quality. I for example would gladly accept the semi-premium quality (example: RUF's, SEAT Ibiza quality) to replace the standard quality of GT6. We would survive with no-interior cars. Only graphics maniacs find no-interior cars unacceptable. You can still drive them perfectly and in the end, the car dashboards are only useful for the dials but nothing else... the rest is decoration

Yeah no, that idea won't work either, and PD will be a joke if they did that. It's maybe good for you but not for others. If those interior-less premium cars are going to come back in GT7, than they'll need there interiors modelled as well. If not, than PD should just throw them out.

 

[NixxxoN]

Could you please elaborate on that a little bit? What constitutes good quality gameplay for you? As I see it the single player is a joke. Randomly thrown together races with rubber banding AI that lets you win by default. No tire/fuel wear even in Arcade Mode, rather random grids etc. The list of faults is long. I am really wondering where you see the silver lining in terms of gameplay quality.

Online does work fairly well even with the bugs but it is very basic in its functionality. Certainly nothing that would make me think GT6 has great online features.

The single player mode is not very good, but online still works well and the most important function, which is to make multiplayer qualifying and races (up to 16) works well, and thats the key. In my case, 99% of the time that I spend in GT6, is in the lobbies, racing with 10 or more online players at the same time and I have lots and lots of fun... If I can, why others can't? Thats what I dont understand

Yeah no, that idea won't work either, and PD will be a joke if they did that. If those interior-less premium cars are going to come back in GT7, than they'll need there interiors modelled as well. If not, than PD should just throw them out.

Graphic detail, graphic detail, graphic detail... you seem to be the typical gamer of nowadays that I'm talking about.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Graphic detail, graphic detail, graphic detail... you seem to be the typical gamer of nowadays that I'm talking about.

Who said anything I wanted more detail? Other racing games are modelling interiors for cars, so why can't PD? Do you want them to become a joke badly? I certainly don't.

 

[doblocruiser]

Graphics are only presentation. But the essence of the fun in the games is certainly not in the graphics.

If graphics are less important why don't we all play amazing racinggames from years back which very often have more to offer than the current generation ?

 

[pyrates]

The single player mode is not very good, but online still works well and the most important function, which is to make multiplayer qualifying and races (up to 16) works well, and thats the key.

Graphic detail, graphic detail, graphic detail... you seem to be the typical gamer of nowadays that I'm talking about.

That is enough for you to call it good gameplay? You yourself say that single player is not very good. Since it is a major unavoidable part of the game that alone is enough to say GT6 gameplay is not good - not by a long shot.

I also wouldn't call the basic online connectivity with qualify and race in its most basic form good gameplay. That's as if you'd call a football player a great player when he can at run in a straight line but nothing more than that.

 

[Imari]

GT6 has a good quality gameplay... although the CPU is crap, and the online has some bugs, but other than that, it has quality. If you try some more you'll notice it.

So your argument is that my opinion that I don't find GT6 to be a quality experience is wrong? Great.

-I find the career mode to be dull and repetitive, and not sufficiently flexible to allow me to drive the races that I want. Why am I stuck with small fields and short races if I want to race lower PP cars?
-I find the graphical instability in terms of the frame rate to detract significantly from the racing experience, particularly at high speed.
-I find the AI to be completely unchallenging unless I cripple myself, in which case it's simply a bizarre race of a slow car versus a fast car going slow with a huge headstart.
-I find that knowing that rubberbanding still exists makes any win feel relatively worthless.
-I find the customisation to be lacklustre, and rarely does it make me excited to go and modify a car.
-I find Arcade Mode to be extremely limiting when it comes to trying to set up my own races.
-I find online to be far more work than it's worth to try and find a good room. Quickmatch already.
-I find the lack of proper leaderboards to be a severe impediment. I think Autolog/Rivals is one of the best additions of recent years to racing games, and it's criminal not to include something so simple.
-I find that the sounds rarely generate any emotion in me at all. I love the sound of a roaring Mercedes engine, but they sound flat and lifeless.
-I find that the bugginess and backwardness of the tuning takes away any desire I have to tune cars. I want to learn to tune as I would tune a real car, not learn to tune some arbitrary system.

There is no part of GT6 that I look at and think, "Wow, they've done that better than any other game out there. Fantastic!" I do occasionally find cars that are simply sublime to drive, and it's really nice when it happens. But generally, the negatives are such that I simply don't bother turning the game on any more.

I keep it because GT Academy is starting soon, and this is one of the few things that GT has done right. And it's not even really part of the game, it's a Nissan marketing exercise that simply uses GT6.

GT6 has until the end of GT Academy to improve itself for me. I feel that it can, GT5 at the end of it's lifespan was a profoundly different game to GT5 1.01. Unfortunately, GT6 has so far not taken that path, it is still largely the same game that it was at release.

Should GT6 not be improved, I will either sell or give away my disc to some child who will enjoy it. And they will enjoy it, because they'll be viewing it as a game, whereas I view it from the perspective of a seasoned sim racer and enthusiastic driver (and tinkerer) of real car.

I wouldn't think I'll be buying another PD game if it comes to that, though.

I feel you have some strange issue about this. You care to much about graphics detail and not enough about the gameplay itself. When I play the game all I care is to drive as fast as possible, and not search for graphic inconsistency or graphic mistakes.

Where have I said I care about graphics detail? I specifically said I'd like to see a game with lowered graphics detail and increased content.

I've said that I find the mixture of high and low quality graphics to be distracting. I don't see what's complicated about that.

The single player mode is not very good, but online still works well and the most important function, which is to make multiplayer qualifying and races (up to 16) works well, and thats the key. In my case, 99% of the time that I spend in GT6, is in the lobbies, racing with 10 or more online players at the same time and I have lots and lots of fun... If I can, why others can't? Thats what I dont understand

Because I've got iRacing for that, and it's much, much better at online than GT6 is. It's much better than pretty much any other game for simple pick-up-and-play racing.

I have GT6 for the single player experience, and as you say, it's not up to much.

If graphics are less important why don't we all play amazing racinggames from years back which very often have more to offer than the current generation ?

Some of us do.

 

[Samus]

If I can, why others can't? Thats what I dont understand

People clearly describe to you issues they have with the game, they go into specific details and rather than understand and acknowledge them you just play dumb, as if you can't comprehend these issues exist for people, or that their opinion is just wrong, the game is fine and they are the problem.

That is your issue right there. It's not that you don't understand, it's that you choose not to understand.

 

[Zlork]

Brief.

We still have same messages and same criticisms by the same members.

Frankly, I admire the courage of positive people. Personally, I tried but I saw that it was useless.

 

[pyrates]

Brief.

We still have same messages and same criticisms by the same members.

Frankly, I admire the courage of positive people. Personally, I tried but I saw that it was useless.

Also brief: That's because we still have the same issues we had at release.

 

[NixxxoN]

Who said anything I wanted more detail? Other racing games are modelling interiors for cars, so why can't PD? Do you want them to become a joke badly? I certainly don't.

Having some non-interior sub-premium cars means then will be a joke? No they wont. All cars with interior means less cars available. With this theory, you could also say other games are a joke because they have very few cars compared to GT6.

If graphics are less important why don't we all play amazing racinggames from years back which very often have more to offer than the current generation ?

If I cared only about the graphics, I would have abandoned the PS3 altogether and only play on PC with an uber expensive graphics card and all that stuff, and some people do... but fortunately I dont.

That is enough for you to call it good gameplay? You yourself say that single player is not very good. Since it is a major unavoidable part of the game that alone is enough to say GT6 gameplay is not good - not by a long shot.

I also wouldn't call the basic online connectivity with qualify and race in its most basic form good gameplay. That's as if you'd call a football player a great player when he can at run in a straight line but nothing more than that.

Bad AI doesnt equal bad gameplay. Aren't the physics good? Yes.
About the 2nd thing... then your criteria to me looks so weird I dont know what to say.

 

[Zlork]

Also brief: That's because we still have the same issues we had at release.

This is only a game, you know ?

There are more important things in life.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Having some non-interior sub-premium cars means then will be a joke? No they wont. All cars with interior means less cars available. With this theory, you could also say other games are a joke because they have very few cars compared to GT6.

Oh my lord...

 

[NixxxoN]

So your argument is that my opinion that I don't find GT6 to be a quality experience is wrong? Great.

-I find the career mode to be dull and repetitive, and not sufficiently flexible to allow me to drive the races that I want. Why am I stuck with small fields and short races if I want to race lower PP cars?
-I find the graphical instability in terms of the frame rate to detract significantly from the racing experience, particularly at high speed.
-I find the AI to be completely unchallenging unless I cripple myself, in which case it's simply a bizarre race of a slow car versus a fast car going slow with a huge headstart.
-I find that knowing that rubberbanding still exists makes any win feel relatively worthless.
-I find the customisation to be lacklustre, and rarely does it make me excited to go and modify a car.
-I find Arcade Mode to be extremely limiting when it comes to trying to set up my own races.
-I find online to be far more work than it's worth to try and find a good room. Quickmatch already.
-I find the lack of proper leaderboards to be a severe impediment. I think Autolog/Rivals is one of the best additions of recent years to racing games, and it's criminal not to include something so simple.
-I find that the sounds rarely generate any emotion in me at all. I love the sound of a roaring Mercedes engine, but they sound flat and lifeless.
-I find that the bugginess and backwardness of the tuning takes away any desire I have to tune cars. I want to learn to tune as I would tune a real car, not learn to tune some arbitrary system.

There is no part of GT6 that I look at and think, "Wow, they've done that better than any other game out there. Fantastic!" I do occasionally find cars that are simply sublime to drive, and it's really nice when it happens. But generally, the negatives are such that I simply don't bother turning the game on any more.

I keep it because GT Academy is starting soon, and this is one of the few things that GT has done right. And it's not even really part of the game, it's a Nissan marketing exercise that simply uses GT6.

GT6 has until the end of GT Academy to improve itself for me. I feel that it can, GT5 at the end of it's lifespan was a profoundly different game to GT5 1.01. Unfortunately, GT6 has so far not taken that path, it is still largely the same game that it was at release.

Should GT6 not be improved, I will either sell or give away my disc to some child who will enjoy it. And they will enjoy it, because they'll be viewing it as a game, whereas I view it from the perspective of a seasoned sim racer and enthusiastic driver (and tinkerer) of real car.

I wouldn't think I'll be buying another PD game if it comes to that, though.



Where have I said I care about graphics detail? I specifically said I'd like to see a game with lowered graphics detail and increased content.

I've said that I find the mixture of high and low quality graphics to be distracting. I don't see what's complicated about that.

I think you are so perfectionist its ridiculous.
All games and all things in life have so many imperfections. I dont know what more to say.
One thing I would say, if the lack of leaderboards are for you an impediment... then I find it pathetic. You play games to have fun, or only to try to be high on the leaderboard, to show off to your friends? I mean come on...

Oh my lord...

Yes, its easy...
-GT6 has so many cars because some of them are standard and dont have interior.
-Other games have all cars with interior but have much fewer ones.
-Cars with full detail and interior take long to be modeled, therefore it means we will get less cars.
-If we want a lot of cars, we should expect some of them without interior.

Where is the law that says "A developer must model all cars with interior otherwise they will be a joke" ?

 

[Samus]

So now you're saying all you need for good gameplay are good physics, the rest is irrelevant? More evidence of the above.

Oh and now if you find any genuine issues you're a perfectionist? Brilliant.

 

[CBH]

Perhaps GT6 is falling behind, I will say yes the graphics are rubbish but the physics are good the career mode is a joke. I like the Time Trials but they are getting a bit boring and things are not improving in GT6 with promise features that's why I think GT6 is falling behind and falling apart an I am on the verge of stop playing GT6 altogether to some it up GT6 is definitely not going forward.

 

[pyrates]

This is only a game, you know ?

There are more important things in life.

Sure it is. I fail to see the point of your comment, however.

Having some non-interior sub-premium cars means then will be a joke? No they wont. All cars with interior means less cars available. With this theory, you could also say other games are a joke because they have very few cars compared to GT6.

If I cared only about the graphics, I would have abandoned the PS3 altogether and only play on PC with an uber expensive graphics card and all that stuff, and some people do... but fortunately I dont.

Bad AI doesnt equal bad gameplay. Aren't the physics good? Yes.
About the 2nd thing... then your criteria to me looks so weird I dont know what to say.

About the 2nd thing: You really don't think online could use a bit more than it does now? I'll keep it to just one very simple example: If I want a meaningful competitive race, why is there no display of gaps between me, the driver in front and the driver behind me? Can you race without it? Sure. But when you have competitive opponents on your level these gaps do matter over the course of a race.

 

[Imari]

Brief.

We still have same messages and same criticisms by the same members.

Frankly, I admire the courage of positive people. Personally, I tried but I saw that it was useless.

What courage?

There are things to like about GT6, particularly if you have a certain playstyle that complements it's strengths.

The problem seems to be that some people who enjoy GT6 simply cannot understand how others cannot. It's not one way, some people who don't enjoy it don't seem to understand how some people can either.

Bad AI doesnt equal bad gameplay.

Well, it doesn't equal good gameplay. It's a racing game. Bad AI pretty much guarantees that the competitive single player part of the game is going to be poor.

Aren't the physics good? Yes.

Depends on your definition of good. They're reasonably good for console as far as driving feel goes, but they're pretty poor as far as numerical accuracy goes.

They're not good at all in the greater context of driving simulations in 2014.

They're good enough that people enjoy them, and that's all that's needed. I enjoy Wipeout from time to time. It's good fun. I don't think hyper-realistic physics are necessary for an enjoyable game, although they obviously help if that's one of the things you're specifically looking for.

I think you are so perfectionist its ridiculous.
All games and all things in life have so many imperfections. I dont know what more to say.
One thing I would say, if the lack of leaderboards are for you an impediment... then I find it pathetic. You play games to have fun, or only to try to be high on the leaderboard, to show off to your friends? I mean come on...

Ah, abuse. Good one.

I find leaderboards to be fun thing to do to improve my driving skill. I enjoy the feeling when I'm able to go a little faster, or find a better line. I could do that alone, hot lapping, but I find it far more enjoyable to have a target to beat. Racing is fundamentally a competitive endeavour, and leaderboards tap into that competitive spirit that most racers share.

I don't feel ashamed of my desire to become better. I enjoy it. It's not about being high or low on the leaderboard, it's about working your way up one step at a time, learning and having fun.

Clearly you don't experience this, and that's fine. It's not for everyone. I do find it quite rude that you would tell me that the way I want to play my game is pathetic though.

 

[iRevelationz]

This is only a game, you know ?

There are more important things in life.

Meaning what exactly? Are we not allowed to have negative opinions on an internet forum regarding said game?

 

[NixxxoN]

About the 2nd thing: You really don't think online could use a bit more than it does now? I'll keep it to just one very simple example: If I want a meaningful competitive race, why is there no display of gaps between me, the driver in front and the driver behind me? Can you race without it? Sure. But when you have competitive opponents on your level these gaps do matter over the course of a race.

I agree with this. But you can still see the gaps in the track map.

Depends on your definition of good. They're reasonably good for console as far as driving feel goes, but they're pretty poor as far as numerical accuracy goes.

They're not good at all in the greater context of driving simulations in 2014.

They're good enough that people enjoy them, and that's all that's needed. I enjoy Wipeout from time to time. It's good fun. I don't think hyper-realistic physics are necessary for an enjoyable game, although they obviously help if that's one of the things you're specifically looking for.

Ah, abuse. Good one.

I find leaderboards to be fun thing to do to improve my driving skill. I enjoy the feeling when I'm able to go a little faster, or find a better line. I could do that alone, hot lapping, but I find it far more enjoyable to have a target to beat. Racing is fundamentally a competitive endeavour, and leaderboards tap into that competitive spirit that most racers share.

I don't feel ashamed of my desire to become better. I enjoy it. It's not about being high or low on the leaderboard, it's about working your way up one step at a time, learning and having fun.

Clearly you don't experience this, and that's fine. It's not for everyone. I do find it quite rude that you would tell me that the way I want to play my game is pathetic though.

GT should not be too much of a simulator. It should be a good balance that can please the vast majority of players which are the casual ones, and please the more hardcore fans who want more of a simulation thing. But I tell you, hardcore simulators are not so fun. Tell the F1 drivers when they get into the F1 simulator...
And not abuse, I didnt mean to disrespect, Its my opinion about those who only care about beating someone and about leaderboards. I also like to do well and win, I think everyone does... but I have experienced competitive gaming before and... I think people should not get obsessed with it and take the game as a job, unless you want to become a professional racing driver I suppose. But as long as you take the game as a very serious thing, the fun is kinda gone.

 

[Samus]

See there it is again, pushing your opinion as fact and always finding a (poor) excuse for a flaw.