PP - Performance Point Unfair! Cars list

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Gturbo5

Gturbo5

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Gturbo5
Thread about PP - Performance Point Here.

Test any cars to limit PP. (Version v1.02)
Track: Cape Ring South 3.2km track was best for test.
It will pp fair race time lap?

Driving Aids:
-I Use Logitech G27 Wheel - (Manula MT)
-Driving line OFF
-TC and ASM - OFF
-Active Steering OFF
-ABS 1
-Grip Track Edge REAL
-Tyre Fuel - OFF
-SRF - ON (https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/skid-recovery-force-time-lap-what-it-is.296539)
-Tyres: Racing SOFT!

Cars 550PP limit list:
(30 cars done)


1.09.000 - 1.10.600 For 550pp - Be True-Good Time lap!

=TIME LAP=BHP=Weight= =Cars= (Fix PP to) (if fix pp it will fair race).

- 1.08.594 - 486 - 1070 - Alfa Romeo 155 2.5 V6 Ti ‘93 (558pp)
- 1.08.729 - 510 - 1100 - Opel Calibra Touring Car ’94 (558pp)
- 1.08.867 - 231 - 560 - Light Car Company Rocket ’07 (557pp) [500pp 1.12.669]
- 1.09.045 - 333 - 870 - KTM X-Bow R ‘12 (555pp)
- 1.09.063 - 423 - 1000 - Mitsubishi FTO Super Touring Car (555pp)
- 1.09.321 - 435 - 1160 - Subaru Impreza GT300 Base Model ’08
- 1.09.392 - 458 - 1060 - Mercedes AMG 190E 2.5 16Evo II Touring Car ‘92 (555pp)
- 1.09.880 - 533 - 1400 - Ferrari Enzo ‘02
- 1.10.044 - 524 - 1500 - High End Performace G37
- 1.10.053 - 550 - 1500 - SRT Viper GTS ‘13
- 1.10.098 - 557 - 1350 - Pozzi MotorSports Camaro RS (552pp)
- 1.10.144 - 435 - 1180 - Nissan R390 GT1 Road Car ’98 (548pp)
- 1.10.161 - 528 - 1250 - Ferrari F40 ’92
- 1.10.620 - 459 - 1180 - Ford GT40 Mark I ’66 (549pp)
- 1.10.779 - 519 - 1240 - Ruf RGT ’00 (549pp)
- 1.10.933 - 552 - 1340 - Lamborghini Gallardo LP 560-4 ‘08 (547pp)
- 1.11.258 - 540 - 1500 - Chevrolet Corvette Stingary (C7) ’14 (545pp)
- 1.11.328 - 540 - 1540 - Ferrari 458 Italia ‘09 (545pp)
- 1.11.358 - 478 - 1195 - Mine’s Lancer VI ‘00 (547pp)
- 1.11.430 - XX - XX - Honda NSX Concept ’13 (548pp) (Original 552pp)
- 1.11.667 - 520 - 1460 - Mine’s BNR34 Skyline GT-R N1 Base ‘06 (544pp)
- 1.11.686 - 518 - 1440 - Audi R8 5.2 Fsi quattro ’09 (547pp)
- 1.11.757 - 447 - 1200 - Subaru Impreza Touring Car (546pp)
- 1.11.815 - 529 - 1620 - Mercedes SLS AMG ’10 (544pp)
- 1.12.186 - 582 - 1400 - Lamborghini Diablo GT2 ‘98 (545pp)
- 1.12.244 - 553 - 1500 - Lamborghini Diablo GT ‘00 (545pp)
- 1.12.246 - 539 - 1600 - Nissan GT-R Black Edition ’12 (543pp) [569pp -1.09.971 - 577- 1470]
- 1.12.554 - 550 - 1600 - Nissan GT-R N24 GT Academy ‘12 (542pp)
- 1.13.127 - 503 - 1360 - Lexus IS F Racing Concept ‘08 (532pp)
- 1.13.418 - 553 - 1400 - Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 Turbo (J) ‘96 (528pp) [565pp -1.12.356 -616-1400]

Cars GT3-DTM 600PP list: (4 cars done) later more.

- 1.06.476 - 571 - 1120 - Mercedes CLK Touring Car '00 (Old DTM) (607pp)
- 1.07.638 - 571 - 1260 - BMW M3 GT (Bmw Motorsport) '11 (New DTM)
- 1.08.811 - 535 - 1200 - BMW Z4 GT3 '11 (594pp)
- 1.08.927 - 508 - 1100 - Mercedes CLK Touring Car '00 (Gran Turismo 5)
- 1.10.362 - 535 - 1380 - Mercedes SLS AMG GT3 '11 (588pp)
- 1.11.093 - 560 - 1380 - Nissan GT-R Nismo GT3 N24 '13 Schulze Motorsport (579pp)

GT3 cars unfair race! :/

Too much unfair PP Horrible System so mess!

FIX PD Please! :(

Any question? You try do test this same.
 
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baldgye
What? ...turn SFR off?
Click to expand...

I tested Skid Recovery Force:

SRF ON - 1.08.594 - 486 - 1070 - Alfa Romeo 155 2.5 V6 Ti ‘93
SRF OFF - 1.09.649 - 486 - 1070 - Alfa Romeo 155 2.5 V6 Ti ‘93
 
baldgye
Am I the only one who has no idea what's going on in this thread?
Click to expand...
Nope, I can't see any point here either, SRF and Racing softs and a bunch of cars with different PP ratings.

If you want to compare cars and see if the PP is fair then you first need to use cars that have the same PP, modify those which are lower PP to bring it up to match and then do so with out SRF as this will make the hard to drive cars appear faster than those which are easier to drive and would be faster without it. Also do not use racing softs. Racing hards at best and only then if you are going to be testing race cars. If no race cars then do not go below SS tires.

Also note that on a track with very many high speed corners the Race cars are going to be a bit faster at the same PP due to the downforce allowing higher speeds in those corners where as on tracks with more straights the high powered non race cars will have an edge
 
Good thread.

Today i was racing in my Audi R8 Ultra, in stock after oil change it has 562hp and 1260kg resulting in 597PP.
I raced against GT 500 NSX, also 600PP, but it was clearly overpowered ~650hp and <1100kg
On track (Norschleife) i was able to do 6:48, while NSX easyly goes below 6:28 :(

PP counting system works uneven.
 
Last edited:
baldgye
Am I the only one who has no idea what's going on in this thread?
Click to expand...
All I'm seeing (other than the RS and SRF bit) are lap times and PP ratings that seem to be in parity = slower times for lower PP...unless I'm missing what the OP is on about.
 
Also the X-Bow, Rocket and GSX and other motorcycle/light cars always have seemed to dominate in medium PP races all along...
 
I think PP rating for X Bow street i fair, this car can't go faster than 240 kmh, while other cars with same PP easily go around 290 km/h.
 
Doing the test with racing softs makes sense for -like it or not- this is pretty much the only tyre used online above 500PP. But otherwise HBR-Roadhog is right. SRF should be off.

Such a list is a very good idea though, thanks for doing the work.
 
Ah, after looking at this list some more I kinda get what you did, although I think your method is a bit flawed.
As has been said before, you cannot base your findings on 1 track with racing softs and SRF on.

First of all, some cars are suited more for twisty tracks while others are suited more for tracks with long straights.
Compare a high powered, heavy car with a low(er) powered light(er) car and you will see that tracks matter. Downforce of course is another thing to consider.
The high PP rating for the Red Bull Junior for example does little for it when it is raced on an large oval and pitted against LMPs with a similar rating.

SRF is a magic thing and indeed cars that are hard to handle benefit most from this. You will be able to use a lot more throttle when SRF is on, so cars that need some form of throttle control benefit a lot more from it than cars without it.

A similar thing can be said about racing softs as they give an extremely high (unnatural?) amount of grip. They are almost as magical as SRF.
 
Thread about wrong PP and GT-R version PP. (peoples don't know what happend bad pp at time lap unfair). i have done tested in gt6.

Car version: Nissan GT-R '07, '09 V-spec, '12 black edition, GT3, N24, ARE HORRIBLE & PP!

Others cars fast than Nissan GT-R time lap! :/

PP - Performance Point Unfair! Cars list:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/pp-performance-point-unfair-cars-list.296671

I Tested: (i have more done cars list but just show here):
Track: Cape Ring South
Time lap (600pp):
Road Car:
1.06.609 - 625hp-1150kg - McLaren MP4-12C '10
1.07.244 - 630hp-1240kg - Ford GT '06
1.09.209 - 621hp-1400kg - Pagani Huayra '13
1.11.159 - 681hp-1720kg - Bugatti Veyron 16.4 '13

*Why wrong pagani and bugatti so slower?

GT500:
1.05.438 - 595hp-1130kg - Toyota Supra GT500 Base Model '05
1.05.696 - 563hp-1100kg - Nissan GT-R GT500 Base Model '08

*Really fast than any cars same pp unfair.

GT3:
1.07.638 - 571hp-1260kg - BMW M3 GT (Bmw motorsport) '11
1.08.811 - 535hp-1200kg - BMW Z4 GT3 '11
1.10.362 - 535hp-1380kg - Mercedes SLS AMG GT3 '11
1.10.823 - 528hp-1250kg - Audi R8 LMS ultra (Audi Team...) '12
1.11.093 - 560hp-1380kg - Nissan GT-R Nismo GT3 N24 '13

*So mess unfair GT3 race.

(550pp):

1.09.575 - 568hp-1330kg - BMW M3 Coupe '07
1.10.098 - 557hp-1350kg - Pozzi Motorsports Camaro RS
1.12.246 - 539hp-1600kg - Nissan GT-R Black Edition ’12
1.12.554 - 550hp-1600kg - Nissan GT-R N24 GT Academy ‘12
1.13.141 - 487hp-1620kg - Nissan GT-R N24 Schulze Motorsport '11

*Nissan GT-R slower horrible?

GT-R are worst why? PD haters GT-R?
Are same PP why wrong PP fail? PD Drunk?

Please Fix that! :(
 
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Maybe they're just making up for the fact that the GT-Rs in GT5 tended to be much lower PP than their pace deserved? :)
 
Though I think you're overdoing the drama a bit, at the very least the GT3 GTRs (and N24) are indeed slower than other cars at the same PP. A stock GT500 car will easily beat them by several seconds per lap, at the same or even lower PP.
 
Morphisor
Though I think you're overdoing the drama a bit, at the very least the GT3 GTRs (and N24) are indeed slower than other cars at the same PP. A stock GT500 car will easily beat them by several seconds per lap, at the same or even lower PP.
Click to expand...
Super GT car have WAYYYYYYY more downforce on them then a full lineup of GT3 cars :P
 
You don't need 2 threads on the same topic. Merged.
 
MasterFocus
Super GT car have WAYYYYYYY more downforce on them then a full lineup of GT3 cars :p
Click to expand...

That might be true in reality, however in the game the GT3 cars have higher downforce... On top of that the GT3 cars have more PP by a significant margin. Yet they are slower, and the Nissans are easily the slowest of em.
 
They have more downforce points but they dont feel that way. Possibly the weight difference as well.
 
You've already got the best tires in the world you don't need the computer to help you.

Turn SRF off and never look back!
 
Performance Point rating has nothing to do with individual driving characterstics of particular car, it just shows approximately the very rough "calculation" of performance-related factors (engine power, weight, torque curve, etc.) per particular car.

Actual in-race performance will be very different - as your results show, no matter really have you used SRF or whatever tire compound - due to other individual characterstics of particular vehicle that are not part of PP calculation: type of drive, gearbox ratios, weight balance, air resistance characteristics, suspension characteristics, ability to cope with particular type of tires, braking efficiency, whatnot...

PP is just rough informative value that have no significance whatsoever regarding actual comparison of two or more cars in their track performance regarding efficiency of driving which translates into laptime.
 
Gturbo5
- 1.07.638 - 571 - 1260 - BMW M3 GT (Bmw Motorsport) '11 (New DTM)
Click to expand...

Sorry to say but this BMW M3 GT has nothing to do with DTM!!!
It's more likely a GT3 car or N24 for races like the 24 hours of the Nurburgring.
DTM is a whole different class...
 
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