RMK V2 Control Box & Derek Speare's GT1-FVS Comparison

  • Thread starter Mr Latte
  • 106 comments
  • 23,584 views
I can assure you Rs74 my upcoming opinion and comments on both of these products will be fair and to my personal findings. Not everyone will perhaps agree with points I make, that is upto the individual to determine themselves how relevant they are. A full review would in my opinion cover lots of testing/usage of each, this is more to showcase each product to give others more of an idea of their functionality, feel, looks and first impressions.

It's as if I've been reminded this is not Mr Speare's highest end product. I'm fully aware of that too however both offer almost identical number of functions and to me are similar competing products.

I do agree that it is strange why the catalogue of products was showcased here and information on service etc. Please can you PM me more details, information on your products/ideas and upcoming plans.
 
Here are my thoughts on the matter of reviews made under forum handles. If you're a vendor of any product of specific interest to those in an internet forum, it's vital to identify one's self to avoid the taint of opacity.

Mr Latte's posts, while very informative and fair, are only as objective and valuable as his willingness to identify himself to show that he is free of bias and personal agendas. My agenda is clear, and I am a commercial supplier, so everything I say about my components is going to be expected.

However, posting a comparison under the guise of objectivity under a nom de plume still lacks the transparency necessary to avoid the stigma of bias. Mr Latte could even be me or the other man for all the rest of the good readers know without firm identification.

I'd be willing to send my components to Mr Latte for reviews and I think he does an excellent presentation of his ideas. Maybe I won't agree with some of the points, but I'm smart enough to listen to critics to the degree that their comments make good business sense.

And I'm also willing to state my case when I believe it's necessary. Mr Latte opened the door by comparing one of my components against another. Any fair assessment of product reviews is a condition by which makers of those components may respond with their own statements, and not only should they, they have the duty to the observers to state their point of view, especially when we don't even truly know who the reviewer is. :)

Derek Speare - USA
 
Personally, I find it very off putting that the thread, ehiccg is incomplete in its beginnings has turned into this. Showing your boards, pedals etc... is really not neccessary.
I think the comparison is fair, being that the 2 boxes offer essentially the same optons. Comparing this to one of your even higher end boxes would not be proper the other way. These two products are in the same range.

I think I know which way I will go now.
 
derekspeare
However, posting a comparison under the guise of objectivity under a nom de plume still lacks the transparency necessary to avoid the stigma of bias.
Derek Speare - USA
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So what about that basic comparison was bias? From my perspective you come across as defensive about your products being opened and pictured.

RMK seems confident about his work and doesn't need to make mendacious comments. RMK, look forward to seeing more products from you.
 
What most members don't realize is on the iRacing forum everyone is identified by their real name. Both Derek Speare and Remigiusz Sosnowski sell their wares their. Remigiusz's products are brand new to that forum and as I stated earlier are very nice. Derek on the other hand has been in the Sim business for a very long time and he is very well known in the PC Sim Racing community.

Members here normally do not see these types of products because consoles rule the roost on GTPlanet. If some of the members would check the iRacing forums here at GTPlanet they might get a sense of what's available as far as peripherals for the PC.

My comments earlier were not meant to disturb mr lattes fair and impartial presentation here but only to point out to the members that Derek does offer other options. mr latte did present all of Remigiusz Sosnowski's wares in another thread so to be impartial I stated that the two products were not apples to apples only suggesting that Derek has other products available.

Mr Latte
For me I detest tacky, crooked button labels. Obvious some arn't that fussy but think it can spoil the beautiful look of some boxes. I'd love to see a model with illuminated buttons but with professionally printed symbols on them, like your "Start Button".
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Mr Latte
I was actually thinking of and making reference to the SRT video as Darin called his "cheesy" labels. Gees for a review that was a crime if not embarrassing.
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Can anyone else see that mr latte was referring to Darin at ISR from this statement?


Mr Latte
Sorry, due to continued arguments I won't be responding to left888 and for the sanity of others will ignore his posts, he knows this, the reasons why and should respect that not follow after my posts or indeed threads.
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None of my comments in this thread can be construed as argumentative, however I could be wrong and if I hurt your feelings Rodney I do sincerely apologize.

BTW I totally agree with Derek Speare's comment about identifying one self on this forum, I have always been straight up in this forum on my identity.
 
I don't think having these "nicknames" on this forum should be viewed as a bad thing. Yes, iRacing's forums require that you use your name, but this is not the norm on the vast majority of the forums out there, so you can't really blame Mr.Latte of this opacity thing, at last not in a way that makes it look as if it was on purpose. Check out the member list, you'll find that there really aren't a lot of members registered under their actual names, not because of malicious reasons, but because it is neither a requirement from GTPlanet nor the norm in internet forums in general.
 
Coxis
I don't think having these "nicknames" on this forum should be viewed as a bad thing. Yes, iRacing's forums require that you use your name, but this is not the norm on the vast majority of the forums out there, so you can't really blame Mr.Latte of this opacity thing, at last not in a way that makes it look as if it was on purpose. Check out the member list, you'll find that there really aren't a lot of members registered under their actual names, not because of malicious reasons, but because it is neither a requirement from GTPlanet nor the norm in internet forums in general.
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The essence of using one's own name is not related to general forum activity, nor is it even relevant. However, when you make public product comparisons it's fair to be expected to be asked for your identity by the makers of the reviewed products. It's also appropriate to reveal it. Otherwise no one really knows how credible the review is even when it's as fair as Mr Latte's.

/ds
 
Caz
Personally, I find it very off putting that the thread, ehiccg is incomplete in its beginnings has turned into this. Showing your boards, pedals etc... is really not neccessary.
I think the comparison is fair, being that the 2 boxes offer essentially the same optons. Comparing this to one of your even higher end boxes would not be proper the other way. These two products are in the same range.

I think I know which way I will go now.
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No reason to apologize for a thread you didn't create. If it was incomplete, maybe the entire post should have been at one time. Since it was posted, it's there for the world to see.

I consider the comparison to be fair even balanced against the fact that My box is 70 dollars less than the other one. I'll put anything I make against anything else. Since my component is offered in a review, I have every right and obligation to answer anything made in the review with my statements as I determine them to be relevant.

Any other position is untenable as it simply states that the reviewer can say what he likes, but the makers of the subject matter of the review have to limit what they say. I don't agree with that ideal.

I respect your choice. I wish every sim racer to find precisely what it is they feel is the best for them.
 
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@Derek Speare
Just please post a new thread and discuss nickname/realname (or any other) issues there.
You seem not to understand the point I made and that's fine. But bringing another irrelevant issue instead is something Im really against.
Why people interested in hardware reviwes have to go through this??
People know your name they know my real name. What is wrong with MrLattes nick? You can read his 3000+ posts to make your opinion about him.
...
Just read your another post - really seems you take MrLattes role now. Yes it costs quite a lot to produce steel enclosure to your own design with built in screw threads, aditional custom cut stainless steel details, screws, nuts not mentioning custom painting and assembly time... (quality rotary encoders too) Unlike 5$ plastic project box.
 
the_greeze
Hey Derek,



Forget about the button boxes, when can I get my paws on these beauties? :)
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Oh man those pedals look so so yummy! Check them out on Darrin's cockpit! Looks like we will be seeing a review soon:
 
Jav
Oh man those pedals look so so yummy! Check them out on Darrin's cockpit! Looks like we will be seeing a review soon:
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEU1HbbXOfQ">YouTube Link</a>
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Yeah, I caught a sneaky glimpse on there! Need more info!!! lol
 
Coxis
Why does every topic created by Mr.Latte end in madness? :lol:
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Hey at least this time I can't be blamed, I haven't even been allowed to offer my opinion yet and before I have the comparison has been evaluated, corrected on what I missed or didn't do, told how it is unfair, with a whole showcase of products shown that haven't been covered, further intrusions into who is who or their credibility.

Guys, this has become a real mess.
Should I rename the thread "Battle Of The Boxes!!!"


Is it possible for a mod to clean the thread, let me finish what I have to say or offer in the comparison before anyone starts judging me, my credibility and indeed how good or bad of a finished comparison I do offer?

I would like to do something creative for the forums again that some can enjoy or at least get some info on these products.
 
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A farmer's was standing at the barn crying to his father that the horses all ran away. The father asked how it happened. The boy told his father that he opened the door. The farmer told the boy, "son, you have no right to cry".

The door was opened, Mr Latte. The consequences cannot be undone no more than the bell unrung. I'd steadfastly object to a "cleaning" on your behalf, and that would add even more opacity than exists.

I've stated the comparison was fair. However, you've not revealed your name, you've not revealed you've purchased a box from the other man nor have you revealed from whom or how you've obtain one of my boxes. If the purpose of the thread was to help the other guy sell his, great. If the purpose was to benefit the GT Planet community, removing any possibility of bias is the first step.

The thread has been started. The horses are running. I'll bet my horses against any. I'm happy to say that I give more of my components away to support the goals of a number of sim racing communities than my competitor has sold. I'm also proud to say I have thousands of voices in my chior singing that DSD is a safe and secure bet.

Derek Speare
 
Derek, with all due respect.

I am a paying customer of both products, these are public forums and quite frankly I do not expect you to intrude in the way you or lefty have. Do you intend to stampede over every thread that someone creates regarding reviews/comparisons of one of your products? Furthermore I do not need to give my personal details for these forums nor have I asked for either your consent or approval just like I havn't asked the other product builder and member of these forums.

Your comments could be seen by some that you are trying to coax someone into doing future reviews by offering them that chance before they have even given their full or finished report.

Oh trust me I would very much enjoy that opportunity, however I feel I would rather earn the chance to prove a good candidate for such not be seen to be swayed into it.

At no point has your reputation been put into question yet you keep enforcing it.
I congratulate you on your success, you are obviously proud of what you have achieved.

This thread however is not about you and your "full-range" of products again with all due respect, it is also not about the Trackboss or other items in your range. If you and lefty would of at least given me the chance to finish then by all means I have no problems with people evaluating my accounts on the matter (but not before they are given) and even be quite vocal or critical as I am often of others.
 
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Nice photos and I would like to see Mr Latte's opinion and I do not care who he is. This is a public forum and vendors can post what they like. As a reader, I do not mind seeing product clarification from the vendors but seeing people go off topic and vendors being defensive about their products is rather off putting.
 
How does knowing Mr. Latte's name in real life make me trust him more? I don't listen to what people say because of what their name is.

It's just a bunch of photos (👍) so far anyways, (looking forward to more) how are there already disagreements about how it is being presented?

And really, unless one doesn't work they will both function the same anyways (meaning they'll both work, aside from the # of buttons and rotary switches).

Each Gamer/Racer will need to choose based on their own desires for their own race cockpit (both aesthetically and functionally), not to mention their wallet.

Mr. Latte's opinion of either unit (if he presents one) is just that, his opinion.


Gordie Howe
 
gordie44
How does knowing Mr. Latte's name in real life make me trust him more? I don't listen to what people say because of what their name is.

It's just a bunch of photos (👍) so far anyways, (looking forward to more) how are there already disagreements about how it is being presented?

And really, unless one doesn't work they will both function the same anyways (meaning they'll both work, aside from the # of buttons and rotary switches).

Each Gamer/Racer will need to choose based on their own desires for their own race cockpit (both aesthetically and functionally), not to mention their wallet.

Mr. Latte's opinion of either unit (if he presents one) is just that, his opinion.


Gordie Howe
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Are you crazy? You're giving you full name away on a public forum? Watch out, there's a clan of sim-racers out there to hunt you down for your opinion. If they get you, you will be held responsible by all who relied on you for the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

I have a signed Here's Howe! poster of you from 1984, you reckon it will be worth more if you're kidnapped?
 
I can't quite wrap my head around the whole forum alias debate. So it would be completely different if Mr Latte was instead Mr Dan Longfellow? If he went by his "real name" on here, how could we even know for sure what his name is? Would we require him to scan and post his birth certificate and give a blood sample as well? For all we know, the derekspeare posting in here is really Brad Pitt. It's the internet - anonymity is just part of the game and hopefully everyone can understand that and take things with a grain of salt.

With that said, if his thread started off with obvious bias towards one product and bashing the other, then there would be cause for concern. But there does not seem to be anything alarming or anything that damages credibility in the OP, so I'm afraid that I'm missing the point of this. I'd be much more concerned (read: not really concerned at all) about the random people under names like "Sp0ng3B0b1997" or "UberRacer2008xx" bashing random stuff for no good reason over someone like Latte with a long post history posting a seemingly well-done, unbiased review (or the beginning parts of one, at least).

So, just like Mr Latte "opened the door" with this thread, you "opened the door" with offering your products for public sale. You're going to get people who despise your products for random and mundane reasons, it's part of the business. Heck, look at the flak that game developers get; if they forget a tiny 3x3 pixel sponsorship decal on a race car, people are at their front door with pitchforks within minutes. It's just how things are. But it doesn't seem like that's how it is in this thread, hence why I don't understand all the debate.
 
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swiftwilly
Based on pure looks - RMK boxes looks much better
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Based on pure attitude- RMK boxes looks much better.

Seriously Mister speared, your attitude and remarks in thus thread are truly childish. Being proud of what you have accomplished is one thing, but taking up a defensive position as you have when a new player hits the markets is worrysome.
You have built a great following and from what I gather very well earned. But your comments here tell me you don't like competition. You make a great product line, but are you afraid someone else might take the top spot from you. Is it the possibility of having posters mention someone elses boxes in a majority of their posts here along with I racing.
You and left have considerably destroyed what may have been a great thread.

If rmk had a 32 button box like you do, I am sure that those would have been compared against each other.
My suggestion is to just keep on doing what you do and let others do their thing. If the market decided the rmk box is not worth the 70$ over your Equivalent level box, you have nothing to worry about. If you are as worried as you deem to be about competition then you are in no way shape or form as confident in your product line as you come off to be.

Remember this is the internet, you are a business man. Your comments affect business, and personally you and you alone have made up my mind on future purchases for any similar products.



Also, you have skirted the square peg round hole issue completely.


Signed
J. Caswell. ( a lap dog to Mr latte according to left)
Boston
 
Caz
Based on pure attitude- RMK boxes looks much better.

Remember this is the internet, you are a business man. Your comments affect business, and personally you and you alone have made up my mind on future purchases for any similar products.
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completely agree...and I am ready to buy or make a button box myself this very week.
Needless to say, on this thread alone..it wont be a DS box 👎
 
Planning to update by Sunday evening.

Competition is a good thing but I too do not think some replies and explanations are really necessary. I think you should respect and give your competitor more credit than you already have regardless of how many units you have sold.

This competitor, with their first product has outclassed any model I see in your current range regardless of price. I assume your other boxes are similar in quality?

Maybe if you are up for the challenge and want to arrange something with your TB Champion you can then by all means get my personal details via PM. I will gladly ensure it is added to the mix and presented in an alluring fashion with lots of detail. If RMK wants to arrange a different colour to also be shown or add a 2nd model then well that is fair or if it interests members here?

First though let me get these two properly compared it will be open, fair and take into account a wider view not just personal preference.
 
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