Saturn Offers Accord/Camry/Aura Three-Way Test: New Info, Video

[YSSMAN]

We've been debating this for a while at GMI...

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- If you want to test drive a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord, starting next month you'll be able to do it at a Saturn dealership. General Motors is asking Saturn dealers to have one or more of the competing models in the showroom so customers can look at it, sit in it and drive it.

Of course, Saturn dealers can't sell you an Accord or Camry. But they hope that, when you see a Toyota or Honda sedan next to the Saturn Aura, you'll decide to buy the Aura.

"In that side-by-side comparison, we come out really well," said Mark LaNeve, head of North American sales and marketing for General Motors.

Later this year, Chevrolet dealers will be doing the same thing as they introduce customers to the redesigned Chevrolet Malibu, which shares its engineering platform with the Aura.

In focus group research, GM has shown potential customers new GM models next to competing vehicles with all brand identifications removed and, said LaNeve, customers have reacted well to the GM products.

Another advantage for GM dealers in having competing products on site is that customers may not need to set foot in a competing dealership before making a purchase decision.

"I think we can stand up to the comparison," said Wade Hoyt, a Toyota spokesman.

Auto salespeople always research the competition, he said, and prepare advantageous comparisons to offer customers considering another product.

"They talk down the competition all the time," said Hoyt, "so this is just taking it one step further"

According to industry newspaper Automotive News, sales for the Saturn Aura, which was voted Car of the Year by automotive journalists in January, 2007, have been disappointing for GM. So far this year, about 18,000 Auras have been sold, according to Autodata, a company that tracks car sales.

Part of the reason GM is willing to take this step, said LaNeve, is because the company has little to lose. Midsized sedan shoppers often don't even consider GM products, he said, instead going straight to Honda and Toyota dealers.

The Toyota Camry and Honda Accord are now the two best-selling cars in America.

"Over the course of a few years that became the default choice," said LaNeve.

GM has sold about 48,400 of the current version of the Malibu so far this year. Meanwhile, Toyota has sold about 145,000 Camrys.

GM wouldn't even consider doing something like this with its SUVs, said LaNeve. GM currently holds about a 70 percent market share in large SUVs, so there would be little to gain from bringing Toyota Sequoias into Chevrolet dealerships to compare to the Tahoe.

Personally speaking, I love the fact that GM has the balls to do something like this. Instead of attempting to scream out that they've got a better product, they want to PROVE they have the better product, and thats a HUGE step in the right direction. With Ford's success with the consumer test-drive thing (see the C/D and RT commercials), I assume that GM assumes they can do the same thing.

A Saturn salesman on GMI has said that some of the dealers (including his, a Washington State dealer) has been putting up a bit of a fuss about it because they would have to pay to rent the comparable car, or to buy the new car, as GM won't pay for it. But if the dealers have the means to do so, they want it to go through. The salesman likes the idea, but he is unsure of the current plan.

I thought the quote from the Toyota spokesman was funny:

"I think we can stand up to the comparison," said Wade Hoyt, a Toyota spokesman.

Auto salespeople always research the competition, he said, and prepare advantageous comparisons to offer customers considering another product.

"They talk down the competition all the time," said Hoyt, "so this is just taking it one step further"

I have never once met a salesman at a Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Chevrolet, Pontiac, Ford, Chrysler, Dodge, etc who actually researches the competition to the extent they would need to in order to prove something against a comparable car. Furthermore, more often than not, it is the foreign-make dealers who are "talking-down" to the domestic models be they at the dealership, in print ads, or in commercials.

In my perfect world:

If Toyota and Honda are so confident that their products are indeed better, they'll put an Aura and an '08 Malibu up against the Camry and the Accord at their respective dealers as well. Lets see how they do when the tables are turned...

 

[a6m5]

More powers to them, but they are kind of missing the point, if they ask me.......

Their priority should be to bring the shoppers to their dealerships in the first place, and I don't know if this is enough. How many people you guys know have actually set foot in a Saturn dealership? Not many I know, I'm sure.

This test works, only if they can bring people into their dealerships in the first place.

 

[TsLeng]

If Toyota and Honda are so confident that their products are indeed better, they'll put an Aura and an '08 Malibu up against the Camry and the Accord at their respective dealers as well. Lets see how they do when the tables are turned...

GM wouldn't even consider doing something like this with its SUVs, said LaNeve. GM currently holds about a 70 percent market share in large SUVs, so there would be little to gain from bringing Toyota Sequoias into Chevrolet dealerships to compare to the Tahoe.

err......so why would honda or toyota do that?

 

[Jay]

Hmm they seem to be scraping the bottom of the barrel to the point now where GM dealers can off load their extremely biased views on competitor products with first hand examples, this is not something I would look fondly torwards when entering a dealership. I like to come to my own opinions on things (I accept dealers obviously push their own models).

Although this is a good idea if the dealers have competitor models that they leave you to check out for yourself at your leisure at the dealership, but I couldn't see them doing that.

 

[Keichi Tsuchiya]

Haha. They suck that much. It would be funny if they actually encouraged Honda and Toyota's sales by turning those actually considering a GM model away (It could happen...).
Personally, If I were Honda or Toyota I'd have dealerships right next door to these places. So, if they do have a model inside to test drive even though we are right next door, the customer can see that there is something seriously up and will come over anyway.

 

[skip0110]

I'm not so sure this will work in their favor.

I mean the Aura is nice and all but it's no Accord.

 

[YSSMAN]

Haha. They suck that much. It would be funny if they actually encouraged Honda and Toyota's sales by turning those actually considering a GM model away (It could happen...).
Personally, If I were Honda or Toyota I'd have dealerships right next door to these places. So, if they do have a model inside to test drive even though we are right next door, the customer can see that there is something seriously up and will come over anyway.

The train of thought is that if they can see that there aren't any major differences between the four cars, they may consider the American ones over the Japanese ones based on styling, performance, price, etc. And even if the customer doesn't buy the car, the hope is that they tell their friends that they saw a Camry or an Accord against the other American models, and that they were similar.

...The whole point is that they want to get people in the dealer, and furthermore, have people see that the GM cars are as good or better than the Japanese competition...

Between the four of them, the Chevrolet should be able to trump the Toyota without much of a problem... The Saturn versus the Honda on the other hand, its a bit risky. The Accord is still, at least in my mind, one of the best sedans you can buy... But the Aura is a damn-close second in my book...

 

[skip0110]

Between the four of them, the Chevrolet should be able to trump the Toyota without much of a problem... The Saturn versus the Honda on the other hand, its a bit risky. The Accord is still, at least in my mind, one of the best sedans you can buy... But the Aura is a damn-close second in my book...

But, the Accord is almost 5 years old now...and is due for a refresh next year.

 

[Gonz013]

Ballsy. I love it- more dealers should do it.

 

[bennyrrr]

I think that the current Malibu will get killed by a Toyota quality and driving wise. The Aura is nice, but the Accord and Camry are benchmark, and I dont see them getting dethroned anytime soon (Until I get a G8 with a nice V8 and a 6 speed.)

 

[TopHat]

They're not going to do it for Chevy's until the 08 Malibu is out. They're probably going to show you a 23K dollar Aura, XE, and then show you a Camry LE. Camrys aren't too hot until about 25K or so.

 

[ND4SPD]

Heh, I bet you dealers will have the base Accords and Camrys next to the top of the line Aura's and Malibu's.

 

[Diab]

Hmm a Vectra or an Accord? I know the Euro Accord craps all over the Vectra but the Vectra is the reps vehicle of choice so who knows where this could go, my money would bet on the better build of the Japanese though plus the actual fun of the driving, the Vectra is a boat, just ask Jeremy Clarkson. lol Though that may suit the American roads better.

 

[Casio]

Heh, I bet you dealers will have the base Accords and Camrys next to the top of the line Aura's and Malibu's.

Agreed.

I could easily see them making the Camry have squeaky doors, or make it run harsh as well.

 

[YSSMAN]

Hmm a Vectra or an Accord? I know the Euro Accord craps all over the Vectra...

We would obviously be having the US-Spec Accord, not the TSX (Euro Accord) going up against the Vectra/Aura here in the American showrooms. The Accord is going on a bit in years, and it is still a really good car (far better than the brand-new Camry). I'd say the Saturn wins on exterior and interior design, but what is killing the Vectra/Aura thus far is the fact they don't offer it with a four-pot and a six-speed automatic...

...We have to wait for the '08 models for that...

Heh, I bet you dealers will have the base Accords and Camrys next to the top of the line Aura's and Malibu's.

GM hasn't really said what the plan is, as they are relying the dealerships themselves to make the call there. Dealers that aren't paired with a Toyota or Honda spin-off likely won't have this comparison on the lot (they are being forced to buy the car or rent the car for six weeks, or not do anything at all).

I think it would be safe to assume that they would attempt to get similarly equipped models on the lots, but overall that would be easier to match-up with the Camry and Malibu versus the Aura and Accord, given that the Aura only has V6 options.

I've looked at all of the models outside of the '08 Malibu (seen it at the Chicago Auto Show), and they are all pretty damn close to each other in terms of quality, looks, and performance. Honda has a lot riding on the next Accord, just like Chevrolet with this Malibu (replacing not only the current model, but the Impala as well come Zeta time).

...I'm not certain if the dealers in Michigan will be doing this (remember, 90% domestic market share), but you'd be more likely to see it out west or out east of the central, domestic-friendly strip...

 

[Jay]

GM hasn't really said what the plan is, as they are relying the dealerships themselves to make the call there.

And there lies a problem, dealer quality varies drastically. IMO most aren't very trustworthy at all and would stoop quite low for a sale.

 

[YSSMAN]

Saturn dealers have a pretty good rep here in the US for their service and quality as compared to others. I believe they have been rated second only to Lexus here in the US for the past few years.

The whole question of the dealers is the big one, as some are going to be a bit more 'fair' about it than others. The GM dealer guys I talk to say that they want GM to set some kind of mandate as to what needs to be done instead of just grabbing whatever is around and using that as a model. But even then, I think most of us (dealer guys or not) know that they aren't going to stick a Malibu LTZ up against a Camry LE, or whatever.

I think the big thing is that they want customers to see that their (GM's) stuff is as good or better than the Japanese stuff, and furthermore, they can save you a bit of money as well.

I'm kinda mad that we probably won't have dealers doing this here in Michigan...

 

[Jim Prower]

I'm kinda mad that we probably won't have dealers doing this here in Michigan...

Doubt they'd need to. They'll probably start out in import-crazy coast states, first, California especially.

 

[Keef]

I think I might have to make a stop at the Saturn dealership to investigate this "Aura". Same goes for when the Malibu comes out. It's going to take some serious convincing to make me believe that the Malibu uses higher quality materials for the price and has a better design and is more comfortable than the Accord.

 

[YSSMAN]

The Aura is a pleasant surprise. Even I was shocked by how nice it was, especially for an American car, the first time I got in it and tinkered around. The Malibu should be a shade or two better, given its had a year or so to grow compared to the Saturn, but you could see that it was a nice car while it was spinning on the stand in Chicago.

$26K buys you a lot of car with the Aura XR, and that certainly is the model worth looking at.

 

[ExigeEvan]

Agreed.

I could easily see them making the Camry have squeaky doors, or make it run harsh as well.

No oil changes, low quality fuel, loud running tyres, make the seats abit crap and maybe even let the spark plugs get a little dirty.

There's a whole host of things they could do. Anyone that would rather try all three cars at one ever-so-slightly bias dealer instead of using abit of effort and driving to another branded dealer (are the branded dealers set up generally in the same areas as they are here?) is setting themseelves up for a con.

 

[Jim Prower]

Actually...Locally, we have one dealer that sells Buick, GMC...and Mazda. Another sells Ford, Jeep and Subaru. Feel like cross-shopping a Legacy against a Fusion? a Lacrosse against a Mazda6?

Many Import makes, when they first get here, set up shop in domestic carmaker showrooms, and some dealers kept that way of doing things. I can't speak for the coast, but some of that's that's how we do things around here. also, Many dealers own dealerships with multiple makes. Any car you buy, they make money.

 

[skip0110]

$26K buys you a lot of car with the Aura XR, and that certainly is the model worth looking at.

The differences in the numbers between an Aura XR and a Accord LX V6 come out in the wash.

It come down to which car is a better drive. For your average person driving at 2/10ths, it probably doesn't matter. If you drive at 11/10ths you'll want the Accord.

 

[Pupik]

If you drive at 6/10ths you'll want the Accord.

Fixed. "11/10ths" demands a different car altogether.

 

[YSSMAN]

The differences in the numbers between an Aura XR and a Accord LX V6 come out in the wash.

It come down to which car is a better drive. For your average person driving at 2/10ths, it probably doesn't matter. If you drive at 11/10ths you'll want the Accord.

I'm not going to disagree with you there. The Aura is a great car up until about 8/10, when tire grip gives out and the extra weight sets in. Plus, there is always that problem that you can't get a stick in the Saturn. The Aura has a great level of control, not to mention the extra power of the 3.6L and the control offered up by the six-speed automatic, but its still a bit behind overall, more or less because GM wanted the car to be comfortable wile also being sporty.

But, if we're really looking at driving our sedans at 11/10ths, we'd be looking at Nissan Altimas and VW Passats...

I think Autoweek said it best when they compared the XR to the SE:

Proclaiming a winner is difficult. The Camry won all of the performance tests except the skidpad. However, day-to-day testing had us walking away in favor of the Aura’s superior on-road manners, interior, styling and value.

While we are enthusiasts at heart, Camry’s performance edge is mostly small except in braking. As for what ultimately sells cars in this segment, Aura has strong credentials. The performance advantages of Camry are not significant enough to overlook its vanilla styling, cheapish details, higher price point and poorer ride quality compared to the Aura’s.

Saturn won’t overthrow Toyota for title of best seller, but it now has a strong package in Aura to start winning over skeptics and making them into believers, as it did with us. In the end, Aura is the better choice.

 

[Azuremen]

Bah, I could see this being good and bad now for GM, now that people are bringing up the honesty issues.

If they do an honest comparo, their initial quality and lower price (Even if just a grand or two) will sway less informed motorists. Shoppers that think like I do will be completely unaffected, as I tend to research stuff out and test things in the most unbiased (or equally biased) way. And long term reliability is more of an issue than smaller fit and finish issues. Though GM has come along way from Car and Driver saying most everything on the inside felt extremely cheap compared to the Japanese models.

But it also doesn't take alot to do comparisons of your own. All the dealerships are bunched in two major places in Spokane... and normally networked. One area has Subaru, VW/Audi and Mazda basically on the same lot, and then a bit down the road you have GM and Toyota fairly close to each other. Other part of town has Lexus, Toyota, Honda, Saturn, GM and others all within 2 or 3 blocks of each other. I could just part at the Honda, test an Accord, walk 5 minutes to the Saturn dealership, test the Aura, and then walk over to the Toyota dealership and test the Camry. So those kind of things could work against GM in this, especially if honesty is an issue with the comparison...

If the GM guys don't do fair or proper comparison, they might just alienate a potential customer. Most people don't trust car sales guys to begin with (and I can see why, the toss alot of BS around in their pitches), and if the person feels they are getting a slanted view, they might be more inclined to just check for themselves. Combine that with having dealerships all within handy walking distance and it could lead to someone finding that the Camry isn't as bad as Joe-Blow the GM guy said it is. Which leads to them distrusting Joe-Blow more and liking the Toyota dealership more. Which is bad for GM

That bland styling on the Camry is part of what I like about it. I think it looks much better than the current Accord, and my wife agrees. And thats the thing... family-ish cars like the Camry need to have both adults agree, and that sorta bland but still stylized look works fairly well I think; with the SE package adding a bit of sporty flair.

And quoting Autoweek and such about new cars always irks me... as they always look at the immediate value, not long term. People like being able to keep a car till 200k miles, or have it maintain a strong resale value. Part of the reason why Hondas do so well, though I feel they maintain their resale value too well.

 

[YSSMAN]

...My cousin's (formerly my Aunt's) Grand Prix is already well-over 200K and the only issue ever was a small transmission fix. Outside of that, the car has always ran like a champ outside of leaking oil. And to be honest, my Mom's Camry (and former Corolla before it) had more oil issues than any of the American cars we've owned.

Long-term value is always something that is on a sliding scale, and most people know that most American cars won't hold it as well as some Japanese models. But that being said, it changes often, so there isn't any telling how things will look a year or so from now.

I'm still in the camp that wants Honda and Toyota dealers to carry GM and Ford products side-by-side their own, just as GM (and hopefully Ford) will be doing here shortly. If their products are this good, they won't have anything to worry about...

 

[1X83Z]

If their products are this good, they won't have anything to worry about...

The mere thought of a GM or Ford product being better than a comparable Honda or Toyota is laughable, possibly excepting the Aura.

 

[franz]

Recently I am shopping for mid-side sedan, stil haven't decided yet
anyhow I went to Saturn dealership, those salespersons are not pushy at all and they didn't even care to make a comparison
however when I went checking out Pontiac G6, they always try to compare it with camry, accord and fusion. Value-wise, Hyundai is kicking their ass and they agree with that LOL
But I can see Toyota and Honda is very confident with their stuff and for Nissan they are super hard-selling, maybe they are one of the top seller in Ontario (they said)

 

[Barracuda]

tisk tisk, i don't see the point of purchasing any of those cars, at $25,000 especially. For that kind of money you could easily purchase an older, even classic car, and fix it to your liking. The public these days is just to stupid to realize that. Everything has to be NEW NEW NEW.

"ooh you drive a 10 year old car, that's bad, you must be poor or something" *slaps average American in the face*

I like this idea. And don't you tell me if honda was in GM's position they wouldn't stoop so low to use a base model against their best. It's all about the money these days, so it wouldn't surprise me one bit if some dealerships did do that.