Should gtp start using screening system for new tag users?

[bevo]

I mentioned this as a post in another thread and it didn't get much attention. I figured it was a question worthy of it's own thread.

I have noticed in the last several weeks that the quality and sportsmanship of the gtp_ racers has dramatically declined. When I first started playing gt5p, I was always so excited whenever I would get in a race with gtp_racers. Now, unless it's one of the guys that I raced with in the beginning(spyhunter, kensei, digitalrelay, and a few others I can't think of off the top of my head) I don't know what to expect. The races were great. Always competitive, and almost always clean. Now you never know what's going to happen. I have been getting rammed and ganged up on regularly by gtp_racers recently. It seems like what I am assuming is the newer races think that they are in some kind of gang, and if you don't have the gtp tag your a target for abuse. There is no waiting if your wrecked flagrantly by one, and they are always pushing to get to your inside at every turn. It's not how fast the racers are that i am worried about. It's the sportsmanship.

Anyway, what I am getting at is. Should GTP start using some sort of screening method before they enter someone into the registry. Maybe new wannabe tag carriers could be given times to race with longtime members before being handed the tag. A referral system could also work. Any kind of system, I'm sure someone could come up with the perfect way.

I know I don't even carry the tag, I would like to though, just haven't gotten around to it yet since the private rooms are not up yet.

I know you guys here at GTP know what your doing, it's obvious by the quality of your site. I love how you weed out the idiots. It 's really nice to be able to come to a forum where cussing and text style writing are not allowed. I just hate to see the good name of GTP_ be run in the ground by many of your new racers.

I hope this doesn't offend the staff.

 

[Z]

Your post is pretty much the reason I will always refuse the tag, though I've been around these parts for a time, now. I didn't want it in the beginning and certainly not now. In some of the recent cases, a GTP tag on a member is like putting a freshness seal on an expired food item. That's about all I'm willing to say about that.

 

[P3nT4gR4m]

Isn't the whole idea to report any tags you see behaving badly? I haven't had any abuse from any tags. I've had accidents (gtp prefix doesn't say anything about your ability) but I've never had abuse off another tag, be it gtp, gtrp or gt5net. Only by bringing offenders to task can we hope to keep it this way.

 

[superwally]

I don't know how much good a screening system will do, as anyone can put GTP in front of their name, but I understand your point. I have witnessed some pretty questionable behavior out there, mostly in the NTSC races-and the victims aren't always non-GTP'rs-I was shadowing during a Ferrari 512 PP600 event, and watched as most of the field careened off one another on the final lap. Not pretty.

I have been in a couple races where I dished out punishment to another driver for hitting/punting a fellow GTP'r, it has to be clearly deliberate for me to take any action. I have also done the same for non-GTP folks that are out there racing clean.

A "punters club" of unregulated GTP_tag drivers is not what I want to be associated with when I race online.

The only thing I can think of would be to have a crew of GTPrs run without tags, and monitor the tagged drivers in the race, pretty much at random. I don't know how effective this would really be, however. It would be hard to watch everyone.

Hopefully, with private rooms, the problem will be diminished.

 

[Vaxen]

Private rooms and private events will be the first opportunity to put any "teeth" into the GTP_ tag. Players who conform to the rules will be invited to attend, while players who don't, won't. I don't know whether this will extend to behavior witnessed on the public servers, but it very well might.

Edit: I don't speak for Sphinx or GT Planet, so the above reflects my understanding of the intent of the GTP_ tag and is in no way official.

 

[bevo]

Hopefully the full gt5 will have race teams. That would be the perfect answer to all of the problems.

 

[NLxAROSA]

If you see someone with a GTP_ tag behaving like an a-hole, confront them or report them. I really don't see the point in having a system that nags ALL users, while there are probably only a few rotten apples spoiling it for the others. Besides that, a screening system only validates on entering, not drivers who are already in.

I like the friendly attitude of the GTP system, as it's very open and inviting to everybody who would like to join.

What I'm saying is: address the problem where it's at, not some general system that applies to everybody. It only shows that you distrust your members by default, which IMHO is very bad.

 

[atledreier]

You guys should look up CRC (aka Clean Racers Club) over at the LFS forum. We had a voucher system. You were a prospect until two members would vouch for you. Then you got to wear the tag. The way that worked was: You had a '*' in your tag when you were a prospect so that CRC members could recognize that, and pay attention to your driving and behaviour. Then, if you behave and do good, the memebers will vouch for you in the forum. When you have two vouchers you're in. And similar, two complaints from fellow members get you kicked out for a period, with an even more severe penalty for repeat offenders. We also had private servers with only CRC members, but that can't be done with the current system.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

Your comments risk alienating yourselves, because knowbody likes superfans or people that bring exclusivety where it isn't needed.

There are people of varying skill that run with the GTP tag. I am not the best in the world but by being part of this forum I have picked up driving tips that have helped my driving. In the end of the day the tag is not there to say that we are all fantastic drivers, it states that we take consideration for other people on the race track not just GTP but anyboby on track at the time. It shows that we don't turn up on-line and just go out ramming people of the track.

I think you all should run with tags. By doing this if you come across a GTP'er driving like a tool, you know instantly that you have an oportunity to discuss incidents that happen on track with that member.

I named somebody the other week for what I deemed bad driving. It turned out they were a forum member without the tag. After discussing it on the boards then via PM we kissed and made up, after agreeing it was purely a racing incident.

So to sum up we should all be tagged (pardon the pun), so that we can weed out those that abuse anybody on a race track.

 

[atledreier]

That's exactly what CRC was. It wasn't about driving skills, it was about racing clean and fair. If you put someone on the grass you wait for him to overtake you again. Stuff like that. Not about laptimes at all.

 

[Dragonistic]

That's exactly what CRC was. It wasn't about driving skills, it was about racing clean and fair. If you put someone on the grass you wait for him to overtake you again. Stuff like that. Not about laptimes at all.

Most with the GTP tag already wait, as do i even though i have no tag, unless i feel it was a racing incident that wasn't my fault and i'm in a good position but not the lead. If the roads busy then i'll continue til its safe to pull over, or dump it in the grass.

 

[Z]

In the end of the day the tag is not there to say that we are all fantastic drivers, it states that we take consideration for other people on the race track not just GTP but anyboby on track at the time. It shows that we don't turn up on-line and just go out ramming people of the track.

I think you all should run with tags...

IMHO, it does not insinuate a consideration for others. I've been rammed off plenty of times by GTP players (to remain nameless) who were fighting for position amongst themselves, ignoring the others. What that said to me is that these particular drivers think the tag represents the elite of the GT5 community when that is certainly not the case.

I don't need a tag to run clean or fair, personally. Come find me online sometime (any of you). If I bump you (it won't be intentional), I'll apologize in some manner (PSN message, forum message, PM, pulling over and willingly lose (as I do deserve it, etc.)

 

[P3nT4gR4m]

IMHO, it does not insinuate a consideration for others. I've been rammed off plenty of times by GTP players (to remain nameless) who were fighting for position amongst themselves, ignoring the others. What that said to me is that these particular drivers think the tag represents the elite of the GT5 community when that is certainly not the case.

I don't need a tag to run clean or fair, personally. Come find me online sometime (any of you). If I bump you (it won't be intentional), I'll apologize in some manner (PSN message, forum message, PM, pulling over and willingly lose (as I do deserve it, etc.)

There's a reason for this?

 

[Z]

There's a reason for this?

Sure. I'm not going to just call anyone out here on the forum; it's not the place. If I've an issue with another driver, I will handle it in a private fashion. Seems fair to me and to the forum for not having to read through an argument they aren't involved in.

 

[P3nT4gR4m]

Seems fair enough as long as the disputes are resolved. Otherwise it strikes me that unrepentant offenders should be brought to task in some way. This was more or less implied as I recall in the signup terms. Would be a shame if some bad (malicious, not unskilled) drivers were to go unreported. Stands the potential to get the GTP - tag a bad name too.

 

[muffolini]

I had a problem yesterday with a GTP tagged player yesterday. However, I PM'd him, and we resolved the issue, with no bad feelings either way (I hope so anyway ). Therefore, if you do have a problem, I feel it's best to talk to the other player/s involved rather than cast the event off as a general lack of care from GTP taggers.

 

[Z]

Seems fair enough as long as the disputes are resolved. Otherwise it strikes me that unrepentant offenders should be brought to task in some way. This was more or less implied as I recall in the signup terms. Would be a shame if some bad (malicious, not unskilled) drivers were to go unreported. Stands the potential to get the GTP - tag a bad name too.

I am civil enough to try to resolve an issue as best I can, else we agree to disagree and go our own ways. If I'm in a room with a person of 'that' nature, I won't resort to a room dump. I'll pull to the side at the start, reverse to the pit lane and let everyone else finish their race. IMO, the less-desirables (GTP Players or not) will be dealt with once private rooms become a possibility.

As I understand it, this forum (perhaps only a small group of you, but I have never visited) has recently made use of Internet Relay Chat to coordinate races -- excellent. This should also be an avenue for bringing to light the malicious intentions of another (there is also private messaging within that system). Personally, I race with others on a TeamSpeak server and we are able to communicate these things from the front or back of the field.

One person might get bumped at the back, but the aggressor may not get the penalty. Then the rubber-band kicks in and soon they're up on you. Luckily, there's a defense system and I'll know to watch out for them if someone is kind enough to relay the information.

 

[P3nT4gR4m]

I am civil enough to try to resolve an issue as best I can, else we agree to disagree and go our own ways. If I'm in a room with a person of 'that' nature, I won't resort to a room dump. I'll pull to the side at the start, reverse to the pit lane and let everyone else finish their race. IMO, the less-desirables (GTP Players or not) will be dealt with once private rooms become a possibility.

As I understand it, this forum (perhaps only a small group of you, but I have never visited) has recently made use of Internet Relay Chat to coordinate races -- excellent. This should also be an avenue for bringing to light the malicious intentions of another (there is also private messaging within that system). Personally, I race with others on a TeamSpeak server and we are able to communicate these things from the front or back of the field.

One person might get bumped at the back, but the aggressor may not get the penalty. Then the rubber-band kicks in and soon they're up on you. Luckily, there's a defense system and I'll know to watch out for them if someone is kind enough to relay the information.

HAHA! TS on public servers is formidable Our clan used to join UT3K onslaught rooms and decimate the opposition whenever we'd been trounced in a league match. Helped mend the ego bruises.

 

[kensei]

The GTP_ tag means nothing sadly. I've stopped racing under my GTP_ screenname and have witness some lame things from GTP_ racers. There are a handful of GTP_ members that when I see are great racers but the majority I don't recognize, nor can find in the official list on this site, and they drive accordingly. It seems that if GTP is going to support an "official" game tag they really need to be out there policing it all. I have had some run ins with bad GTP_ers in races and have dealt with mods here reporting such behavior, that works all well and good, but it's not enough. But policing it all takes alot of time and alot of people. More than I assume the mods have here.

I still have my GTP_ tag and if there is ever any kind of organized private rooms in GT5 I will use it for GTP events...but otherwise it's simply embarrassing to have it out there given the general level of GTP_ racers I've watched in the past weeks.

 

[Z]

HAHA! TS on public servers is formidable Our clan used to join UT3K onslaught rooms and decimate the opposition whenever we'd been trounced in a league match. Helped mend the ego bruises.

Formidable? Eh, sure.. but it's better than jumping into the deep end of an empty pool if you know what I mean.

 

[Beerz]

If GTP members using the tag are driving around ramming people on online races and you have witnessed it, although I don’t disagree you not posting their names on the forum (since mistakes happen and everything could be sorted out without having clean racers’ names stained due to a misunderstanding – it happens), I’d strongly suggest reporting every single one of those situations to a moderator (Sphinx or any other). As, by the way, is intended by the GTP staff.
The reason for this is to strengthen the idea of a clean racing community, where rammers are not welcome.

By not doing anything, this whole thread loses its point and is nothing but a rant that stirs things up. Not recommended.

Also, regarding eligibility for using the GTP tag, my personal opinion is that “everyone’s innocent until proven guilty”. Therefore, I’m not for having ‘tests’ for new people wanting to be a part of it.
If people (members) with the tag misbehave, then they should be called upon and the staff will take the measures they see fit for each case.
The other way around, would (in my opinion, of course) create unfair situations and would make this whole thing like an exclusive country club, where you have to have a certain status or know certain people to get in.
Again, not recommended.

 

[JPS]

I like the idea of a vouch for a driver system mentioned above. Myself two days after having purchased the game i came online, as i had never done anything like his before, not being the best driver in the world, well quite a long way off actually, i was bumped, dumped, shoved, braked tested etc etc and i have bumped others, hand on heart can honestly say accidently as i'm no malicious driver whose hell bent on a win have bumped others, BUT within the first hour online i noticed all the GTP tags and on how courteous these drivers were, so after checking with google found this site, joined with the intention of learning to better myself as a driver and hopefully help promote the GTP with courteous driving myself, unfortunately mishaps still happen wether "rubber band" or my own slip ups as i get to grips with my car. So i would of liked the idea of being vouched for to earn the right to drive as a GTP racer. What i do feel is well out of order is being belittled as a new driver by getting a grilling from possibly long term GTP members about the standard of my driving knowing full well that new members on GTP could also be new gamers on GT5, much better to be polite and pm that person askin for a response for a particular race like me and muffolini(mentioned above) than have a pop in open messege. I'm sure the site wants new members, greet and help so they stay rather than nag and moan so they leave.
Reason i say all this is as a new member i now feel i have to take extreme caution when racing GTP members as if i bump one by accident maybe because my braking distance is longer shorter, whatever, i'm going to get an ass kicking on this site somewhere.
Anyhow nuff said, hope it makes sense.

 

[Z]

If GTP members using the tag are driving around ramming people on online races and you have witnessed it, although I don’t disagree you not posting their names on the forum (since mistakes happen and everything could be sorted out without having clean racers’ names stained due to a misunderstanding – it happens), I’d strongly suggest reporting every single one of those situations to a moderator (Sphinx or any other). As, by the way, is intended by the GTP staff.
The reason for this is to strengthen the idea of a clean racing community, where rammers are not welcome.

By not doing anything, this whole thread loses its point and is nothing but a rant that stirs things up. Not recommended.

Understood. I've become a bit perturbed on certain occasions, but not too many repeat offenders. I speak to them and attempt to resolve things. If a player runs me cleanly for a number of laps, then realizes I've got the draft on the final straight and blocks me or shunts me into the wall, I message them and ask them why. I try to explain that you can't win them all and that it's just a game -- have fun with it. Anyhow, If it does get bad enough, I will start to report them.

The following statement is pretty much inexcusable, like telling a police officer that you didn't know you couldn't do this or that, but I've been on about a month's break from this site and was unaware that there was a reporting method. I assumed (poorly) that the online portion of the game was entirely seperate from this forum, regardless of tags. I mean, anyone could tell their friend "Hey, sport a GTP tag in front of your name and people might think better of you." I find it difficult to govern, but as I race a lot online, I will try to be on the lookout.

 

[Z]

Reason i say all this is as a new member i now feel i have to take extreme caution when racing GTP members as if i bump one by accident maybe because my braking distance is longer shorter, whatever, i'm going to get an ass kicking on this site somewhere. Anyhow nuff said, hope it makes sense.

Cashwars, extreme caution is not necessary, per se. Race as you will, practice offline, etc. If an accident occurs, simply let the other know it was just that -- an accident. Hopefully they will be open enough to consider that it's racing and these things do happen. People have different cars, driving styles, controller users, wheel users, slow users, fast users, etc. It's never going to e clean every time, so all you can do is use good judgement when the time comes.

Everyone is new at one time or another, so we all must start somewhere.

 

[BB-ANDY-]

I think the reason is the new tyre restrictions, not to say GTP_members cant handle the tyre restrictions ( S2 etc... ), the braking distances and your overall controll of the car has declined, therefore making people more likely to nudge.

 

[Sjaak]

I race to much online and I am happy to say that seeing this matter (GTP punters?) from a pal view,it is not so bad as people wanted to tell this forum.
In fact the pal GTP_racers I met are a good example how to deal with a race.


I have not a NTSC version but if the NTSC forum members see any unregular behaviour in the races,use the system by reporting them.

Shouting that the GTP tag is nothing worth or means nothing nowadays, is just a attempt to make more moaning possible.

As always the ones without the Tag have the most complains but aren't willing to take one to show the good example to the ones they critisize.

And yes,like Rudi said,**** happens,even by the best.
We all,yes people read it well,we all make mistakes.

 

[Z]

I race to much online and I am happy to say that seeing this matter (GTP punters?) from a pal view,it is not so bad as people wanted to tell this forum.
In fact the pal GTP_racers I met are a good example how to deal with a race.


I have not a NTSC version but if the NTSC forum members see any unregular behaviour in the races,use the system by reporting them.

Shouting that the GTP tag is nothing worth or means nothing nowadays, is just a attempt to make more moaning possible.

As always the ones without the Tag have the most complains but aren't willing to take one to show the good example to the ones they critisize.

And yes,like Rudi said,**** happens,even by the best.
We all,yes people read it well,we all make mistakes.

See PM, please.

 

[Sphinx]

Busy feeding 4 teenagers at the moment. I will post again after they have emptied the house of all food.

 

[daan]

I think that we should continue to put people on the GTP PSN registry the same way we are now. Then, if we are presented with evidence of someone with a GTP tag deliberately punting someone, they should be removed from the registry. If someone else then comes here and complains about them, then we can point out that they've been removed, but we can't physically stop folk from using a GTP tag.

 

[Vaxen]

To me, the GTP_ tag means the following:
- As a bearer of the tag, it means I promise to do my best to race as honorably as I can, to best represent the association that the tag represents. Winning and competing at a high level is nice too, but that is a distant secondary goal.
- When I see another bearing the tag, it means only that I'll give them the benefit of the doubt when they are on my tail; while if they are unknown and tagless, I assume they could very well be a punter and drive a bit more defensively. (I will never initiate hostilities, and will only retaliate in the most egregious cases.)

Once I know the driver, tag or no, I'll react according to their reputation, not their tag. In any online environment, whether it be forum, MMORPG, or other online game, the only thing any of us have of lasting import is our reputation.

My personal experience is that almost all GTP_ tag holders race honorably, though a few show more consideration to other tag holders than to the general public. This is unfortunate in my view, but is what it is.