[SPOILER] Santa Claus: Your Thoughts

  • Thread starter Danster
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Danster

Danster

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What are your views on our beardy, hungover friend? Elaborate Lie or Lovely Festivity?

The Inspiration for this thread came from a few friends at the pub the other week. this friend of mine told his children that santa wasn't real at the early age of 5. he also gave away the remark about the santa festivity as being "perverted".

Post Away your thoughts on this delicate matter. :) :indiff:

EDIT: Sorry, This should have been posted on the opinions forum... never mind
 
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He doesn't exist........

Though a good icon of giving good to someone else other than family. Its also a good figure for little children, though it is the same reason to give them presents every year but its always good to see a child smile. I lost my dream of Santa Claus around 5 because I saw my parents buy the gifts and we had no chimney. At the moment, I didn't think he would knock at my door in the middle of the night because we wouldn't answer it.
 
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It's an important lesson for children to learn to question what they're told - even good things. To rob your children of the chance to do their own thinking and piece the puzzle together does their development some minor harm.

I think it's a great way to help raise intelligent individuals while doing them no harm.

It's also a wonderful way to help children enjoy their vivid imaginations while they still have them. But the practicality of Santamas goes further.

Most parents want to give their children gifts. They like to make sure that their children are entertained, but buying them gifts throughout the year is a good way to teach your child the wrong things. You want them to learn to earn their gifts - but you also want them to behave for less tangible reasons than gifts.

Santamas is a convenient way to give your children the toys you want them to have while preventing them from becoming whiny beggars, or constantly angling you for a kickback for everything they do right.
 
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Of course he's not real. I stopped believing when i was nine because i asked my dad why the government never went to the north pole and disected him.

That's what he got for making me so science-minded.
 
He's real as long as you believe he is. If you don't believe then well to you hes not real. He is after all a Saint. But we really do not know for sure it all depends from person to person and their beliefs. So is this the answer I don't know its just mine.
 
I think it's a good idea to let kids have a vision of someone who can bring them happiness at Christmas, but it also gives them false hope when you can't get them the present they want and have to explain that Santa can't get their pressie!
 
The worst part is: "I know what i want from santa but what are you getting me?" *directed to unfortunate parent*

My Nephew asked me if santa could bring him his dead grandmother for christmas.
 
Solid Lifters already mentioned it, but if you really want to find out the origins or historic significance of Santa Claus, google for Sinterklaas or Sint Nicolaas. This guy lived about 500 years ago. And his birthday (though some argue it's in fact the day of his death) is still celebrated in some countries. Santa Claus is kind of a raped derivative of him.

Danster
My Nephew asked me if santa could bring him his dead grandmother for christmas.
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Eww smelly.

[edit]: edited the thread title. :D
 
Yep, we have 2 holidays, Sinterklaas (Dec 6th) and Kerstmis (Christmas)
Here Christmas is a holiday because Jesus was born, not because of the Saint.
 
Well I stopped believing in Santa Claus after I woke up one morning too early and found my parents putting my presents under the tree. I do believe that Santa Claus is a good thing for children though. It gives you something to look forward to at the end of the year. Granted the man Sinterklaas did exist at one point in time. He died quite a great while back and the concept of him still exists in the embodiment of others. As much as it makes me feel like a nerd to say this. Santa claus is much like "V" from V for Vendetta. He is a concept. He exists to give people hope for something. When V died in the story Evey picked up where V had left off. And thus she continued the concept of V. Never mind that V himself had died. Evey picked up the mask and continued the concept for the greater good of Brittan. So in a sense Santa Claus is very much like V. While the original man had died long ago. The concept of him still exists so that people have something to aspire for.
 
Danster
My Nephew asked me if santa could bring him his dead grandmother for christmas.
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sn00pie
Eww smelly.
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Can't you do a seance to summon her spirit there for the nephew?? 💡💡 He might find it cool due to it being creepy. ;)

BTT. I believed in Santa as a kid, want my kid to have a similar view but to understand later what it truly means. :)
 
I stopped believing in it when I was about 3 or 4. I wasn't told or anything, I just couldn't believe it at all. My thought was confirmed when I woke up and nothing was under the tree, went to brush my teeth, came back and there was $50 in a stocking. It was err... a bit obvious.
 
Danoff
It's an important lesson for children to learn to question what they're told - even good things. To rob your children of the chance to do their own thinking and piece the puzzle together does their development some minor harm.
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The ends don’t justify the means though ;) – I don’t think I can be convinced that it’s ever okay to lie to one’s children. Lying to them just because other people will do the same isn’t the way to teach them to be skeptical and critical.
 
Sage
The ends don’t justify the means though ;) – I don’t think I can be convinced that it’s ever okay to lie to one’s children. Lying to them just because other people will do the same isn’t the way to teach them to be skeptical and critical.
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Actually, the phase where they would become non-believers is possibly the greatest contributor to a child's scepticism.
 
It's a lot nicer if you think that Santa is the embodiment of the joy and unity felt during the festive period.

Santa is the gift of giving, and so he exists if you feel joy at Christmas.
 
I agree with Danoff that it's important for kids to believe in Santa when they're young. Eventually they'll learn that it's not true, and that'll make them question their parents about lying and whatnot. It helps them learn about lying, good or bad. While they're young they'll be developing their imagination and having fun, which is super important in their mind's development. The truth is that if you ever find an adult that seriously believes in Santa then something went wrong in their development process. Those are the kind of people who are gullible and easy to fool. They never learned to question things they're told, and Santa is one of those things.

I am curious how a person goes about keeping the spirit of Santa and giving gifts and whatnot. I'm just not into it anymore. It seems like its a time when I get a bunch of stuff that I don't want or need. I'd rather get the money they spent on it so I can actually get something I need. And since it's then polite to give them a gift, how about we all just keep our money to ourselves? That'll make everything a lot simpler. You get yourself what you want, and I'll get myself what I want, and neither of us have to bother with a pointless transaction that wastes time and energy. And also increases your chance of getting in a car crash by a factor of 23. What's logical about that? Christmas from this atheist's eye is terribly illogical.
 
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I saw him once. Dude was like six feet tall. The Easter Bunny is as real as real can get.

Cadbury%20Easter%20Egg%20Hunt-Great%20Bunny.JPG


Woah.
 
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Well, since The Polar Express (film, and book) takes place in my home town, I'm legally obligated to believe in Santa Claus. Otherwise, my bells don't ring.

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Nevertheless, letting kids believe in Santa for as long as possible is a good thing. I didn't figure it out until I caught my Mom placing presents under the tree, but I always felt bad for the kids who would get picked on because they still believed in him. Oh well.
 
Sage
The ends don’t justify the means though ;)
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You know I have to agree with that.

Sage
I don’t think I can be convinced that it’s ever okay to lie to one’s children.
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That's another story. I fully intend to lie to my children. I think responsible parents should. Children aren't equipped to hand the truth at every age - it's up to you to determine what they can handle and when, that's part of your job as a parent.

When they ask you what happened to becky's mom you don't necessarily tell them that she shot herself in the head. You might say it was an accident. It depends on where you judge the kid to be in their emotional development and maturity level.

When your kindergardner is picking his nose and eating the result you don't necessarily tell him that the reason you're asking him to stop is because it's socially unacceptable and that if he doesn't stop now he'll be teased by the other kids. That's not a message that a kindergardner is going to understand.

When your kid asks you why you and mommy woke up so late, are you going to tell him the truth?

I'm not saying you should lie constantly. I think it needs to be reserved for some peice of information that you don't think they're developmentally ready for - or something that you think aides in their development.

As to the ends not justifying the means, I don't think you need to justify a lie that is intended to help. You'd have to claim that lying was wrong, inherently, and I'm not sure it is. It certainly doesn't violate anyone's rights. Obviously you don't want to harm them to accomplish something, but I'm not convinced that lying to your children = harming them.
 
There’s a big difference though between telling your child that “Becky’s mom had an accident” and “An angel decided that it was time for Becky’s mom to depart this world”. I’m 100% okay with adjusting how you give information to children, including withholding information, but I don’t think I could ever bring myself to completely totally outright lie (except as a joke, if they’re old enough to understand that).

I’m not saying that because of rights or anything like that (you don’t tell your children to eat their broccoli because of natural rights), just on the basis of what I believe is good parenting, including establishing a strong relationship of trust with your child. There are plenty of ways to teach your child skepticism, and plenty of ways to let your child’s imagination run wild, and plenty of ways of keeping your child from becoming a spoiled brat, all without needing to lie to them. I happen to be an example myself – my parents never did the Santa thing for me. If anything, that’s what helped teach me skepticism, because I would think “Wow, look how easily other children are fooled just by what their parents tell them” (I think you can agree that’s somewhat analogous to what happens in religion). I’m not saying that teaching them there is a Santa won’t teach them skepticism, but I’m just saying that there are millions of ways to teach them that without lying.
 
I had deduced that there was no Santa around four.
1: He flys around in something without wings. It's not a podracer.
2: Who would be bored enough to fly around at Mach 200 to give presents to random children?
3: I never got what I wanted for Christmas. Things like a new game.
 
don’t think I can be convinced that it’s ever okay to lie to one’s children.
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You've got to lie about a lot of things e.g the tooth fairy, your beliefs on religion (I always think your child should have his/her own idea about religion) and in a slightly more complicated matter, sex.
 

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