StarCraft 2 - Season 7 is live. Someday I'll ladder, honest

  • Thread starter Thread starter Azuremen
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Does anyone here think late game reapers are viable in TvT?

I was in a long game (4 Bases each), with one of those siege tank stand off's in the middle of the map. I went to drop and unfortunately he had filled his base and his engagement areas with turrets and lost 4 medivacs full of tanks and marines while trying to find a way around. By the time you have 4 bases you generally have quite a number of barracks anyway, so if I made like 6-12 reapers to jump into his base(s) and start sniping buildings would it be worth it? Also how do reapers with the speed upgrade fare against sieged tanks? (I've never got the speed upgrade...).

If a reaper is 50/50, I can get 6-7 Reapers for the same price/supply as a Battlecrusier. Be more mobile, half the build time, and be able to two-shot depots and pylons. For the price of two Battlecrusiers I could get 12 reapers and be taking down CC's in seconds.
 
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^ give it a try! unconventional stratagies can catch people by suprise
 
I would say ask yourself these two questions:

- Do they have a large tank spread that could hit your reapers moving past.
- Do they have a large force of blue flame hellions near their base.

If the answer is no to both of those questions, Reapers would tear them apart. So long as you can sneak them in, it'll cripple them quite badly. The real question is if that money would have been better spent on say Vikings, which could give you air dominance and make your tanks much stronger.
 
Time to complain about the broken ladder system again.

So my mate and I broke into Silver league in 2v2. Worked into the top 5 of Silver, winning 30+ games probably 70-80% of the time including against Gold and Plats, went on a losing streak of 5 games (3 of which were against gold playered teams) where we were pretty unlucky, then got demoted back to bronze!

I've almost given up on the 1v1 ladder. Play a game where I'm favoured against a Gold opponent with 500 wins and win easy (thinking yes, might be going up soon...), then 2 games later I player a bronze player with 4 career wins who is favoured against me. I understand the MMR and all that, but it's so hard to be motivated when it's seemingly impossible to move up from bronze after 199 career wins. Especially when I read guys on Team Liquid saying it only takes 50 or so games to get to Diamond from Bronze.

This is how my division ladder currently stands (Points/Games)
9th DavidSaxon 580 130
10th Everready 569 96
11th Alpine 553 32
12th Strecky 546 52
13th FelixNothus 544 65
14th Gview 542 75
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When I have the same number of points as the guys around me, around half to a forth of the number of games played, it's very frustrating. Do I need to play 130 games like one of those guys and be a 3k bronze player...
 
If your win rate is between 40%-60% then I wouldn't worry about it, the MMR is doing it's job to match you against good opponents. Even though it may seem ****** being in a poor league they aren't particularly restrictive.
 
Owen.C93
If your win rate is between 40%-60% then I wouldn't worry about it, the MMR is doing it's job to match you against good opponents. Even though it may seem ****** being in a poor league they aren't particularly restrictive.
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Yeah, I have good games more often than not so I'm not complaining about that really, (and learning to hold off Cheese well, SEA Bronze is the cheesiest place on the planet), but like I said, it's kinda frustrating I'm not getting a shiny new badge when I read people win like 40 games and get up to Plat, (I won 40 in a row before...)

I actually autosave all my replays and just got SC2 gears. Since Season 2 started I have a 76% 1v1 win percentage. (Though TvT is by far my worst at 48%)
 
Casio
Yeah, I have good games more often than not so I'm not complaining about that really, (and learning to hold off Cheese well, SEA Bronze is the cheesiest place on the planet), but like I said, it's kinda frustrating I'm not getting a shiny new badge when I read people win like 40 games and get up to Plat, (I won 40 in a row before...)

I actually autosave all my replays and just got SC2 gears. Since Season 2 started I have a 76% 1v1 win percentage. (Though TvT is by far my worst at 48%)
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Once your MMR starts to stabilize it will place you in a league. Which means losing some games as well. Win you are winning 40 in a row it doesn't know what to do with you as putting you in silver isn't really going to mean anything at that point because you are likely playing above that level as well.

Like I've said before, you should hop on the NA servers sometime, but hit me up with a PM before you do so as I've been super busy in the real world. This way I can make some effort to be online around the same time (provided it isn't too crazy, given the time zones)
 
Watched the SHOUTcraft Invitational last night. Was damn good, especially TLO vs Destiny. TLO has some crazy stratagies, especially in the first game that went for 40 mins!
 
Azuremen
Once your MMR starts to stabilize it will place you in a league. Which means losing some games as well. Win you are winning 40 in a row it doesn't know what to do with you as putting you in silver isn't really going to mean anything at that point because you are likely playing above that level as well.

Like I've said before, you should hop on the NA servers sometime, but hit me up with a PM before you do so as I've been super busy in the real world. This way I can make some effort to be online around the same time (provided it isn't too crazy, given the time zones)
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I'll try to hit up NA this week. I've been playing pretty well lately against Silver/Gold guys and winning maybe 65-70% lately, not too concerned about league at the moment, just getting my builds/money spending tight. The other day I had a 10 minute game where my average unspent minerals was ~170, so I was pretty happy with that, and cause I'm playing a lot of 2v2, I'm learning to deal with cheese pretty well...

One of the things that's helped me a lot over the last couple of weeks is a little Unit called the 'Raven' :sly:, I really never used it much until recently and am realising what an underrated unit it is (No one uses a Raven in bronze...). With my first Starport I used to generally go a banshee or a Medivac to do some base damage, but now I generally go Raven first and it's awesome.

TvT is still the worst of my match-ups, generally because I get bored of siege tank stand-offs, still not sure 100% what to do in that match up. I smash TvP and am alright at TvZ unless it goes into a longer game.

EDIT: I've added another Replay of a match I thought I did alight in (Even though I basically just made Marines), hopefully I've improved a bit since you guys last saw...
 

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I'm in platinum 2v2 random, and gold 2v2, all I do is simply mass marines, or mass marauders If against protos, my micro's is pretty decent (100-110 apm) so I try and make mobile units to play towards this strength, and I stray from building too many tanks, especially when against protos.

Casio, we should team up as a terran V terran 2v2 team.
 
High APM does not mean decent micro necessarily. What are you rated in 1v1?
 
MarkWebber
Gold rank 2.
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Gold. Okay. FYI, rank inside a league doesn't mean much due to the fact each division has adjusted point values, so Gold rank 2 in one div could be the same MMR and such as gold Rank 80 in another Div.

Focus on macro if you want to improve though. Micro is less important till at least Diamond, more likely Masters to be honest.
 
GTP SC2 tournament?

Seems that most people here are on SEA or NA, so us SEA's can play on NA...or can you play cross server but just not ladder?
 
^ Sounds like a good idea Casio! Just please wait about 2 weeks, as I'm getting a new PC and Starcarft 2

I know I'll need to have a bit of practice first, but I've played a number of RTS games and have been watching SC2 for about a year. I also know I'll get my butt kicked, but I'm ok with that :lol:.
 
My mate and I had our semi-regular 2v2 night and got bored and decided to off-race as Zerg. I had only played as Zerg a handful of times, he had never.

We managed to win our first 9 games in a row...

I conclude that Zerg is OP.
 
Just got Star craft 2 a week ago. I Hadn't played an RTS in years and am addicted to it like crazy. Haven't played iracing since I got it. I was just playing single player against the cpu until a yesterday whne I started beating it on hard, and decided I might be good enough to try some online. I did my 5 evaluation games and won 3 out of 5 and got put into the platnum league. The problem is that I won my first game, because the other guy must have never played before. It was like playing the cpu on easy. The other 2 wins I got I was getting destroyed and they had disconnects. Now I am getting killed every game I play. I bet I haven't had one last for more then 5 minutes.

I play as the terran and try and mass marines and mauraders, but I always just get rushed and destroyed no matter who I am playing against. I will be close to them on resources, but they just always make so many more unitls then I do, that I can't defend against them. I've watched videos online and tried to do the same thing that the good guys do, but it just doesn't work at all for me.

When I play against protos, they just bring in a few scouts ( I think it's called a probe), and shock my worker that is building my first barracks. Then they bring in these big things that shoot lasers and destroy everything. I really don't see how I could get setup any faster.

I really wish I could start over and just replay my evaluation games, and get put in a lower league. It's making me start to lose interest in the game.
 
^ I haven't played it yet, but I've been watching stuff about the game for ages. looking through some good Youtube channels such as:
Totalbiscuit, A UK pro-game commentator, who presents the matches in a really interesting and basic way, helping to ease into the game, whilst still providing entertainment.
Day[9], A US SC1 pro, who does alot of analysis of SC2 pro games,, as well as some game commentaties (Day[9] website)

Would also recommend watching this video about the mechanics of the game (hotkeys, etc). After watching these videos, I think I could step into SC2 and do alright off the bat (and I will test this in about 2 weeks :lol:)

NOTE: This is my opinion. there are many, many good SC2 video providers, I just happen to like these 2 the most
 
The crazy thing about it, is how fast you have to adjust. You really have to be good with all the races so that you know what they can do too. I think thats my biggest problem online. I've got so I can beat the computer ojn very hard, but the computer doesn't seem to be that good at making adjustments. You can just pump out alot of marines and mauraders, as long as you do it really fast, you have a good chance at winning. When you play online there is no telling what they are going to do. You could start with an MMM push, and then realize they are bringing in cloaked planes and you are screwed.

My biggest problem is the micro control. I seem to be alright at the macro, but I can't keep track of everything, and control my troops. I even downloaded a strategy guide thing, that runs while you are playing to try and help me out. There's so much to try and remember, that it's really hard for me to try and beat people, since I got put right in the platinum league. Hopefully I either start winning a few, or get kicked to a lower league soon.

It's a really fun RTS though, if you are thinking about getting it, then get it.
 
bevo
The crazy thing about it, is how fast you have to adjust. You really have to be good with all the races so that you know what they can do too. I think thats my biggest problem online. I've got so I can beat the computer ojn very hard, but the computer doesn't seem to be that good at making adjustments. You can just pump out alot of marines and mauraders, as long as you do it really fast, you have a good chance at winning. When you play online there is no telling what they are going to do. You could start with an MMM push, and then realize they are bringing in cloaked planes and you are screwed.

My biggest problem is the micro control. I seem to be alright at the macro, but I can't keep track of everything, and control my troops. I even downloaded a strategy guide thing, that runs while you are playing to try and help me out. There's so much to try and remember, that it's really hard for me to try and beat people, since I got put right in the platinum league. Hopefully I either start winning a few, or get kicked to a lower league soon.

It's a really fun RTS though, if you are thinking about getting it, then get it.
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I'd suggest you play against players, computers aren't very good to practice against IMO. Actual players are unpredictable (for the most part). Also I don't think you need to know how to play all the races just know what each units', of your race, advantage and disadvantages are against other races units. Micro is just gonna take practice, at least it was for me. Hotkeys are a must of course.
 
bevo
Just got Star craft 2 a week ago. I Hadn't played an RTS in years and am addicted to it like crazy. Haven't played iracing since I got it. I was just playing single player against the cpu until a yesterday whne I started beating it on hard, and decided I might be good enough to try some online. I did my 5 evaluation games and won 3 out of 5 and got put into the platnum league. The problem is that I won my first game, because the other guy must have never played before. It was like playing the cpu on easy. The other 2 wins I got I was getting destroyed and they had disconnects. Now I am getting killed every game I play. I bet I haven't had one last for more then 5 minutes.

I play as the terran and try and mass marines and mauraders, but I always just get rushed and destroyed no matter who I am playing against. I will be close to them on resources, but they just always make so many more unitls then I do, that I can't defend against them. I've watched videos online and tried to do the same thing that the good guys do, but it just doesn't work at all for me.

When I play against protos, they just bring in a few scouts ( I think it's called a probe), and shock my worker that is building my first barracks. Then they bring in these big things that shoot lasers and destroy everything. I really don't see how I could get setup any faster.

I really wish I could start over and just replay my evaluation games, and get put in a lower league. It's making me start to lose interest in the game.
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Those big things that shoot those laser beams that look like they're from war of the worlds are called stalkers, and the best counter for them are marauders (with concussion shell research preferrably), and another rushing unit for protos is the zealot, best unit against them are marines and a few marauders to slow them down with concussion shells.

Protos is more likely to effectively beat you by rushing because of warp technology, so If you see a robotics facility in their base during your scout/scan early on, you know he is almost 100 percent going for a cheesy rush all in build, warping his units right near your base.

If you play against terran, and you see 2 barracks early on, and no gas, you know he is going for early marine pressure, so you can choose to copy his build and go for 3 or 4 barracks (because by the time he gets his troops to your base you will have like 4 or 5 more marines than him, give or take 1 or 2 depending on base distance), or bunker up (with scv's repairing them) your choke point and build tanks, and go for an early expansion (build your command center inside your base and orbital command it) and when you know its safe to open your supply depot bring a few of your tanks down and siege them up and set up your expansion ect.

If you hold off early pressure from your opponent, you will most likely have a stronger economy mid game. Thats the downside to fast pressure, you sacrifice economy.
 
MarkWebber
Those big things that shoot those laser beams that look like they're from war of the worlds are called stalkers, and the best counter for them are marauders (with concussion shell research preferrably), and another rushing unit for protos is the zealot, best unit against them are marines and a few marauders to slow them down with concussion shells.

Protos is more likely to effectively beat you by rushing because of warp technology, so If you see a robotics facility in their base during your scout/scan early on, you know he is almost 100 percent going for a cheesy rush all in build, warping his units right near your base.

If you play against terran, and you see 2 barracks early on, and no gas, you know he is going for early marine pressure, so you can choose to copy his build and go for 3 or 4 barracks (because by the time he gets his troops to your base you will have like 4 or 5 more marines than him, give or take 1 or 2 depending on base distance), or bunker up (with scv's repairing them) your choke point and build tanks, and go for an early expansion (build your command center inside your base and orbital command it) and when you know its safe to open your supply depot bring a few of your tanks down and siege them up and set up your expansion ect.

If you hold off early pressure from your opponent, you will most likely have a stronger economy mid game. Thats the downside to fast pressure, you sacrifice economy.
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- When I think of a unit that reminds me of War of the Worlds I think of a Colossus. In any case marauders are still a viable solution for those but you better catch them early. Once a 'toss player has a good sized army of stalkers and 2 or 3 colossus your bio army (meaning alot of biological units which is what terran usually runs around with like an MMM build) will get destroyed. In which case I'd suggest Banshees as support or Vikings if you want to not spend as much.

- Isn't the Cybernetics Core the building that researches Warp Gate tech?
 
A few games recently I've played a Zerg who are starting their second hatch early, before the pool is even finished. I feel like I should be putting some pressure on but by the time I have a few marines out they generally have enough zerglings or a crawler to deal with it. Is there a way to put some early pressure on them or is the best thing to do expand with them and go from there?
 
I finally got moved down out of platnum level lest night. I actually almost competed with the first person I played in the level below platnum. I tried a 6 rax marine rush, and it worked for a few minutes. I got caught up in the moment and forgto about my base and stopped producing marines long enough to screw myself.
I jusy really need to learn what counters each other, and what the other races buldings are. I try to scout, but it really doesn't matter because I have no idea what I'm looking at. I think I might go play a few games tonight with the protos, and then a few with the zerg, to try and figure out what I'm suppose to be looking for when I scout.

If anyone wants to play a game or 2 tonight with me, and give me a few pointers, I would be more then happy to let someone beat up on me for awhile. My user name is Bevo.
 
Casio
A few games recently I've played a Zerg who are starting their second hatch early, before the pool is even finished. I feel like I should be putting some pressure on but by the time I have a few marines out they generally have enough zerglings or a crawler to deal with it. Is there a way to put some early pressure on them or is the best thing to do expand with them and go from there?
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After they've started the pool seems almost slow to me. I prefer to go hatch first when I play as zerg in both ZvT and ZvP. If they aren't expanding before their pool finishes, I honestly find it suspect.

Look into 2 rax builds for applying pressure, or Blue Flame Hellion openings.

bevo
I finally got moved down out of platnum level lest night. I actually almost competed with the first person I played in the level below platnum. I tried a 6 rax marine rush, and it worked for a few minutes. I got caught up in the moment and forgto about my base and stopped producing marines long enough to screw myself.
I jusy really need to learn what counters each other, and what the other races buldings are. I try to scout, but it really doesn't matter because I have no idea what I'm looking at. I think I might go play a few games tonight with the protos, and then a few with the zerg, to try and figure out what I'm suppose to be looking for when I scout.

If anyone wants to play a game or 2 tonight with me, and give me a few pointers, I would be more then happy to let someone beat up on me for awhile. My user name is Bevo.
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Don't focus too much on counters, at least at your point in the game. You can win by just maintaining solid macro - don't stop making workers, keep your money low, don't queue units, and expand regularly. It is quite possible to get to Diamond making only Marines and getting stim, maybe adding in medivacs if the game goes on for a bit.

I'd also suggest playing Random, as you will be forced to learn what each unit does. You'll also better understand what timings are possible, what works and why at those timings, and so on. You'll have a better idea of what the player getting 2 gases before the Cyber core can allow (usually DTs), or why a Zerg's spawning pool feels very late (secret third hatch before pool?) etc.

Also, stop using those silly applications that run in the back ground and tell you what you should make for what you see. By the time you see they have 5 colossi, trying to get to Vikings if you don't have the Starport up will take too long - you'd be better off trying to make something happen right then rather than trying to "counter" them. New players get way too caught up "X counters Y, and Y counters Z" rather than just learning good mechanics.
 
Azuremen
After they've started the pool seems almost slow to me. I prefer to go hatch first when I play as zerg in both ZvT and ZvP. If they aren't expanding before their pool finishes, I honestly find it suspect.

Look into 2 rax builds for applying pressure, or Blue Flame Hellion openings.
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All Bronze Zergs just 6-8 pool or Roach rush off one base. Almost every game now I'm playing silver/gold ranked players now and finding they are a lot less stupid.

The funny thing is that whenever I'm 6-8 pooled and proceed win easy I like to check my opponents match history. Most of the time the last 10 games they did were all the exact same thing. :lol:

Yesterday I had my toughest game ever. A legitimate 1h 20min game vs Zerg, where it wasn't just floating buildings around or a trillion spine crawlers. Ended up making 914 units. I'll post a replay later. I think the zerg kinda sucked and I did dumb things but still happy I came out on top.
 
Casio
A few games recently I've played a Zerg who are starting their second hatch early, before the pool is even finished. I feel like I should be putting some pressure on but by the time I have a few marines out they generally have enough zerglings or a crawler to deal with it. Is there a way to put some early pressure on them or is the best thing to do expand with them and go from there?
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A good tactic that If executed accurately, puts the Zerg who fast expands under alot of pressure, is to bunker rush their expansion. Bring about 2 marines and 2 scv's (by building 2 early barracks's) and start building 1 or 2 bunkers at their expansion, preferably 1 of them in a closed position next to a wall so that once their zerglings get out, you can box your marines in a pocket so they can't get a surround on you) by this stage they will not have any zerglings, and the correct play from them is to deny you from completing the bunkers by pulling a handful of drones from their mineral line.

Your marines will die quickly If these drones surround you so you need good micro, aswell as macro, to keep on rallying your marines to the spot, so the bunker rush requires serious multi tasking. And with ideal play from Zerg, you will only get an equal or worse position in the middle game. If the Zerg panics and makes mistakes, you can create an advantage by either winning outright on the spot by destroying their hatchery, or, expanding yourself and creating a superior economy.
 
So my mate and I are now ranked #1 in Silver League in 2v2. Hoping for promotion soon...

Played insane from here the other day, got my ass handed too me (No one uses HT in bronze/silver and wasn't prepared!).
 
Casio
So my mate and I are now ranked #1 in Silver League in 2v2. Hoping for promotion soon...

Played insane from here the other day, got my ass handed too me (No one uses HT in bronze/silver and wasn't prepared!).
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Haha yeah High Templar's become more popular as you move up it seems. I play Protoss though so I never face them :P

You did pretty well though, You'll be moving up in no time I'm sure.
 
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