The Damage Thread - Best Buy Demo, Now Thats More Like It!

[Forza4life]

I don't know man. After rewatching both the gif and video repeatedly, I still think the impact from backing/slamming into the barrier caused the splitter to bend back and flap forward (I don't think it went through the asphalt). I guess I just gonna have to agree to disagree with you on this one. Just gonna read others opinion on this topic/debate from the sidelines.

 

[Pierced Lead]

Not much, still pretty weak even when is good that is realtime. I hope they make it much more severe and add paint scratches. We havent seen much deformation and paintscratches together.

If im not mistake even GTA have realtime damage, and of course an old game like Viper Racing (was great, i loved hitting the other cars with the ball).

Edit: yes, realtime

You shouldn't compare GTA with GT because the former doesn't have any licensing issues in the way of implementing good and realistic damage.



And that is clearly clipping in the NASCAR video, as much as I don't want it to be that piece is clipping through the road.

 

[CoolColJ]

This'll blow your mind, folks. Perhaps it's both clipping and flapping.

Mind blown !

 

[Dravonic]

You shouldn't compare GTA with GT because the former doesn't have any licensing issues in the way of implementing good and realistic damage.

Neither have NASCAR cars in GT5. Or any other racing cars for that matter.

 

[The_Paladin]

You shouldn't compare GTA with GT because the former doesn't have any licensing issues in the way of implementing good and realistic damage.



And that is clearly clipping in the NASCAR video, as much as I don't want it to be that piece is clipping through the road.

First im not comparing, i saying that is nothing new like someone put it back there.
Second, race cars doesn´t have problems with licenses at all, they can even caught fire. Gran Turismo already have different damage levels for production and race cars according what we have seen in videos, so why not having a brutal visual damage for racecars?

 

[Organ-Donor]

First im not comparing, i saying that is nothing new like someone put it back there.
Second, race cars doesn´t have problems with licenses at all, they can even caught fire. Gran Turismo already have different damage levels for production and race cars according what we have seen in videos, so why not having a brutal visual damage for racecars?

Who knows, maybe we will.

I'm pretty satisified the direction it is going considering this is PD's first time dealing with damage. This also makes me very confident with damage in GT6 considering they already have the blueprints now, and they look pretty damn good to me.

 

[The_Paladin]

Who knows, maybe we will.

I'm pretty satisified the direction it is going considering this is PD's first time dealing with damage. This also makes me very confident with damage in GT6 considering they already have the blueprints now, and they look pretty damn good to me.

LOL GT6, i hope my grand children can play it in their life time. j/k

I had enough of waiting for GT5 (and i hope that finally comes out this year) i dont want think about GT6.
Not far ago Kazz said it will be take about 2 years after GT5, i laughed a lot because he was not even done with GT5 and he was talking already of GT6 and possible timeframes.

 

[Organ-Donor]

LOL GT6, i hope my grand children can play it in their life time.

I had enough of waiting for GT5 (and i hope that finally comes out this year) i dont want think about GT6.
Not far ago Kazz said it will be take about 2 years after GT5, i laughed a lot because he was not even done with GT5 and he was talking already of GT6 and possible timeframes.

Ok.

 

[The_Paladin]

Ok.

Yep, lets enjoy GT5 for a few years before start thinking about GT6.

 

[Vincent Viceroy]

👍 to those who agreed

To be fair...that's pretty good.

And what relevance has GTA:IV to GT5? Get that crap outta here. We are talking about sim racing games...not adventure games. The tech is not at all comparable considering the subject matter.


OK...can we now agree that this is a step forward in damage technology for racing sims on console?*



*this is what I was actually getting at. FORUM FAIL!

 

[RedOak]

And what relevance has GTA:IV to GT5? Get that crap outta here. We are talking about sim racing games...not adventure games. The tech is not at all comparable considering the subject matter.

Actually, its got everything to do with this Thread; which is about damage on car models.

GTA4 makes due in rendering AI NPCs, Driving NPCs (that actually make a good effort at trying to get away from you), visual FX, a whole freakin' city in streaming memory and car damage that's more convincing than Forza Motorsport 3... its got every right to be in here.

.

A note about "real time" damage...

The correct industry term is "Procedural damage". And that stuff, no game in the industry does it really. They are all pre-rendered, including GTA4. Its just that some games do it very well and have up to 250 position for damage and so, can "procedurally" develop damage models from pieces. What basically happens is the point(s) of impact calls for its damage model version and starts to deform from there through whatever calculation they need (be it physical dispersion (simulated of course) or simply "closest point to" and so on. So most of the time, you don't get the same result because the point of impact differs slightly. This is how FlatOut, GRID and DIRT2 does it as examples. I'm sure that's how GTA4 does it as well.

 

[Vincent Viceroy]

Actually, its got everything to do with this Thread; which is about damage on car models.

I've never understood why people associate cross genre technologies with each other. GT5 and GTA are doing completely different things. There is absolutely no need to compare one with the other. Also you've got to consider the cars you drive around in Liberty City are fake so you can do what you want with them.

I mean we could go stupid here...the drivers in GT5 don't use the Euphoria engine so the animations aren't as good. It doesn't work like that.

I dunno...I'm just not at all comfortable comparing technology from two games that serve two completely different purposes.

 

[patriotzero]

GT6 damage concept teaser trailer not in-game.

 

[Smoke&Slide]

Patriotz where did you find that ThunderHill raceway vid ?.

 

[patriotzero]

in official site

 

[AleksandarSRB]

GT6 damage concept teaser trailer not in-game.

lol

 

[Spagetti69]

^ Thats online isn't it?

 

[regnar]

I been a races like this before, the flag marshals should have been communicating with the others marshals further up the track to throw the flag. the drivers where still racing up to the wreck with no warning.

 

[Dravonic]

I've never understood why people associate cross genre technologies with each other. GT5 and GTA are doing completely different things. There is absolutely no need to compare one with the other. Also you've got to consider the cars you drive around in Liberty City are fake so you can do what you want with them.

I mean we could go stupid here...the drivers in GT5 don't use the Euphoria engine so the animations aren't as good. It doesn't work like that.

I dunno...I'm just not at all comfortable comparing technology from two games that serve two completely different purposes.

Lets see... cars in GTAIV deform depending on how you crash them. Cars in GT5 deform depending how you crash them. Why can't we compare them again? I can't really understand. Both have damage and people are comparing the damage both have, without considering anything else. It doesn't matter that they are different kinds of games. Both have cars, both have dynamic damage, so you can compare the damage in one game, with the damage in the other game. No problem.

 

[Vincent Viceroy]

Lets see... cars in GTAIV deform depending on how you crash them. Cars in GT5 deform depending how you crash them. Why can't we compare them again? I can't really understand. Both have damage and people are comparing the damage both have, without considering anything else. It doesn't matter that they are different kinds of games. Both have cars, both have dynamic damage, so you can compare the damage in one game, with the damage in the other game. No problem.

I don't remember anyone comparing Forza 3 damage with GTA:IV. There's simply no need.

Like I said driver animation would be better if PD used the Euphoria engine. While we are at it why don't we compare Burnoutaradise as well. I mean that's another game that doesn't use real manufacturers but has extraordinary damage modelling.

This is just stupid.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

I don't remember anyone comparing Forza 3 damage with GTA:IV. There's simply no need.

...are we supposed to?

Like I said driver animation would be better if PD used the Euphoria engine. While we are at it why don't we compare Burnoutaradise as well. I mean that's another game that doesn't use real manufacturers but has extraordinary damage modelling.

This is just stupid.

It actually makes perfect sense. Nobody is arguing that GTA had unlicensed cars, meaning they could smash to their hearts content, but, they did have real-time damage modeling, and that particular aspect, of how it was done and how it affected the game's performance using the system's capabilities, can be discussed. From what I remember playing that game though, there was definite slowdown when you'd end up in a pretty big wreck. The crash physics were pretty impressive though, if probably more severe than what we can expect from (most) cars in GT5.

There's no sense in limiting comparisons, when relevant, to just the one genre. There are breakthroughs in development in other genres that can benefit GT, say the lighting/shading/general atmosphere shown in games like Heavy Rain and Alan Wake. I know I'd be amazed if we got some weather that showed realistic, top-of-the-morning light fog on the track .

 

[Vincent Viceroy]

So, for example, would you think it's OK for reviews to criticise GT5 for not having a damage model like GTA:IV or, to the extreme, like Burnoutaradise? Wouldn't it be more objective to use contemporaries like Forza, Race Pro, Ferrari & Supercar Challenge?

I mean that would send a chill down my spine if they started to compare damage, weather systems and other effects from a different genre to GT5.

Maybe it's just me then but it seems, in terms of relevance, out of place.

 

[witham]

So, for example, would you think it's OK for reviews to criticise GT5 for not having a damage model like GTA:IV or, to the extreme, like Burnoutaradise? Wouldn't it be more objective to use contemporaries like Forza, Race Pro, Ferrari & Supercar Challenge?

I mean that would send a chill down my spine if they started to compare damage, weather systems and other effects from a different genre to GT5.

Maybe it's just me then but it seems, in terms of relevance, out of place.

No I agree with you

 

[Killinator]

On the point of the latest NASCAR crash vid, I don't know too much about NASCAR but should the hood be seperating like that, are there seperate panels on a NASCAR racecar like that or is the body all completley one piece?

 

[Forgetful]

Their hoods work.

 

[analog]

So, for example, would you think it's OK for reviews to criticise GT5 for not having a damage model like GTA:IV or, to the extreme, like Burnoutaradise? Wouldn't it be more objective to use contemporaries like Forza, Race Pro, Ferrari & Supercar Challenge?

I mean that would send a chill down my spine if they started to compare damage, weather systems and other effects from a different genre to GT5.

Maybe it's just me then but it seems, in terms of relevance, out of place.

How is this inappropriate or not relevant, I guess it's somewhat the same as comparing special-effects in movies of a different genre and how they do it or isn't it?
All these movies tell a different story and have different budgets and priorities but you can compare and learn from similar aspects ( or at least the different or even similar technique they might use ).
Nobody's going to compare all aspects of a game like GTA to GT as they are indeed different with different priorities and limitations ( like nobody's going to compare movies from completely different genres ).
And as for reviewers making comparisons which might be deemed unfair, that's up to them and for you to decide whether you agree with it or not.

 

[Devedander]

On the point of the latest NASCAR crash vid, I don't know too much about NASCAR but should the hood be seperating like that, are there seperate panels on a NASCAR racecar like that or is the body all completley one piece?

The hood is a seperate piece.

Damange in that NASCAR video is very nice looking if a bit muted. All the more shame that leve of damage is reserved for only some of the cars...

 

[SlipZtrEm]

So, for example, would you think it's OK for reviews to criticise GT5 for not having a damage model like GTA:IV or, to the extreme, like Burnoutaradise? Wouldn't it be more objective to use contemporaries like Forza, Race Pro, Ferrari & Supercar Challenge?

I mean that would send a chill down my spine if they started to compare damage, weather systems and other effects from a different genre to GT5.

Maybe it's just me then but it seems, in terms of relevance, out of place.

Ah, two different situations, in my eyes. For an actual review, talking specifically about how GT stacks up to other racing games? Yeah, it'd make sense to compare to other sims. But like what Analog said; some things can (and should, imo) be compared cross-genre, basic pieces that apply to almost any genre. Most games have some sort of damage or destruction engineered in; GTA's is similar to what GT's goal is, so it does make sense to at least look at how both teams approached real-time damage. If this means we can have a swing set that launches us a few blocks in GT...

It's why I mentioned Heavy Rain and Alan Wake. Absolutely should not be compared on a game-to-game basis, but certain aspects of those games (the dedication to providing a specific atmosphere) is impressive, and that same level of dedication would never be shunned if included in GT, at least not that I can imagine.

 

[Vincent Viceroy]

OK...so I'll bow out of this now HOWEVER GTA:IV still doesn't deserve to be compared to GT5.

If you want to talk about how damage should be implemented you need to talk Burnoutaradise

 

[johan.liebert]

I wonder if there are any car explosions in this game. Yes i know it sounds like something out of a micheal bay horrible accident but i curious are there those hidden items in the damages for the cars.