The Xbox One Thread - One X & One SXBOne 

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Scaff
Can you provide a source for the PS4 having DRM?

If not then its a may not a will.
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Ok, fair point. But it's very unlikely that with MS having opened the door with the copy of Watchtower that Sony will not follow through. If someone can come up with an alternative to DRM (bearing in mind you don't need the disc to play the game), I'm sure MS would love to here it. But I guess you're right, at the moment it's a may not a will, but all I'm saying is don't be surprised come E3.

Scaff
In regard to the Kinect camera from what I have read to date it has to be plugged in and you can't switch it off or mute it, if you have a source for MS saying otherwise that would be great (honestly - because that's a major issue for me).
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http://uk.gamespot.com/features/xbox-one-microsofts-phil-spencer-talks-used-games-always-on-6408725/

When the interviewer starts talking about playing Skyrim and talking to his girlfriend:

Interviewer - And I start talking to my girlfriend who was with me at the time and I mention the guy who I'm seeing in the game and he comes out of the speakers and he can hear everything I'm saying because the Kinect is plugged in. Are there going to be options to kind of turn off all of this?

Phil Spencer - You definitely will have the software capability to turn off all the capabilities of Kinect. We want to put the gamer in control. And privacy. The box data information that collects is your data; it stays with you. You are in control of what you want to be collected. Game developers will obviously enable certain features and you'll be alerted when certain things are happening. Putting the gamer in control is really important.

Scaff
Whatever the solution is for Fanatec its not going to be free for owners of current wheels, and right now its stopping at least one person buying a wheel form them.

Its also entirely possible that MS has moved to another wheel provider (as Sony did moving from Logitec to Thrustmaster), which could also explain Fanatec being silent on the issue, as acknowledging that would kill all 360 wheel sales overnight.
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I'm in exactly the same boat as you. I was going to buy one of the Forza CSR XL packages as a birthday present to myself, but I think I'll wait until we hear something from Fanatec before I commit to buying any wheel.

Scaff
Its a discussion forum, that means (as long as the AUP is followed) people from both sides get to have a say. That I can assure you is not going to change.
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And nor would I ever want it to. The freedom of speech is one of the greatest things we have (despite the Labour Government trying to stop it), and I fully welcome a discussion that is balanced and fair. However, there comes a point at which nothing new is added to the discussion and unfortunately becomes nothing more that yammering. I'm not saying that the thread should shut down until we have new information, but going over the same old points won't change it.

Jawehawk
Sony already stated that they are leaving used games for developers/puplishers to decide what to do with. You just take whatever is thrown at you, without speaking out when a company goes too far? If everyone did that, gaming would be completely ruined by now.
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I get what your saying, but you are complaining about things that cannot be changed. DRM is a software issue, people are complaining and it's being resolved. Kinect camera always on is a software issue, people are complaining, and it's being resolved. Always online is a software issue, people are complaining, and it's being resolved. But the RAM, HDD size, TV passthrough, controllers, etc. are hardware issues, and this late in development, are not going to change.

Feedback is an important part of a products development cycle, and one could argue, quite successfully, that should have been spread further through the existing Xbox community. However, these features have been unveiled too late in the development of the community. Perhaps (and thus is unlikely but possible), MS will allow developers the option of shutting down one of the OSes to free up memory for the game. But we shall see, there are still a few months to go for things like that to emerge.
 
DG_Silva
I get what your saying, but you are complaining about things that cannot be changed. DRM is a software issue, people are complaining and it's being resolved. Kinect camera always on is a software issue, people are complaining, and it's being resolved. Always online is a software issue, people are complaining, and it's being resolved. But the RAM, HDD size, TV passthrough, controllers, etc. are hardware issues, and this late in development, are not going to change.

Feedback is an important part of a products development cycle, and one could argue, quite successfully, that should have been spread further through the existing Xbox community. However, these features have been unveiled too late in the development of the community. Perhaps (and thus is unlikely but possible), MS will allow developers the option of shutting down one of the OSes to free up memory for the game. But we shall see, there are still a few months to go for things like that to emerge.
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You are partially right. Yes, some of the complaints are about things that can't be changed at this staged. And if it's not consumer friendly, then that's a good thing that we're complaining about it. It lets other companies (in this case, that would be Sony) that we won't stand for stuff like that. If the XBOX One is as bad as it currently appears, and still achieves great sales, then Sony (and MS) will have no reason not to pull the same crap next generation (I realise that we haven't heard everything about the PS4 yet).
If it doesn't do well in sales, then they'll have to remake their products into more consumer friendly products.

And people are right to be upset with how the XBOX One appears at the moment. It forces Kinect (which means a higher price) on to consumers, despite the majority (guisstimate) not being interested in it. It currently looks like it will demand users to connect online at least once every 24 hours, which makes no sense for those not interested in online features. Then there's the whole DRM/used game thing, which is essentially taking one of the worst things about PC gaming, and applying it to consoles. It's punishing the people who bought your products, while at the same time not stopping those who want to obtain it in illigal ways, from doing so.

Then there's the complete neglect of anything but the American market... IN A WORLDWIDE PRESS RELEASE!
 
DG_Silva
Ok, fair point. But it's very unlikely that with MS having opened the door with the copy of Watchtower that Sony will not follow through. If someone can come up with an alternative to DRM (bearing in mind you don't need the disc to play the game), I'm sure MS would love to here it. But I guess you're right, at the moment it's a may not a will, but all I'm saying is don't be surprised come E3.
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Sony have been bitten hard by DRM in the past (CD's on PC) as such I'm not quite so sure they want to head in that direction again (but they may).

A solution for MS? Well what about simply needing to pop the disc in? Works perfectly well on the 360 right now, all my games are installed and I've never found it a problem to pop the disc in. What MS have come up with is a solution to a problem that need not exist, simply because they want to force control of the (very profitable) second hand market back to publishers.

Does a house builder or a car manufacturer get a cut once a house or car is sold on again?


DG_Silva
http://uk.gamespot.com/features/xbox-one-microsofts-phil-spencer-talks-used-games-always-on-6408725/

When the interviewer starts talking about playing Skyrim and talking to his girlfriend:

Interviewer - And I start talking to my girlfriend who was with me at the time and I mention the guy who I'm seeing in the game and he comes out of the speakers and he can hear everything I'm saying because the Kinect is plugged in. Are there going to be options to kind of turn off all of this?

Phil Spencer - You definitely will have the software capability to turn off all the capabilities of Kinect. We want to put the gamer in control. And privacy. The box data information that collects is your data; it stays with you. You are in control of what you want to be collected. Game developers will obviously enable certain features and you'll be alerted when certain things are happening. Putting the gamer in control is really important.
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Its a step in the right direction, but its still not 100% clear to me what you can and can't turn off an when?
 
Imari
You're full of bright and helpful ideas, aren't you?
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Sure
Eks
I shouldn't have to, that's the thing.
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You either delete stuff, buy a bigger HDD, stop buying more games or simply don't let the Xbox One come into your house.

It's really not that hard. For it's at the moment the latter of the things above.
 
I am struggling to think of a reason for forcing full game installs without the need for a disc except to make the used game system make sense.

PS3 load times from disc were not that much worse than 360 and the new Blu Ray drives in both machines are 6x where the PS3 was 2x which means a theoretical 3x quicker read rate. I'm sure that will be ample and Sony certainly seem to think so.
 
Reason for forcing full game installs = We want money from them used games user betches! Period.

Hope that breaks M$`s neck. For sure M$ (same as Nintendo and Sony) is a company that wants to make money. And I am totally okay with that. But to me it looks like M$ just can`t get enough. And they deserve any negative feedback on the internet.

Oh they are collecting for the publishers? For sure... (irony). Bet M$ gets a nice cut from it.

Sony now has all possibilities to win next gen console war.
 
Earth
One key point that separates the PS4 from the Xbox One is game installation. You have to install the entire game to the Xbox One hard drive from the disc. After that the game will run from the HDD without the need of the disc. Obviously thats going to cause problems if there isn't strict pass codes and online DRM.

As far as we know, PS4 games do not have to be completely installed on the HDD. That means the games have to play off of the disc, so DRM isnt a necessary requirement
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You can fully install games on the 360 but it checks to see if the disc is in the drive before it lets you play the game. I would much rather have this method than online checks. I also really dislike the notion that I can't lend a game to a friend at let them try it.

Of course the big issue for me is the Fanatec wheel support.

The DRM I feel is a very bad thing and I am strongly against it on principal though it would have very little effect on me if any I still don't like it and have a hard time paying money that will support this method but if they do not do something about the wheel support that is a definite deal breaker.
 
dr_slump
Sure

You either delete stuff, buy a bigger HDD, stop buying more games or simply don't let the Xbox One come into your house.

It's really not that hard. For it's at the moment the latter of the things above.
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You're ignoring the point that some people WANT to buy a One to play the exclusive Xbox games they like but are put off by these features, and that's why they're voicing their concerns. Just telling them to not buy it doesn't really help them.
 
Samus
You're ignoring the point that some people WANT to buy a One to play the exclusive Xbox games they like but are put off by these features, and that's why they're voicing their concerns. Just telling them to not buy it doesn't really help them.
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People want many things, generally too many.
dice1998
External HDD's are supported, supposedly.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/21/...utm_source=Feed_Classic&utm_campaign=Engadget
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What if you open the console and replace it? Just wondering...
 
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dr_slump
People want many things, generally too many.

What if you open the console and replace it? Just wondering...
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Warranty void and at this stage it's impossible to know if it would work. There may be security to make sure it only works with the original drive, nobody knows at this stage.
 
Or what if it's like, not removable. I think "hard wired" is the term, like it's a permanent wire connecting the HDD and console.
 
I expect Sony to do something similar to MS with the DRM. If they don't well good for them but its probably a publisher demand too by Activision and EA etc and they're just seeing how far they can push it and letting it sink in for you guys.

Certainly going to be an interesting E3
 
chromatic9
I expect Sony to do something similar to MS with the DRM. If they don't well good for them but its probably a publisher demand too by Activision and EA etc and they're just seeing how far they can push it and letting it sink in for you guys.

Certainly going to be an interesting E3
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Sony already stated that they are leaving all things regarding used games to the individual puplishers. In other words, they aren't enforcing any global DRM on the PS4. Unless of course they change their original statement.
 
DG_Silva
Ok, fair point. But it's very unlikely that with MS having opened the door with the copy of Watchtower that Sony will not follow through. If someone can come up with an alternative to DRM (bearing in mind you don't need the disc to play the game), I'm sure MS would love to here it. But I guess you're right, at the moment it's a may not a will, but all I'm saying is don't be surprised come E3.
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You're talking like a ruined woman. "My husband did it to me so you better be sure as hell that yours will do the same to you!"

What then, when PS4 is confirmed to have no such thing? Will you be the surprised one? "Because they did it too," is one of the weakest arguments you could ever put up.


DG_Silva
http://uk.gamespot.com/features/xbox-one-microsofts-phil-spencer-talks-used-games-always-on-6408725/

When the interviewer starts talking about playing Skyrim and talking to his girlfriend:

Interviewer - And I start talking to my girlfriend who was with me at the time and I mention the guy who I'm seeing in the game and he comes out of the speakers and he can hear everything I'm saying because the Kinect is plugged in. Are there going to be options to kind of turn off all of this?

Phil Spencer - You definitely will have the software capability to turn off all the capabilities of Kinect. We want to put the gamer in control. And privacy. The box data information that collects is your data; it stays with you. You are in control of what you want to be collected. Game developers will obviously enable certain features and you'll be alerted when certain things are happening. Putting the gamer in control is really important.
Click to expand...

Dude, you can't seriously believe everything these people are saying after all the lies and backhanded actions they've done in the past (along with most every other corporation to be fair). They're just telling you what you want to hear and you're taking it and running away to show all of us like it's the answer we've all been waiting for. Like, " OH MAN! That MS representative said we don't have to worry! Such an ease off my mind! HALLELOOO."
No, this guy's bull****.

The point is, if they really wanted to put your privacy first, and really cared about giving control to their consumers, they wouldn't have forced us to have the Kinect plugged in in the first place!

That's where control begins and ends, wake up. Jesus christ.

DG_Silva
And nor would I ever want it to. The freedom of speech is one of the greatest things we have (despite the Labour Government trying to stop it), and I fully welcome a discussion that is balanced and fair. However, there comes a point at which nothing new is added to the discussion and unfortunately becomes nothing more that yammering. I'm not saying that the thread should shut down until we have new information, but going over the same old points won't change it.
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You gotta realize there's more than just the first few batch of people that've spilled their guts on these issues that want to come and give their feedback, it just seems like this bothers you because you've stubbornly decided to support Microsoft and they've given you absolutely nothing to defend with.

Going over the same points over and over is quite important. It brings up new perspectives we didn't see before, new information's posted everyday, people's different situations can be voiced (as far as country, room environment, internet capability, etc.). I mean, it's just obvious.

And sorry if we're trying to inform people on their purchases, some guys come in here looking for a few words to help their decision between PS4 and Xbone. Yeah, it's still early, and they would know that. Don't act like people that are on the fence shouldn't be even thinking about purchasing until E3, 'cause that's just not how things work.

DG_Silva
I get what your saying, but you are complaining about things that cannot be changed. DRM is a software issue, people are complaining and it's being resolved. Kinect camera always on is a software issue, people are complaining, and it's being resolved. Always online is a software issue, people are complaining, and it's being resolved. But the RAM, HDD size, TV passthrough, controllers, etc. are hardware issues, and this late in development, are not going to change.

Feedback is an important part of a products development cycle, and one could argue, quite successfully, that should have been spread further through the existing Xbox community. However, these features have been unveiled too late in the development of the community. Perhaps (and thus is unlikely but possible), MS will allow developers the option of shutting down one of the OSes to free up memory for the game. But we shall see, there are still a few months to go for things like that to emerge.
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This is one of the most blindly optimistic posts I've seen in a while.

MS will change nothing, this is what they want.
 
I hope they do change some thing or that the info we have is inaccurate because it they have no support for existing wheels and they are using the DRM and always on kinect then my feed back will come in the form of canceling my XBox Live subscription and not buying the new hardware nor any games for XBox
 
HKS racer
NO support for existing wheels??? And people with the CSR Elite? Screwed?
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At the moment this seems to be the case. Poor guys! :lol:
I don't know what wireless protocol the Xbox was using, just that it was some sort of proprietary (hardware based?) encrypted wireless (2.4ghz?) protocoll. The new Xbox doesn't seem to support this... so yeah, doesn't look great so far.


But hey, the Xbox One does have USB ports and the CSR Elite does have a USB cable (originally meant for PS3 and PC uses).

Perhaps (and I'm pretty sure this will be the case) they make it possible to connect it via USB with the Xbox One? Shouldn't be a task of the impossibility since the wheel is supposed to work with a simple PC.
May not be as comfortable as wireless, but who cares.

Ooooor, MS is again greedy minded and brings out some sort of Xbox360 periphery receiver (except for controller, of course).
Something like this: http://www.gamepadproxy.com/support/?d=7&p=205


Forza 5 will be present at the E3. I see big chances that they show us a possible solution for this problem. :)
 
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dr_slump
But hey, the Xbox One does have USB ports and the CSR Elite does have a USB cable (originally meant for PS3 and PC uses).

Perhaps (and I'm pretty sure this will be the case) they make it possible to connect it via USB with the Xbox One? Shouldn't be a task of the impossibility since the wheel is supposed to work with a simple PC.
May not be as comfortable as wireless, but who cares.
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If that's the case, the Xbone would also then be able to support Logitech wheels and Thrustmaster. Probably not gonna happen, the 360 used a different, proprietary, protocol called XID. Then there's also Xinput, which is a proprietary API that allows PCs to talk to 360 controllers.

Fanatecs' wheels used XID wireless to connect to the 360 (you can't use a wired connection) and an HID (universal protocol) USB connection for the PS3 and PC. In order for it to be able to even "talk" to the 360 it needed a proprietary RF module with a security chip in it and this RF module will be changed for the Xbone as has been reported. MS takes their security very seriously and they're not known for liking backwards compatibility, so I doubt it can work at all.

As you said though, MS could work on some sort of adapter solution at cost.
 
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