Tips on Driving without TCS

  • Thread starter Khannie
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Sometimes, what actually makes me spin is not the lack of traction control or not primarily my throttle control. Is the back end sliding because of trail braking. I tend to use Brake Balance more to the rear end, so it slides more. It’s good... and it’s bad. Lol
Maybe that’s happening to you too.
 
The guys here have given some good advice. i ain't experienced enough to provide anything further on driving without tcs. Apart from don't use csa when trying to learn simply jump into the deep end you'll get the hang of it. Below would be helpful in learning to deal with oversteer while trying drive without tcs.


Best of luck mate, I use a G29 only aid i have on is default abs I get fed up by spinning or being touched from behind and losing traction. But as a regular top10 guy who drives with the same aids i do once said 'winners never quit and quitters never win'

Thanks for re-posting this Monkey.

It seems as though it is hard to grasp when you put this stuff in to words, so the only way it might start to be understandable is to persevere with difficult cars, like the M6 GT3. Also, it's up to the users to kit themselves out with the proper hardware to begin sim racing with (sorry, I'm assuming most controllers in sim racing are like attempting heart surgery wearing boxing gloves, as no one it seems has produced a controller comparable to a wheel yet).

Prevention is better than cure..and no pain, no gain, so practice without the assists.
 
Sometimes, what actually makes me spin is not the lack of traction control or not primarily my throttle control. Is the back end sliding because of trail braking. I tend to use Brake Balance more to the rear end, so it slides more. It’s good... and it’s bad. Lol
Maybe that’s happening to you too.

This is a good tip. If you have a high + brake balance and release the brake fast it will make your car spin. You need to manage your turn in and ease off the pedal.
 
Happy to report that I drove my first clean race without TCS in the M4 yesterday at Bathurst with no spin outs and actually improved a few spots from 16th to 10th.

I’m comfortable with most Gr.4 cars with no TCS but still not consistent with the Gr.3 cars just yet. Thanks to all for the tips!
 
Those using controller, try to motion control. At least the movements are not jerky. Then move to tcs 0 on Race A. If you handle it, then move to GR4...then GR3
 
Worth noting that most gt3 cars have TCS now, so actually turning it off is less real...

However.... GTs TCS is so heavy handed that it requires different approaches anyway, you can leave it on and not lose speed if you drive like it’s off, the only time it interferes is when you start drifting or losing control and it will attempt to slow you.

I’ve found out that certain cars actually need it to stay stable where as others aren’t reliant on it.

All down to your general feeling and skill level.

I’ve driven for years on Pcars, AC, F1 and Iracing without TCS or Abs, PD just seemed to have gone their own way with it.
 
However.... GTs TCS is so heavy handed that it requires different approaches anyway, you can leave it on and not lose speed if you drive like it’s off, the only time it interferes is when you start drifting or losing control and it will attempt to slow you.

This isn't really true, even TCS on 1 in GT:Sport it really interferes with exit speed. To achieve the optimal exit speed with TCS off you almost do little micro-slides.
You really notice it on lower speed corners where TCS interferes so much, if a driver with TCS is behind one without TCS and they both get optimal exits, the non TCS driver will be significantly faster out of the corner.

CSA on weak actually acts a lot more like how TCS should, unfortunately GT:Sports physics don't really get that.
 
I don’t know how anyone can be competitive using motion control. To me it feels like trying to drive a car with the wheel not attached. No sense of center and counter steering is a crap shoot.

I could understand why people used it at launch when countersteer on the stick was deadly, but that was fixed at the end of October. People who advocate it seem to be those who claim Gr1 on controller is 'impossible' when it's actually probably my strongest category as a DS4 user :lol:
 
I don’t know how anyone can be competitive using motion control. To me it feels like trying to drive a car with the wheel not attached. No sense of center and counter steering is a crap shoot.
I could understand why people used it at launch when countersteer on the stick was deadly, but that was fixed at the end of October. People who advocate it seem to be those who claim Gr1 on controller is 'impossible' when it's actually probably my strongest category as a DS4 user :lol:
I have used motion control since i bought the game early november. Ive been advocating for DS4 users to use this since I found it myself. I dont use any aids anymore and MS is no problem with any car that I drive. On top of that, my most successful tracks/car combos is the GR.1 and Gr 3. Porsches on Suzuka and Yamagawa. So there is no reason why MS should limit anyone to specific car classes.

Counter steering is easy (and from what i read it is easier than with a wheel) also due to the short distance between full steering locks. If you just play with the controller flat and tip it either direction to steer then return back to flat, you have a good idea of where center is.
 
I have used motion control since i bought the game early november. Ive been advocating for DS4 users to use this since I found it myself. I dont use any aids anymore and MS is no problem with any car that I drive. On top of that, my most successful tracks/car combos is the GR.1 and Gr 3. Porsches on Suzuka and Yamagawa. So there is no reason why MS should limit anyone to specific car classes.

Counter steering is easy (and from what i read it is easier than with a wheel) also due to the short distance between full steering locks. If you just play with the controller flat and tip it either direction to steer then return back to flat, you have a good idea of where center is.
To each their own. I’m so much faster and consistent using the left stick for steering. With or without aids.
 
To each their own. I’m so much faster and consistent using the left stick for steering. With or without aids.
A wheel would be much better no doubt (for me MS is the next best thing), but I love the smoothness that comes from the motion steering. Feels natural, and when I used the sticks I found that I would tip the controller anyways :lol:
 
A wheel would be much better no doubt (for me MS is the next best thing), but I love the smoothness that comes from the motion steering. Feels natural, and when I used the sticks I found that I would tip the controller anyways :lol:
Wheel is ideal. I had the T150 pro and a nice setup. But multiple shoulder injuries from sport when I was young left me in significant pain after a short period of racing. I wish I could have used it longer but I’m content with a DS4. Able to maintain A/S without much trouble.
 
This isn't really true, even TCS on 1 in GT:Sport it really interferes with exit speed. To achieve the optimal exit speed with TCS off you almost do little micro-slides.
You really notice it on lower speed corners where TCS interferes so much, if a driver with TCS is behind one without TCS and they both get optimal exits, the non TCS driver will be significantly faster out of the corner.

CSA on weak actually acts a lot more like how TCS should, unfortunately GT:Sports physics don't really get that.


You read too much into this, I merely said you can do it and not lose speed, in certain cars this is impossible, but there are a lot of cars that the TCS system on 1 does not interfere unless you’re tonking the power on exit. I’m not saying that it’s right or wrong, merely that GTsport has its own way of providing TCS.

I’m usually quicker (once tuned in) without TCS, but in GTSport, it feels like a requirement in some cases, especially the way some cars are digitally stabilised nowadays too.
 
My advice for you if you want to drive faster is not driving without TC, but with TC. You will be significant slower without TC.
If you dont belive me try your self, pick a track and do it with TC 2 and without TC. What are you fastest with?
I already have the answer its faster with TC 2 for you.

This my advice for any one that cant drive without TC and its thats simple and the purpose of TC is bacause every one cant drive without TC.

My user name is "eliasbarca6" you can see on kudosprime that at the moment I'm top B driver, but my actually level is mid A. You can see I made an DR reset, just to have some more fun. I even once had DR S, but that was using the glitch, not on purpose.
And I´m on my way back to my where I belong around mid A.

And you know what. I almost always have TC on 2, so that I´m sure that is possible to reach driver rating score 40.000 with tc on 2.
Of course it´s easy to drive without TC with FF cars and AWD.

Driving without TC is not something learned in few days or weeks, it´s months or maybe years.
And here comes the trick and important one.
Use TC but drive the car like you don´t have TC on, dont let TC kick in when you drive. If you can do/learn that you will be "almost" as fast as driving without.

I example do that, but I cant drive race C Suzuka with 11 laps with out one mistake, so i have the TC one to save me from spinning out, we all now its more ore less require only 1 spin out and the race is game over.

But some of you are right, TC on some sections/corners on some circuits is just bad. Like Suzuka last highspeed corner where its almost possible to take it flat out, TC kick in where you will not spin out if you did´nt have TC on and here you really losing time. Another example is Dragon trail where the highspeed left, right left corners getting TC to kick in unnecessary and you again lose time. And there is plenty of examples like this, most of those situations i put TC on 0 on the fly and again turn TC on 2 when I´m past those corners.

And how can you learn to drive like you don´t have TC on even if you have it on.
On every opportunity you have when you are not in race put TC on 0, you know every time you waiting for race to start. If you make faster qual times with TC on, put TC on make fast Qual time and use the rest of the time to train without TC.

All you people that thinking the difference between you and the Dr s people is TC, is wrong.
There is much more time to gain when focusing on other things like racing line, smoothness, weight distribution, corner entry, exit speed. finding the apex, trail braking and so on. Keep looking on the videos from top 10 there is gold there.

If you are not ready for driving without TC and start to drive without, all your focus will be on not spinning out and you will loose the opportunity to focus on other racing techniques like i wrote few lines up.

Let me say it like this "Our time to drive without TC will come, but its not now"

Every day i become a better driver, every day i getting better to drive the car Without TC kicking in, and many thanks for the guy that invented TC.
TC made me become a better driver, TC is my best friend, She i always there when i need her.

Let her in your life, so you can put your focus somewhere else.
 
Sounds like a love letter at the end there :)

👍

Yes, a lot of the people seeing the TC as something bad and its not bad for every one. Accept it and love it because some of us has to live with it.
At least to we find something better.

The love thing is just a point :-)
 
Yes, a lot of the people seeing the TC as something bad and its not bad for every one. Accept it and love it because some of us has to live with it.
At least to we find something better.

The love thing is just a point :-)
I have to use it on the gr. 3 and 4 rwd cars... on number 2. 1 seems to make no difference at all.

I had never considered driving as if it was off though, as you suggest... I will try tonight
 
I might be a good case study for you to compare yourself to.

I had some minor racing experience in GT4, but I was never very good.
I got GT:Sport when it came out and was using a DS4 (I just switched to a wheel about a week ago).
I raced with TCS on 2/3, and was middle of the pack DR.B, I mostly only raced GR.4 races.

Eventually I would drop my TCS down to 1, and I would qualify for races with TCS on 0, once you get used to TCS off you realize how aggressive you can be with the throttle with GR.4 cars before they spin out.
I eventually moved up to DR.A
I was also using CSA on weak at this time.

Then a tournament popped up for Canadians, and I practiced really hard for it. The tournament didn't allow TCS, and didn't allow CSA either (no assists).
This was when I basically went cold turkey and removed all of the assists.

Now I race with no assists, and I drive all of the cars.

You get used to it pretty fast when you remove TCS, you learn that the throttle is to be applied progressively - and it's not an on/off button, learning how to feather a throttle also helps with learning how to throttle a brake.

Now I'm high DR. A nearly DR. S - and am always driving with no assists.
 
I have tried turning it off in qualifying in group 4 but I lose more time in just waiting to be pointed forward before hitting the throttle that it's better to just leave it on. For now. I will keep trying...
 
I have tried turning it off in qualifying in group 4 but I lose more time in just waiting to be pointed forward before hitting the throttle that it's better to just leave it on. For now. I will keep trying...

The amount of throttle you can apply is directly related to the amount of steering angle you currently have.
Watch the top replays and watch how the throttle progressively builds as they exit the corner, you don't have to be perfectly straight before you can power down.

I'll find you a good example.
 
The amount of throttle you can apply is directly related to the amount of steering angle you currently have.
Watch the top replays and watch how the throttle progressively builds as they exit the corner, you don't have to be perfectly straight before you can power down.

I'll find you a good example.

I have been practising that too, actually... it's quite difficult on a controller with about 1cm of travel though...
 
Sometimes, what actually makes me spin is not the lack of traction control or not primarily my throttle control. Is the back end sliding because of trail braking. I tend to use Brake Balance more to the rear end, so it slides more. It’s good... and it’s bad. Lol
Maybe that’s happening to you too.
This is a good tip. If you have a high + brake balance and release the brake fast it will make your car spin. You need to manage your turn in and ease off the pedal.

I can't help but think these insights were gleaned from a certain recent Canadian event... ;)

@Khannie - my advice would be to try to focus on the relationship between your steering angle and throttle angle. In the faster stuff like Gr.3, it can be very easy to overwhelm the rear tires because you've got too much lock on. After a while you'll realize you can start unwinding lock earlier than you might've thought, and feed the throttle in smoothly alongside doing so.

In Gr.4, I find the Cayman and GT86 two very good training cars. They can take a lot of abuse before letting go, and the relative lack of torque makes them more resistant to wagging the tail mid-corner.
 
I have been practising that too, actually... it's quite difficult on a controller with about 1cm of travel though...

I mean it's only until recently that I switched to a wheel, before that I was using a controller (stick controls, not motion - R2/L2 gas & brake & manual).

It takes awhile to get used to, but with a little determination you'll quickly figure it out - nothing teaches you how to control the throttle better than spinning out...
 
I don’t use it with Gr4 cars and below...
I use on the go with Gr3 and Porsche 919 (the Gr1 Mazda is safe to drive with TC-0)...
Depending on how much I know the track and comfortable I do the turns I lower the TC also during race if I’m being pressured by other drivers or if I need to pressure someone I increase the TC

A good way to learn and test is time trials and Arcade races

Also as suggested above you should play with B.B. . On Gr4 cars, because I don’t is TC anymore, I’m now playing with the B.B. during the race depending on the track and turns...

I’m still learning and trying to improve but what helps me a lot are the top 10 replays and the race replay (specially the races where aliens are) and see how other driver did...
 
I mean it's only until recently that I switched to a wheel, before that I was using a controller (stick controls, not motion - R2/L2 gas & brake & manual).

It takes awhile to get used to, but with a little determination you'll quickly figure it out - nothing teaches you how to control the throttle better than spinning out...
Yeah I use stick etc. too. I am practising though... I can now use the Genesis and 86 with TCS off and CSA weak. I have some way to go before I attempt the Vantage or 458 though :lol:
 
A method which works well for me is to take every corner a gear higher than what is suggested, but at the same entry speed as normal. You can stomp on the gas earlier on the exit without worrying about excessive RPM kicking the back wheels out.
 
Yeah I use stick etc. too. I am practising though... I can now use the Genesis and 86 with TCS off and CSA weak. I have some way to go before I attempt the Vantage or 458 though :lol:

The Vantage isn't too tough, but the 458 is a bit harder.
The big test comes in the GR.3 cars - those cars spin out so much easier than the gr.4's.
 
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