Tires too grippy...

  • Thread starter Thread starter GTAQV
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HBR-Roadhog
Lets not forget that in a game there is no risk of injury and that makes drivers faster than they would be in real life. I know I can crank out some good times on the ring in games but in real life I would be 1-2 minutes slower even in a car with more speed and more grip as I would be much more careful.
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A pro driver doesn't care about that, at all. When competing in anything all that self preservation aspect just disappears, doesn't exist.

Plus it would be marginal in Tsukuba in particular, with its slow corners, only one that would be meaningful times wise and every BM driver knows how to tackle them to perfection.
 
avens
A pro driver doesn't care about that, at all. When competing in anything all that self preservation aspect just disappears, doesn't exist.

Plus it would be marginal in Tsukuba in particular, with its slow corners, only one that would be meaningful times wise and every BM driver knows how to tackle them to perfection.
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Ummm don't think so... There's an ohh **** point where you know you've gone too fast. Could guarantee, you or me, or anyone else for the fact would choose to wear brown pants under the fire suits if we got the chance to drive some of the worlds fastest hyper-cars at full speed on track...
 
Depends a lot on car and track i would say (and who pays for the car when you bin it)

On a safe track with huge run off areas in a proper race car this "surviving instinct" will have no influence.

On the Nordschleife in a powerful road car no sane man will attack every corner at 100%.
 
would this grippy thing explains why on the other hand of the sports spectrum, the sprt softs are nearly slipping all the time?


Let me explain. I tried to get some highest allowed tires for a challenge ( like the wind, e.g.) and well I was ok , driving the Huarya Aroiund ssx without any major issues... that is for the two 12km straights. as soon as i tried to turn... I would lose it . with dire consequences..

I've been experiencing this with all cars I've equipped with sports Soft... what gives?
 
Spent 15 minutes testing the 458 Italia at Tsukuba... stock car with oil change (no mods, no aids, ABS 1, grip real)

Comfort softs 1:00.131
Sorts hard 58.323

Ran 11 laps on the comforts and 5 on the sports... the car would go sub 1 minute on comfort softs and sub 58s on sports hards.

It's properly challenging on comforts... it requires very precise trail braking on entry to get the nose in to the corner, balancing both front and rear grip. On exits it has as much oversteer as you'd ever want... up to and including 4th gear, so you need very good part throttle control.

On sports hards it's similar, but much, much easier to drive.

It's absolutely brilliant on comforts... intense, and exactly as I'm imagine driving a near 600bhp mid engined car on road tyres would be.
 
The tires themselves, aren't too grippy. I just believe they give some cars way too grippy of tires. For example, the GT86 comes with the same rubber as a Lamborghini Aventador on GT6, while in real life they have the same tires as a Prius, which on GT6 has CM. I downgrade most of my cars level of grip when I am driving them to have fun.
 
MOTORTRENDmitch
Obvious sarcasm. I'm saying, the tires have very little grip.
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Obvious sarcasm is wrong then. They can sustain 1g in corners with a bit of extra camber (.9g-.95g in stock form), when warm but not too warm. I cannot possibly call it 'very little grip'. They are junk in the wet/damp, I'll give you that.

That's obviously not SH, but CS would probably be appropriate.
Or CM, but then the Prius get CHs.
Need that data logger soon....
 
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MOTORTRENDmitch
Obvious sarcasm. I'm saying, the tires have very little grip.

Furthermore, rather than disagreeing with the less serious point I made, would it kill you to have agreed that I'm right in stating it doesn't have the same tires you find on a super car.
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Super car? I think not.... It's a 250Hp +/- 4 banger....
 
I'd agree that the default tires that most cars come with in GT6 have too much grip compared to their real life counterparts. I beat both the real-world Nurburgring time set by the CTS-V and the qualifying time set by the Deltawing at Le Mans by about 6 seconds each. Both cars untuned with their default tires.
 
Stotty
Strange, as all the commentary I've seen on the GT86 in the motoring press comments on the 'low grip' tyres.
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Most of the motoring press is staffed with grip junkies. It's not spectacular by any means, it's an average summer tire, but it's not terrible in the dry. It won't pull .9g in a Prius either.
 
MOTORTRENDmitch
The tires themselves, aren't too grippy. I just believe they give some cars way too grippy of tires. For example, the GT86 comes with the same rubber as a Lamborghini Aventador on GT6, while in real life they have the same tires as a Prius, which on GT6 has CM. I downgrade most of my cars level of grip when I am driving them to have fun.
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MOTORTRENDmitch
I wasn't calling the GT86 a supercar, I was saying it has the same tires as a supercar.. and if you want to be Mr. Specific, 250HP is almost 50hp too high..

Read my post over.. Do you really think I was calling the GT86 a supercar. :rolleyes:
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Tadaah.... And no I wasn't being specific as why I left the plus/minus
 
Swagger897
Tadaah.... And no I wasn't being specific as why I left the plus/minus
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He's explaining how the GT86 comes with the same tires as the Aventador. How in any way is that calling the GT86 a super car? It's really not that hard to figure out. And you highlighting parts of Mitch's posts taking them out of context does nothing to prove your point, btw.
 
HBR-Roadhog
Lets not forget that in a game there is no risk of injury and that makes drivers faster than they would be in real life. I know I can crank out some good times on the ring in games but in real life I would be 1-2 minutes slower even in a car with more speed and more grip as I would be much more careful.
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MasterFocus
59.7 for the Ferrari 458 vs 1:02 IRL isnt that bad, considering that you dont have any fear going in any curve in the game.
I'll be curious to see time made with a proper cockpit simulator with G effect and all. I bet that those time would be slighty slower than IRL.
You can only simulate to a certain point in a game that dont really let you feel those G's.
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Any normal racing driver won't be scared to push their car to the limits. Three seconds is a lifetime on Tsukuba, for your information.

To the OP, I watch BM too, and I found the times to be too quick compared to their real life counterparts, even on CS tires.
 
Ok, but, let's be honest, there's three important variables here, and we can't really know for sure without owning and driving cars with the same counter part tyres in the game.

A. How Grade/Compound performs in the game.
B. What corresponding real world compound the cars come with stock - are these defined correctly (is a sports soft really a sports hard, ect).
C. The grip level of the cars stock in game tyres, versus their real life counter parts.

It's important to realise that our lap times in the game will be faster than in real life. I have owned two cars in real life, that are also in the game, and they have what the game 'should call' comfort hard and comfort soft (Peugeot 306/307 with Michellin XM1+, and a Golf V GTI with Pirelli P7s). However, a Pirelli generally has more grip than its Michellin counter part, and likewise the Michellins last longer and give better fuel consumption, but how is the game going to represent that across the board for different car manufacturers with different stock tyres?

It has to round the tyres up or down to the nearest compound they believe it can grip to, in real life. And I know at road speeds, my Peugeot has more grip than I get from the comfort hard tyres (it doesn't understeer wildly in a 50mph zone holding that speed in a bend in real life, it will in the game).

So all that matters is, does the car grip as it should in real life? Yes, great leave if like that if that's satisfactory. No? Your 458 grips more, than upgrade the tyres until you get the right feel, or downgrade if it should be slower, isn't it that simple?
 
Another question is how accurate the tracks are and the grip level they give.

IRL grip level changes a lot with temperature and a lot of other variables.
Also it can make a big difference how much and what kind of other racing recently took place on a track.

I guess GT6 simulates none of this things (is there even different grip off and on racing line ?) and you also don't know much about the conditions at the time the reference times where done.

So seeking "the real tire" just with time comparing is not gonna work to good IMHO.


Comfort on powerful cars (Viper, 458, MP4-12C, Enzo) feel and sound just wrong to me, so even if it turns out that times with those are closer to reality compared to hard sport i would not use them.


(No experience in such cars IRL)
 
Swagger897
As "grippy" as they are, can we all agree that they all degredate way too fast?
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I did some 8 lap racing online and it was really interesting with tire wear. Racing softs ran out at the last few laps so selecting another rubber really came in to play, but that was only the Soft, so really the race had to be longer to be more dynamic, or the tires could've worn faster. So my conclusion is that the degeneration is pretty much perfect as it is.
 
GTAQV
I get what you're saying, bur for example there are 3 types of sports tires, why not have the sports hard with a more realistc grip level and let the ocasional driver (or uninterested in realism driver) switch the tires for the softs...
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I dont know we can say that the actual tires themselves in GT6 have unrealistic levels of grip, as we dont know anything about them really other than what kinds of lap times were able to get on different sets. The cars themselves are depicted as having certain downfoce/handling/weight distribution/etc characteristics that effect lap times and speeds much more than the tires themselves.

One think I dislike is the wear rate on the racing tires which is very quick on some cars, and the lack of "strategy" that can be implemented, for example NOT being able to run on harder tires for longer making them faster overall than softs. As it is softs are always with nearly 100% certainty to win a long race unless the race is just beyond the range of the softs, then sometimes mediums can beat them.
 
I've been driving my Lotus Evora a lot today on Sport Hard (which is what I tuned the car to on build) changed to Sport Soft when I had to keep up with Aventadors, FXX's, 458's etc. (Cut me some slack on that please! :D). Upon reading this thread I changed down to Comfort Softs - what I'd expect a Lotus Evora to come with IRL and boy was it different! It's Exactly what I'd expect driving that car on tires like Michellin Pilot Super Sports/Contisport Contact 5P's/Pirelli PZero Nero's to be like.

I own a VW Scirocco IRL, it has Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetric 2's fitted, it's currently remapped to 265BHP and 330Lb/ft, has a full induction system fitted, White-line Anti-Lift Kit and Neuspeed Engine Mount insert. It's safe to say that it's as fast, if not faster, than the standard Scirocco R is. After that I went and used the standard Scirocco R that I have on the game and Put Comfort Mediums on it (What I'd expect my Goodyear Eagle Assymetric 2's to be) and, whilst I'm using a DS3, on cape ring it started to understeer just a little bit before the speed I've tested mine at does. This, in my mind, means that the tire model is pretty good - which is good enough to me!
 
PD should add an option to set a starting tire wear level for the front and rear. I don't find it realistic always driving street cars on brand new tires, especially older ones. Who do you know that replaces their road car tires every month even?
 
I did some testing on various tracks with a Honda NSX in GT5 and came to the conclusion that CM are closest to real life laptimes.

A big issue on tracks with long straights/high speeds is the lack of aerodynamic drag.
Cars accelerate way too fast after 60mph all the way to their (very optimistic) max speed.

The sense of speed is another thing that catches you out, you think you're going 35mph and its actually 70mph
 
Comfort tires now have much more grip than in GT5, GT86 should have CH tire :) I think most cars below 210HP should have CH.
 

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