Toyota fails..... Again

  • Thread starter Thread starter Azure Flare
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A good idea?

  • yes

    Votes: 6 7.9%

  • no

    Votes: 70 92.1%
  • Total voters
    76
Sniffs
and I'm still trying to figure out what automotive demographic is aimed at us gen exers.
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I can answer that one: small crossovers and "funky" small cars. The MINI Countryman comes under the first banner and something like the Kia Soul comes under the second.
 
jacoja06
Good lord. The number one car I was looking forward to after all these years may be slowly morphing into another Camry. I’ll still probably end up buying it though... really depending on the body design.

My backup plan, the new RX7 they are developing. Supposedly.
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Supposedly being for the last number of years, and nothing ever comes of it. Just buy a Monaro.:lol:
 
Eric: they keep forgetting that most americans of the Gen X persuasion are too BIG to physically fit into something the likes of a kia Rio...and I don't just mean fat guys, either. I think my generation got the bulk of the growth hormones they were slippin into the cows to make more money offa sales :P

Home: the MINI's are meant for the guys of my generation that are CEO's...not the common working man
 
Sniffs
Eric: they keep forgetting that most americans of the Gen X persuasion are too BIG to physically fit into something the likes of a kia Rio...and I don't just mean fat guys, either. I think my generation got the bulk of the growth hormones they were slippin into the cows to make more money offa sales :P
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Yeah, my height makes compacts and sub compacts highly amusing.

Sniffs
Home: the MINI's are meant for the guys of my generation that are CEO's...not the common working man
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Eh? I mostly see them driven by sorority girls and other college educated types that couldn't quite get into the BMW/Benz range. Or they wanted something cheap with "sporting" history.

Upper management and such still prefers their badges - Lexus, Benz, BMW, Audi...
 
Not surprising.

IMHO, they set the carrot too high. Expecting to build an all-new car from the ground up around an engine that's difficult to package and not terribly fuel efficient.

Whereas if they took and cut down the old IS platform, which they have tooling for, and design it around the old IS drivetrain mated to their current 1.8 liter engines (which are fuel efficient, and powerful for their displacement), they could have a new car for much less in terms of development and production costs.
 
either way, we're getting a watered down version of this. it will be "camry-ized" in order to generate better sales, most likely, here. they (the US insurance industry) are still paranoid about anything with less than 4 doors.
 
Sniffs
Home: the MINI's are meant for the guys of my generation that are CEO's...not the common working man
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Dunno about that... My uni accomodation car park is full of the damn things. Then again there's also someone with a new TT and (I swear to god) a 2001 CL500, so perhaps that's not a massive surprise.
 
Jondot
Dunno about that... My uni accomodation car park is full of the damn things. Then again there's also someone with a new TT and (I swear to god) a 2001 CL500, so perhaps that's not a massive surprise.
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Foreign students, middle and far east, are well known in Swansea for driving stupidly expensive cars for students. One guy was driving a nearly new 3-series convertible, another a 3 yr old mid-range E-class.
 
Sniffs
either way, we're getting a watered down version of this. it will be "camry-ized" in order to generate better sales, most likely, here. they (the US insurance industry) are still paranoid about anything with less than 4 doors.
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If the rumour is true though (and as far as I'm aware it's still just a rumour) we're still getting a front-engined, rear-drive coupe.

Even if the finished product is a bit dull, that's still a solid base from which tuners can work. A Honda Civic, to all intents and purposes, is a dull economy car, but with not a lot of work you can have a fairly handy bit of kit. I expect this Toyota, whichever route they take with it as a company, should still have a lot of potential.
 
niky
Whereas if they took and cut down the old IS platform, which they have tooling for, and design it around the old IS drivetrain mated to their current 1.8 liter engines (which are fuel efficient, and powerful for their displacement), they could have a new car for much less in terms of development and production costs.
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I've never understood why corporations are always so incredibly focused with coming out with an entirely new car every single time when trying to dominate a segment. If you've got a solid platform, engine package, etc... Just add awesomeness. The same formula will still work.

Of course, the difference is whether or not you do it for two decades. Right GM?
 
YSSMAN
I've never understood why corporations are always so incredibly focused with coming out with an entirely new car every single time when trying to dominate a segment. If you've got a solid platform, engine package, etc... Just add awesomeness. The same formula will still work.

Of course, the difference is whether or not you do it for two decades. Right GM?
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Agree. Look at Ford spawning off the RS and rs500 from the focus.
That' what Subaru, Mitsubishi, and Nissan did back in the day with the impreza, lancer, and skyline.
Worked before but now almost everyone thinks they need something new and original.
 
home: i doubt that. i think RWD is getting a rep over here for being "old Fashioned"...and I think some of the buying public still associates RWD with performance only.

YSS: mabey they've still got the fifties on the brains.
 
Sniffs
home: i doubt that. i think RWD is getting a rep over here for being "old Fashioned"
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Perhaps for regular cars, family cars and the like, but there will always be a market for RWD.

...and I think some of the buying public still associates RWD with performance only.
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I can't see how that disagrees with what I said - RWD is inherently suited to cars with a performance bias. Thus even if Toyota tone down the FT-86, tuning companies still have a RWD blank canvas on which to paint their masterpieces.
 
race'emhard
http://jalopnik.com/5521080/report-toyotas-turning-the-ft+86-into-the-solara

Who's idea was this? I was looking forward to maybe purchasing one of these. But no, Toyota's idea of a RWD coupe is just like nearly every Toyota, boring, and I do not want one.
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Is this a JOKE or what?

I was really looking forward on spending 20 grand on a nice handling light weight car form Toyota! now its going to be a expensive ugly cow.

If Toyota made the FT 86 coupe look about 90% of the concept on the outside, stick in at least 200 HP engine.. and sell it for 21K, they will sell like hotcakes! Heck why not stick in the V6 camery engine in that lil car? why use Subaru 170hp engine? Toyota is pissing me off the more I think of the car and HOW GREAT it would of been.

This car would be perfect if it had.

Same body as the Concept ( I do not care what interior it has)
268 HP V6 Toyota engine
230+ Turbocharged 4 cyl Subaru engine
less then 1200KG
Limited slip standard.
Base to start at 20-21k

Now this will sell!
 
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If the Subaru version of the Toyota FT-86 has a flat-6 engine, I would drive it. Yes, turning the FT-86 into a Solara is the worst idea ever which is why I should never trust Toyota's marketing scheme.
 
There are rumors that Toyota will make an even smaller FR car since the ft-86 ballooned in price.
 
that would have been a perfect gen coupe 2.0 competitor, We need more new cheap RWD coupes....come on Nissan..you can do it...apparently Toyota through in the towel..
 
dave_sz
There are rumors that Toyota will make an even smaller FR car since the ft-86 ballooned in price.
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Likely built with the 1.5 liter engine used in the Daihatsu Xenia, from reports on the engine's displacement, power and torque.

Something I'd been theorizing about since we first heard about this car...
 
Considering that the average Toyota buyer is not in their twenties, I'm guessing Toyota going to the Solara route is sticking with their bread and butter costumers (my parents, grandparents, etc.).
 
niky
Likely built with the 1.5 liter engine used in the Daihatsu Xenia, from reports on the engine's displacement, power and torque.

Something I'd been theorizing about since we first heard about this car...
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I'd definitely rock something like that, even more so than the car the FT-86 was due to be. I still think it's a crying shame Mazda never marketed a proper coupe version of the MX5. They only built a short run for the Japanese market. I reckon they'd have sold like crazy.

car_photo_13825_7.jpg
 
If they can water it down, make it a little more plush, and really give what the older folks want, why not? It's a good business decision. It'll still be a nice car too. I'd buy one.

If I was 45.
 
TorqueHappenS08
that would have been a perfect gen coupe 2.0 competitor, We need more new cheap RWD coupes....come on Nissan..you can do it...apparently Toyota through in the towel..
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i don't see the genesis coupe as being of any concern to Toyota. Maybe if people bought them, but to this day I've seen maybe 3 on the road.
 
homeforsummer
I'd definitely rock something like that, even more so than the car the FT-86 was due to be. I still think it's a crying shame Mazda never marketed a proper coupe version of the MX5. They only built a short run for the Japanese market. I reckon they'd have sold like crazy.

car_photo_13825_7.jpg
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I had no idea Mazda did something like that. 👍 While it looks like a Escort ZX2 in the pic, which is never a good thing, a lighter weight, Miata coupe(non-convertible) would sell for sure. It's not just about the top for a lot of Miata owners. Some of them actually prefer fixed top, and on top of that, there will be buyers who shied away from the car in the past because it's a convertible. They'd jump on something like this. You'd expect better fuel economy and rigidity, too.

I've long wished they'd rip off the BMW Shoe/M-Coupe and make a hatchback Miata. :D
 
Well, the current PRHT gives you the best of both worlds. Not that rigidity actually suffers with the top down, as it did with the older cars (a friend relates that putting on his NA's hardtop cures half the rattles...), and it's only a smidge heavier than the non-PRHT.

A fixed-top base model would be nice, but the current MX-5 is stiff enough that a base soft-top with a removable hardtop is going to be more than enough for anyone.

That said, yes, the "hairdresser" connotations of being a convertible will still turn some people off, but honestly, they don't know what they're missing.
 
I didn't realize how solid, or how light the current soft top is, but there still is the concern regarding leaks.

You are right about lots of people missing out on some top-off fun. I took one for a short drive while back, on a nice sunny day, too. Totally unique driving experience. :D
 
dave_sz
i don't see the genesis coupe as being of any concern to Toyota. Maybe if people bought them, but to this day I've seen maybe 3 on the road.
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I've seen alot of them here, On a day to day basis i see at least 9 coupes. You can't base the number on how well they all sell, just based off of what you see. :sly:

There actually doing quite well...But i'm not going to jack this thread.
 

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