Transformers 2: Revenge of the Fallen

  • Thread starter YSSMAN
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Grumble, grumble much? (lulz)

I just ordered my tickets for the "regular" DLP/THX screen on the north side of town. IMAX tickets sold out just before my friend and I were going to purchase a handful, but knowing us, we'll end up seeing it a time or two (I think I ended up seeing TF1 in the theater three or four times).

Early reviews are in across the internets as well, and it seems to be pretty similar to the last run. Things blow up, things go boom, robots swear at us, and Megan Fox gets nekked. Turn your brain off, and its a lovely summer movie extravaganza.
 
I just saw it a little over an hour ago, and I needed some time to procress my reaction. So far I'm having mixed feelings; it could have been worse, but it could have been better. That's not to say it's dead in the middle, though. Right now I'm just having some trouble trying to work out what it's closer to; at the moment, it's better than average.

The only real problem with the film is that its gets its pacing mixed up. There were no scenes that were in the wrong place at the wrong time, but rather that everything in the first half of the film builds up the story and the second half plays it out. That's fine, but everything in the first half happens very quickly, and the second half doesn't jump around as much.

Michael Bay has really matured in terms of his ability to structure a sequence. The Final Fight in the first film was a mess: it was very difficult to determine who was fighting who, or to tell them apart. Like when Optimus and Megatron blasted through the office building; it was ahrd to tell where one stopped and the other began. That only happens on one occasion here, a fight between Bumblebee and a Decepticon I couldn't quite work out. But the thing about the fight sequences here is that they don't overstay their welcome. It would have been very easy to make the Shanghai sequence twice as long, but the film doesn't feel the need to do it.

The acting isn't that bad; Megan Fox is interchangable with a cardboard box, and while the new characters don't get that much in the way of development, their personalities are different enough that you can tell them apart. I especially liked Jetfire - even if he was an expositionry deveice - and Sam's lecturer. I was a little worried about the Twins and how they were completely new, created for the intention of humour, and while they can be annoying, they do get some lines that are actually funny. The only thing I ever found annoying was when lines are delivered too quicly to be made out, or the background noises drown them out a little. There's definately a few scenes that I'll have to watch with subtitles.
I wasn't too impressed with the Fallen. The voice actor was the wrong choice, and his effects on the narrative were subverted by the presence of Megatron. Personally, I think he should have stayed dead; resurrecting him undid a lot of the things from the first film. His 'true' face just looked wrong as well; ILM were clearly going for an insectoid apperance, but it just clashed with the industrial lines of the robot part of him. Perhaps a better plot for him would be to have him trying to deal with the ambitions of Starscream in Megatorn's absence.

Devastator was incredible - even if you could see the money burning every time he was on-screen - and I think the Twins' moment of glory ranks up there with the Shanghai Showdown and Forest Fight as the film's high points. I was a little confused by him at first; I was led to believe the Constructicons merged to form him, but Long Haul an Mixmaster appeared elsewhere in the fight with Lennix's team. Devastator was either made up of seven un-named robots, or broken down into seven smaller pieces to make it easier for him to hide.
Otherwise, it's what we've come to expect from the Bayhem. The robots alternate between beating each other up, shooting each other up and blowing each other up, and all of it executed very well indeed.

And there were no sunsets.
 
As @Michael_Bay would say:

BOOM!

I'll echo what a lot of people are saying in their reviews. The effects are great, the occasional fan service is nice, but by no means will Transformers 2 be winning any awards for acting, or writing. No, not at all. I'll echo even more of the reviews. While the movie is paced fairly nicely, the opening hour or so lacks direction, to the point where you have no idea where the story is going. There are a lot of funny, but cheap, one-liners as well. I like that. I liked it a lot. Oh, and the robots curse... A lot. I liked that too.

As a summer popcorn movie, it gets an A+++. As something that follows cannon, and does what the fans may have wanted based on the television show, no, chances are that those folks will hate it. Boooo to them, I was there to have fun. That's exactly what I did.

NOTE:

See this thing in IMAX. Although I was in a DLP theater, I think it needed to be waaaaay bigger to get the full effect. Especially in that last major fight sequence. Also, it would help the violence be more epic. WAY MORE EPIC. Like, the robots themselves couldn't hit the broad-side of a barn in the first movie. This one? Lets just say that "S*** GETS REAL, SON!"

Time for some spoiler thoughts:
* Jetfire rocks. Yes, there are stupid gimmicks with him, but I liked it. Especially when he brought the whoop-ass near the end. Speaking of Jetfire, yes, he does merge with Optimus Prime. Although, he isn't the Space Shuttle.

*"The Twins" really end up being annoying. Although their language is good for giggles occasionally, nah, they're not for me

* Right... Arcee is there. So is Jolt, and Sideswipe. How much screen time do they get? Ziltch. Ironhide and Ratchet get far less as well. Disappointment washed over me a bit. I wanted more time with the Autobots as a team.

* The Decepticons on the other hand - there were too many of them to keep track of. Seriously. More robots = awesome, but I'd like to know who the hell they are. The RC truck was sweet. And the humanoid thingy was creepy awesome, in a T-X way. Dude.

* Props to Mike Bay for calling out the douchebag in the tight polo at the frat party. I loved it.

* Where was Barricade?

* Final point... I have no idea where the third movie is going to go. At all. Obviously there are still "seekers" left to find, which could hold the last part of the story... And we already know that Megatron and Starscream have retreated to regroup. Outside of that, I have no idea where things are in terms of the story, or what else they can pull out of their magic hat. Unless they bring Unicron in. Hmmm

* Oh, Soundwave. Fan-service, that's for sure.

So, yeah. I'd give the movie a solid C on content, but an A on visual awesome. More transformers, more large-scale fights, more hardcore robot violence, bigger 'splotions, and some harsh language. Nope, its not a "good" movie, but I see the fans making it a winner when they have control of the votes.
 
Hey, the Pretender was far cooler than the T-X if only for the simple fact she didn't contradict the canon the way T-X did by being able to bring projectile weapons through the time-travel device.
 
Well my favorite inexpensive movie theater is apparently gone now. So much for 3 dollar movies. Now I gotta go to the mall and pay $7.50. :grumpy: Might as well watch it IMAX, but they're all sold out.
 
Just got back from watching this the second time. Visually very cool movie. Few mistakes in how some scenes were done. Anyhow below are my positives/negatives.

Positives

*Soundwave! Hearing his voice was good enough for me. And when he shot out Ravage I was so glad they kept him as a minion

*Ravage was one of my favourite transformers as a kid so loved him being in it. sucks he died though

*Transformers were just more bad ass. Optimus prime's execution of Demolishor and Bumblebees arm tearing. Not to mention Forest scene

*The mass of little clips posted on the net was all but the first 10 minutes of the film. So nothing was ruined.

*Sideswipe was cool as

*Wheelie was funny as!

*Action much easier to follow

*Decepticons were just ruthless. Ripping apart a fellow decepticon to fix megatron was unexpected.

*Alice was great. Very well done.

*Model T ford Transformer!

Negatives

*how was longhaul and mixmaster in the battle at the ruins while also combined to form devastator at the pyramid all at the same time?

*few stuff ups with Sam's hand being bandaged 1 instant and not in another

*somehow when Sam died his shirt kept getting more holes burnt into it as they tried to revive him?

*Needed more Jolt, Arcee and Chromia

*I still haven't completely understood what Jetfire or the twins said throughout the movie (also when Sam broke down in the lecture threatre. Just gathered that Einsteins theory of relativity is wrong?)

Can't wait for the 3rd iteration now. Just hope for a tad more explanation even if it sacrifices some action. There were just a few too many bots in the movie. Regardless was cool and have no complaints to watch this again the other 2 times in the next week.
 
One of my biggest issues with Transformers was the characterization Jazz was given of being a the street-talking token black guy bot (never mind the further cliché he is also the one that dies).

So, you can imagine my disappointment at reading this article.
http://www.cinematical.com/2009/06/24/michael-bay-defends-transformers-racial-stereotypes/

Michael Bay Defends 'Transformers' Racial Stereotypes
by Dawn Taylor Jun 24th 2009 // 1:32PM

Among the criticisms leveled at Michael Bay's rock 'em, sock 'em Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen are charges that two of Bay's secondary robot characters, Mudflap and Skids, promote offensive racial stereotypes. The director doesn't disagree -- he just doesn't see anything wrong with it.

Lest you think that these critics are being hopelessly, knee-jerkingly PC, consider the following: The comic-relief robots have enormous jug ears and bug eyes. One of them has a gold tooth. They speak in a high-pitched, rapid-fire drawl that calls to mind Chris Tucker and the Wayans brothers (as reported here by Erik Davis, the voices were done by black actor Reno Wilson, and comedian and voice talent Tom Kenny, who also voices Spongebob Squarepants). Their "street" dialogue runs along the line of one of them suggesting "popping a cap" in another robot.

"We're just putting more personality in," Bay told the Associated Press. "I don't know if it's stereotypes - they are robots, by the way. These are the voice actors. This is kind of the direction they were taking the characters and we went with it."

Mudflap and Skids are hardly the only thing that critics are finding wrong with Bay's sequel, but in a film that's chock-a-block full of things to hate, it still stands out as one of the most egregious botches. In her review in the New York Times, critic Manohla Dargis wrote that the characters speak with "conspicuously cartoonish, so-called black voices that indicate that minstrelsy remains as much in fashion in Hollywood as when, well, Jar Jar Binks was set loose by George Lucas."

"I purely did it for kids," the director said. "Young kids love these robots, because it makes it more accessible to them."

Over on the fansite CHUD, which is hardly a bastion of political correctness, writer Devin Faraci calls them "Little Black Sambots," and says that he was dumbfounded by the characters: "They have a 'playful' back and forth relationship, which includes them talking in some sort of modern day rap-age jive, calling each other (censored by FK, rhymes with witch grass) or 'punk,' talking with an exaggerated, crunked-up 'street' accent. They appear to be stoned all the time. And they ... sheepishly admit they 'don't do much readin'.' I was actually surprised that the film didn't find a way to make them wear a Transformers version of baggy pants."

Apparently,none of this bothers Bay. "Listen, you're going to have your naysayers on anything," he told AP. "It's like is everything going to be melba toast? It takes all forms and shapes and sizes."
Click to expand...

For those who have seen it: Is this how these two characters are portrayed? And are critics blowing it out of proportion.

I personally couldn't care less about any racial issues it creates, I just see don't why super advanced sentient alien machines would require this characterization to be interesting, or how the story can even allow them to come off this way.
 
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... Waiting for Biggie Smallsbot in #3.

I'm kind of pissed that I missed the cheap shows now. I do not want to spend 10 bucks on a movie at the expensive theater... might as well go see IMAX like I said. Why oh why did my 3 dollar cinema close down?
 
Omnis
... Waiting for Biggie Smallsbot in #3.

I'm kind of pissed that I missed the cheap shows now. I do not want to spend 10 bucks on a movie at the expensive theater... might as well go see IMAX like I said. Why oh why did my 3 dollar cinema close down?
Click to expand...
Because it is a $3 cinema in a $10-$12 world?

I am assuming it is not a first-run theater? And that they don't have all the fancy digital fun stuff that makes big special effects movies so great?

Small cheap theaters have a few things going against them:

1) They can't usually afford the newest and biggest movie tech, which appears to require an almost annual upgrade nowadays. So, the blockbusters appear drab in comparison to the big theaters.

2) Without all the above fancy tech some people have home systems now that could compete on a level playing field.

3) Movies go from theater to home video in a matter of months now. Waiting for a movie to go from cheap theater to your fancy home theater setup is the equivalent of waiting for a pay-per-view movie to hit HBO.

4) Sticky floors. Seriously, I nearly lost my shoes last time I was in one of those places. ;)
 
FoolKiller
For those who have seen it: Is this how these two characters are portrayed? And are critics blowing it out of proportion.

I personally could care less about any racial issues it creates, I just see don't why super advanced sentient alien machines would require this characterization to be interesting, or how the story can even allow them to come off this way.
Click to expand...

You should have stopped reading it after the NYC critic called them, "so-called black voices".

1 - Those voices don't have to be black people only. I've seen white people talk like that.
2 - Mudflap's voice actor is black (Reno Wilson), so it's a not an attempt to sound like "so-called" black voices" by white people, which is what the NYC critic seemed to be pushing.
3 - They're only there for humor relief. That's all they do through the movie, fighting with each other, showing sibling rivalry.

Next thing you know, they'll be attacking Ironhide for being an overly -aggressive bot because he's a black truck.
 
FoolKiller
Because it is a $3 cinema in a $10-$12 world?

I am assuming it is not a first-run theater? And that they don't have all the fancy digital fun stuff that makes big special effects movies so great?

Small cheap theaters have a few things going against them:

1) They can't usually afford the newest and biggest movie tech, which appears to require an almost annual upgrade nowadays. So, the blockbusters appear drab in comparison to the big theaters.

2) Without all the above fancy tech some people have home systems now that could compete on a level playing field.

3) Movies go from theater to home video in a matter of months now. Waiting for a movie to go from cheap theater to your fancy home theater setup is the equivalent of waiting for a pay-per-view movie to hit HBO.

4) Sticky floors. Seriously, I nearly lost my shoes last time I was in one of those places. ;)
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1. Correct, but it's good enough anyway. It's only a small 8 room cinema. I would pay 10 bucks easily for a digital cinema or IMAX. The one at the mall here is only expensive because... it's a 24 at the mall. They do have one ginormous cinema room, which I'm fairly certain Transformers will be playing in, that is of about $7 quality. And I was planning to go for matinee but I missed it-- hence why I am Mr. Grumpy.

2. This is true. In fact, I have all the equipment. I just have condo neighbors that I have to consider.

3. Yeah, and I would probably wait for the blu-ray if it weren't for all of your giant blocks of spoiler text that I am dying to read.

4. Sticky floors and terrible seats, yes.
 
Reventón;3442152
You should have stopped reading it after the NYC critic called them, "so-called black voices".

1 - Those voices don't have to be black people only. I've seen white people talk like that.
2 - Mudflap's voice actor is black (Reno Wilson), so it's a not an attempt to sound like "so-called" black voices" by white people, which is what the NYC critic seemed to be pushing.
3 - They're only there for humor relief. That's all they do through the movie, fighting with each other, showing sibling rivalry.

Next thing you know, they'll be attacking Ironhide for being an overly -aggressive bot because he's a black truck.
Click to expand...
I personally don't care about the racial issues or if they are "black" voices, but more so the characterization. Jazz in the cartoon was voiced by a black actor, but never once used street slang or did a breakdance move. The actual race, in my mind, has little to do with the storytelling or characterization.

Is it adding to the film? Or are they as pointless as the fat hacker on a donut rush in the first film?

EDIT: I attacked Ironhide for being overly aggressive because it was stupid how they did it in the first film. Does that count?

Omnis
3. Yeah, and I would probably wait for the blu-ray if it weren't for all of your giant blocks of spoiler text that I am dying to read.
Click to expand...
By "your" you mean the thread in general?

I've grown tired of Hollywood this year.
 
FoolKiller
I personally don't care about the racial issues or if they are "black" voices, but more so the characterization. Jazz in the cartoon was voiced by a black actor, but never once used street slang or did a breakdance move. The actual race, in my mind, has little to do with the storytelling or characterization.

Is it adding to the film? Or are they as pointless as the fat hacker on a donut rush in the first film?

EDIT: I attacked Ironhide for being overly aggressive because it was stupid how they did it in the first film. Does that count?


By "your" you mean the thread in general?

I've grown tired of Hollywood this year.
Click to expand...

Yes.
 
FoolKiller
EDIT: I attacked Ironhide for being overly aggressive because it was stupid how they did it in the first film. Does that count?
Click to expand...

Naw, doesn't say anything about a black Truck as far as I remember.

FoolKiller
I've grown tired of Hollywood this year.
Click to expand...

Really? I gave up on Hollywood in 2005. Thats why you don't see anything from me on movies most of the time as most of them often follow alot of boring and overused things that just are not exciting (or funny) anymore.
 
FoolKiller
For those who have seen it: Is this how these two characters are portrayed? And are critics blowing it out of proportion.
Click to expand...

It could very well be taken as a racial stereotype, but people are griping more or less because its in a big motion picture than anything else. Its no different than watching The Boondocks, really. Which is funny, because they end up reminding me of these guys anyway:

Ed_and_Rummy.jpg




They're there for comic relief, and they provide maybe 40% of the time. Its a sibling rivalry with a bunch of wannabe hardcore kids. That's really all it is. Bumblebee lays down the justice, however. Which was nice.


* Side Thought *

Would have liked to have had more Bumblebee in the movie. Would have been great if his voice worked, again.
 
FoolKiller
I personally don't care about the racial issues or if they are "black" voices, but more so the characterization. Jazz in the cartoon was voiced by a black actor, but never once used street slang or did a breakdance move. The actual race, in my mind, has little to do with the storytelling or characterization.

Is it adding to the film? Or are they as pointless as the fat hacker on a donut rush in the first film?
Click to expand...
Nope. As I said, all they do is add humor, so I really don't see the point in making a big deal out of them being "racial" issues when it doesn't add or take anything from the film.
 
I just got back from going to see this film.

My review?

Well, it'll have to wait as they were SOLD OUT when i got there. :grumpy:

That's an hour and a half of my life wasted, and I didn't even watch Terminator salvation this week.

:irked:👍
 
Speedy Samurai
10 bucks? that's it. Over here it is twice that and there are no cheap theaters.
Click to expand...

Yeah well why spend 10 when you can spend 3 elsewhere, or at least 7.50 at the same theater at an earlier time.
 
*how was longhaul and mixmaster in the battle at the ruins while also combined to form devastator at the pyramid all at the same time?
Click to expand...
I think it was a case of Devastator being broken down into seven parts to make it easier for him to hide. He's thirty feet tall in the crouching position; he'd be one hundred if he were standings, so there's no one vehicle that could do that. Given that he was in a mining site to begin with, I'd say he used the Constructicon alternate modes to blend in.

*somehow when Sam died his shirt kept getting more holes burnt into it as they tried to revive him?
Click to expand...
I don't think they took his shirt off whilst trying to shock his heart into beating again, so I'm pretty sure the burns would have come from the defribilaltor.
 
Do you race?
I think it was a case of Devastator being broken down into seven parts to make it easier for him to hide. He's thirty feet tall in the crouching position; he'd be one hundred if he were standings, so there's no one vehicle that could do that. Given that he was in a mining site to begin with, I'd say he used the Constructicon alternate modes to blend in.
Click to expand...

I understand that but what I am saying is different. Mixmaster and Longhaul are both part of devastator. Yet somehow Devastator (with mixmaster and longhaul both part of him) was in one place while Mixmaster and Longhaul were also in the ruined town fighting the humans. How can they be at 2 different places at the same time? Just is an obvious corner cutting to get more bots on screen without having to make new ones. Which is unfortunate because they had a few bots they could have used but decided to kill them early in the film (ie. sideways)
 
VEXD
That's an hour and a half of my life wasted, and I didn't even watch Terminator salvation this week.
Click to expand...

If I'm honest, neither are good movies. Between the two, I'd rather see TF2 again, but T:S holds far greater promise when it comes to making a heartfelt attempt at a good movie. Reading some of the reviews of TF2 after seeing the movie have really caused me to laugh, but also reflect somewhat negatively on the film. There are a lot of terrible, terrible things in this movie - some of which I touched on in the review. I think where I begin to have a problem is that...

A) People went in expecting it to be a massively awesome masterpiece of wonderment - forgetting that it is a Michael Bay film, written during the writer's strike, that is there to entertain... And most importantly, make an incredible sum of money.

B) In reality, this is a movie made for kids. Given the over-sexualized content, drug references, and what are certainly not-too-friendly racial "jokes," I'm not totally comfortable with my nine year old brother seeing the movie. But he will, as will millions of other 9-14 year old boys that the movie is targeting.

C) Points referenced in (B), particularly with the racial jokes. Mudflap and Skids are getting a lot of heat for being racist depictions of African Americans. I mean A LOT. While I certainly see those points in the movie, and admittedly I did say "woah, really?" a time or two in the theater - its not that big of a deal. At all. Now I'm hearing bitching about a random (black) character that is "saving up to buy new teeth" as a negative. *sigh* The PC police will never be happy, but I think it would be legitimate to say that Bay pushed some of those boundaries a little bit too far.

D) A review on Aint It Cool, pointing out countless flaws, echoed my biggest problem with the entire movie... While there are more robots, on both sides, we don't see enough of them. Not even close. We get a hint of the Starscream/Megatron dynamic, but certainly not enough of it. We saw a bit of the Autobot's family dynamic, but I don't even think Jolt said a damn thing. A single phrase from Arcee is not enough. It is as though Bay completely ignored the biggest flaw from the first movie - developing the story of the robots themselves. Its frustrating, really.
 
Regarding the Mudflap and Skids, I finally figured out a way to explain why I hate characters used purely for comedic relief.

I was reading Jalopnik's review and they decided to change the names of Mudflap and Skids to Jar and Jar.

So, to sum up, my issue with this idea for this movie and the Vaudeville routine they put on a few times in the first film is that if I am not going to forgive George Lucas for Jar Jar Binks there is no way I am even going to give consideration to Michael Bay for it.
 
God that was a stupid film. But, for every time I thought "this is so stupid" there was another moment where an Autobot tore off someones arm etc. Basically, if you want to see a movie about Transformers movie you'll likely enjoy it, because it's a movie about giant transforming robots fighting each other. And for people that dont view that as a selling point probably won't be going anyway :D. You probably won't be impressed by it but there is certainly a lot of entertainment to be had. Plus, if you are a male, Megan Fox running in slomo.
 
Alright I'm finally in the film. Expect me to join the conversation in a few hours.
 
FoolKiller
I was reading Jalopnik's review and they decided to change the names of Mudflap and Skids to Jar and Jar.
Click to expand...

I like to call them Herp and Derp just because of how silly they look. I haven't even watched the movie yet (I don't do theaters nowadays) and I know I'm in for some silly (and possibly annoying) nonsense with those two.
 
Okay, I saw the movie and I think I just got mindfreaked.

I'm very disappointed that so many characters were just introduced and then zapped. How the hell do they expect to have any sort of development? You can't just cannon-fodderize transformers like that. That's not the way it works. The first mistake was with Jazz, and now it seems to be contagious. Also, the me-so-hawny college girl was a big wtf. I thought it was funny and everything, but is that really appropriate for transformers? Really? I think Bay saw that they were working on a new Terminator and said, "hey, let's give them a run for their money!" The Twins were also... strange. Like FoolKiller says-- completely unnecessary. I mean I don't really mind the voices (the movie-goers seemed to eat it up), but did they have to model the heads after a pair of monkeys? And the gold tooth? Since when do they even have teeth, especially beaver teeth!

So those are my gripes. The new kid was also kind of lame. They probably picked him because he looked like Carlos from the cartoons.

edit: Also, the US Navy has a
RAILGUN?
Lol, what?
 
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