What do you think the next Forza Horizon needs?

1,236
United States
Country lead by Bigoted Orange
ShawnPhillips
Shanic Oatmeme
The massive car count is part of the reasoning Forza is the only racing franchise I still play regularly.
Because Forza has so many weird and wonderful cars that no other racing game would even think to add. And racing those cars that only Forza has is some of the most fun I've had in a racing game for a long while. Not since the days of Gran Turismo 5 when me and some friends would race all kinds of weird stuff around the Nurburgring for hours on end.
 
10,390
Canada
Canada
The massive car count is part of the reasoning Forza is the only racing franchise I still play regularly.
Because Forza has so many weird and wonderful cars that no other racing game would even think to add. And racing those cars that only Forza has is some of the most fun I've had in a racing game for a long while. Not since the days of Gran Turismo 5 when me and some friends would race all kinds of weird stuff around the Nurburgring for hours on end.
I am so so glad I'm not the only one who appreciates Forza's ever growing liberty of cars. It's also another reason why it's become my new GT, especially after GT gone to iRacing-hood and completely abandoned what made me fell in love with it in the first place.

Like you, I've driven so many weird and fun cars back in the days if GT5 online. Just cruising and chillin' was one of the days I've ever had on there. :embarrassed:

If there is one thing I don't want Forza to do, is copy other racing games. They can borrow ideas like improving the online aspect of racing, but not to the point of sacrificing it's content and taking away its spirit.

Sorry if I often delve deep into my feelings about this. It's just that I really, REALLY appreciate what Forza is doing right now. I hope and prey nothing takes that away, and one of those is the car list that continues to grow and expand in models, along with manufacturers! 👍
 

TonyJZX

(Banned)
3,945
Australia
Australia
I'm at level 60 and I've played on and off since release... there's literal months where I didnt play this. And every time I play it I feel bored tired by the 30 min mark.

I think this whole formula is done. This is the 3rd iteration and at its heart, THE RACING IN BORING.

Breaking it down its still basically 3 lap races, point to point and pointless and frustrating 'showcases'... which just showcases the same music tracks, the same restart mechanics and the same "take control of your car to show a big jump" spectacles and maybe land on your roof.

Mercifully they have reduced the amount of cross country events but yeah... I do get the point where people are doing V8 4wd transplants all the time given that you will get at event like say.. 1960 muscle car cross country or hypercar rally and you need 4wd.

In the past a lot of events to me would essentially Audi only as I couldnt be bothered paying for a 4wd conversion and you just tune up an Audi Avant to compete.

I'm getting a vibe at this point Horizon is turning into EA Fifa 2020... a virtual 18-24 month recycle of whatever ideas and models they had in the recent past but they're looking at 'interesting' ways to lock certain cars behind DLC and/or artifical barriers... "unicornification" (I'm going to trademark that).

ALso the races tend to have odd classifications... eg. 900pp English cars.

Well I do like my 900 class McLaren F1 getting overtaken by a 900 class Land Rover Defender! It just takes me out of the 'zone'.

Further I see an odd ummm... truncation of performance.

Like the cars seem to really be between D500-S900 where all the cars seem to have similar performance I guess to have game balance?

500-700 feels terribly slow. 800-900 feels about right. 900+ is needed to get across the freeroam map because driving point to point to compete in events is just so boring now.

I'm not a fan at all of the "Fornitification" of Forza but it at least is not super intrusive.

They should be doing a wholesale upending of this series. Yes perhaps a return to the story mode of FH1. I feel like the whole FH FM series really needs something special to enliven reinvigorate the whole series.... and this is something Series X and 4k60 isnt going to help.
 

GilesGuthrie

Staff Emeritus
10,973
United Kingdom
Edinburgh, UK
CMDRTheDarkLord
Good points. I think you're getting at the issue that the game has metas in each class, and if you want to do any racing at 900PP or above, you need AWD, even on tarmac events. This isn't helped by the sheer quantity of wet races. I live in Britain, and it doesn't rain as much as T10 thinks it does.

The showcase events are OK. Good fun the first time you do them, but they could really do with varying the routes.

They really need to sort out the quality of racing. Driving standards in the online races are becoming increasingly toxic, but in Solo, there should be an uptick in the quality of drivers as you progress through the skill levels. Currently it just manipulates your starting position and the speed at which the drivatars race. I'm sick to the back teeth of being punted off by so-called "Pro" drivers running 7th, which then means you can't win the race because the pole-sitter is now 30s up the road.
 
732
Russian Federation
Russian Federation
Kannon33r
1. General gameplay
First of all, they should redone progression:
- garages should be main money sink, GTAO-like, not cars. Car prices could be downed to FH2 values. This will keep cars affordable, but will keep inflation low enough and give "hardcore" audience some reasons for grind.
- wheel spins should not give cars, but cosmetics, performance upgrades and money. Maybe, there could be discount coupons in wheelspins adjustable for different car manufactures or vehicle classes.
- skills sets and Forza editions. IMO, every car should have Forza edition unlockable by reaching top of its skill tree(not all of FE cars should be crazy, maybe unique swaps installed). All cars should have comparable skill trees, but lower tier cars could have lesser money/exp/wheelspin bonuses. Skill points should be tied to car, this would give us a reason to try more cars.
Second, PI system and car restrictions for races should be expanded. Similar to what we already have in tournaments - by year, by drivetrain, by weight and horsepower, etc.
Third, race modes. Speedtraps as events, timetrials, etc. Roadcar pathfinding could be extended with Horizon Stories mechanic "no more than 10s out of roads".
2. Level design and weather
Map should be more dynamic, with drawbridges,railroad crossing, dynamic industrial machines, etc. Seasons change should be more dramatic - floods in spring, thunderstorms in autumn, blizzards and avalanches in winter and drought in summer.
 

GilesGuthrie

Staff Emeritus
10,973
United Kingdom
Edinburgh, UK
CMDRTheDarkLord
- wheel spins should not give cars, but cosmetics, performance upgrades and money. Maybe, there could be discount coupons in wheelspins adjustable for different car manufactures or vehicle classes.

Why don't you think that wheel spins should give cars? I get a lot of fun out of seeing some random car in the garage and driving it - cars I never would have bought out of the auction house or the auto show.

Drivatar cosmetics and emotes as wheelspin prizes can get in the sea, as far as I'm concerned. T10 should just make them into microtransaction rewards like Fortnite does.
 
732
Russian Federation
Russian Federation
Kannon33r
Why don't you think that wheel spins should give cars
Its inflates car value. Like OK, its cool when it gives you something special, like FE car, but 99% of the time it throws at you something that you will delete. IMO, its disrespectful to throw some cult classic into garbage only because you already have one and everybody does. I think FM did this random rewards much better.

I get a lot of fun out of seeing some random car in the garage and driving it - cars I never would have bought out of the auction house or the auto show.
Coupons could do it same way, IMO. Like 99% discount for retro hot hatch instead of giving you one more god damn clio, at least it wouldnt waste you garage space.

Also, it makes sense with this
- garages should be main money sink, GTAO-like, not cars. Car prices could be downed to FH2 values. This will keep cars affordable, but will keep inflation low enough and give "hardcore" audience some reasons for grind.

Drivatar cosmetics and emotes as wheelspin prizes can get in the sea, as far as I'm concerned. T10 should just make them into microtransaction rewards like Fortnite does.
This game throws at you too much cars and money, so anything that stops this flood of wealth is kinda OK for me.
 
8,674
United States
Marin County
This might be controversial.

Because I'm spending so much time at home, I decided to do something I haven't done in many, many years. I bought a Need for Speed game. At $4.99 it was so cheap, I couldn't pass it up - I bought NFS Payback.

Let me get this out of the way initially: The car/driving mechanics are absolutely bonkers stupid. Like, I probably won't renew my EA access to continue playing the game longer than 1 month. The modification system is also unfathomable. Lastly the rural parts of the map are a little too big and nondescript, IMO.

But the world feels so much more alive & interesting than any of the Forza Horizon series. I'm trying to parse out exactly why, but it feels so much more like a real world than the sterile box of the Horizon series (especially 4). Below are some points that I think make Fortune Valley's open world feel so much more compelling.

-High level: Authored Experience vs Player Directed Experience - Unless the tools for the latter are very sophisticated (they are not in FH), I'll take an authored experience every time. Horizon fails miserably at this, IMO. All of the Horizon games have felt pretty directionless and wishy washy as a result, and combined with the below I think explains why the Horizon series feels so uncompelling.
-Rather than generic races to check off a list against faceless, voiceless drivatars, Payback races are against clubs and then you face off against the leader. This mechanic was great in the Tokyo Extreme racer series (even though it was purely text-driven in that game) because it actually immerses you into world. I still think about how fun and compelling the TXR series games were despite how the content in them was so incredibly small compared to the FH series.
-I thought the storyline mechanic of NFS Payback would be cheesy and uncompelling. It's definitely cheesy, but it does provide a far better entry point into the world of the game than Forza's lame as hell "festival" that is unbelievable to the point of distraction. I actually continue to play Payback because of the story, which actually surprised me. (it's definitely not because I enjoy the driving :lol:)
-The city itself feels so much more real than the creepy-feeling movie prop cities in Forza Horizon. In Horizon, the cities (mainly surfers paradise in 3 and Edinburgh in 4) are so incredibly tiny compared to what seems reasonable, and the transition from city to countryside is extremely abrupt. They also suffer from being overly pristine. This leaves you with a feeling that the whole city is one of those WW2 decoy cities designed to confuse enemy pilots. Fortune City (I think that's the name), even though it's completely fictional, feels way more real and lived-in. It has different districts with different feeling. Some of it actually feels gritty, even. It has a far more gradual density fade - the periphery of it actually feels sprawling (to an extent, there are still limitations) like most cities in the real world do.
-There is a more confident feeling art style throughout the game. It's not photorealistic in the way that Horizon strives for, but it feels stronger in some way.
-Little things like your character making comments about different parts of the map are actually nice.
-I really dislike how FH4 transitions to generic studio environments after and before races. If there was any immersion before, it gets blown out by these dumb GUI-world time outs. You don't see this in Payback and indeed the cut scenes serve to further immerse you in the world, and they do a great job of it! I don't care if they are pre-rendered...they work!

I think, from the highest level, the problem is that Forza Horizon is lacking a lot of intentionality. That's more or less ok in a circuit racer like Forza Motorsports where you can extract a lot of joy from hotlapping, tuning, and wheel to wheel racing, but I find it severely lacking and uninteresting in an open world game. I think they chose the festival narrative as it was one in which they could plausibly create their open world without it seeming unrealistic or contrived and realistically, because it probably involved a lot less work (no writers, bare bones voice actors, etc). But the result is that it feels distant and uninteresting. They should just hold their nose and jump in the deep end with an actual story (even if it's a little dumb or cheesy), IMO, or the games are always going to feel like you're just taking your cars for a spin along some half-considered roads, IE: without purpose.
 

TonyJZX

(Banned)
3,945
Australia
Australia
I'm at Level 100 now and a bit in Fortune Island and Lego.

Fortune Island is the same kind of Storm Island Blizzard Island nonsense where there's a certain *theme* that underlines a fairly boring mini map. The treasure component doesnt do it for me. I think we kind of expect the 1st dlc to not be that good.

HOWEVER... Lego is actually pretty good. I dont know what it is. I think its better than Hot Wheels.

There's something really fun about it even though I think underneath its not that revolutionary.

Lego is probably the best part of Horizon 4. They will probably do a full game offshoot like "Forza Horizon Lego Speed Champions" which is all Lego.
 

neema_t

Bearded Member
Premium
8,562
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
neema_t
FH5 needs end game content to give no lifers like me a reason to keep playing after we've unlocked everything. Also, some narrower, twistier roads so that class D, C and B cars are fun instead of feeling like you're cycling down a drag strip.
 
165
United States
United States
More structure for the career, and if you are going to keep the festival vibe, make it feel like an actual festival. Horizon 1 felt like a proper festival with sanctioned events. Horizon 2 had the best balance of the original game and the current ones. You weren’t driving through peoples backyards ruining everything in the off-road events.

Forzathon live had potential but is way too repetitive

Lastly a more varied world. FH1 had the most variety, FH2 had a good map and the more open world. FH3 has good scenery variety but the roads were super flat and boring. FH4s world is boring. The scenery never changes besides the seasons
 
9,394
Australia
Western Sydney
mustafur
Races without checkpoints atleast for road races(replace them with sector lines on the road), as well as barrier building like how the road races made by PGG are so we can make fixed looking tracks.

Proper Road courses could be made this way and the real creative geniuses will be able to make master peices.

You could do this for dirt races as well pretty easily.
 
836
Australia
Australia
I'd like to see the likes of the Motorsport All Stars pack return from FH3. Its always cool to drive circuit racecars outside of the track confines of the Forza Motorsport franchise.
 
37
England
England
A function to turn off traffic so we can actually do the speed trap and jump pr stunts without crashing into cars at each attempt. More French, Japanese and Swedish cars ( Volvo and Saab ) would be cool. Older style rally cars, like 80:s and 90:s Group A and Wrc cars ( Wrc from 1997 ).
More engine swaps ( both within the same makes and outside )
More wheels.
 
1,343
Mexico
Mexico
You must be talking about FH3, because cars are ghosted in FH4 for speed traps, danger signs and drift speed zones. As for customization, something like NFS Heat would be ideal.
 
37
England
England
You must be talking about FH3, because cars are ghosted in FH4 for speed traps, danger signs and drift speed zones. As for customization, something like NFS Heat would be ideal.
Not on speed traps, speed zones, yes, but not speed traps.
 
1,343
Mexico
Mexico
You are right! I guess the traffic hasn't bothered much there. I notice that if you are online it is more sparse and spread out.
 
239
Brazil
Brazil
RodSk8Dude
A function to turn off traffic so we can actually do the speed trap and jump pr stunts without crashing into cars at each attempt[...]

Don't know if you're aware, but there's a glitch where, after doing a Horizon story/business, traffic/AI opponents will dissapear, only on Horizon Solo I guess. Sometimes I enter and quit the nearest one to make it easier (changing cars or fast travelling will re-enable traffic).

It's not as practical as actually having an option on the menu, but it does the job.
 

AOS-

Premium
28,684
Canada
'Sauga, ON
I only picked up the game less than a month ago, and 4 is the first Horizon I've ever gotten exposed to. I come from a world of Burnout Paradise, NFS from 2010 to 2012, and a slurry of other older games (but they don't matter).

The literal open-world was both a bit silly- but largely a blast. The open-world of MW2012 made driving through the city somewhat difficult as the smallest slip mean you were going to crash into a wall without a doubt. This though, you blow through almost all obstacles, and while it's a bit goofy, it takes a whole load of stress out of playing, and that is enjoyable for me at this time.

I like that you can advance at any specialty event you wish, and don't follow a linear structure. NFS 2010 did this too leaving you the option to advance between Cops and Racers at your own leisure. I've spent very little time progressing through the events and more time grinding for cash and making liveries. I don't see a shortage of things to do at this time, so I don't have any exposure to what end-game looks like.

What I absolutely would like for a next Horizon is for Microsoft to get off the Teredo network protocol for online. 10 times out of 10, I have never been able to connect to Horizon Live on one of my PCs, and only recently has my other computer started to drop connection more frequently.
 
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15,843
United States
Maryland
GranTurismo0517
RandomCarGuy17
Actually, there's a few things on my mind as someone that's still playing this game each week.

So, here's what I think the next Forza Horizon needs:
1. A fusion career mode between Horizon 1-2 & 3-4. I love how open FH4 has become in some ways to wear I can create my own racing routes and custom events, but I kinda lost the motivation to keep playing FH4 in spite of things like the Eliminator event and custom route creation. I think I would be more engaged if I had a mountain to climb, so maybe bring back some linear elements from FH1.

Have you start as a newcomer, but as you get better; the world opens up to you. Something that has been done before, but I like this. However, you start unlocking all of the extra fun custom options such as custom events and routes once you level up in ranks. And at the end of the game, you have all of the custom options unlocked as an reward.

2. More bumper options for cars, some notable aftermarket part options are a must for cars. Especially on a game like this, maybe even sillier upgrades like custom headlights for cars including those multi-colored ones you see on some cars. I think they're silly, but it's fine to be silly sometimes. I mean, FH4 already had a chickensuit as an avatar outfit; so what do they have to lose?

With that said, I still want more factory car part options. Please PG, let me put LX bumpers on my Foxbody Mustang Cobra R! That's all I want!

3. New livery editor, where decals can be applied to windows and custom decals can be uploaded into the game. Kinda like in GTSport. Keep the other options present, but let me be lazy and upload .svg files as decals! Seriously, recreating decals is so tedious!

4. Remodel all of the reused models still existing. Turn 10 and PG can't do this anymore, they need to make new models for the older stuff like the Skyline R32 GTR, Impreza 22B, SW20 Toyota MR2, VW Golf R32, and so much more. They just look so offputting compared to their latest stuff.

5. Abilty to skip voiceovers and tutorial sessions. In spite of what I said above about everything being closed off from the start, I still don't want my hand being held at the start. Give me to option to pick between what events I want to enter at the beginning and forget about the voiceovers. Just make them an option to listen to, maybe move them to a phone mechanic or something like in the NFS games.
 
8,674
United States
Marin County
My biggest wish is for PG not to just phone it in for the next title. There are so many tedious and annoying decisions throughout the interface and the gameplay. The UI, in particular, feels like it was designed by a schizophrenic. The following is the things that just bug me that aren't necessarily game breaking. I have a lot of other wishes, but just give us the bare minimum user experience improvements, please.

From a general standpoint, why are there so many layers of menus? Seriously you start every session 3 menus deep. It just feels like moving in molasses, especially as the menus are all so loud, nondistinctive, and sluggish. Worse still, there is so much overlap and ambiguity between menus that I struggle to remember where to go find what I'm looking for. This is compounded further because the at-home menu is completely different from the driving menu. Is it really necessary that these be different? The whole experience is bewildering, and that's not a good thing. It's one of the worst UIs I can think of, and I use Revit. I really, really hope they create a new UI from the ground up for the next game, it really, really needs it.

Why is the route creator such a damn chore to use? The method of tracing the course is OK (I'm being charitable, the complete lack of ability to make adjustments after you are done is just nonsense), but the courses are truly buried behind menus. I have, on occasion, honestly forgotten where my courses started from because there is no straight-forward way to see where they are. There should be a simple intuitive "creation" tab from the pause menu where you can see all of your courses (at the moment, the only way to see all of them is to build a new one and hit save! Crazy). I know this was their first go at it, but so much of the map is not really available for the course creator because of the fixed start locations (there are some loops I would really love to use, but I cannot because there is no start point anywhere along it).

Less "friction" within the user interface. This game saves so often and the burden of waiting makes me anxious enough (subconsciously, I mean) to avoid going to the garage or design area unless I need to. Hopefully the SDDs of the next generation machines will help this, but going from the garage menu to the painting menu takes entirely too long

Why is it not possible to preview a design before downloading and applying it? It's a little hard to appreciate details from a thumbnail that only shows one side of the car...

Why can't designs have wheel color detached from the body graphics? I've put up numerous designs, and I don't think it's necessary to dictate what color wheels somebody has. For that matter, why are designs always locked? I'm certain many people would be totally ok with open-sourcing their designs. Why not give us the option?

Why, WHY, when searching for a design for a specific car, does the search result default to all cars? What is the purpose of this?

Why is the auction house so slow and awful? Why are there so many steps in the process of bidding and receiving a car from the auction house? Why, WHY, do we have to actively retrieve money from an auction we didn't win? Honestly, what is the purpose of this? And what is the purpose of losing that money after a certain period of time? Is that supposed to be immersive? Why are we effectively placing our money in escrow in a video game?

Why can't we save custom paint colors for use on multiple cars? Why do the special paint finishes (matte, semi-gloss, etc) revert to the "advanced" color picker instead of the broadly useful standard colors? Why do we have brass, gold, diamond plate, zinc, wood, copper and camo paint presets, but not bronze or titanium, materials actually commonly found on cars?

Why can't we have saveable car lists for events? It would be great if I didn't have to individually assemble my period-correct or segment-correct car lists for every event I make.

Why can't we have options for disallowing drivetrain or engine swaps in races? Kind of sucks when I want to have an all-FF event and the drivatar vehicles invariably end up AWD with comically large tires.

Why can't we adjust the time of day rate of change? It's pretty weird to do a sunset race that lasts less than 15 minutes and see the sunrise at the end. Adding to this, why is the night so short? I swear night lasts no more than 5 minutes.

Why, WHY, do songs repeat during an event? Did they really disallow multiple tracks when you're in a race? Why? If you run a race longer than 3 laps, you'll be hearing the same song over and over again. Maybe this is a hardware limitation, but it seems more like an oversight. Related to music, WHY do many menus revert to the same 3 or 4 songs ALL the time. The game has a ton of music, but I hear the same 3 or 4 songs relentlessly in loading menus and post race payout scenes.

Why is there still a bug that keeps water droplets or snow, indelibly, on your windshield when you go from freemode (if it's raining/snowing) to a race (where it's not raining). How can this honestly not be fixed yet? It's a really dumb bug that could be fixed so seemingly easily.

This is a bit minor, but why does every pre-996 911 have interior cameras placed in different locations? The interior should be largely the same between all the air-cooled 911s but the viewpoint is different in all of them. The Hoonigan 964 is particularly bad. Why is the dashboard camera offset to the left in that car?

It's pretty clear to me that 95% of PG's development budget goes towards map creation and adding cars. The actual user experience has changed so little since the original game and its quite disappointing. Again, I just want them to not phone it in. It just feels like they don't really put in the level of care that you would expect for such a massively profitable title. I wouldn't expect such a disinterested user experience in a rockstar, polyphony digital, bethesda, or even EA title (not that each of those doesn't have its own unique problems). It actually feels a little insulting.
 
121
Finland
FI
NaughtyLittleBoy
NuttyLittleBoy
I've probably mentioned this somewhere (even on this thread before), but less or preferably no mandatory progression through online play. I spent most of the holidays waiting to connect to online events either having no other players or getting disconnected. Also, online play seems to bring out the worst sides of humanity and I admit to having been guilty to that as well.
 
4,102
Ireland
Warwick, UK
PJTierney
PJTierney
I don’t think the next game “needs” anything since its current formula has been incredibly successful.

Personally I’d like to see a move away from the FOMO-inducing timed exclusive rewards though I imagine that’s one of the reasons it’s still being supported 2+ years after launch. Forza Horizon 3 felt like a tighter, more focused experience overall.
 

GilesGuthrie

Staff Emeritus
10,973
United Kingdom
Edinburgh, UK
CMDRTheDarkLord
Thoughts from the last few weeks of play:

  • Allow filtering of the car list by TYPE of car (i.e. its purpose, street/rally/offroad etc). I've taken to painting my cars different colours according to their purpose, so I can recognise the street cars (navy blue/silver wheels) from the offroad (matte green/orange).
  • Proper offroad suspension as a tuning option. Currently you have to put the same "rally" suspension on an Audi TT or a Baja truck.
  • "Winter Tyres" are a silent switch as you go in & out of Winter. I was surprised as all hell to get in my 900pp Vette this week and find it was on Rally tyres. I'm guessing this car was built for winter racing and it's been put on rally tyres automatically for autumn.
  • Sort out the ranking of cars in the Eliminator. The Level 6 Subaru is slower across moorland than the Level 4 Subaru. The Level 4 Supra is slower than glacial erosion.
  • Show the track map as an option in the pre-race menu screen
  • Auto-filter the map based on the event type. i.e. "Complete 3 dirt scramble events", there should be a button press to take you to the map, pre-filtered to just show dirt scramble events.
  • Longer races that aren't just the 4 blue-riband events. Seriously, every race being 3 minutes long isn't a challenge.