What If...?

[RACECAR]

This thread is for basically what the title says. to start off, what if the aircraft technology were to be used on prototypes, whether it be le mans or daytona?

 

[Jugend]

[smartypants]It already is. They got wings on cars, you know.[/smartypants]

I don't get the question, really. What kind of aircraft technology? VTOL? Stealth? Heatseeking missiles? A twin blade rotor on top of the drivers helmet?

 

[RACECAR]

[smartypants]It already is. They got wings on cars, you know.[/smartypants]

I don't get the question, really. What kind of aircraft technology? VTOL? Stealth? Heatseeking missiles? A twin blade rotor on top of the drivers helmet?

what you see on Super GT cars, Dude.(Formerly JGTC).

 

[TheCracker]

? ? ? - what aircraft technology is used on Super GT?

 

[GilesGuthrie]

The use of aerodynamics, ultra-lightweight parts (titanium), specific combinations of materials (i.e. carbon fibre) are all pretty much jointly developed by the motorsport and aerospace industries. At the human level, people migrate from aerospace to motorsport and back again all the time.

So yes, given that both aerospace and motorsport require manipulation of air by very strong, very light components, I think that you can really say that the two disciplines are already irrevocably intertwined.

 

[RACECAR]

The use of aerodynamics, ultra-lightweight parts (titanium), specific combinations of materials (i.e. carbon fibre) are all pretty much jointly developed by the motorsport and aerospace industries. At the human level, people migrate from aerospace to motorsport and back again all the time.

So yes, given that both aerospace and motorsport require manipulation of air by very strong, very light components, I think that you can really say that the two disciplines are already irrevocably intertwined.

well now that makes so much sense why the same things are used. so let me clear the confusion I Caused here. what I was trying to ask was what if those very same advanced aero dynamics were to be used on Le mans prototypes or Daytona prototypes? would the cars be much faster?, would the aerodynamics possibly cause a blowover? That was what I was trying to get out.

 

[Layla's Keeper]

Whoever told you that advanced aerodynamics aren't used on LMP's?

Seriously, aerodynamics at Le Mans were way ahead of the JGTC back in the 80's, and they constantly become more and more refined. Have you ever taken a close look at the venturi tunnels and "false floor" of a Reynard, Dallara, or Audi R8?

The ACO has constantly monkeyed with the rules to take away downforce from the aerodynamicists, just like in the FIA, and the aerodynamicists just keep working in the wind tunnel to get it back.

Hell, take a look at the infamous Allard J2X Group C car (from 1992, no less) and tell me that aerodynamics at Le Mans are behind those in JGTC.

 

[RACECAR]

Whoever told you that advanced aerodynamics aren't used on LMP's?

Seriously, aerodynamics at Le Mans were way ahead of the JGTC back in the 80's, and they constantly become more and more refined. Have you ever taken a close look at the venturi tunnels and "false floor" of a Reynard, Dallara, or Audi R8?

The ACO has constantly monkeyed with the rules to take away downforce from the aerodynamicists, just like in the FIA, and the aerodynamicists just keep working in the wind tunnel to get it back.

Hell, take a look at the infamous Allard J2X Group C car (from 1992, no less) and tell me that aerodynamics at Le Mans are behind those in JGTC.

so I see. I wasn't really aware about that and I Just only knew that it was on JGTC cars but not aware that it goes back farther then I thought with LMPS. but what about Daytona Prototypes? or GT1 and GT2 Cars?

 

[Layla's Keeper]

Well, GT1 and GT2 cars have very restricted aerodynamic add ons because the intent of the classes is to remain close to the road car.

GT1 cars are allowed flared fenders, deeper air dams, a restricted amount of "gills", and a very restricted rear wing.

GT2 cars have to have their entire aerodynamic package approved by the ACO/FIA due to even tighter restrictions.

Daytona Prototypes are similarly restricted because the idea is to maintain close competition. However, the cars still produce equivalent downforce to older WSC cars like the Riley & Scott MkIII or Ferrari/Dallara 333SP. Construction methods are similar, too.

Basically, the reason that the major international series like GARRA and Le Mans don't have radical modifications in their GT classes is because the cars must maintain a great deal of relevance to the production/street version. The JGTC is little more than a xenophobic sideshow for Japanese manufacturers with silohouette formula tube chassis cars that have nothing to do with their street counterparts.

 

[RACECAR]

What If:
The Current P2 Class Lola B05/40 was turned into a P1 car?
Pontiac Came Back to Nascar with the GTO?

 

[Layla's Keeper]

Pontiac coming back to NASCAR with the GTO would have the same effect as when Toyota enters NASCAR with the Camry/Solara/whatever - a new set of decals and another limited aero template. The only difference would be an already established engine program in the GM SB2 Cup 358.

As far as the new Lola becoming a P1 car, it's possible provided someone decides to ballast and re-engine the Lola chassis. Many of the new breed of P2 chassis are designed as "dual purpose" chassis due to the success of the outgoing MG Lola EX257.

However, until the former LMP900 class chassis have all disappeared, there is no reason to convert a current P2 car to P1. The older LMP900's are powerful and have less restricted aerodynamics. It's cheaper and easier for the teams to work around new limiters like wing endplates, changed diffuser heights, and added Gurney flaps, than to build up speed from an already limited chassis.

Honestly, though, I really just want the open cockpit pancakes scrapped. I was against the WSC when IMSA and the ACO formed that travesty, and was still against it when it became the LMP class, and remain against it to this very day. Group C/GTP should never have died, and closed cockpit cars (and no, I don't count the Audi publicity stunt that was the Bentley Speed 8's victory) should still rule Le Mans.

As far as I'm concerned, roadsters at Le Mans died the day Gendebien and Hill brought the last Testa Rossa home in first.

 

[RACECAR]

What if:
GTP was brought back?

the 24 hours of le mans became the first round of the LMES?

Mercedes, Cadillac, Toyota, Nissan, Ford, and Honda came back to le mans and possibly came to the american le mans series?

The trans am and the camero was brought back?

 

[Drift260Z]

This thread is for basically what the title says. to start off, what if the aircraft technology were to be used on prototypes, whether it be le mans or daytona?

in F1, I heard that the materials and aero stuff used on a brand new 2005 spec Eurofighter jet used in the RAF were already outdated by the 1991 McLaren F1 car. that gives you an idea of how far ahead F1 technology is . thats just about impossible for a normal human like me to comprehend.








rock.

 

[TheCracker]

The technology used at an aircrafts conception will be every bit as cutting edge as that used by F1 teams. However an aircraft, for example the Eurofighter, will have a gestation period of maybe a decade between drawing board and final in-service airplane. In F1, a car has about 3 or 4 months between these stages.

 

[RACECAR]

what if:

Ferrari returned to prototype racing?

Cadillac came back to ALMS with a gt car and a Prototype?

Lola began competing in the rolex sports car series?

Oldsmobile came Back?

 

[xcsti]

This is the weirdest thread ever, he throws out odd ideas and people respond.

1) The only way I could see it happening is if theri f1 efforts dissolved. They could pull an audi and invest a but load in developement and have something that would be competitive for a few years.

2) The cts-v is a gt car and the aco has been considering allowing cars like it (four doors). They had a prototype a few years ago. I don't remember if it even saw the light of day.

3)Are they still calling it the rolex series? Given the restrictions in the daytona prototype class I doubt they could change much.

4)Not for at least a decade. Even then I doubt they would commit to any motor sports until they were stable.

 

[RACECAR]

What If:

the American Le Mans Series came back to Charlotte, Las Vegas, and Texas(my Home Track!)?

The brand new Viper coupe was two years later a race car run by non other then team oreca?

The Super GT Championship Came to Laguna Seca?

Jacky Ickx or Mario Andretti come back just for the 74th running of the 24 hours of le mans?

Danica Patrick comes to sports car racing?

Team oreca comes for the final two rounds of the A.L.M.S.?

 

[Dorifto]

1) If it went there....then it would be there.

2) It should have happened a couple of years ago, but when it does happen, the Viper will dominate like it did in the late '90s early '00s once again.

3) Basically any track other than California Speedway would be cool. If it came to Laguna Seca, then I would go and watch.

4) They would get tired after a coulple hours and retire.

5) If she goes, she goes. Not much more to it.

6) If that happened, I would smile.


Now: What if Formula 1 went back to those crazy turbocharged engines, huge slicks, possible ground effects, and no damn regulations that make everything so "safe". Also, what if they un-kinked the mulsanne?

 

[RACECAR]

1) If it went there....then it would be there.

2) It should have happened a couple of years ago, but when it does happen, the Viper will dominate like it did in the late '90s early '00s once again.

3) Basically any track other than California Speedway would be cool. If it came to Laguna Seca, then I would go and watch.

4) They would get tired after a coulple hours and retire.

5) If she goes, she goes. Not much more to it.

6) If that happened, I would smile.


Now: What if Formula 1 went back to those crazy turbocharged engines, huge slicks, possible ground effects, and no damn regulations that make everything so "safe". Also, what if they un-kinked the mulsanne?

"looks like the tables have turned Mr.Powers"
if the turbocharged engines came plus the huge slicks plus ground effects and they had no safety restrictions, basically people would get killed. and if they unkinked the mulsanne, everyone thinks the blowover from 99 was scary, they haven't seen nothing yet.
"looks like the tables have turned again Dr. Evil"
What if:

the R8 was hybrid?(as opposed to just subtle modifications.)

Dale JR comes back to ALMS to race just at Sonoma?(if you saw last year,that was toasty)

Olive Garden Team Rafinelli comes back to the ALMS with New Improved Lamborghini Murcielagos?

Bobby rahal comes to The A.L.M.S.?

 

[Layla's Keeper]

Formula One has never raced at the Circuit le Sarthe, so an F1 car's speed down the Mulsanne is moot.

Mario Andretti HAS come back to Le Mans several times - most recently with Panoz - because it's a thorn in his side that he's never won at Le Mans. His best shot was actually in 1969 when he was contracted to Ferrari, but he ended up with a 312P instead of a 512S, which is still a moot point because neither car was reliable enough for a good finish that year.

Rafanelli Olive Garden developed their 550 Maranellos because of the fanaticism of the owner for Ferrari. To run a Lamborghini would be heresy to any tifosi, and Mr. Rafanelli is most definitely tifosi. Besides, the Murciealago has proven ineffective on American road courses.

 

[RACECAR]

what If:

GTP was brought back?

there was a race that was 48 hours?

Buick(if were still here)Made a protoype Called the "La Sarthe"?

Klaus Ludwig came back to sports car racing after a 7 year absince?


BTW, I found something interesting to know(and if you already know, don't make me look like an Dumbass)anyway, I have found out the location of the other C5R.
now we know that pacific coast motorsports has the # 4 corvette but the # 3 championship winning car(also running on yokohama tires) is owned by a Belgian racing team.

 

[RACECAR]

what if:

the rumors about honda's le mans efforts were true?

BMW returns With An LMP1 and GT2 car?

Mazda builds there own LMP(P1 or P2)chassis?

Lister comes to ALMS with its V12 Storm Cars?



BTW, next week, I will post a new forum Called "Camyron's Concepts"(Camyron is my real name). It will feature drawings of possible cars(new or redesigned) to race in respective racing series.

 

[RACECAR]

What if:

Gran Turismo stopped being exclusive to sony(much like square enix did with nintindo)?







BTW, a virus caused my computer to crash,destroying all my saved stuff in all so thats why my thred was not posted but sometime this week I should be done and have it posted it up.

 

[RACECAR]

What If:
BMW came back to the ALMS?

Cadillac came back to the Rolex Sports Car Series?

 

[Layla's Keeper]

BMW is right now gearing up to bring the new E90 generation of the 3 series into WTCC competition and has purchased the Sauber F1 team to create BMW's own team (pulling out of Williams).

There was word that they were planning a go at FIA GT1 competition with the M6, but that project appears stillborn.

If anything, BMW would go to the LMES first, as most competitors are, after proving the M6 in FIA GT1.

As far as Cadillac returning, they attempted to convince the ACO that four doors should be allowed in GT so that they could enter the CTS-V. The ACO didn't bite, and Cadillac is quite happy with their success in Speed World Challenge.

 

[RACECAR]

What if:

Honda, Nissan(as a car manufacter), and Toyota returned in 06 to compete in the Rolex Sports Car Series or the ALMS(and at Le mans)?

Charlotte, Texas, and Las vegas became Part of the grand am Schedule?

 

[Tornado]

1. The racing would be good. Nissan's already race in Grand Am and have a good fight against the Mustangs.
2. People would stop watching Grand Am and it would go down the toilet. Oval tracks are not places for close to stock sports cars. Trans Am maybe. Grand Am, no.

 

[Layla's Keeper]

Not to mention Toyota is already an engine supplier in the Daytona Prototypes with Lexus badging. In fact, Chip Ganassi Racing uses Lexus power in their Rileys and are the only exception to the Pontiac dominance.

Charlotte, Texas, and Vegas all have "roval" configurations, and in fact Charlotte used to host IMSA rounds in the 80's and 90's.

However, GARRA is moving more towards traditional natural terrarin road courses. While Phoenix is a traditional sports car venue (again, lots of IMSA racing) and Homestead is a staple of the GARRA calendar, the most successful (aside from Daytona) weekends this year were Mid-Ohio, Mosport, and Laguna Seca.

 

[RACECAR]

What If:
Lister Comes to the ALMS full time?

The Audi R8 would have been a Hybrid?





BTW, good news for the texas residents here in GTP, the ALMS is Coming to houston next year.

 

[Layla's Keeper]

What if you freaking DISCUSSED why you asked these questions and the answers you're giving instead of tossing out random (and often inane) questions?

And considering the state of ACO, right now "hybrid" has more the "obsolete chassis pressed into another year of service" meaning than "electric propulsion supplement to internal combustion".

Besides, the electric/internal combustion hybrid has already been tried at Le Mans. Doesn't anyone remember Sparky?