What is PD's reasoning with Sport?

[RAMburger]

This is the first GT game on PS4, and they are essentially bringing the "next generation" of GT out with what essentially looks to be a budget title. Or perhaps it's an experimental work-in-progress. They keep touting the PS4's superior processing power but eliminated dynamic weather and day/night cycles. I suppose the sound will have significant improvements which are long overdue, but what else will really make this title stand out?

It's simply difficult to see at this point in time how this game will reinvigorate the GT brand, and reinforce its status as the penultimate IP in the genre.

What are your thoughts?

 

[dbarrade]

I feel like it's a prologue and an experimental tie in with FIA eSport. I believe they will release a Spec II with more content but by then it will be too late and the media will have ripped them to shreds regardless of any improvements they have made over previous GT's.

 

[MisterOne77]

I see this game as an experiment. It seems like PD are seeing whether the community will like this new direction of GT, or if they will reject it, which seems to be the case.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I see this game as an experiment. It seems like PD are seeing whether the community will like this new direction of GT, or if they will reject it, which seems to be the case.

Sony and PD aren't conducting an experiment. You don't experiment with $$hundreds of millions on the line. PD and Sony are convinced this is the way to go in the future and they are attempting to re-establish the GT brand in the direction they think console gaming is headed. Most of us also believe this is the general direction gaming is headed. Note for accuracy that headed is a direction, not a destination. Where we disagree is how far we are along that path and whether or not the general direction of gaming applies specifically to this genre at the same level it does to combat/confrontational games and FPS shooters.

 

[RAMburger]

Sony and PD aren't conducting an experiment. You don't experiment with $$hundreds of millions on the line. PD and Sony are convinced this is the way to go in the future and they are attempting to re-establish the GT brand in the direction they think console gaming is headed. Most of us also believe this is the general direction gaming is headed. Note for accuracy that headed is a direction, not a destination. Where we disagree is how far we are along that path and whether or not the general direction of gaming applies specifically to this genre at the same level it does to combat/confrontational games and FPS shooters.

If they're going to water down the traditional campaign/career mode to focus on online then they better at least make sure it's as stable as bedrock, because even then it'll be tough to get most of the fanbase on board with this new direction. How awesome would it be if this was structured like Most Wanted '05, where you could take a customized car out of the garage, go cruising and race however you'd like. I think the online should be an additional component, not the main focus. It still has too shaky a history (microtransactions, host advantage/lag/connection issues, glitchers/cheaters, etc.) to rely on , and I just don't see this going well.

 

[VBR]

What are your thoughts?

I think I'm more inclined to buy Project CARS 2 than GT Sport. Because of the new direction this will be the first GT game I'm not wanting to buy, & that's coming from someone who's main thing is online racing. Tried the GTS beta & was less than impressed with the stability of the netcode, GT5 & GT6 ran way better on my set up.

 

[MisterWaffles]

Tried the GTS beta & was less than impressed with the stability of the netcode, GT5 & GT6 ran way better on my set up.

Wondering what your reasoning behind this is. GT5 had one of the buggiest crap netcodes of an online game I've ever played. GT6 was better but I still had many issues. The experience I had in the GTS beta was much smoother than any the PS3 era games had to offer,

 

[FerrariF1GT]

What is PD's reasoning with Sport?

Polyphony has partnered with the FIA, the world's premier motorsport governing body, to create a game that focuses on e-sports. Some of the steps Polyphony has taken to push this concept include balancing the majority of the game's cars into classes (e.g. Gr.3, Gr.4, N300) and using balance of performance to make each car's capabilities relatively equal to its class rivals. Whether or not this will work in the long run is up for debate because the 'first impressions' are mixed between the community.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Wondering what your reasoning behind this is. GT5 had one of the buggiest crap netcodes of an online game I've ever played. GT6 was better but I still had many issues. The experience I had in the GTS beta was much smoother than any the PS3 era games had to offer,

I'll take a wild guess and say he was less than impressed with the stability of the netcode and that GT5 & GT6 ran way better on his set up.

 

[MeechShrykull]

eSport

heh
good luck getting the average gamer to care
its astounding how out of touch PD is with their audience

 

[eran0004]

This is the first GT game on PS4, and they are essentially bringing the "next generation" of GT out with what essentially looks to be a budget title.

Budget title? How?

heh
good luck getting the average gamer to care
its astounding how out of touch PD is with their audience

Where do they even get their ideas from?

 

[Bobert power]

I think the reason for Sport was to redo the racing formula. It is short, sweet, and to the point this time around. I'm actually glad PD is changing course (As far as we know) toward a motorsport approach.

 

[Sick Cylinder]

All this wait and so little content - no I won't be buying!

There was no need to start all the cars over again. The obsession with perfection is what has led to such a late and thin game - unfortunately Kaz always seems to be working towards something in the future rather than producing something for the here and now.

 

[Muxlee]

do you need a PSN subscription to play the game online or enter the esports leagues/races ?

 

[PhaedrusSocrate]

To play online any game like GT, yes you need subscription... But, also, such games do have periods when they are "free", and some modes of online gameplay can be made permanently free. So, strictly theoreticaly, GTS could decide to have FIA stuff for free (at least for time being) but typical private online (lobies) is bound to demand subscription. Imo

 

[queleuleu]

All I know a lot of people are not keen to buy GTSport because of the "career mode". They're not against the idea of a big online mode, they just want next to it a traditional career mode. I guess it won't sell as much as a usual GT because of the online focus.

 

[Tired Tyres]

do you need a PSN subscription to play the game online or enter the esports leagues/races ?

Online racing against others. Yes you will need Plus. Anything else no. Same with any other online title. The only ones you don't have to have Plus for are free to play titles and the subscription games like Final Fantasy Realm Reborn.

 

[Johnnypenso]

All I know a lot of people are not keen to buy GTSport because of the "career mode". They're not against the idea of a big online mode, they just want next to it a traditional career mode. I guess it won't sell as much as a usual GT because of the online focus.

I wonder how many people will get "tricked" into buying the game thinking there is a big offline campaign mode ala previous iterations of the game. Sure the advertising doesn't say, "Ok we scrapped that big offline career", and you wouldn't expect them to announce it this way. But when casual fans skim through the features of this game I think many will assume it's a traditional GT game but with all the added features listed on the official PS or GT websites. I believe there's going to be some post purchase regret among the casual fans that they can't push a couple of buttons and be in endless race series with their highly modified Honda Civic, effortlessly beating AI like a rented mule.

 

[queleuleu]

I wonder how many people will get "tricked" into buying the game thinking there is a big offline campaign mode ala previous iterations of the game. Sure the advertising doesn't say, "Ok we scrapped that big offline career", and you wouldn't expect them to announce it this way. But when casual fans skim through the features of this game I think many will assume it's a traditional GT game but with all the added features listed on the official PS or GT websites. I believe there's going to be some post purchase regret among the casual fans that they can't push a couple of buttons and be in endless race series with their highly modified Honda Civic, effortlessly beating AI like a rented mule.

Random tweets :


Most liked comment on the official channel for the Gamescom trailer : "Please add a proper campaign mode with a progression system D:< !!!!"

I'm surprised that Sony let them do knowing how misconceived GTSport is.

 

[Muxlee]

To play online any game like GT, yes you need subscription... But, also, such games do have periods when they are "free", and some modes of online gameplay can be made permanently free. So, strictly theoreticaly, GTS could decide to have FIA stuff for free (at least for time being) but typical private online (lobies) is bound to demand subscription. Imo

well that's going to be an expensive game , one of the reasons I dumped forza was because of the nag screens, with very little offline content as a casual player I cant justify a monthly subscription for GTS.

 

[RAMburger]

Budget title? How?

They removed standard features already mentioned in this thread to essentially make a bare bones online only racing game. Yes it looks amazing and sound has improved, along with what I'm sure will be exceptionally accurate physics algorithms for the cars, but they seem to be alienating a huge chunk of their fan base by taking away several loved and major features (full fledged offline career mode, dynamic weather/ToD, etc.).

I'll call it: if this is the future direction of the franchise, then watch people's interest level drop, and hence sales. It leaves the only explanation for this new direction to be that they (PD/Sony) think the brand is popular enough to buck the trend, because if the last couple generations have shown anything it is that online-focused games still carry a well-deserved stigma. At this point it almost seems like there's a PD curse in effect since they haven't hit a home run in well over a generation since GT3 A-Spec. It's like every installment since has caused enough consternation of some kind to threaten or dismantle its status as the driving sim king.

I hope I'm eventually proven wrong, but so far there simply hasn't been enough reasoning to prove otherwise.

 

[eran0004]

They removed standard features already mentioned in this thread to essentially make a bare bones online only racing game. Yes it looks amazing and sound has improved, along with what I'm sure will be exceptionally accurate physics algorithms for the cars, but they seem to be alienating a huge chunk of their fan base by taking away several loved and major features (full fledged offline career mode, dynamic weather/ToD, etc.).

I'll call it: if this is the future direction of the franchise, then watch people's interest level drop, and hence sales. It leaves the only explanation for this new direction to be that they (PD/Sony) think the brand is popular enough to buck the trend, because if the last couple generations have shown anything it is that online-focused games still carry a well-deserved stigma. At this point it almost seems like there's a PD curse in effect since they haven't hit a home run in well over a generation since GT3 A-Spec. It's like every installment since has caused enough consternation of some kind to threaten or dismantle its status as the driving sim king.

I hope I'm eventually proven wrong, but so far there simply hasn't been enough reasoning to prove otherwise.

They added a ton of non-standard features though. Sure, it's a change of direction, but budget title? No.

 

[Sick Cylinder]

I think the direction of GT Sport was forced when they made the decision to make fresh cars and not reuse the premium content. The obsession with perfection forced this. The PS4 is not particularly powerful and is already a few years old - despite this PD decided to push the graphics with new "Super Premium" cars. The effect of this is a game which had to have dynamic time of day and weather deleted.

PD have previously stated that it takes them half a man year to produce each car. If GT Sport had released when originally planned the car list would have been embarassingly small.

Personally I think that decision to waste the premium assets and start again was completely and utterly unfathomable. It dictated a small car list - it created a big delay and forced the creation of a niche game with a very narrow focus - online play and photos.

If we look at the things which are most complained about in threads about GT6 - the quality of the graphics on the cars is very low on the list. Poor sounds is probably top, together with feeble, chase the rabbit AI. I expect sounds to be slightly better, but the lack of a career mode suggests to me that PD have just thrown in the towel and admitted defeat - perhaps they simply can't code convincing AI.

Replays and photomode / scapes will be class leading, but what is the point of that if the car selection is uninspiring.

This could have been such a great game - it could have had online FIA championships, great photo mode, great car list, great career mode, but strange strategic decisions by PD create a game which I can only see having very limited appeal. It will still sell well because many people will buy anything with the GT name, but I think it will end up on the shelf gathering dust earlier than any previous GT titles.

 

[Tired Tyres]

It wasn't forced at all. There are 50 car modellers listed in GT6's credits. They can make 100 cars a year. That's an easy 350 cars. Instead you'll get 177 or so. That's on purpose decision making.

 

[Mr Tree]

heh
good luck getting the average gamer to care
its astounding how out of touch PD is with their audience

Well, I'm not sure if it will take off.
But! I really think becausr of the average (somewhat higher) age on these boards we live in a bubble.

All my younger friends detest offline features. 'Bots are stupid and don't give any sense of accomplishment.' that's their pov.
Those players are numerous these days look at csgo, dota2, LoL, ...
And there is only one way to get those playerd into race sims, that is offering them dece't matchmade games.

This does not mean gts will succeed at their goal but 'us' offline players are in the decline and online play is the future. Sony/PD jist want to try and hop onto that wagon.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Well, I'm not sure if it will take off.
But! I really think becausr of the average (somewhat higher) age on these boards we live in a bubble.

All my younger friends detest offline features. 'Bots are stupid and don't give any sense of accomplishment.' that's their pov.
Those players are numerous these days look at csgo, dota2, LoL, ...
And there is only one way to get those playerd into race sims, that is offering them dece't matchmade games.

This does not mean gts will succeed at their goal but 'us' offline players are in the decline and online play is the future. Sony/PD jist want to try and hop onto that wagon.

As has been pointed out many times, racing games are not fighting games. The requirements are the opposite and it means racing games aren't as easily suited to online play as combat games. Fighting requires nothing more than aggression and the ability and willingness to annihilate your enemy. There are no rules are than the physical limitations imposed by the game. Racing requires etiquette and respect for the other person's space and gameplay. It requires delicate, pinpoint control. There is an expectation on all players that they will conform to real life norms and behaviours that mimic real racing. It only takes one person to upset the balance of an entire event. 2 or 3 that decide not to conform can easily ruin an entire race.

Sure, in a lobby with like minded individuals it's great. Everything else is time consuming and frustrating. PD is attempting to defy all statistics from all online/offline racing games to date and create a huge online community where none has existed before. It's a bold attempt but IMO, short sighted and not suited to the majority of racing gamers that still prefer a large offline career. Even in a GTP poll of what I would presume are hardcore fans and not typical, casual fans, still favour the inclusion of an online career to the tune of 86.5%!! It would have taken little effort to produce a career mode and the AI looks improved enough in some videos to make it workable.

 

[Mr Tree]

As has been pointed out many times, racing games are not fighting games. The requirements are the opposite and it means racing games aren't as easily suited to online play as combat games. Fighting requires nothing more than aggression and the ability and willingness to annihilate your enemy. There are no rules are than the physical limitations imposed by the game. Racing requires etiquette and respect for the other person's space and gameplay. It requires delicate, pinpoint control. There is an expectation on all players that they will conform to real life norms and behaviours that mimic real racing. It only takes one person to upset the balance of an entire event. 2 or 3 that decide not to conform can easily ruin an entire race.

Sure, in a lobby with like minded individuals it's great. Everything else is time consuming and frustrating. PD is attempting to defy all statistics from all online/offline racing games to date and create a huge online community where none has existed before. It's a bold attempt but IMO, short sighted and not suited to the majority of racing gamers that still prefer a large offline career. Even in a GTP poll of what I would presume are hardcore fans and not typical, casual fans, still favour the inclusion of an online career to the tune of 86.5%!! It would have taken little effort to produce a career mode and the AI looks improved enough in some videos to make it workable.

Well I agree like I stated I'm not sure they'll pull it of due to the reasons you state. I think the truth is we're a dying breed. So all these racegames are trying to implement systems to force us to race clean as to try and counter the issues you stated, as to try and open up online play.

Wheter or not they succeed I truly believe online play is the way to go if a gaming company want's to keep it's head above water in the future.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Well I agree like I stated I'm not sure they'll pull it of due to the reasons you state. I think the truth is we're a dying breed. So all these racegames are trying to implement systems to force us to race clean as to try and counter the issues you stated, as to try and open up online play.

Wheter or not they succeed I truly believe online play is the way to go if a gaming company want's to keep it's head above water in the future.

There's no logic behind dropping one massive gameplay element in favour of the supposed future, when everyone else in this genre that is even remotely successful is perfectly capable of doing both. There's no need to choose a single direction for the game at all. They could have done everything exactly the same and just added in the offline career as a traditional feature. They could still have focused all the marketing and all the effort towards the online portion of the game just like they are doing now. The fact that they didn't is truly baffling.

 

[MisterOne77]

They removed standard features already mentioned in this thread to essentially make a bare bones online only racing game. Yes it looks amazing and sound has improved, along with what I'm sure will be exceptionally accurate physics algorithms for the cars, but they seem to be alienating a huge chunk of their fan base by taking away several loved and major features (full fledged offline career mode, dynamic weather/ToD, etc.).

I'll call it: if this is the future direction of the franchise, then watch people's interest level drop, and hence sales. It leaves the only explanation for this new direction to be that they (PD/Sony) think the brand is popular enough to buck the trend, because if the last couple generations have shown anything it is that online-focused games still carry a well-deserved stigma. At this point it almost seems like there's a PD curse in effect since they haven't hit a home run in well over a generation since GT3 A-Spec. It's like every installment since has caused enough consternation of some kind to threaten or dismantle its status as the driving sim king.

I hope I'm eventually proven wrong, but so far there simply hasn't been enough reasoning to prove otherwise.

What about GT4? That if I'm not mistaken is loved to death. Probably on the same level as GT3.

 

[RAMburger]

Well, I'm not sure if it will take off.
But! I really think becausr of the average (somewhat higher) age on these boards we live in a bubble.

All my younger friends detest offline features. 'Bots are stupid and don't give any sense of accomplishment.' that's their pov.
Those players are numerous these days look at csgo, dota2, LoL, ...
And there is only one way to get those playerd into race sims, that is offering them dece't matchmade games.

This does not mean gts will succeed at their goal but 'us' offline players are in the decline and online play is the future. Sony/PD jist want to try and hop onto that wagon.

The problem with that is these younger gamers see the online era as completely acceptable or as good as we can hope for, because they have no earlier basis to pull from. Anyone who's gamed since the 90's or earlier probably sees things through a very different lense.

I'd love for PD to pull this off, but reality weighs in heavily against all odds. There is even a poll in another thread in this forum that shows most people would prefer offline career features. I have no problem with online if it's stable and secure, which is rarely the case; at least not compared to offline.