what on earth has happened here then?

  • Thread starter Thread starter tam38gti
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moron88
sport softs suck. they cant put more than 400hp down with any aggressive driving. race softs struggle with 600hp at times. if we want to run race softs, how does it effect you?
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Sports Softs can put down 700hp with smart driving
It affects everyone else because in online racing, you'll have more grip than anyone playing with realistic tires.
 
Brakes were on 4/3. Ride height was down about 30mm front 20mm rear. Spring rates were untouched, fairly soft.
 
I thought of this the first time I saw them in GT6 lol.

 
Streeto
Honestly I don't think slicks (racing tires) should be allowed on any road car at all, the only real world situation that you see road cars using slicks is in drag racing to put down all that excessive power.
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The real world application of slicks is whenever the owner puts slicks on the car. Not allowing them on road cars make no sense at all.
 
Numbers
yeah racing tires on a non racing car please.

be a man and run sport softs
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I shouldn't really have to defend this but if you read the Thread you'll see I was experimenting with tyre combinations in order to set the quickest time possible. The thing is though, you know, if I fancy putting RS tyres on a roadcar I can. And do.
 
tam38gti
I shouldn't really have to defend this but if you read the Thread you'll see I was experimenting with tyre combinations in order to set the quickest time possible. The thing is though, you know, if I fancy putting RS tyres on a roadcar I can. And do.
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Dude you don't have to defend, it is just that RS and driving aids seems to be a call for penis contest in this forum
 
Numbers
yeah racing tires on a non racing car please.

be a man and run sport softs
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So you can't put race tyres on a road car that you are racing? Surely if you decide to race a car it becomes a 'racing car' for the duration of the race?
If you enter a road car into a Dirt rally should it be fitted with Sports or comfort tyres because it isn't a rally car?

There is nothing wrong with using lower compound tyres. If you're in an online lobby and you want it to be fair specify the compound you want to use.
Equally there is nothing wrong with using Race tyres to Race!

Back on topic, I wonder if the problem with stoppies and odd rollover behavior is related to the high speed aero problems in GT6 (top speeds way to high on some cars) or if they are relics from GT3 and 4's wheelie glitch (we only have PDs word the physics engine is ALL new')
 
bikerbob951
You're joking, right? If not, I guess you've not ridden in any cars with race tires... believe me, they are bonkers.
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No, I haven't. And I haven't raced a car in real life, nor had a high performance car. But for some reason, I have the feeling tires in GT have way too much grip. Sport Hards is about as far as I go. SM and SS are saved for special occasions, but I've always thought they are almost too grippy. Looking at the replays it almost looks unnatural the way they make the car stick to the road. And I'm talking about Sport tires.

Maybe I'm wrong.
 
The discussion about racng tires on a road car is not about having slicks on a road car, of course you can do that if you take your car to the track in real life, the issue is that the racing tires in Gran Turismo offer more grip than what is realistic to the equivalent tire in real life. In real life I don't think a normal, everyday family car's chassis could handle the G-forces that the fictional RS tires in GT give you.

Also, as Husky mentioned, even SM and SS seem to have an unnatural amount of grip, SM is about the most I use even on the most powerful of road cars, or SS on the rear if it's an 800+hp muscle car with skinny tires. In replays, most cars still look like they corner too quickly even on SH tires.

Tires however, have nothing to do with the problem in the OP's video, that is about weight, gravity and the car's center of gravity. Something there is wrong, you can still do front flips on CS tires.
 
HuskyGT
No, I haven't. And I haven't raced a car in real life, nor had a high performance car. But for some reason, I have the feeling tires in GT have way too much grip. Sport Hards is about as far as I go. SM and SS are saved for special occasions, but I've always thought they are almost too grippy. Looking at the replays it almost looks unnatural the way they make the car stick to the road. And I'm talking about Sport tires.

Maybe I'm wrong.
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I've never driven a car on tires like that, but I've ridden... it's quite an experience. I highly recommend showing up at an autocross, and just ask for a ride, folks will be more than happy to oblige! I'd equate them to Sport soft, maybe even RH personally. My habits are about like you describe in your post though, SS have more than enough grip in most situations for me!
 
See, I remember a discussion way back when GT5 was in it's prime, and many claims were made that all Racing tire compounds in the game were WAY too grippy compared to reality, even with specialty one-off super tires… I don't know if the same is true for GT6, as I am yet to play it. But from what I saw (and others have mentioned), I think it could be a combination of things, including poor representation of tire grip levels.

It could be that the weight distribution model is inaccurate, and "over-works" itself in extreme situations like this, forcing the car to do more body roll than it should in the real world. That, or it could have something to do with contact points, meaning that since the rear wheels are off the ground, the game engine redistributes puts more force and likely more grip (similar to how the aero model works - the faster you go, the more downward force on the tires, etc.) into the contact points (in this case the front tires), then throwing everything way off balance.

If you combine all three of these problems, this sort of behavior kinda makes sense. But we don't know the inner workings of the engine… So we can't know for sure.
 
BDoggPrelude
Oh really?

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I think it's hilarious how judgmental people are around here. Like there is only one way to play the game, your way of course, and any other way of doing things is wrong.

"Don't use racing soft tires, traction control, SRF, ABS...the X1 is so unrealistic." Just let people play the game how they want to. How does it affect you?
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Those tires would similar to sports soft at most in GT6, I made a variety of Best Motoring replicas -including lap times replicated and sports medium is similar to shaved R comp semi slick ( most tuned car Tsukuba record holder uses this ), while sports soft is similar to DH slick ( no tread ) The last picture tire has wide tread block, probably barely legal :) Here is a quote of my post :

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...snip
Oh, sports soft IMO is roughly equivalent to DH slick tire, so street cars in GT6 with SS tires is just like fitting race tires if comparing grip level. I found this when I built the Toyota Motorsports GmbH 86GT CS V3 replica, I went to some other forum, and asked for opinion from someone who have experience with this car and also have GT6 :D He said the real 86GT Cup car uses DH slick ( Michelin and Pirelli ) and GT6 closest would something in between sports medium and sports soft, while sports medium is like R comp semi slick ( probably shaved ) in most cases. He thinks it's very close to SS tire - he also gave a lot input to help me built the replica.

He also mentioned about race cars with aero and racing tires are a bit different, some are closer with sports soft, some with sports medium and some needs racing hard :confused:, probably just PD tire + aero physics. So RH tire in GT6 would be like fitting DM or DS slick ( he mentioned cars like 458 Italia )and RM tire DSS slick on most non race cars IMHO. This is just based on someone's observation who had real world experience driving cars in GT6, I think his finding is similar to kamuifanboy and another member here who posted comparison video of 86 GT ( real life racers too ) who share similar opinion. I talked too much :lol:
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If anyone curious, try to build my 86GT CS V3 Cup replica, run sports soft at 24H Nurb main start line straight, go to 160kmh/100mph and weave/zig zag while full on throttle, and see how grippy sports soft is.

If want more realistic experience, try build my Wangan Midnight replicas, they are all on comfort soft ( ultra high performance summer tires ) - 600HP Ferrari GT0, 800HP R33 GTR, 800HP Supra RZ.
 
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I love how people always treat generic tire labels in gt as real tires. E.g SH is equivalent to x or y. How do you know? Is there a cross reference table published by PD? Otherwise, most of you are just making things up based on what you believe "seems" real. It's kind of comical.
 
HuskyGT
No, I haven't. And I haven't raced a car in real life, nor had a high performance car. But for some reason, I have the feeling tires in GT have way too much grip. Sport Hards is about as far as I go. SM and SS are saved for special occasions, but I've always thought they are almost too grippy. Looking at the replays it almost looks unnatural the way they make the car stick to the road. And I'm talking about Sport tires.

Maybe I'm wrong.
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Lol. And here is the problem with all of this speculation around here. How do any of you know how these tires handle on different vehicles and different track layouts in real life? Half of you have probably only had your drivers license for a couple years, if at all. The fact that PD has narrowed down ALL of the tires in the world into 9 different levels is already enough. Now all of you "experts" want to try to narrow those 9 down even further because you don't believe they exhibit real world grip? That's laughable at best.

No, I bet you probably haven't ever raced a car on a track. I bet you probably haven't tested numerous different compounds from different manufacturers on different vehicles and different tracks. In truth, you have no idea that a Michelin Pilot Super Sport will probably lay down 1-2 second better lap times than the Bridgestone Potenza S-04 Pole Position on an average track with an average sports car like a Scion FR-S. Those tires would probably fall into the Sport Medium category BTW, if you're going to just dump every tire in the world into 9 different categories.

Personally, I have a good amount of racing experience. I was an avid autocrosser for close to 10 years. In that time, I raced many different vehicles of many different performance levels, many different levels of modification and many different levels of racing classes on various surface types and track layouts using many different tires. I have gone to about a dozen or so road course events, not actual wheel-to-wheel racing but timed laps. I also work in the tire industry and have been invited to and participated in quite a few tire testing events put on by tire manufacturers where they put their new products up against their competitors and put you behind the wheel of cars outfitted with various tires to test them.

What does all this mean? Take it however you want. I know there are many on this forum that have as much or more experience racing as I do. I do not think I am the end all source for racing and tire knowledge. I DO think there are way too many people on this forum that sit on a couch and theorize Gran Turismo physics vs real life when they, in fact, don't know a thing about real life racing.

You want to find out how wide of a range of grip there can be between various tire compounds? Go drive a car outfitted with some cheap entry level Chinese all-season tires and see how the car handles. After that, swap those tires with Pirelli's Super Soft compound F1 tires and see how much of difference there is. Extreme? Yes. Now just try to imagine how many different levels of tires there are between that entry level Chinese junk and those F1 tires. Don't have access to Pirelli F1 tires? Next best thing you could do would be go to a local autocross event. Walk around and talk to some of those guys and they will let you ride in the car with them quite often. See if you can get rides with people that have different types of tires. Might give you a better understanding of what PD is dealing with when they are trying to create tire physics in the game and just how little you actually know about the subject.
 
jr93alty
I love how people always treat generic tire labels in gt as real tires. E.g SH is equivalent to x or y. How do you know? Is there a cross reference table published by PD? Otherwise, most of you are just making things up based on what you believe "seems" real. It's kind of comical.
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The game tells you what the tires are supposed to represent! There is a description for each variety of tire when you go to the tuning shop and the one for comfort tires describes them as being the best representation of real world road tires. Furthermore, PD uses a photo next to the tire types as further description, with the one next to comfort tires depicting a street radial, the one next to sports tires depicting a cup tire, and the one next to racing tires showing a true slick tire. Whether or not PD has accurately modeled each tire type is open for debate, but it is incredibly obvious what each type is supposed to represent.

You say, "how do we know?", that we're making this stuff up? I say, how on earth do people stumble through the game so blindly not noticing things like the images next to the tire selections? If a sports tire is not a cup tire why do PD show a picture of a cup tire? If a comfort tire is not supposed to be a street radial why do they show a picture of one of them next to them? It's obvious! :banghead::banghead::banghead:
 
tam38gti
This is my admittedly poor iphone capture of what to me was a strange and surprising game handling/behaviour flaw. The car in question is an Evo, tuned to just around 500pp - so you might fairly imagine that handling would be fairly benign and predictable - but no. Have a look...

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pre-order cancelled. X(
 
Outeke
IMO a car would not flip over like that, but then again, it is a videogame!
And when PD touches it, ANYTHING is possible ;)
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When you are going ~130km/h down the slope and hit something with 1 side of the car/1 tire this is exactly what will happen! Depending on the speed the car will either roll or just go on one of it's sides.
Seriously ... this happens all the time, even irl.
Dodzzz
Can anybody do that in GT6?
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Well like 2-3 weeks ago I saw a clip of a GT planet member that was doing a race on Monte Carlo. He went on 2 wheels after the Grand hotel hairpin and was going like that all the way to Mirabeau bus before coming to his 4 wheels. Maybe if it was a straight he would have gone like that for longer. :)
We all know that from one point the car will flip and rotate in the air just like the car has no mass at all, yes.
Oh, here is tha man - BrandonW77 - see upper post.
But I don't see a problem with you hitting a kerb with 100km/h and flipping over.
 
f1webberfan
When you are going ~130km/h down the slope and hit something with 1 side of the car/1 tire this is exactly what will happen! Depending on the speed the car will either roll or just go on one of it's sides.
Seriously ... this happens all the time, even irl.
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Yeah it happens in RL......
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But to a normal heavy car....no way it will come up as it does in the video.
 
Outeke
Yeah it happens in RL......
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But to a normal heavy car....no way it will come up as it does in the video.
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Well ... mass in space doesn't matter, as well as aerodynamics.
As for the video, my opinion is still the same - if you hit something at high speed you will get airborne.
 

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