Why do people still like and follow F1 so much?

[Earth]

The cars are no longer interesting. When I started watching in the late 90s there was V10s vs V12s, and they all looked different, not this specish racing you have now.

Interesting courses like Hockenheim have gotten neutered into another generic, soulless track

Vettel is winning everything and no rival has emerged. Jimmie Johnson may have won alot of recent NASCAR championships but almost every one of them featured a rival that pushed him until the very last race.

So many gimmicks like bad tires and DRS to create artificial passing. Boring racing wasnt that big of a problem when the cars were at least interesting.

As far as Im concerned theres way better racing out there. Indycar had an amazing year, but Im guessing nobody noticed because...they dont have red cars?

I dont see a reason to watch F1 anymore really. The cars arent exciting, one team/driver is dominating, the tracks arent exciting, the racing is contrived, what really is left to make it worth watching? Its past pedigree?

Is it that F1 is the racing league for casuals so it will always have a massive following? Sort of like the McDonalds of racing? With the WEC Audi vs Toyota vs Porsche battle looming, along with the USCC, and another season of Indycar on the horizon, what does F1 have that makes it better then any of these? The cars are faster?

 

[G.T.Ace]

I'm thinking like this since years.

 

[niky]

F1 still gets attention because it's international in exposure (much as I loved CART in the 90's, I'll be damned if I can find Indycar coverage locally except in off-hours replays on odd channels), because it has the most money, big name talent and that whole rockstar vibe still going for it.

Of course, a lot of long-time viewers share your sentiment, and popularity seems to be waning amongst the hardcore.

Note: there's nothing really "casual" about F1. You can watch it casually, but most of us have the TV, live commentary feeds off websites and timing apps all open at the same time. If not for the technical side of the sport, this year's races would have gotten very boring very quick.

Some of them still did.

-

Interesting =/= competitive.

Mass dampers were "interesting". They were banned because they were an unfair advantage.

Double diffusers were "interesting". Banned. Too effective.

Exhaust-blown diffusers were "interesting". Ditto.

The cars are mostly the same simply to make racing competitive. But obviously, that's not working out all to well.

 

[Bo]

Because there's still hope that Red Bull can get Vettel's and Ricciardo's ERS units/gearboxes mixed up. Or they douse the wrong car in petrol.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The cars are no longer interesting. When I started watching in the late 90s there was V10s vs V12s, and they all looked different, not this specish racing you have now.

No longer interesting? I really don't see how they aren't and when you look at the close details and even the obvious ones you see the cars are very different. As for the engines far too many people are stuck in a rut about this, and to be honest it's asinine. There were 4,6,8,10,12,16 cyl in different variations (not yet turbo for any) a generation and a half before we ever came to exist. Back then people were saying what you've said now that the cars looked spec driven.

Interesting courses like Hockenheim have gotten neutered into another generic, soulless track

This I agree, but it isn't an F1 problem considering all the other top tier series that race there. It's an FIA issue and that goes far beyond F1.

Vettel is winning everything and no rival has emerged. Jimmie Johnson may have won alot of recent NASCAR championships but almost every one of them featured a rival that pushed him until the very last race.

So many gimmicks like bad tires and DRS to create artificial passing. Boring racing wasnt that big of a problem when the cars were at least interesting.

Same for Vettel bar two seasons, and we all know if it weren't for the chase, it'd be the same in NASCAR, you have to rationalize and level the argument to make it work. I've just done that.

As far as Im concerned theres way better racing out there. Indycar had an amazing year, but Im guessing nobody noticed because...they dont have red cars?

Sure they do they're the fast ones with the target on them . Indy Car doesn't get much attraction because it isn't broadcast in the most accessible of environments and since IZOD has left, perhaps a new sponsor will do a better job of promoting the racing like Rolex or Sprint does.

I dont see a reason to watch F1 anymore really. The cars arent exciting, one team/driver is dominating, the tracks arent exciting, the racing is contrived, what really is left to make it worth watching? Its past pedigree?

Then don't watch it if it annoys you that much, it's not like a sim racing game where are enjoyment is a requirement for it's success. The corporate recognition and manufacture competition at the top level either here or in WEC is what is most important, as you can see the fans as far as the FIA see are just static objects. The tracks aren't F1's fault since plenty of other big groups race on them, and thus you must not enjoy them either? The cars aren't exciting because why? Other than what you said earlier there are several eras that that can easily be said and tossed too. I agree though that just like NASCAR and some of what Indy has done and others perhaps TUDOR that gimmicks aren't racing and everyone should learn from those that are still making competitive fun to watch racing.

Is it that F1 is the racing league for casuals so it will always have a massive following? Sort of like the McDonalds of racing? With the WEC Audi vs Toyota vs Porsche battle looming, along with the USCC, and another season of Indycar on the horizon, what does F1 have that makes it better then any of these? The cars are faster?

F1 is not the racing league for the casuals, you just don't realize how many long time fans and enthusiasts of cars and engineering along with the rich elite are out there keeping it big. F1 has a whole new set of rules for one and really I can understand the rant but when you factor in what many of us have said on the other F1 threads it'd be wise to see what happens next year.

 

[XPOWER180]

Well said, OP! F1 is just utterly boring, all car's look the same and each new circuit that pops up to replace a loved classic just looks bland and soulless. I only bother with the BTCC, WTCC, Australian V8's and DTM now. Far more action and all on classic circuits!

 

[Akmuq]

"Vettel is winning everything and no rival has emerged."
2010, 2012.

Also, I don't think anyone not American will pay attention to USCC.

 

[Northstar]

Just because Vettel/Red Bull has won the titles for 4 years straight doesn't mean it's not competitive, both 2010 and 2012 went down to the last race and this year Ferrari, Lotus and Mercedes were all battling for 2-4 for the entire season. Next year should be even more interesting in the constructor battle as Red Bull has a new driver and both Ferrari and Mercedes have really good line-ups.

 

[Dennisch]

And maybe next year we finally get to see engine blow ups.

 

[Diehardracer]

Strangely I find myself agreeing with LMSCorvetteGT2. I watched a lot of it in 2013 (despite the BBC having to run a broadcast schedule where half of the rounds was full race coverage and the other half extended highlights no thanks to Sky TV again winning the rights) and I really fail to see where the disadvantages are. I think if you look closely enough at something you can find fault with anything. And I should know how true I think that is. You all know my views on studying a motorsport so much to such a great degree you cease enjoying it for what it is. When you get too involved in wanting to know about the mechanical and financial aspects of a series then you stop becoming a spectator.

I found the effort put in by Mercedes really quite good. Ferrari had it's good days. There was lots of good things about F1 2013. Here is to more of the same in 2014.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

And maybe next year we finally get to see engine blow ups.

You mean like Grosjean's car or like Bianchi's this year.

 

[Dennisch]

Yes, but more.

 

[R0ssingt0n]

I only watch F1 because any motorsport is better than no motorsport. Although if, say, the BTCC was on at the same time as F1 I'll watch the BTCC. F1 is a last resort for me.

 

[Bo]

I only watch F1 because any motorsport is better than no motorsport. Although if, say, the BTCC was on at the same time as F1 I'll watch the BTCC. F1 is a last resort for me.

IMO, BTCC is the best series in the world currently. It has an atmosphere that no other series could capture.

 

[Bigbazz]

It's the same old complaints as far back as I can remember to be honest.

Vettel dominating yes, but it went down to the wire in 2010 and 2012. In 2010 we had an amazing season and 2011 though dominated by Vettel had some of the best races I've ever seen. In 2000-2004 you had the same, Schumacher dominating and people hated F1 then, and even when Senna was popular a lot of people did not like him because of his success.

It will always be that same old "oh the good old days" nonsense. The good old days when 10 or more cars retired in every race. The good old days where top teams had better tyres than the low end teams, even from the same manufacturer. Senna got lucky in Monaco 1984 that the Michelin rain tyres were the same as what the top teams got, the same was not true for the dry weather tyres.

Nowadays it's more of an even playing field. Yes the DRS often causes almost free passes but the drivers have to be faster than the car infront to be in that situation in the first place. Yes they have KERS boost but in the past they had turbo boost that they could turn up, the difference is that KERS actually promotes advances in technology on road cars, something we have already began to see. Sure we have overly sensitive tyres, but the complaint before these was that the Bridgestones being too durable made the racing boring because drivers were always at near peak performance, Pirelli made tyres that spiced up the racing as they were asked and initially it was very popular.


Next year represents some exciting technical changes to the cars. It's all great having 3.5L V10 engines with 900bhp but it does nothing to advance the technology of the future, it's a relic of the past. F1 has to move on and innovate with technology just as Le Mans is doing (Porsche are using a 4 Cylinder in LPM1 next year).

Personally I still love Formula 1, yes there have been a lot of boring races in 2013 but that is attributed mostly to the fact that we're fed up of seeing Sebastian Vettel win. Having a Mclaren uncompetitive didn't exactly help either, the fact is that had you removed Red Bull and Vettel from the championship it would have been a great season. Mercedes, Lotus and Ferrari were all competing with each other.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

@Bigbazz he had other good results in 84, Portugal is the other one that comes to mind.

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

IMO, BTCC is the best series in the world currently. It has an atmosphere that no other series could capture.

I would like to agree but the driving standards are too low, the number of times Turkington got hammered out of the lead by Honda's (including the eventual champion) made the championship a joke. The best series in the world is Blancpain Endurance Series.

 

[Alex.]

BTCC is far, far too slow. There simply isn't enough of a sense of speed for me to enjoy it as racing. WEC is about the limit for me, and the speed is the reason I like to watch F1, as well as the paddock figures and the history of the sport, how it influences the image of F1 today.

 

[Bo]

I would like to agree but the driving standards are too low, the number of times Turkington got hammered out of the lead by Honda's (including the eventual champion) made the championship a joke. The best series in the world is Blancpain Endurance Series.

You really hate Honda. But the driving standards are much better than they were in say 2005-2009, because back then there were so many rivalries the main goal for most people was to ram as many people off the track as they could. It was the time when the Plato vs Neal conflict was reaching its climax:


And we had the likes of Giovanardi and Muller causing carnage:


(Plato went off just where I was standing)

 

[Bigbazz]

If Jason Plato was in F1 he'd be banned within 3 laps, can't believe he gets away with driving like that. I see BTCC hasn't changed all that much since the the 90s in terms of driving standards. I havent watched it since then, that first video in the post above is ridiculous.

 

[Bo]

That was 2006, I got into BTCC because of its fairly stupid driving. It has calmed down a bit since then, but the old guys are still willing to show the kids why they shouldn't mess around (best move i've seen all year, Tordoff had it coming to him the way he was driving):

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I still say WEC and ALMS (now USCR), GT3 stuff and WTCC are the best. F1 and NASCAR could be good if the gimmicks were left to reality TV and not a sport. IZOD I think will be good next year and 2015 with the aero upgrades and changes.

 

[SagarisGTB]

I'd say BES and Super GT are the best right now (huge grids of great cars, tons of action, no gimmicks).

But F1 remains a must-watch because of the unmatched cars, best drivers, and just the fact that it's F1. F1 is F1 and will always have the high stakes and high drama associated with the "pinnacle" of motorsport. F1 is simply the mammoth of (non-US) racing: every bit of news gets attention, every race is watched by millions, the sponsors pay huge amounts to be on the cars, every race gets people talking. F1's fame and history will carry it and keep it at the top for the foreseeable future, no matter what the big wigs do to sabotage themselves.

And it doesn't hurt that F1 has had action packed races over recent seasons. Whether you like the gimmicks or not, the racing has been pretty good the last 4 years.

 

[Imari]

I'd say BES and Super GT are the best right now (huge grids of great cars, tons of action, no gimmicks).

Super GT still has the gimmick (if you want to call it that) of pretty aggressive success ballast. Still, it has some fantastic racing and I love the wide variety of cars that are present in the GT300 class.

 

[Bo]

But next year SuperGT have DRS. I hope no driver ever feels the need to, because i've never seen a driver in SuperGT 'need' an overtaking gimmick.

 

[Diehardracer]

They are ALL good in their own way. All forms of Touring Cars, Single-Seater, GT's...etc. Flogging one for the few bad negates the many good. The BTCC comes in for a lot of lambasting on here for being too slow and for having poor driving standards. But if people were to just take it at face value and enjoy it for what it is and not look too deep where you will inevitably find it easier to find the bad points then the BTCC would be a lot more popular. There is loads of good Independent drivers and teams, loads of diverse machinery, great duels. Is it worth looking overall that for the sake of being pernickety?

I have loved the BTCC since 2001 and to this day feel it unnecessary and needless to worry about things that don't concern me and is really up to the suits at TOCA to sort out. Both technical, mechanical, financial and what you may call judicial. I am a supporter and spectator. My role is to go along and cheer my favourite driver along and be entertained by great racing. I love it and don't see myself wanting to do any different. I am happy. I would love it if everyone was like that.

 

[Bo]

I honestly don't see why people say BTCC is slow. A), They drive faster than you probably ever could, no matter the machinery, and B) Cars doing a constant 200mph doesn't make the racing exciting. Driving inches apart with constant unpredictability makes racing exciting.

 

[HKS racer]

The decanted reduction cost programm started by a whip lover years ago now it's proving all its inefficacy.
F1 teams now are forced to spend million of euros on ultra sophisticated spaceship simulators, with NO guarantee to achieve reliable data because as advanced your simulator can be it will never be as accurate as testing the real car on a real track, expecially when your goal is to gain two-tents of a sec per lap on a given update.

 

[niky]

The alternative being to allow teams to spend hundreds of millions and to have Red Bull still running away with the championship because they have the biggest sponsor of all?

 

[Ardius]

BTCC is far, far too slow. There simply isn't enough of a sense of speed for me to enjoy it as racing. WEC is about the limit for me, and the speed is the reason I like to watch F1, as well as the paddock figures and the history of the sport, how it influences the image of F1 today.

At some of the tracks on the BTCC calendar you can stand far, far closer to the trackside than any F1 race except maybe Monaco (and even then you're paying a premium for that generally!). And at some tracks theres even very little or no high fencing, giving a much better view.
I don't know about you, but I get a much higher sense of speed standing mere yards away from a touring car going 100mph+ than I do standing 1/4 mile away from a F1 car doing 150mph+.

Not to mention this year where we've had the visible farce of drivers driving well below their limit to nurse Pirelli tyres. At least its flat out racing in the BTCC.
Even WEC has more flat out racing, which just goes to show how messed up F1 is these days. Indycar is no better in this respect.

Hell, I've physically sat and watched Indycars doing 200mph+ at Indianapolis and it still wasn't quite the same feeling of "on the limit" as standing somewhere like Lodge corner or Old Hall corner at Oulton Park and watching cars bump around on their suspension and lean with opposite lock all over.

All this is irrelevant anyway as really the greatest sense of speed is this: