Your Opinions on the H-Shifter/Clutch Changes

Do you like or dislike the changes to the H-Shifter/Clutch combo?

  • Like

    Votes: 38 31.4%
  • Dislike

    Votes: 83 68.6%

  • Total voters
    121
  • Poll closed .
The fast drivers were using exploits in the game with the shifter and clutch, including at race start shifting from 1st to second by using just the clutch. Even more average drivers were able to use this exploit to challenge a paddle shifter on pole to the first corner in a race.

I'm not debating that scenario. It's certainly more than possible. I was more referring to the complicated downshift procedure Pigems explained and how that's unlikely to ever be used by a fast driver (because they are good enough to use clutch consistently) or a slow driver trying to beat faster paddle drivers (because they lack the coordination in the first place).
 
I just realized something interesting.......... I did a race with my RCZ Gr.3 Road Car and for the hell of it decided to try it with the H-pattern again. Well, after a few laps of slow shifting I realized I hadn't missed one shift. I started shifting faster and was like wow, this feels like the pre-update shifting. Went back to a standard Lancia Delta and missed a shift every time I shifted too fast. Jumped in the Amuse S2k and pre-update shifting once more. So, I guess PD only implemented this new slower shifting restriction on standard road going cars and not on tuned or modified road going cars that would have modified or upgraded transmissions. I guess in a way the updated shifting is somewhat realistic in this way but if they keep it like this they are going to have to smooth things out a bit. I wish we had options to upgrade parts like previous GT's
 
I'm not debating that scenario. It's certainly more than possible. I was more referring to the complicated downshift procedure Pigems explained and how that's unlikely to ever be used by a fast driver (because they are good enough to use clutch consistently) or a slow driver trying to beat faster paddle drivers (because they lack the coordination in the first place).

They wouldn't do something to make them faster because it was easy for them? I know for a fact they used it.
 
They wouldn't do something to make them faster because it was easy for them? I know for a fact they used it.

So how many top drivers do you know that uses Pigems downshift method then? Not more than a handful I reckon. Again, unless you really want that top 1 spot on the leaderboard, I don't think many will bother constantly switching between stick/paddles. It's a terrible way to drive for a small gain, and certainly not sustainable in a close racing situation. But hey, I'm not an alien so what do I know?
 
VBR
I'd really love to see the GT series taken away from Kaz & given to a game designer who actually has some understanding of what the players want & need.
You do realize he started and owns Polyphony Digital- which owns all rights to the Gran Turismo franchise.. that's his. Despite what people say about Sony having some kind of stake in PD around here, they don't. It's a privately owned game studio...
Edit
"Giving it away to someone else" is never going to/ cannot happen.
 
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You do realize he started and owns Polyphony Digital- which owns all rights to the Gran Turismo franchise.. that's his. Despite what people say about Sony having some kind of stake in PD around here, they don't. It's a privately owned game studio...
Edit
"Giving it away to someone else" is never going to/ cannot happen.
PD are a wholy owned Sony studio, its not a private or independent studio.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyphony_Digital
http://www.polyphony.co.jp/company/
https://www.webcitation.org/65gEJ7aWq?url=http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/index.html

Sony own the rights to the GT series, and while very unlikely could fire Kaz and replace him if the wanted to.
 
Sony own the rights to the GT series, and while very unlikely could fire Kaz and replace him if the wanted to.

I wouldn't have a problem with that at all. I honestly feel someone else could take GT over and do a much better job making the entire game balanced for all types of players. Kaz is so focused on only one aspect of the game and I feel doesn't care at all about the majority of the GT fanbase and how they play this game anymore. Then stupid decisions like making the H-Shifter unusable for every part of the game just for the small amount of people who compete in the FIA wouldn't happen.
 
In the interest of parity should PD introduce a system to allow the opportunity for miss shifts in any car that has a h-pattern transmission IRL no matter what controller is being used.

i.e you have to hold the shift button down for a random period of time, if you release it before that time expires your shift is missed, and get to do it again.

Just imagine the uproar that would bring, yet that is what using a H-pattern in GT sport feels like right now :(
 
In the interest of parity should PD introduce a system to allow the opportunity for miss shifts in any car that has a h-pattern transmission IRL no matter what controller is being used.

i.e you have to hold the shift button down for a random period of time, if you release it before that time expires your shift is missed, and get to do it again.

Just imagine the uproar that would bring, yet that is what using a H-pattern in GT sport feels like right now :(


OH NO! PD has just realised that players who shift semi-automatically with a DS4 have an unfair advantage over those players who shift using fully automatic gears. Now, they are going to nerf the DS4 shifters to compensate for this "terrible situation".


:sly: :lol:
 
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I guess i should postpone the shifter purchase :lol:

Seriously tho, is it actually that bad? Can anyone share a video or something?

I wouldn't postpone shifter purchase. It works clutchlessly which is still mega fun and IMO more fun than paddles. And they'll fix it sooner or later. Probably later
 
Definitely a good intention, and a issue that needed to be addressed, but it's done in the wrong way.

With paddle and H-Shifter now being equally fast to shift, the H-shifter is the worse option. If you shift using clutch + H shifter, you need to keep one hand ready to shift, you can't use left foot braking at the same level, and there is a very good chance you'll botch some of the shifts.

So if anything, I'd say the paddle has the advantage now.
 
I'm really amazed how 26 people voted I like it !!
They probably have little experience in the sim games with manual gearbox and clutch.
GT game in this way since GT5 and in my opinion nothing had changed in these years before this update. It was already difficult enough to repeat AC and Dirt Rally. If anything, the problem lay in the one-two that GTSport added to those who did not use the clutch: this surely benefits, especially with slow cars, those on the march (and the Tsukuba TTs are an example) but with other faster cars this advantage is he was losing in climbing.
To solve a problem PD has created another that makes driving with H and friction scandalous.
Native race cars with H and clutch shifts are now RIDICULOUS to drive.
Playing GT with manual gearbox and clutch made it all more satisfying, now it doesn't make sense to play it.
For me GTS is dead today if they don't solve this problem, I prefer to play Dirt Rally and AC now!

Greetings to all

:cheers:
 
It's just my luck that I invested in my first wheel setup from the T-GT, TH8A, T3PA-PRO pedals and Playseat Challenge last week only for them to make my shifter useless now.
It also nice to see some people on here get what just happened but then many others are so blindly ignorant that they are actually happy they ruined the game for all those people (right at 5 million players) who do not play Sport Mode or the FIA races but might like to use a shifter in other parts of GTS.

But for all those who are happy ruined the shifter for the entire game instead of fixing the problem the right way or just for Sport Mode only. We get the satisfaction of knowing people will always cheat and game the system in Sport Mode so they will always be on the losing end and they will never get an even playing field.

I've always been someone who promotes and enjoys seeing all the different ways people come up with to play this game. But over time all these (its all about Sport Mode and screw everyone else) people have completely turned me off from this type of game play. Instead of wanting everyone's game play to be the best it can be so GT will continue to survive and grow.
 
Sure, its a discussion. I dont mean to be pestering but I gues it can seem that way when replying to disected post lol if my replies so pestering they need to stop pestering me with disected post & crying when I reply. Leave it be but thats baloney, keep posting playing Ohhh woah is me, the Digs oh my the Digs. Cry me a river, no sympathies and Boo Hoo, lol come on

Let it go, or is that the issue? You cant let it
Sure, its a discussion. I dont mean to be pestering but I gues it can seem that way when replying to disected post lol if my replies so pestering they need to stop pestering me with disected post & crying when I reply. Leave it be but thats baloney, keep posting playing Ohhh woah is me, the Digs oh my the Digs. Cry me a river, no sympathies and Boo Hoo, lol come on

Let it go, or is that the issue? You cant let it go.....

For be the supposed "car guy" you make your self out to be if you simply can not see the problem with the new H shifting update you really ain't much of a car guy. There is nothing at all acceptable or realistic about it.
 
I'm really amazed how 26 people voted I like it !!
They probably have little experience in the sim games with manual gearbox and clutch.
GT game in this way since GT5 and in my opinion nothing had changed in these years before this update. It was already difficult enough to repeat AC and Dirt Rally. If anything, the problem lay in the one-two that GTSport added to those who did not use the clutch: this surely benefits, especially with slow cars, those on the march (and the Tsukuba TTs are an example) but with other faster cars this advantage is he was losing in climbing.
To solve a problem PD has created another that makes driving with H and friction scandalous.
Native race cars with H and clutch shifts are now RIDICULOUS to drive.
Playing GT with manual gearbox and clutch made it all more satisfying, now it doesn't make sense to play it.
For me GTS is dead today if they don't solve this problem, I prefer to play Dirt Rally and AC now!

Greetings to all

:cheers:
Trolls probably
 
I'm really amazed how 26 people voted I like it !!
They probably have little experience in the sim games with manual gearbox and clutch.
GT game in this way since GT5 and in my opinion nothing had changed in these years before this update. It was already difficult enough to repeat AC and Dirt Rally. If anything, the problem lay in the one-two that GTSport added to those who did not use the clutch: this surely benefits, especially with slow cars, those on the march (and the Tsukuba TTs are an example) but with other faster cars this advantage is he was losing in climbing.
To solve a problem PD has created another that makes driving with H and friction scandalous.
Native race cars with H and clutch shifts are now RIDICULOUS to drive.
Playing GT with manual gearbox and clutch made it all more satisfying, now it doesn't make sense to play it.
For me GTS is dead today if they don't solve this problem, I prefer to play Dirt Rally and AC now!

Greetings to all

:cheers:

I would suspect the 26 people who voted that way are controller users who are happy the clutch advantage is gone. And that’s their prerogative to feel that way — it never should have existed in the first place.
 
Not to over simplify things but, in the real world manual cars DO have an advantage over automatic. I do not consider paddles with no clutch manual, three pedals or it's an automatic. I do not have a shifter, but drive a stick in the real world and if i had to drive my car the way this game shifts i would go insane. SHIFTING IS A SKILL, especially to do it fast and proper. To eliminate that in a driving/racing game is stupid.
 
Probably yes!
In almost all TT courses at Tsukuba with manual gearbox and clutch I arrived in the European top10 in front of riders faster than me who used sequential or DS4. But then again the problem was not changing too fast with a manual gearbox and clutch, which were similar to the GT5 and GT6, but in the double-barrel that fits when you go up with sequential gear. So the problem was not solved but PD created another ...
There may also be that the change in a road car, with a standard clutch, is slower, but when I see the same effects on the F1500T or an 80s race car the disappointment is great.
It is not a matter of being more or less fast but of playability that today is, unfortunately, RIDICULOUS and not at all simulative
 
For be the supposed "car guy" you make your self out to be if you simply can not see the problem with the new H shifting update you really ain't much of a car guy. There is nothing at all acceptable or realistic about it.

Real car guys knew it was Junk before the update ;)

Real Car Guys have real cars

IMG_20190207_130620_574.jpg


Real Car Guys dont need to use a junk system in a video game to pretend to drive a manual car. We just drive our Real manual cars (0_0)

Nowadays the third pedal is more and more a thing of the past, not to mention for me to run more boost I have been concidering a Dog Box, 8k no Joke but Click shifts :D I get it that some want that pure emersion but this is not the game for that. This is an E-Sports branch off where fairness is priority, I'm not selfish I believe that fairness for everybody is worth the sacrifice.
 
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PD are a wholy owned Sony studio, its not a private or independent studio.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyphony_Digital
http://www.polyphony.co.jp/company/
https://www.webcitation.org/65gEJ7aWq?url=http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/index.html

Sony own the rights to the GT series, and while very unlikely could fire Kaz and replace him if the wanted to.

Er.. it says right there on PD's website PD is a subsidiary of Sony. Which means their not owned by Sony but rather SIE (another subsidiary) has some holding in the company.
More stake than I initially thought, but certainly not owned lol. Unless their holdings are above 51%.. which isn't public information.

I'm going by what Kaz said in an interview somewhere where he basically stated, someone suggested he go off and start his own company. He wanted to go one direction with his first title and Sony wouldn't allow it. So once finished and released, PD was started and GT was born.
Edit:
It was Motor Toon Gran Prix. Which was released by Sony not PD.. another reason I dont bother with Wiki.
Another edit:
Yea I'm wrong. PD is funded by SIE who is controlled by Sony.
 
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Er.. it says right there on PD's website PD is a subsidiary of Sony. Which means their not owned by Sony but rather SIE (another subsidiary) has some holding in the company.
More stake than I initially thought, but certainly not owned lol. Unless their holdings are above 51%.. which isn't public information.

I'm going by what Kaz said in an interview somewhere where he basically stated, someone suggested he go off and start his own company. He wanted to go one direction with his first title and Sony wouldn't allow it. So once finished and released, PD was started and GT was born.
Edit:
It was Motor Toon Gran Prix.
PD is a fully owned subsidiary of SIE, which itself is fully owned by Sony, its says so on PDs own website.

Kaz even sits on the SIE board.

It's not part ownership or anything else, they are a first party studio owned by Sony.

Studio Poly (as they were) began life as an internal Sony studio, after MTG they were spun out as a first party studio and renamed Polyphony Digital, however they have never been independent, not stock release has ever occurred for them and they remain fully on Sony's balance sheet.

Sony (via what was SCEI, then SCE and now SIE) own they outright, always gave done and thus fully own the rights to GT.

This is public knowledge and quite freely evident from PD, SIE and Sony.

Read the history of SIE which quite clearly says this.

https://www.sie.com/en/corporate/history/1993_2002.html

Screenshot_20190330_190133_com.android.chrome.jpg
 
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Right so I wanted to find out exactly what difference input device made to shift speed, so I used my capture card (Elgato HD60s) to obtain footage of gear changes for three cars, the Toyota GT86, Subaru WRX Group B Road Car, and a McLaren F1 GTR). Under four different input methods, Game Pad, Paddles on my wheel (T300), H-Pattern with no clutch (TH8A) and H-Pattern with clutch (TH8A and T3PA Pro). All but the H-Pattern with clutch were flat shifts (throttle is kept fully depress during the shift), this can't be done with the H-Pattern with Clutch as it results in a miss shift.

I then measured from the start of the in-game gear change that you can actually see, which is the indicated change to new selected gear or drop to Neutral (and this doesn't appear in all cases); to the end of the observable cycle which is the first reapplication of throttle. I measured this using the captured 60fps footage in a video editing package (HitFilm Pro), which allows frame by frame analysis and then gives a duration in frames, which I converted into seconds and M/S.

Note that this removes a number of variables such as the time it takes me to hit the button, pull the paddle, move my hand to the shifter, etc. As such its a fairer measure as it looks just at the time GTS takes to process and action the shift itself.

The results were taken from five different upshifts, three 2>3 and two 3>4

Note that I have not used any glitched method here, as I wanted to focus just on the input options the title expects you to use.

So the results are:

Toyota GT86
Game Pad: Frames 22 / Secs 0.366 / m/s 366
Paddles: Frames 22 / Secs 0.366 / m/s 366
H w/o Clutch: Frames 22 / Secs 0.366 / m/s 366
H with Clutch: Frames 37 / Sec 0.61 / m/s 610

Subaru WRX Group B Road Car
Game Pad: Frames 7 / Secs 0.116 / m/s 116
Paddles: Frames 7 / Secs 0.116 / m/s 116
H w/o Clutch: Frames 7 / Secs 0.116 / m/s 116
H with Clutch: Frames 7 / Sec 0.116 / m/s 116

McLaren
Game Pad: Frames 6 / Secs 0.1 / m/s 100
Paddles: Frames 6 / Secs 0.1 / m/s 100
H w/o Clutch: Frames 6 / Secs 0.1 / m/s 100
H with Clutch: Frames 6 / Sec 0.1 / m/s 100

Now to say that some of these results look 'odd' is an understatement, and I do need to make the observation that when using the clutch, only in the case of the GT86 did the shift from the starting gear to the final gear go via neutral. With the changes for the WRX and F1 being what can only be described as rather quick to say the least and the on-screen change animation and audio actually lag behind the speed of the shift.

Its also interesting to note that the H-Pattern without clutch seems to be treated as a Gamepad or Paddle change by the game itself, only resulting in a miss-shift if the gear you end up in is wrong, however the change itself is completed and throttle applied before you actually get to the destination gear physically. This also seems to be the case with the H pattern with clutch, as long as its not being used on a road car and as long as you don't mess up with clutch or throttle.

The only input method that can result in a miss-shift due to clutch and throttle position is the H-Pattern with Clutch, and the speed at which you shift is also now a factor in this, but the speed is more than reasonable if you are in either a race derived car (the WRX) or race car (F1), however for the road car (GT86) this is absurdly slow and results not only in a greater chance of a miss-shift, but also a consistently slower change speed registered by the game itself, on average a 1/3rd slower than any other input method, losing around 0.1 to 0.2 seconds per change over any of the other three input methods. GTS also forces totally un-realistic clutch and throttle positions on you during a change.

So my conclusion is that for race derived cars (such as the WRX) or race cars, given that either H-Pattern option gives no speed of change advantage its pointless to use it, as you have to move your hand further and away from the wheel in both cases, and in the case of with clutch risk a miss-shift.

In the case of road cars not do the H-Pattern options lose you time on every shift, but combined with the need to move you hand off the wheel and in the case of the with clutch option carry the much greater risk of a miss-shift (the entire action actually takes around 2 to 3 seconds - that's a long time to steer one handed) it puts drivers at a significant competitive disadvantage.
 
Thanks for this effort. :@:Scaff

So many explanations and constructive suggestions in this thread.

Now we need someone who cares and has a connection to Polyphony. :gtpflag:

We need some proper implementation of Clutch+H Shifter peripherals in the near future.

And native support for the upcoming - Podium Racing Wheel F1® - officially licensed for PS4™ would be very nice too.



 
@Scaff Well, the game knows when a car is supposed to have a sequential gearbox or flat shift. The former actually deactivates the clutch completely, the McLaren you tested will not respond to any clutch input. As for the Subaru Gr.B Road Car, it has a H pattern gearbox, but it simulates a flat shift system - that's a thing in real life, actually I've seen that on a number of Impreza, it's implemented in the ECU which cuts fuel injection or ignition when the clutch pedal is pressed beyond a certain amount (generally it is set to be activated over a certain speed and / or RPM), so you can stay on the throttle while shifting. So you shouldn't be able to mis-shift in that car in the game (and I don't think using the clutch and lifting made the shifts any faster with it before the update).

If we focus only on cars with classic manual gearboxes, there's actually a great disparity in terms of shifting speed without pre-update clutch. The GT86 / BRZ is quite slow to change gears, the Skyline R32 even worse I think, while a car like the F50 is actually not that bad.

@K3Tuning like I and most shifter owners said, we completely agree the advantage was not acceptable for FIA races. But what you fail to see is that breaking the shifters entirely beyond use was unecessary when there are several other possibilities which don't break anything while being simpler to implement (and also even balance out BoP better), like improving "regular" shifts or forcing sequential gearbox when BoP is activated. The current system could even be counterproductive.

Right now, the FIA seasons are as far away from being fair as they could be even after this update, mainly because of the whole format and points system (I won't go into details, but expect to see a collaborative work from top players on that subject soon). Add to that the live events, which despite being great from a show standpoint, are utterly ridiculous on the sporting side of things, the lack of real prizes, possibilities for sponsors to get visibility and teams being completely ignored : GT Sport can't be seriously taken as an e-sport in the current state of things, regardless of how hard they try to market it as an e-sport focused game.

And that doesn't even matter that much : a vast majority of players never did FIA races, actually the number of players having entered at least one sport race is extremely low. And that's not even abnormal : it's the same thing for even the biggest titles in e-sports, like Counter Strike, Starcraft or Overwatch. Most of the player base actually never does competitive stuff. These games all make changes to balance things for competitions, but they don't just sacrifice completely something for the sake of fairness. Those games are successful in e-sports because they sell a lot, but more importantly because a lot of people keep playing them. So you NEED to keep the game enjoyable even for those who don't take part into the competitions, because if you lose players, you will also lose viewers. This is even worse in the present case because it touches people who actually spent real life money to be able to use a feature for the sake of enjoyment.

What's baffling me is that Polyphony actually held a meeting with a bunch of last year's finalists, who brought the shifter advantage for road cars to light and explicitely suggested to make the regular shifts faster. They pretty much did the opposite (as they did with other suggestions that were made there, which is driving competitive players nuts right now).

So no, you can't just point and laugh at people who own some hardware you don't have because there's a competitive mode in the game. So far in this poll, nearly 70% are unhappy with that. If all those players leave for another racing game instead, that would hurt the game greatly, including the competitive side.
 
@K3Tuning like I and most shifter owners said, we completely agree the advantage was not acceptable for FIA races. But what you fail to see is that breaking the shifters entirely beyond use was unecessary when there are several other possibilities which don't break anything while being simpler to implement

I dont fail to see, I see it clearly.

Your OPINION is a different fix would of been "better" the clutch pedal is :censored:ed. what is left unseen?

I've actually said a few times that I've never said this PD fix was the best or solution. I only welcome the change as its at least removed some of the unfair advantage. Its sad that In MY Opinion Gran Turismo has broken shifts speeds. PD might want them slow like that for their own reasons. Not for me to say, one can IF all day IF only they did this instead of that IF only they did that instead of this. If is an infinite question, If only lol

PD has its own vision for GT and its not always the direction I want it to go. But I think kids these days dress funny, have weird hair styles and I dont understand their mumble music so what do I know.

PD has done and will do things people disagree with, they seem to know what they are doing as despite all there mistakes and blunders, not going with suggestions like yours or mine, they will keep on going with or without us as individuals.

and laugh at people who own some hardware you don't have because there's a competitive mode in the game. So far in this poll, nearly 70% are unhappy with that. If all those players leave for another racing game instead, that would hurt the game greatly, including the competitive side.

I aint laughing at people who use SIM rig gear on a Arcady console game (0_0), I really hope they didn't buy a clutch rig for Gran Turismo only tho. Go for the racers trying to be more simulations going for that all out emersion. GTS is an Arcade E Sport game for a much much bigger audience than only those with clutch pedals.

Now I have no sympathy for those who thought there was not a problem until this update. Those who would prefer it go back to an unfair system so they can preserve their preference above fairnes.

None, cry me a river, boo who, Zero sympathies for them.


I do have sympathy and RESPECT, NUFF RESPECT for those who Despite being affected and not liking the change. They accept its done for fairness prefering it stay fair until they speed up shifts for everybody or at least impliment theclutch in a way it can't create an unfair advantage.

ALL who feel liKe that even more so those who voiced it.


RESPECT
 
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I'm not debating that scenario. It's certainly more than possible. I was more referring to the complicated downshift procedure Pigems explained and how that's unlikely to ever be used by a fast driver (because they are good enough to use clutch consistently) or a slow driver trying to beat faster paddle drivers (because they lack the coordination in the first place).

Hey all,

I literally made an account on this forum just now because I started playing with my TH8A (with Ricmotech mod) tonight, after the new update, and I am furious about this update. It totally has :censored:ed up the use of a manual trans/clutch worse than it ever was in the first place. I am going to read the entire thread shortly, but let me just complain about what I've noticed tonight after this update-

Some cars I can't even get a reliable shift from 2nd to 3rd - Porsche 356 sticks out
Generally it seems (so far) that most cars are shifting as if they have worn out/no synchros - I mean even the late model sports cars in the game
Any consistent success with heel-toe now? Anyone?
Am I missing something?! Been driving a man trans in real life for over 20 years, and this is not a respectable "sim"-worthy update
This grinding effect they added sounds like some 8bit nintendo sound effect

I understand that they were trying to improve it/improve realism, but so far I'm pretty certain they made it worse than it was before overall!
I'm gonna read the entire thread, like I said, but right now I'm so ticked off, I feel like I'm gonna jump to iRacing or something, because this "update" seems to really have screwed things up worse than they were. Really disappointed. Would love to hear your comments/insight/opinions.

Thanks for reading :-)
 
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@Scaff Well, the game knows when a car is supposed to have a sequential gearbox or flat shift. The former actually deactivates the clutch completely, the McLaren you tested will not respond to any clutch input. As for the Subaru Gr.B Road Car, it has a H pattern gearbox, but it simulates a flat shift system - that's a thing in real life, actually I've seen that on a number of Impreza, it's implemented in the ECU which cuts fuel injection or ignition when the clutch pedal is pressed beyond a certain amount (generally it is set to be activated over a certain speed and / or RPM), so you can stay on the throttle while shifting. So you shouldn't be able to mis-shift in that car in the game (and I don't think using the clutch and lifting made the shifts any faster with it before the update).

If we focus only on cars with classic manual gearboxes, there's actually a great disparity in terms of shifting speed without pre-update clutch. The GT86 / BRZ is quite slow to change gears, the Skyline R32 even worse I think, while a car like the F50 is actually not that bad.
Only the long tail F1 GTRs had a sequential box, the standard ones had a renforced varient of the road cars manual gearbox. This specific car would not have had a sequential system, given that it was chassis No.1 of the GTRs and following its Le Mans win was immediately retired.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McLaren_F1_GTR

Even sequential boxes of that age didn't shift that fast, in many cases they were no faster than a manual box, they were initially used because they were more convenient and kept your hands on the wheel (depending on the exact system).

The shift on the F1 is too fast, the WRX is a fantasy car so it's not the best example and I should go back and look again with the Quattro Group B (as that is 100% a manual).


@K3Tuning like I and most shifter owners said, we completely agree the advantage was not acceptable for FIA races. But what you fail to see is that breaking the shifters entirely beyond use was unecessary when there are several other possibilities which don't break anything while being simpler to implement (and also even balance out BoP better), like improving "regular" shifts or forcing sequential gearbox when BoP is activated. The current system could even be counterproductive.

Right now, the FIA seasons are as far away from being fair as they could be even after this update, mainly because of the whole format and points system (I won't go into details, but expect to see a collaborative work from top players on that subject soon). Add to that the live events, which despite being great from a show standpoint, are utterly ridiculous on the sporting side of things, the lack of real prizes, possibilities for sponsors to get visibility and teams being completely ignored : GT Sport can't be seriously taken as an e-sport in the current state of things, regardless of how hard they try to market it as an e-sport focused game.

And that doesn't even matter that much : a vast majority of players never did FIA races, actually the number of players having entered at least one sport race is extremely low. And that's not even abnormal : it's the same thing for even the biggest titles in e-sports, like Counter Strike, Starcraft or Overwatch. Most of the player base actually never does competitive stuff. These games all make changes to balance things for competitions, but they don't just sacrifice completely something for the sake of fairness. Those games are successful in e-sports because they sell a lot, but more importantly because a lot of people keep playing them. So you NEED to keep the game enjoyable even for those who don't take part into the competitions, because if you lose players, you will also lose viewers. This is even worse in the present case because it touches people who actually spent real life money to be able to use a feature for the sake of enjoyment.

What's baffling me is that Polyphony actually held a meeting with a bunch of last year's finalists, who brought the shifter advantage for road cars to light and explicitely suggested to make the regular shifts faster. They pretty much did the opposite (as they did with other suggestions that were made there, which is driving competitive players nuts right now).

So no, you can't just point and laugh at people who own some hardware you don't have because there's a competitive mode in the game. So far in this poll, nearly 70% are unhappy with that. If all those players leave for another racing game instead, that would hurt the game greatly, including the competitive side.
Excellent post.
 
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