Your thoughts about "standard" vs. "premium"

[freshseth83]

You're not getting what I'm saying. In GT4 and before there was no 'cockpit view'. Yet it GT1 and GT2 there were cars that were able to be 'race upgraded' why would GT5 not be the same with cars that are standard, or lack 'cockpit view'? I don't see where you get all this other stuff you're saying in your post. I wasn't talking of any of that. I'm speaking from a logical standpoint, that there were race upgraded cars before that will be featured in GT5. Regardless if they weren't in GT5P, there is still a possibility that even some standard cars could be race upgraded. If a Viper GTS from lets say 1999 is turned into a Viper GTS-R GT2 car, that car might be standard, because from what we know so far, that hasn't been shown to be a premium car. If it's even in the game. That's just an example.

 

[Griffith500]

You're not getting what I'm saying. In GT4 and before there was no 'cockpit view'. Yet it GT1 and GT2 there were cars that were able to be 'race upgraded' why would GT5 not be the same with cars that are standard, or lack 'cockpit view'? I don't see where you get all this other stuff you're saying in your post. I wasn't talking of any of that. I'm speaking from a logical standpoint, that there were race upgraded cars before that will be featured in GT5. Regardless if they weren't in GT5P, there is still a possibility that even some standard cars could be race upgraded. If a Viper GTS from lets say 1999 is turned into a Viper GTS-R GT2 car, that car might be standard, because from what we know so far, that hasn't been shown to be a premium car. If it's even in the game. That's just an example.

The Standard cars are only from GT4 and GTPSP - which I stated in my second reply to you (plus, I never mentioned GT5.)

I get the "other stuff" from my head, based on what little I can remember. I think that's a fairly standard (if obviously flawed) way to do things; I can back stuff up with the original sources if you really need me to, but that's hardly the point. I was trying to show you why, in my opinion, "Racing modify menu" likely only applies to the Premium cars.

If you're expecting a GT4-spec Viper to be able to turn into a GT2-spec [R] Viper, I'd wager you're forgetting about how Kaz tends to do "his thing" - or are simply being optimistic. Plus, we don't know what the "Race Mod" (menu) even is this time around. Given the furore about the possibility of having GT4-spec (Standard) cars on the track at the same time as GT5 (Premium) cars, I can't imagine what people will think if GT2-spec (PS1-spec!) models and textures suddenly appear... But that's by the bye, really.


All I'm saying is, it seems very unlikely that Standards will be race mod-able. That's it. Nothing you've said has changed my mind on that, I'm afraid.
You're obviously welcome to believe what you want.

 

[freshseth83]

You still don't get what I'm saying. GT4 cars included cars from GT3 and GT2 and GT1. I don't know why you say things like GT5 standards will only be cars from GT4 and GTPSP, because cars from those games were cars from previous GT games. So in other words, GT5 will have cars from ALL GT games. Not just GT4, because GT4 wasn't cars that were JUST in GT4. They were from GT3, GT2, and GT1. Get what I'm saying?

 

[SlipZtrEm]

They are cars from previous GT's, yes, but they're not the actual assets from the PS1 games. That should be clear to anybody with eyes. I don't see what a car's particular model year should have to do with racing mods. Your argument makes no sense.

The race mods from GT1 and 2 are utterly useless for any practical application in GT5. Even the Standard cars.

The other reason some of us think Standards are unlikely candidates for Race Mods is because it represents some poor time management. Say what you will about whether Standards look good or not in GT5; that's not the point. I think we all know that the eventual goal for PD is to have all cars up to the level of detail shown in Premiums; it just makes sense, no? So investing more time in a dead-end tier of quality just doesn't add up. Oh, it'd have some great short-term benefits, but it just makes more sense to invest more time in the tier that actually has a reasonable future ahead of it.

 

[FlourescentBlak]

^Yup

 

[Tornado]

Say what you will about whether Standards look good or not in GT5; that's not the point. I think we all know that the eventual goal for PD is to have all cars up to the level of detail shown in Premiums; it just makes sense, no? So investing more time in a dead-end tier of quality just doesn't add up.

*Sees images of a Racing Mod spoiler with a higher poly count then the rest of the car combined*

 

[Devedander]

*Sees images of a Racing Mod spoiler with a higher poly count then the rest of the car combined*

PS4 quality spoiler!

 

[shadynader]

Cold, dark and lonely in this thread, so sad. Well back to the TGS party for me.

 

[freshseth83]

They are cars from previous GT's, yes, but they're not the actual assets from the PS1 games. That should be clear to anybody with eyes. I don't see what a car's particular model year should have to do with racing mods. Your argument makes no sense.

The race mods from GT1 and 2 are utterly useless for any practical application in GT5. Even the Standard cars.

The other reason some of us think Standards are unlikely candidates for Race Mods is because it represents some poor time management. Say what you will about whether Standards look good or not in GT5; that's not the point. I think we all know that the eventual goal for PD is to have all cars up to the level of detail shown in Premiums; it just makes sense, no? So investing more time in a dead-end tier of quality just doesn't add up. Oh, it'd have some great short-term benefits, but it just makes more sense to invest more time in the tier that actually has a reasonable future ahead of it.

Wtf are you talking about? I used a year model as an example. I didn't say that was a necessity. You need to read over someone's post before you reply like the 'mr. know it all' you are. I don't care what it is you have to say half the time you say it. All you do is ridicule and criticize. I was giving an example. The car list has the Viper GTS-R listed as a standard car. Yet there's a Viper GTS that's premium, an 02' model. Now if you can transform that Viper GTS into a race model, which would be the Viper GTS-R, that would take the place of that car which is standard, but now upgraded into premium. And who knows if the standards can receive the same treatment. I'd imagine they can. Why would the box say you can upgrade and customize '1000 cars' but leave out Standards? You could customize and add wings and wheels to cars in GT4, so I guess according to you that won't happen in GT5? Hm, makes no sense to me. Upgrades are for all cars. I would think it'd include body modifications as well. Maybe not, but I hope so. That's what I originally said.

What I'm getting at is that there are cars that are standards that we love. But then some of those are race cars we wish were premium. So when Kaz said that he would try to do this upgrade with the cars he thinks we would want to see them do it to, you would think cars like the Viper GTS which is premium, could be upgraded to a PREMIUM version of the Viper GTS-R (which happened in GT2). So when you sit there and say they don't have assets of GT1 and GT2, you're wrong. The cars are there, and the race upgrade is making a return. If it's done the way it was in the past then we could potentially see cars like the Viper GTS-R as our own upgraded Viper GTS premium car.

 

[CeeJay]

Man, that weather trailer is so bittersweet. Working wipers, rain effects on the windshield. It looks so stunning! Yet I can't stop thinking about those 800 cars that won't have these effects! Argh!! Must... get... over... this....

 

[Organ-Donor]

Man, that weather trailer is so bittersweet. Working wipers, rain effects on the windshield. It looks so stunning! Yet I can't stop thinking about those 800 cars that won't have these effects! Argh!! Must... get... over... this....

Use the 200+ cars that do have cockpit view for the weather?

 

[FlourescentBlak]

Man, that weather trailer is so bittersweet. Working wipers, rain effects on the windshield. It looks so stunning! Yet I can't stop thinking about those 800 cars that won't have these effects! Argh!! Must... get... over... this....

No doubt, those premium cars will be 100 times better with weather effects like rain and snow.

Are they marking premium cars in the menu interface or is it a guessing game?

 

[freshseth83]

You still get hood view... Wipers might work on a roof cam also

 

[SlipZtrEm]

*Sees images of a Racing Mod spoiler with a higher poly count then the rest of the car combined*

Wtf are you talking about? I used a year model as an example. I didn't say that was a necessity. You need to read over someone's post before you reply like the 'mr. know it all' you are. I don't care what it is you have to say half the time you say it. All you do is ridicule and criticize. I was giving an example. The car list has the Viper GTS-R listed as a standard car. Yet there's a Viper GTS that's premium, an 02' model. Now if you can transform that Viper GTS into a race model, which would be the Viper GTS-R, that would take the place of that car which is standard, but now upgraded into premium. And who knows if the standards can receive the same treatment. I'd imagine they can. Why would the box say you can upgrade and customize '1000 cars' but leave out Standards? You could customize and add wings and wheels to cars in GT4, so I guess according to you that won't happen in GT5? Hm, makes no sense to me. Upgrades are for all cars. I would think it'd include body modifications as well. Maybe not, but I hope so. That's what I originally said.

Aw, someone seems cranky. How cute.

So basically your argument is... a ton of conjecture and guess-work? And you complain of others doing the same? I'll break it down.

-You're assuming racing modifications will turn a Viper GTS into a GTS-R. We still don't know to what extent these racing mods will modify the car we apply them too (though I'm certainly hoping for a return to the PS1 days). Maybe the Tuned concepts in Prologue are a better example? We don't know. Something throws a wrench in your theory, though: we have an R8, in V8 and V10 street versions, as Premiums. Yet we have the LMS as a Standard. I'm still confused as to why that happened, but maybe we'll find out during the next few days.

-I use my last post as an example (Standards are a dead-end, modeling-wise), but to further that; do you realize the time the modelers would've had to take to give us racing mods for 600 cars? Though it'd be really funny if the opposite ended up true: Racing Mods being only available for Standards. I imagine that would really force a lot of people to use them .

-"so I guess according to you that won't happen in GT5?"

...where did I say that, again? This isn't the first time you've resorted to just blindly making stuff up to back up your points. I understand it's kind of a habit. But I'll clear that part up, again, too: the box could say "1000 cars, all customizable and upgradeable", and could give us the exact same upgrading abilities for the Standards as we witnessed in GT4. Nothing else. The quote on the box would still be true.

What I'm getting at is that there are cars that are standards that we love. But then some of those are race cars we wish were premium. So when Kaz said that he would try to do this upgrade with the cars he thinks we would want to see them do it to, you would think cars like the Viper GTS which is premium, could be upgraded to a PREMIUM version of the Viper GTS-R (which happened in GT2).

If we want to get picky, the only GTS-R in GT2 was the actual GTS-R. The R-Mod did look similar, but didn't have the proper stats. I see your point insofar as that much though. I wish we had more concrete info on this return of Racing Mods.

So when you sit there and say they don't have assets of GT1 and GT2, you're wrong.

Come back to this thread when you understand what we all mean by assets. There is nothing, NOTHING, from the PS1 games still used in the PS2 ones. Those old Racing Modifications are utterly useless for anything past inspiration.

The cars are there, and the race upgrade is making a return. If it's done the way it was in the past then we could potentially see cars like the Viper GTS-R as our own upgraded Viper GTS premium car.

If the return of Race Mods (which as far as I can tell hasn't really been confirmed from PD themselves, only by relatively small blogs) does allow that much of a transformation, you can count me as someone who will be beyond happy, trust me. I really hope it's more on the level of out-and-out racer and less like the Tuned Concepts. But the PS1 games really have no bearing on what happens if it does indeed return.

Are they marking premium cars in the menu interface or is it a guessing game?

At the TGS? No idea. In-game? They're separated into S/P in our Garage, but nobody knows for sure what the dealerships will look like yet. There's a theory that used car lots will be home to Standards, but with the R8 LMS being a Standard, that'd seem weird. Wonder if people will be able to get hands-on in the GT Mode in the next few days... the newest footage sorta has me back on the hype train.

 

[paulpg87]

with the weather effects the standard cars sucks even more.. i'll never use one of them in a rainy/snow race, after that cockpit with torrential rain and wipers.. com'on, you'll always want ot play with a premium.

 

[Spagetti69]

You still get hood view... Wipers might work on a roof cam also

You've lost me mate. How would that work?

 

[Ryan81]

I'm dreading this standard vs premium thing. Now with the weather features, standard cars will look even more out of place. WHY PD? Why did you have to spoil it with sub-standard cars that graphically belong to the PS2?

 

[FlourescentBlak]

I'm dreading this standard vs premium thing. Now with the weather features, standard cars will look even more out of place. WHY PD? Why did you have to spoil it with sub-standard cars that graphically belong to the PS2?

Think GT6 Think GT6. GT5 is the first PS3 GT game so we can equate it to GT3 in that regards.

I am so looking forward to driving an imprezza in the snow now!!!

 

[freshseth83]

Aw, someone seems cranky. How cute.

So basically your argument is... a ton of conjecture and guess-work? And you complain of others doing the same? I'll break it down.

-You're assuming racing modifications will turn a Viper GTS into a GTS-R. We still don't know to what extent these racing mods will modify the car we apply them too (though I'm certainly hoping for a return to the PS1 days). Maybe the Tuned concepts in Prologue are a better example? We don't know. Something throws a wrench in your theory, though: we have an R8, in V8 and V10 street versions, as Premiums. Yet we have the LMS as a Standard. I'm still confused as to why that happened, but maybe we'll find out during the next few days.

-I use my last post as an example (Standards are a dead-end, modeling-wise), but to further that; do you realize the time the modelers would've had to take to give us racing mods for 600 cars? Though it'd be really funny if the opposite ended up true: Racing Mods being only available for Standards. I imagine that would really force a lot of people to use them .

-"so I guess according to you that won't happen in GT5?"

...where did I say that, again? This isn't the first time you've resorted to just blindly making stuff up to back up your points. I understand it's kind of a habit. But I'll clear that part up, again, too: the box could say "1000 cars, all customizable and upgradeable", and could give us the exact same upgrading abilities for the Standards as we witnessed in GT4. Nothing else. The quote on the box would still be true.



If we want to get picky, the only GTS-R in GT2 was the actual GTS-R. The R-Mod did look similar, but didn't have the proper stats. I see your point insofar as that much though. I wish we had more concrete info on this return of Racing Mods.



Come back to this thread when you understand what we all mean by assets. There is nothing, NOTHING, from the PS1 games still used in the PS2 ones. Those old Racing Modifications are utterly useless for anything past inspiration.



If the return of Race Mods (which as far as I can tell hasn't really been confirmed from PD themselves, only by relatively small blogs) does allow that much of a transformation, you can count me as someone who will be beyond happy, trust me. I really hope it's more on the level of out-and-out racer and less like the Tuned Concepts. But the PS1 games really have no bearing on what happens if it does indeed return

Like I said, you try to make yourself seem better than others with your bash posts and blatant ignorance. GT1 GT2 had 'race upgrade'. Kaz said it would make a return. If it makes a return we could potentially see the same thing that was in those two games. How is that hard to understand? Don't get into a pissing match with me here, I'm not trynna get your face wet, cus to me, you're the one crying over something. I'm not pissy or throwing a fit, I'm calmly replying to you about your post that has nothing to do with what I said. This thread is called YOUR THOUGHTS about standard vs premium. I gave my THOUGHTS. You act like you know things then turn around and say that you don't know. What we wish is just that, a wish. No, I don't know what race mods will be like but if they make a RETURN like Kaz said, who's to say they will be much different from what was offered in GT1 and GT2? I know the stats aren't the exact same, but essentially you turned a viper GTS into the GTS-R GT2 LeMans car. So if this holds over to what we could expect, I'm saying that we might have standard cars recreated by our own upgrades. as in the GTS-R thats in the game is Standard. But if the GTS is premium and we get to 'race upgrade' it to a GTS-R, we actually get that as a premium GTS-R but it's not technically the same car.

See, I wasn't trying to argue with you. I just asked what you were talking about. I used common sense and the words that Kaz used when he said cars that we hope to do this modification to. I only used the Viper as an example. I'm not saying that's a definitive car that will be 'race upgradeable'. But if what I'm thinking is true and there are cars to be race upgraded. That feature was taken from GT1/2 so even if it's not the exact same, it's still a feature of those games. So I used those games' as a basis or an example of what could possibly be featured on GT5. So who knows. Maybe it won't be for standard cars, but if you could add wings to the cars in GT4, I wouldn't see the problem with adding something like body kits, and possibly race upgrades to them as well. Even if they don't we still see a Premium version of the same car as a standard (be it slightly different, ex. Aston DB9). Maybe that's a hint as to how some cars when 'race upgraded' could be the same as say a 'standard' race car (my Viper example).

Another reason i have this assumption is the 'stealth' cars. Of course some aren't race modded, but look at the NSX and GTR. Who's to say that race modification wouldn't turn our GTR or NSX into one of those 'stealth cars' with the full carbon fiber body (tuning options showed body part replacements with carbon fiber ones)? It's a stretch, but those cars are definitely all carbon fiber. Some look like 'tuned' cars, then the GTR, NSX, 787B, Audi R10- those are all race cars. Besides the LeMans cars the GTR and NSX are production cars. And in years past those cars were turned into SuperGT race cars (JGTC). This is one of the things I THINK race modification could do.

 

[Ryan81]

Think GT6 Think GT6. GT5 is the first PS3 GT game so we can equate it to GT3 in that regards.

I am so looking forward to driving an imprezza in the snow now!!!

God knows when GT6 will be coming out. Probably at the same time as the PS4.....

I've said it previously: I would have preferred if they'd given us 200+ premiums and left the standards out completely. After all, GT3 had 170 cars and no other racing game (except FM3) has cockpit view on so many cars. Not only that but with this amount of detail.

 

[DoctorFouad]

where is the guy who was talking about bad management from polyphony for GT5 development process ? lol

hopefully people would realize that polyphony guys werent working only on car modeling !!! but also on tracks, weather system, AI system, sound engine, online functions...

 

[II IVORBIGUN II]

I've said it previously: I would have preferred if they'd given us 200+ premiums and left the standards out completely.

That statement makes no sense at all. What about those who like me will enjoy the standard cars also. If you don't like the standard cars then simply don't use them.

where is the guy who was talking about bad management from polyphony for GT5 development process ? lol

hopefully people would realize that polyphony guys werent working only on car modeling !!! but also on tracks, weather system, AI system, sound engine, online functions...

Absolutely spot on.

 

[Griffith500]

freshseth83: Nobody's arguing that the Race Mod's aren't going to happen. What we are saying is that the Standards will likely get no more customisation than was already present in GT4. Also, we don't know what "racing modify menu" means yet. It could be the possibility to add various race-mod-like parts to the car separately; that never happened in previous GTs.

The reason you can't just add body kits to the Standards is because it requires manual tuning of the attach points, and the underlying mesh cannot easily be removed (since it's a solid hull, and cutting bits out is "dangerous") - thus, we might only see wings and wheels for the Standards (whose attach points are already defined in the models), whilst the Premiums get the full gamut of options that GT5 will offer - whatever those are - since the cars have a separate mesh for each body panel / part that we assume can then be swapped for a different one. Or something. We have to wait to find out.

 

[warp9engage]

With no Standard Cars shown again at TGS, I think it's pretty safe to assume that even PD think they suck. Otherwise, they would be interested in showing more cars. After all, cars are what this game is about.

 

[paulpg87]

With no Standard Cars shown again at TGS, I think it's pretty safe to assume that even PD think they suck. Otherwise, they would be interested in showing more cars. After all, cars are what this game is about.

we all already know that standard cars suck, some pepole just don't want to accept it, like the cockpit debate (And now with weather effects the difference it's even bigger.. just watch the inside view with alla the rain and snow, it's amazing and i want always that experience when playing in wet/snow conditions... an experience that standard can't deliver.)

 

[warp9engage]

we all already know that standard cars suck, some pepole just don't want to accept it, like the cockpit debate (And now with weather effects the difference it's even bigger.. just watch the inside view with alla the rain and snow, it's amazing and i want always that experience when playing in wet/snow conditions... an experience that standard can't deliver.)

The more features like this that are revealed, the bigger the trench between the two types gets. In my honest opinion, if PD has indeed made the game capable of being played using only premiums, they should include an option during the installation of the game to allows us to choose between installing the standard cars or not. After all, no point in wasting space on your hard drive with content that isn't worth it and you don't care about.

 

[Gejost]

If I had 2 wifes, one more beautiful than the other, and I would show of with her, that doesn't nessecarily mean that my other wife is ugly. She is just not as beautiful.

 

[DestinyDanny]

If I had 2 wifes, one more beautiful than the other, and I would showing of with her, that doesn't nessecarily mean that my other wife is ugly. She is just not as beautiful.

Well said!

 

[Spagetti69]

If I had 2 wifes, one more beautiful than the other, and I would showing of with her, that doesn't nessecarily mean that my other wife is ugly. She is just not as beautiful.

Most people would think you have one wife.

 

[Gejost]

Most people would think you have one wife.

Hmm...