Force feedback is just plain wrong (T500RS)

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NTIV10

NTIV10

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ntiliff
I just got my T500RS today. I don't know whether to blame the wheel or the game, but I am very unhappy.

What the hell is wrong with this game? Why do cars end up in a self-perpetuating cycle of left-right force feedback if the wheel is anywhere close to center? I should be able to take my hands off the wheel at 60, 70, 100+ mph without the car all of a sudden going out of control.

Don't tell me I'm not holding it right. I spent quite a while driving the '08 BMW M5 and I can tell you for a fact this is not even close to realistic. I owned an '06 M5 for two years and I have driven it on tight twisty roads and on open highways, including hitting the speed limiter more than once. It is DEAD SOLID on a straightaway, even at 155mph.

Am I missing a setting somewhere? It seems that the steering wheel settings in the options menu do not apply for the T500RS. I've tried Amateur, Pro, and Sim, turned power steering on and off, and turned force feedback all the way down and all the way back up.

I am about ready to return this $600 steering wheel if I can't find a way to get the cars in the game to behave properly on a straightaway.
 
You need to set a little bit of deadzone. Lots of wheels have that problem with GT5 if you don't set a small amount of deadzone. I'm not sure how you do that on that wheel though.
 
I think its a wheel issue,but,then again, I don't recall having that issue on f1 2010. I'll check again, but, I think the DFGT may have a FFB deadzone?
 
The T500RS doesn't have that option, from what I can tell.

Oh, and also, the way it rips the wheel out of your hands if you spin out or come close to it is nowhere near accurate either. I've never had a car do that to me, and I've (both intentionally and unintentionally) spun out/drifted dozens of different kinds of cars IRL.
 
I don't have this issue with a DFGT, although I did with it in Shift. I just think it's simply bad coding. There's NO deadzone on the DFGT in GT5 (isn't even adjustable) and I used to drive with no deadzone in Shift. Only way to get rid of the problem is to apply a deadzone in Shift, which ruins the realism, for me at least.

I used to think my DFGT was busted, but as soon as I got GT5, I found out it's the bloody coders, not the wheel!

You STILL feel a certain amount of side to side forces with SOME cars and tracks with the DFGT in GT5, but it's a VERY simple matter to dampen them out with a bit of holding on tighter. In Shift, it was hang on for dear life and you STILL couldn't dampen it!

Shame that such an expensive wheel has this issue.
 
NTIV10
The T500RS doesn't have that option, from what I can tell.

Oh, and also, the way it rips the wheel out of your hands if you spin out or come close to it is nowhere near accurate either. I've never had a car do that to me, and I've (both intentionally and unintentionally) spun out/drifted dozens of different kinds of cars IRL.
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Maybe you've spent too much time on your Bob (judging by your sig, :lol:), and not enough time, at the helm of your wheel, yet! ;)

Give it some more time dude... Trust me. I tried one last week, and LOVED it.
(and YES, I am quite the experienced driver in real-life, so don't go down that road... lol)
 
weavty1
Maybe you've spent too much time on your Bob (judging by your sig, :lol:), and not enough time, at the helm of your wheel, yet! ;)

Give it some more time dude... Trust me. I tried one last week, and LOVED it.
(and YES, I am quite the experienced driver in real-life, so don't go down that road... lol)
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I'm in law school. It's impressive to me that I've had enough free time to get as high as I have on A-spec.
 
NTIV10
I'm in law school. It's impressive to me that I've had enough free time to get as high as I have on A-spec.
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👍 Good for you mate!! That takes alot out of you! Believe me, I'm not a BAR-certified individual, or anything.. However, I have a BSME and a BSEE, so I feel you on the time-aspect!! :lol:
 
weavty1
Give it some more time dude... Trust me. I tried one last week, and LOVED it.
(and YES, I am quite the experienced driver in real-life, so don't go down that road... lol)
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Sorry, but if the OP is suffering the symptoms he has described, then something is definately wrong, I don't care how much experience you ahve in real life, the fact is that the OP is correct that you should be able to let go of the wheel at 100mph and the car (no matter what it is) should track arrow straight (assuming a flat and level road). There should be no 'juddering' from the steering wheel at all, and it certainly shouldn't spit you off the road.We all know this is a problem with Logitech wheels, but the claim made by Thrustmaster was that this problem had been eliminated, if in fact it hasn't, then the wheel is definately not worth the price they are asking for it....
 
I thought the T500RS supposed to fixed the dead zone issue. Guess not huh? Seriously, is it too hard to implement a Dead zone option in the menu so the users can adjust themselves?
 
TwinturboCH
Sorry, but if the OP is suffering the symptoms he has described, then something is definately wrong, I don't care how much experience you ahve in real life, the fact is that the OP is correct that you should be able to let go of the wheel at 100mph and the car (no matter what it is) should track arrow straight (assuming a flat and level road). There should be no 'juddering' from the steering wheel at all, and it certainly shouldn't spit you off the road.We all know this is a problem with Logitech wheels, but the claim made by Thrustmaster was that this problem had been eliminated, if in fact it hasn't, then the wheel is definately not worth the price they are asking for it....
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Well, you got me? :dunce: :lol:
 
I have the T500 too. have you applied the latest firmware update? (v.32). One of my initial complaints was that the initial application of FFB from the wheel upon slight turn-in felt slightly over powered, and the update seemed to have addressed that, but honestly the change was so subtle it could be me just adapting to the wheel and remembering wrong.

I haven't noticed what you are describing, but I haven't just 'let go' of the wheel on a straight yet to see what it does.

There is no deadzone on this wheel and you can't add one as far as I know.
 
Sounds like a normal force feedback wheel to me. It's a side effect of the Force Feedback technology. It's seeking resistance. You're never supposed to let the wheel overpower your hands. You won't break it, don't worry. If it is breaking from your grip, turn down the ffb in the options menu. I run it at 6.
 
Forgetful
Sounds like a normal force feedback wheel to me. It's a side effect of the Force Feedback technology. It's seeking resistance. You're never supposed to let the wheel overpower your hands. You won't break it, don't worry. If it is breaking from your grip, turn down the ffb in the options menu. I run it at 6.
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It is set on 1.
 
Forgetful
Sounds like a normal force feedback wheel to me. It's a side effect of the Force Feedback technology. It's seeking resistance. You're never supposed to let the wheel overpower your hands. You won't break it, don't worry. If it is breaking from your grip, turn down the ffb in the options menu. I run it at 6.
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Yeah, what he said! :lol: 👍
 
Please post your test conditions:
-track
-online/offline
-car -> tires, default tune?
-special wheel settings (if any)

Curious if I can duplicate this issue with my old Logitech DFP, I noticed most cars will go into a left-right cycle until the car spins out (example: Nurburgring final straight -> hands free not possible for more than a couple seconds...).. though I didn't feel it was an actual problem... sounds like the OP has something more intense going on...
 
Forgetful
Sounds like a normal force feedback wheel to me. It's a side effect of the Force Feedback technology. It's seeking resistance. You're never supposed to let the wheel overpower your hands. You won't break it, don't worry. If it is breaking from your grip, turn down the ffb in the options menu. I run it at 6.
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Exactly. FFB wheels can only apply force on one side at a time unlike a real steering wheel.

Gt5 FFB tries to simulate car's weight shifting so you can feel if the rear end is about to break loose especially with ABS off. The more grip the car and tires has the more sudden the G-force meter will swing left and right the more force you will feel coming from the wheel.

That's the down side of simulates "weight shifting" with FFB wheel especially close to center. The advantage is you get information about your cars handling in the corners and braking without ABS.
 
NTIV10
It is set on 1.
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And it will rip the wheel out of your grip? :scared:

💡

532m.jpg


Sorry, couldn't help myself

Seriously though, make the wheel your 🤬
 
Forgetful
And it will rip the wheel out of your grip? :scared:

💡

532m.jpg


Sorry, couldn't help myself

Seriously though, make the wheel your 🤬
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Bahahahaha, okay... TMI, buuuut, I'm sitting here on the pot right now, with my iPad in hand, trying to finish a #2... and this, sir.. JUST made me drop even more deuce... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
If the OP is referring to taking his hands off the wheel for any straight on any track with any car, then I'd have to say, no, you can't do that even with a DFGT. SOME tracks, due to uneven surface, and SOME cars, due to steering geometry issues, perhaps, yes they WILL eventually spin out or just shunt you off to the side.

But, IRL there are many roads and cars that will do that, too. Remember, most track cars have more knife edge steering geometries than their street equivalents. And few straights are PERFECTLY even, and, in all fairness, it might be possible to remember taking your hands off the wheel IRL, but how fast were you going, how flat was the track, how hard were you accelerating, and most importantly, how long did you dare to do it? That last one is easy to overestimate..! Self preservation might cut it shorter than you would be tempted to do it in a game with no consequences.

For me, especially compared to Shift with all assists off, the issue was the amount of force needed to dampen the oscillation. In Shift, it was lock your arms and elbows rigid, preferably clamp them hard to your sides, and you STILL couldn't make it track straight.

In GT5, at MOST all that is needed is a mild firmness holding the wheel, and, as I said, most cars nothing at all.

So, to the OP, are you expecting total hands off at any speed, any track any car, for any length of time, or is this a more serious problem?
 
Sorry for the quality. It was easiest to show the wheel with the flash on which makes it look terrible. The wheel should never, and would never (in real life) behave like this.




Qxs-Storm
Please post your test conditions:
-track
-online/offline
-car -> tires, default tune?
-special wheel settings (if any)

Curious if I can duplicate this issue with my old Logitech DFP, I noticed most cars will go into a left-right cycle until the car spins out (example: Nurburgring final straight -> hands free not possible for more than a couple seconds...).. though I didn't feel it was an actual problem... sounds like the OP has something more intense going on...
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Circuit De La Sarthe, bone stock 2008 M5, offline, practice. Force feedback 1.
 
NTIV10
Sorry for the quality. It was easiest to show the wheel with the flash on which makes it look terrible. The wheel should never, and would never (in real life) behave like this.

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Face. Palm.

That's completely normal dude. It's NOT 'IRL'... It's still a video game, at the end of the day, no matter HOW much money you throw into it.

👍

Do some curl-ups with some weights, and give it another go, same time next week :)
 
Yeah my g27 does the same thing, lucky for you and me both I figured out a way to fix it! Keep your hands on the wheel, it's kinda hard to do but once you get the hang of it....... : p
 
weavty1
Face. Palm.

That's completely normal dude. It's NOT 'IRL'... It's still a video game, at the end of the day, no matter HOW much money you throw into it.

👍

Do some curl-ups with some weights, and give it another go, same time next week :)
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That's considered normal? Ok. 🤬 this game. Seriously?

I thought this was supposed to be a car enthusiast's game. If you're a real _driving_ enthusiast, this kind of wacked-out behavior should NOT be acceptable.

Guess I'll be returning the wheel.

And to the peanut gallery who are commenting on my strength, that is not the issue. Of course I could just hold onto the wheel. The issue is that the wheel is pushing these forces (to a lesser extent) no matter when and where you're driving. My real car doesn't fight me every time I make a turn, and if they can't keep the game from doing the same, give me an option to turn off force feedback!
 
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weavty1
Face. Palm.

That's completely normal dude. It's NOT 'IRL'... It's still a video game, at the end of the day, no matter HOW much money you throw into it.

👍

Do some curl-ups with some weights, and give it another go, same time next week :)
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What a ridiculous comment. The OP is not saying 'I can't hold the wheel' he is saying that you cannot LET GO of the wheel while going down a straight without the car crashing which YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO as Thrustmaster have made a huge thing about there being no 'centre wobble' on this HUGELY expensive wheel and is supposed to be one of the advantages over the (significantly cheaper) Logitech G25/G27. If one of the KEY SALES POINTS is in fact erroneous, I'd say it's a pretty big deal.

Please, if you don't have anything intelligent to add to the discussion, just refrain from posting.

manhorsedog
Yeah my g27 does the same thing, lucky for you and me both I figured out a way to fix it! Keep your hands on the wheel, it's kinda hard to do but once you get the hang of it....... : p
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Again, we all KNOW THIS IS A PROBLEM WITH THE LOGITECH's. The point is that this wheel is supposed to have fixed that as one of it's key sales points. See above re: unintelligent comments.

NTIV10
That's considered normal? Ok. 🤬 this game. Seriously?

I thought this was supposed to be a car enthusiast's game. If you're a real _driving_ enthusiast, this kind of wacked-out behavior should NOT be acceptable.

Guess I'll be returning the wheel.

And to the peanut gallery who are commenting on my strength, that is not the issue. Of course I could just hold onto the wheel. The issue is that the wheel is pushing these forces (to a lesser extent) no matter when and where you're driving. My real car doesn't fight me every time I make a turn, and if they can't keep the game from doing the same, give me an option to turn off force feedback!
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It's not the game, it's the firmware in the wheels. :( As I said, it's a known bug with the Logitechs, but you are right, Thrustmaster claimed this didn't occur with their wheel. I'd see if you can find a customer services number and see what they say to be honest. And yeah, ignore the stupid posts of people trying to be smartass's, they are talking rubbish :)
 
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NTIV10
That's considered normal? Ok. 🤬 this game. Seriously?

I thought this was supposed to be a car enthusiast's game. If you're a real _driving_ enthusiast, this kind of wacked-out behavior should NOT be acceptable.

Guess I'll be returning the wheel.

And to the peanut gallery who are commenting on my strength, that is not the issue. Of course I could just hold onto the wheel. The issue is that the wheel is pushing these forces (to a lesser extent) no matter when and where you're driving. My real car doesn't fight me every time I make a turn, and if they can't keep the game from doing the same, give me an option to turn off force feedback!
Click to expand...

On the DFGT you can just unplug the power going to the wheel and it will no longer have force feed. Maybe you can do the same with yours. I guess I only unplug mine when using the x1.
 
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l67cooled
On the DFGT you can just unplug the power going to the wheel and it will no longer have force feed. Maybe you can do the same with yours. I guess I only unplug mine when using the x1.
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No power to the T500RS = no controller. It acts like it's not even connected.
 
l67cooled
On the DFGT you can just unplug the power going to the wheel and it will no longer have force feed. Maybe you can do the same with yours. I guess I only unplug mine when using the x1.
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That's a really nasty way of getting round it as it essentially disables the feature you've spent a large amount of money to have. Why buy a $500+ wheel and then disable what is supposed to be it's defining feature?
 
I think the biggest point of all this should be, WHY should I tolerate a wheel that cost $600, yes SIX HUNDRED EXPLETIVE-ING DOLLARS, that behaves like this? I'd rather have a simple spring-loaded wheel with no force feedback than this nonsense.

It feels like the car has a slinky at each corner instead of urethane bushings. It's like one of those playground rides that is mounted on four springs; it yaws about completely unrealistically. Every car in the game does it. This is so unrealistic, I almost want to say that it's MORE REALISTIC to drive with a controller!
 

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