2010 Formula 1 Chinese Grand Prix

[Feschka]

Apparently FIA regulations allow overtaking while entering the pits or going two-wide in the pit lane.

What a joke...

 

[H20HYBRID_GT]

Apparently FIA regulations allow overtaking while entering the pits or going two-wide in the pit lane.

What a joke...

They always have and I hope they won't change it, just the pitlane entry is really dangerous and bad designed like the rest of the track.

 

[725]

That was a good race, enjoyed it. I do think people are underestimating Button. He drove well today and derserved the win and again an excellent call. The race was exciting because of the the drivers were being a little 'naughty'.

Good drives all through the field

 

[Fastas]

Apparently FIA regulations allow overtaking while entering the pits or going two-wide in the pit lane.

What a joke...

I heard that the two Ferrari drivers were called up by the officials, after Hamilton and Vettel were in there.

From the sounds of it they were all told off, (except Massa probably) what else could happen under the circumstances?

I think the former drivers taking an active role in stewarding is allowing for a much fairer assessment of incidents, that shouldn't be laughed at but applauded.

 

[yeti]

I think the former drivers taking an active role in stewarding is allowing for a much fairer assessment of incidents, that shouldn't be laughed at but applauded.

Totally agree...



C.

PS couldn't find a clapping smiley - this was the closest!!

 

[725]

Was there no red button forum on the BBC UK coverage today?

 

[Ardius]

Apparently FIA regulations allow overtaking while entering the pits or going two-wide in the pit lane.

What a joke...

I'm rather glad that we are getting more mellow steward decisions now thanks to the race drivers helping out. It was becoming tiresome watching a great race that had a dramatic incident and ended up having the results altered afterwards, there are very few cases where the stewards need to alter results, usually for serious cheating. For small incidents like that one, a slap on the wrist or a penalty for the following race is all that is required. Just so they know not do it again.

Was there no red button forum on the BBC UK coverage today?

Yes there was. If you're looking for it on the website, they don't always put it up immediately.

 

[725]

Thanks Ardius, I'll keep an eye out on iplayer. They've been quite good recently and everything has been there

 

[Feschka]

Just my opinion: drivers are not kids, there's people in the pits, safety should be regarded as a serious matter. Sorry but I think being "told off" isn't serious enough, pretty pathetic instead.

 

[Fastas]

Just my opinion: drivers are not kids, there's people in the pits, safety should be regarded as a serious matter. Sorry but I think being "told off" isn't serious enough, pretty pathetic instead.

I thought the Alonso lunge on Massa was pathetic but, I'm not a big fan of his. However, in a situation where you need to take that kind of opportunity, would you do it? I think I would.

With Vettel and Hamilton; I don't think there is a valid argument to say McLaren should not have released their driver. In regard to the two of them driving down the pit lane together; it was 'six of one and half a dozen of the other'. Sure Hamilton could have backed off but, why should he? there was plenty enough room for two cars to run side by side. I think that Vettel acted irresponsibly by 'pushing' Hamilton over. The pair of them were on the limiters so it's not like they were racing as such. Vettel also knew Hamilton had a significantly better car so ultimately he had nothing to gain by it. It would have also been dangerous for Hamilton to back out of it considering their wheels were locked too, that would almost certainly have caused an accident.

 

[Ardius]

Just my opinion: drivers are not kids, there's people in the pits, safety should be regarded as a serious matter. Sorry but I think being "told off" isn't serious enough, pretty pathetic instead.

But thats just it - they are racing drivers, they will go too far because thats what it takes to win. Hamilton could have backed off, but from his point of view, he had been released and it was safe for him to go down the pit lane, when he found Vettel next to him his first thought isn't to let him past.
Vettel was also in the same situation though I think he deserves a lot more than a reprimand - when you see the onboard footage from his car he visibly turns his steering wheel towards Hamilton, forcing Lewis towards the wheel guns, etc. That was very foolish and that deserves something a bit more.
However, Vettel did only make a very small movement, just enough to make Lewis back off. I don't like Vettel's way of thinking there though, its one thing to close the door on the track with a gravel trap, its quite another to do it using the pit lane and mechanics...

I disagree though that anything should have been done during the race - the FIA should move away from giving too many penalties that affect the race results. They couldn't have given them a stop-go penalty during the race because that incident required a more thorough investigation of whether it was an un-safe release and to hear each driver's side of the story.

But the pit entrance incidents were relatively fine, the pit entrance is still part of the track and they can't really endanger anyone there by crashing into each other.



Edit:
Found a good picture from Tony Fernandes twitter of his computer screen on the pitwall, not often you get to see this:
http://tweetphoto.com/18742767

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

I wonder how pissed Massa was after Alonso's pass. That was pretty much what salvaged Alonso's race.

 

[Seismica]

That was an amazing drive from Petrov! He thoroughly deserved those points after his spin. Wasn't very impressed by Button, it wasn't really supreme driving that one him, more a fortunately good strategy.

Lewis was very good too, yet another one of his amazing drives (almost) to the top. Schumacher sucked, Alguersuari should have done better, Vettel had bad luck, Webber had even more bad luck, and Kobayashi is beginning to replicate Vettel's start to 08'!

Wasn't really supreme driving by Button? Well, considering looking at the fastest laps, he was only 4th fastest, only outraced by his teammate and the 2 red bulls. There was an element of luck, but I think it was more good judgement on his part with his pit strategy, again. The fact he and Rosberg were ~45-50 seconds ahead of Hamilton until the second safety car closed the gap should've given Button a clear win, but it was not the case. I suppose Button's pit strategy was offset by the safety car intervention later in the race. It was indeed a fantastic drive by Hamilton, managing to overtake what was it, 5 cars after the second safety car? But you can't say Button's driving was not world class.

I feel really sorry for Kobayashi. Upon first seeing the crash, I saw the Sauber without the front wing and I thought not again... But it turns out it was not his or his car's fault. He hasn't really had a chance to prove himself, has he even finished a race yet?

The two Red Bulls had bad luck, bad pit strategy and all round just a poor race. Webber's car was shredding it's tyres more so than the other teams, and Vettel just didn't have the downforce and grip to pass Kubica (I'd call that a credit to Kubica actually). The Ferraris also had a bit of bad luck, but considering Alonso managed to get so far up the field after the amount of pit stops and his penalty, I don't think Ferrari could have hoped for much better. As soon as Alonso jumped the start it was clear they were not going to be challenging for the win, whether the rest of the race was wet or dry.

 

[Anghammarad]

I like Alonso but I thought his overtaking in the pit entrance was a bit too much. I can understand him however since he has beeen stuck behind Massa with a faster car every race so far in 2010.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Who'd have thought yesterday morning that Shanghai would give us one of the best races we've seen in the modern era?

 

[freshseth83]

This was one of the best f1 races in a while and easily the best this year by a long shot. I think it's only surpassed by maybe one or two races from last season, if that. This is what F1 should be without the rain. It would make for an interesting championship. Thing is Hamilton made the wrong tire choice. People criticize hamilton but he makes decisions on his own, it's not just the team. Same with Button. He decides things himself as well. Sure the team is there with suggestions but ultimately it's a combined decision. Regardless of the safety cars, Hamilton would have eventually caught up. Without the 2nd safety car period the leaders tires would have went off much sooner than they did.

 

[Robin]

Finally saw the re-run and wow what a race, who would have thought people would be pitting 4-5 times! I particularly loved the amount of racing for position in the pitlane, it should be its own sport.

This race had you guessing who was going to win all the way until the final corner, watching everyone nursing the cars to the finish was really edge of your seat stuff. Its got to be up there with some of the best races in the last decade.

All the drivers seemed in an overly aggressive mood for some reason. Jenson backing everyone up wasnt the smartest of moves but it made for great TV though because it felt like a race restart.

I would mind if we do what Bernie suggested and run the next race again in Shanghai! I think its a excellent layout and it never fails to be boring.

Robin.

 

[TheCracker]

I would mind if we do what Bernie suggested and run the next race again in Shanghai! I think its a excellent layout and it never fails to be boring.

Yes but run it in reverse 👍

 

[Radracing]

Great race! I would say one of the best so far of the season with Malaysia coming in second. I was hoping for Alonso battling the two Red Bulls specially with Vettle kinda disappointed there but it turned out with some surprising passes in the mix anyways.

But here's a thought I think Bernnie should take from the past races this season into fixing his problem with making F1 more intresting. Lawn Sprinkler systems pointed towards the track in all F1 races.

 

[H20HYBRID_GT]

Ok I watched the race two times again now and I can see how it was an exciting race, especially if you cut all the overtakings and track action together there was really a lot going on...
My point stands still I don't like these newish only purpouse to make overtakes happen robotic tracks, the faster cars overtake the slower cars at the end of the straight... ok fine, doesn't take much skill tho and is predictable. On other tracks, Monaco as an extreme example you get more action thru driver skill, a slow car may prevent the faster car to overtake, or a slower driver gets in front, because the driver in faster car made a slight mistake...

Really IMO the good races are usually on roadcourses like Melbourne, Montreal, Sao Paulo, Monaco, etc... you get the point, not those "I'm the best designer of all times Thielke tracks."

 

[BlacqueJacques]

I thought Hamilton drove a 'reckless' race (last second pit stop actually heading back to get to pit lane) and dueling with Vettel in the pits. Lucky no incident.

Button managed the race well (well deserved win) and those tires at the end of the race were bald!

 

[Anghammarad]

Monaco as an extreme example you get more action thru driver skill, a slow car may prevent the faster car to overtake, or a slower driver gets in front, because the driver in faster car made a slight mistake...

There's really nothing more boring than Monaco's GP (except for the vibe). It's simply impossible to overtake at all. They should just hand out the points after qualification and then do an exhibition race.

 

[H20HYBRID_GT]

Haha, yeah right as if the pole setter always wins... Monaco is an extreme example tho and and you're right it can get boring, but usually I really enjoy watching it.

 

[astrosdude91]

I thought it was a very exciting race, with alot of overtaking. I'm surprised that Red Bull didn't do any better than what they did, when looking at practice and the fact that they qualified 1-2. Oh well.

It's nice to be a Red Bull fan. I actually have a team to root for that actually does well! (That's a shot at you, Houston Astros!)

But my friend is a McLaren fan, so I'm not going to stop hearing about this.

 

[Fastas]

Ok I watched the race two times again now and I can see how it was an exciting race, especially if you cut all the overtakings and track action together there was really a lot going on...
My point stands still I don't like these newish only purpouse to make overtakes happen robotic tracks, the faster cars overtake the slower cars at the end of the straight... ok fine, doesn't take much skill tho and is predictable. On other tracks, Monaco as an extreme example you get more action thru driver skill, a slow car may prevent the faster car to overtake, or a slower driver gets in front, because the driver in faster car made a slight mistake...

Really IMO the good races are usually on roadcourses like Melbourne, Montreal, Sao Paulo, Monaco, etc... you get the point, not those "I'm the best designer of all times Thielke tracks."

It can be difficult and at times plain frustrating to know some action is occurring on the track but it is out of view of the camera lens.

I really like this track though so I'm going to defend it. The variation of it's corners and the two 'snail shells' really seam to test a cars grip and balance and the different lines that were being taken in them adds to the mix. In part, I think this is down to the fact that the driver is off or only feathering the throttle for a greater amount of time that a typical single apex corner. The variation in down-force that each team was running also proves that you can run more than one type of set up and make either work. That must be a difficult feat on a modern circuit. A lot of the corners at Shanghai use this theme and that in itself makes it unique/interesting.

One of my favourite corners by Tilke is at Turkey. Turns 8, 9 and 10 (?) from memory; flat-out and three separate apexes, exiting the last at approx 190mph I do agree that he's done enough now - time to move over!

One thing these new tracks seem to lack compared to most of the ones you mention is elevation variance. Also, tracks that have served another purpose originally as opposed to being purpose made for racing such as public roads or airbases etc. The best example (can't believe you didn't mention it)....Spa

D.

 

[Roo]

According to Autosport, excluding the first lap, pitstops, cars off track and mechanical issues, there were 62 overtakes for position in the grand prix last weekend - the only race in the last 20 years with more was the 1990 Mexican GP, with 70 overtaking manoeuvres.

One of my favourite corners by Tilke is at Turkey. Turns 8, 9 and 10 (?)

It's all turn 8 - a quadruple apex corner.

 

[Fastas]

According to Autosport, excluding the first lap, pitstops, cars off track and mechanical issues, there were 62 overtakes for position in the grand prix last weekend - the only race in the last 20 years with more was the 1990 Mexican GP, with 70 overtaking manoeuvres.



It's all turn 8 - a quadruple apex corner.

👍 dang memory

Great stat too Roo, it goes to show just how much you miss on the box.

 

[F1 fan]

Saying that though, it does also state on your race ticket "Motorsport is a dangerous sport, you spectate at your own risk" so there is also an element of fans and marshals being aware of the dangers. Though obviously I agree spectator and marshal safety are important too - just its not just drivers who are "aware of the dangers" and it shouldn't be seen as that only the drivers are accepting risks, really everyone involved at the circuit is accepting risks.

I fully agree with you on this, but I don't know what percentage of your average group of spectators do...

Safety for all involved should be high on everyone's agenda, but at the same time, buemi's accident could have easily happened on race day, facing a grandstand. If you look at where the tyres ended up, it could have been a disaster. The problem is that a tyre is tricky to slow down, perhaps higher fences with an "inward angle" to prevent the tyre flying into a grandstand... Maybe even some form of spiked fence that may puncture a tyre, having said that, the actual wheel is the biggest problem...

Who knows? The people working on safety are a lot more intelligent than me.

Edit:

Who'd have thought yesterday morning that Shanghai would give us one of the best races we've seen in the modern era?

Yeah, it was a bit of a surprise. I've got to say, with the exception of Bahrain, this has been one of the most exciting starts to a season in a long time. With arguably 3 classic races in a row. I think it is all down to the cars, and the tortoise v hare nature of few pitstops and nursing tyres versus a lot of pitstops and thrashing tyres.

The jenson v lewis partnership is going to be an interesting battle all season. Got to say I'm surprised that Jenson is beating lewis, just like I was surprised in jenson's performance early last season. Before australia 09 I'd pretty much written him off as an "also ran". How wrong I was.

I'm a bit disappointed with Rosberg. Don't get me wrong, he had a great race, but at one point I was sitting with a can of red bull in hand, tired after a long weekend of little to no sleep, with a smile on my face thinking "this is it Nico".

It'll come soon enough, I'm sure. But if the upgrades to Schumacher's car help bring back the "old" Michael, then Nico will need to start winning or else people may just forget how good he's been early this season.

For example, If Michael get's it together, and delivers a few race wins, but Nico doesn't. It's only going to look bad on Nico... The press may be keen to target Schumacher's underachieving form this season, but it would really only take one brilliant "classic Schuey" performance, and the press would totally change their stance on his comeback.

Personally, I am hoping to see the old Michael. As much as he may be enjoying his comeback, the telling "smile and raised eyebrows" to the camera after qualifying and races this year is quite upsetting to a lifelong schuey fan who was hoping his comeback would pan out a bit like Rocky Balboa's...

 

[yeti]

The problem is that a tyre is tricky to slow down, perhaps higher fences

Might work - but I think they went through the fence didn't they?

with an "inward angle" to prevent the tyre flying into a grandstand...

But that could rebound the tyre back onto the circuit - something that they want to avoid - think Henry Surtees...

Maybe even some form of spiked fence that may puncture a tyre

That won't work - someone could end up impaled after a nasty crash...

A combination of the 3 could work though - single "normal" fence... followed by spiky fence... followed by angled fence.

C.

 

[BlacqueJacques]

Energy absorbing nets (a la hockey rink) but designed to contain a heavy speeding wheel assembly may work.

That is also why it is important to pay attention to what is happening on the track.

Still not as bad as rally races and crowds on the side of the road! Scary that!