2013 Airtel Indian Grand Prix

[SVT Cobra GT]

You would also need a Vettel chart for true comparison.

Vettel comparison;

Australia - 3rd
Malaysia - 1st via Multi-21
China - 4th
Bahrain - 1st
Spain - 4th
Monaco - 2nd
Canada - 1st
Britain - Retired (Driveshaft/Gearbox failure)
Germany - 1st
Hungary - 3rd
Belgium to India - 1st

 

[Samus]

That is just the results, what about issues? The Webber chart was biased the other way, only noting the issues, not the finishing positions. It's also only this season, like I said before luck tends to run one way then the other.

My point being there is no evidence of what peasentslayer said, which was "I think Webber has worse luck because Vettel gets the best mechanics/more attention".

 

[SVT Cobra GT]

As far as I recall. Vettel's only issues have come in Britain and Italy. Britain where he retired and Italy where there were concerns over his gearbox and he had to start short shifting.

 

[Samus]

As far as I recall. Vettel's only issues have come in Britain and Italy. Britain where he retired and Italy where there were concerns over his gearbox and he had to start short shifting.

KERS issues in Japan quali, KERS issue in German race, I'm sure there are others.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Care to elaborate how I'm contradicting myself? Or are you trying to cast stones because anytime we butt heads you are not the winning party? Either way I would love to see why you are irritated with me now on this subject.

Free pass this time; you said there's "plenty wrong" with my statement then completely agreed with me.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Free pass this time; you said there's "plenty wrong" with my statement then completely agreed with me.

Free pass? Only seems to establish what I've said. Also how did I agree with you exactly?

 

[BHRxRacer]

Free pass? Only seems to establish what I've said. Also how did I agree with you exactly?

Establish what? Your imaginary winning? I can't remember the last time you were right about anything. Anyway, you said Vettel is close to Hamilton's race pace, which is what I actually pointed out. I was saying there's no wya Vettel is 7 tenths or whatever faster than Hamilton on raw pace, because Hamilton is seriously quick himself.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Establish what? Your imaginary winning? I can't remember the last time you were right about anything. Anyway, you said Vettel is close to Hamilton's race pace, which is what I actually pointed out. I was saying there's no wya Vettel is 7 tenths or whatever faster than Hamilton on raw pace, because Hamilton is seriously quick himself.

I'm sure you can't remember me being right, that'd take you having some humility to admit.

I just read your post twice before you posted, and from what you imply the car is doing most of the work you claim it is 6 tenths faster and he provides the other 2 tenths. Which would lead others to believe that the car does all the work and he isn't even fast enough to be ahead of Hamilton, let alone be on par. If you had more cogency this wouldn't have been lost. I agree Hamilton is quick, but in the current environment of F1 regs, Vettel is able to drive his style better and thus be extremely fast. Though he isn't a purest driver like Lewis, he is a calculated and adaptable driver to technological updates some what like Prost. I don't think Lewis is the fastest right now because he can't get his act together, thus Vettel is easily the fastest in the Circus right now.

 

[BHRxRacer]

I'm sure you can't remember me being right, that'd take you having some humility to admit.

I just read your post twice before you posted, and from what you imply the car is doing most of the work you claim it is 6 tenths faster and he provides the other 2 tenths. Which would lead others to believe that the car does all the work and he isn't even fast enough to be ahead of Hamilton, let alone be on par. If you had more cogency this wouldn't have been lost. I agree Hamilton is quick, but in the current environment of F1 regs, Vettel is able to drive his style better and thus be extremely fast. Though he isn't a purest driver like Lewis, he is a calculated and adaptable driver to technological updates some what like Prost. I don't think Lewis is the fastest right now because he can't get his act together, thus Vettel is easily the fastest in the Circus right now.

No, only if you're just desperate to find something to hold against It wasn't like Hamilton was on foot, his car helped him too. All I was saying that as fast as Vettel's lap was, the 7-8 tenths difference to Hamilton is impossible to be down to raw pace only because Hamilton's equally quick overall Read it again.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

No, only if you're just desperate to find something to hold against It wasn't like Hamilton was on foot, his car helped him too. All I was saying that as fast as Vettel's lap was, the 7-8 tenths difference to Hamilton is impossible to be down to raw pace only because Hamilton's equally quick overall Read it again.

Obviously not, another user thought you were bashing Vettel too. I don't hold anything against you, if you say something I don't agree with I argue it, if you do it on a regular basis I take note of who you are, if you do it to such an extent that reaches jgreen stubborn and inane then I make a point of doing so. Either way at the end of the day it's a forum, I don't live my week waiting to argue against you if that is what you are implying. Also what am I desperate for, fictional internet point? Can you hear me over your ego?

This is what you said:

No, just 6 tenths of it. (saying the car is doing all that work) If you really think Vettel is 8 tenths faster than Hamilton on raw speed something is definitely wrong with you.

I'm saying yes he is just as fast and faster. Not a contradiction with any of my reasoning I've shown you thus far. This quote shows that you doubt Vettel can be that fast against Hamilton and another user thought the same once again. You never said anything that established you though Vettel was on par, and with your prior post in line with most AV users me thinking so isn't too unreasonable.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Obviously not, another user thought you were bashing Vettel too. I don't hold anything against you, if you say something I don't agree with I argue it, if you do it on a regular basis I take note of who you are, if you do it to such an extent that reaches jgreen stubborn and inane then I make a point of doing so. Either way at the end of the day it's a forum, I don't live my week waiting to argue against you if that is what you are implying. Also what am I desperate for, fictional internet point? Can you hear me over your ego?

This is what you said:


I'm saying yes he is just as fast and faster. Not a contradiction with any of my reasoning I've shown you thus far. This quote shows that you doubt Vettel can be that fast against Hamilton and another user thought the same once again. You never said anything that established you though Vettel was on par, and with your prior post in line with most AV users me thinking so isn't too unreasonable.

All I've been seeing lately is you immediately jumping at something I said, taking it out of context then trying to argue.

As for the Vettel bit, well, read it for the 5th time. How is "6 tenths out of 8 tenths" = car is doing ALL the work? 6/8 != 8/8. I was merely pointing out how ridiculous it is for people to say that the entire 8th gap to the guys behind is down to Vettel's skills.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

All I've been seeing lately is you immediately jumping at something I said, taking it out of context then trying to argue.

As for the Vettel bit, well, read it for the 5th time. How is "6 tenths out of 8 tenths" = car is doing ALL the work? 6/8 != 8/8. I was merely pointing out how ridiculous it is for people to say that the entire 8th gap to the guys behind is down to Vettel's skills.

Why? I'd say it is his skill we have a bench mark to compare him to and though it may not be Hamilton, I'd not see he is out driving his car all the time like say Fernando or recently Hulkenburg. He does have slight issues adjusting and when he is having an off week it gets worse. Overall I'd say Vettel is doing great things and better than Lewis outright, if the rules shifted to where they were allowed to just drive full out to the limit and didn't have to be tactical maybe then it could be a claim. But for the moment in the environment we see with F1 the "raw" pace Vettel has is all his not a majority of the car.