2014 Formula 1 Gran Premio de España Pirelli

[axletramp]

"Stoffel Vandoorne and his Mighty Arse Horn"

 

[King1982]

"Stoffel Vandoorne and his Mighty Arse Horn"

He did win on his debut race in Gp2. He's poised to take over from JB.

 

[Roo]

Max Chilton fastest on the first day of testing.

Before you get too excited, he set that time on the super softs. Hamilton - a quarter of a second behind - set his best time on mediums.

 

[mikeerfol]

The impressive thing is that the conditions weren't ideal but still he was 3 seconds faster than his qualifying time (set on mediums)

 

[Sam48]

Max Chilton fastest on the first day of testing.

Before you get too excited, he set that time on the super softs. Hamilton - a quarter of a second behind - set his best time on mediums.

Is it even remotely impressive? I don't know.

 

[neljack]

Probably been seen by a lot already but this was their reaction when the session end.

 

[Samus]

Is it even remotely impressive? I don't know.

Not really. It would have put them fourth on the grid on Sunday but of course they were using super-soft tyres, two grades better than the mediums used in the event.

 

[Alex.]

I can't believe what a big deal they're making out of it. They were 1.2 seconds off Hamilton's pole time on Super Softs on a testing day for christ's sake. It literally would not be any more insignificant if they ran a car with a V10.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

He did win on his debut race in Gp2. He's poised to take over from JB.

Except that Button says he has no intention of leaving the sport. It would be a huge risk for the team to take Vandoorne alongside Magnussen as Honda come in. It's far more likely that McLaren will try to place Vandoorne elsewhere, as they tried to with Magnussen. Force India, Lotus and Haas all seem like viable destinations, especially if Honda want to try and pick up a second team for 2016.

 

[niky]

So a Marussia on super softs is three to four seconds faster than a GP2 car on softs, and is a second slower than one on mediums.

All this tells us is Pirelli should have brought super softs to Barcelona on race weekend to keep Sergio Perez quiet.




Given that pace, I wonder what a front-runner like the Merc or Red Bull would do on a super soft lap...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Probably been seen by a lot already but this was their reaction when the session end. View attachment 156081

Marussia F1: Guys...I think we've finally made wing end-plates so great that we can beat even Mercedes...

Tire guy: *fades into the sauntering mist before everyone realizes*

 

[FormulaKimball]

Problem is race pace is so slow, it looks like a lower formula in speed. I find it amazing that only Vettel managed to beat Grosjean's GP2 race lap from 2008 considering F1 car has more horsepower and probably weighs a lower amount. I think F1 teams need to look at how Dallara GP2/08 based GP2 cars were so fast given power and weight. I would have thought an F1 car with so much technology and so much more money and best constructors and drivers in the world would have an easier time of beating a dated GP2 car fastest lap.

Yep, and as much as most people don't want to think about anything but "oh but the racing is better now", in a way it's exactly the same (one team dominating), it's just happening at a much slower pace. How much slower? In 2007 when they first installed the ("hideous" as David Hobbes calls it) chicane in the last corner, the cars were doing 1:20s in qualifying and 1:22 was the best race lap, with a finishing time of 1:31:36.2. Over the years 2008-2013 the qualifying pace fluctuated between 1:19.9 and 1:22.1 and back to 1:20.7, but the races gradually slowed down to the 1h39m we saw in 2011-2013. 2014, we have 1:25 as the qually pace, 1:28.9 as the fastest lap, and a finishing time of 1h41m. That's ten minutes slower within seven years. Basically a 2007 car could lap a 2014 car *seven times*.

And this is the problem - yes overall the 2014 Spain GP was entertaining (after all it's still technically F1), but between the horrible sound balance (briefly: why can't they turn up the mics next to the track and especially get the commentators to shut up once in a while and also make their audio tracks take up a lot less space in the mix) and the much slower pace due to all the counterproductive changes the FIA keep making, it's not just doing away with the V10 and then the V8, or the changes to the tires, or the aero, or the banning of refuelling, or the additional weight of ERS installations... when it's ALL of those things in too tight a succession, you end up with a very expensive formula that is rather slow.... I don't know, maybe a slow as the cars were 15 years ago? Actually if you look at the Australian GP, even the 1997 race was quicker than 2014... and it was a lap longer!

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Yep, and as much as most people don't want to think about anything but "oh but the racing is better now", in a way it's exactly the same (one team dominating), it's just happening at a much slower pace. How much slower? In 2007 when they first installed the ("hideous" as David Hobbes calls it) chicane in the last corner, the cars were doing 1:20s in qualifying and 1:22 was the best race lap, with a finishing time of 1:31:36.2. Over the years 2008-2013 the qualifying pace fluctuated between 1:19.9 and 1:22.1 and back to 1:20.7, but the races gradually slowed down to the 1h39m we saw in 2011-2013. 2014, we have 1:25 as the qually pace, 1:28.9 as the fastest lap, and a finishing time of 1h41m. That's ten minutes slower within seven years. Basically a 2007 car could lap a 2014 car *seven times*.

Yes because rule changes and tires of a different compound design and maker for what the FIA wanted at that time make for such comparable figures.

And this is the problem - yes overall the 2014 Spain GP was entertaining (after all it's still technically F1), but between the horrible sound balance (briefly: why can't they turn up the mics next to the track and especially get the commentators to shut up once in a while and also make their audio tracks take up a lot less space in the mix) and the much slower pace due to all the counterproductive changes the FIA keep making, it's not just doing away with the V10 and then the V8, or the changes to the tires, or the aero, or the banning of refuelling, or the additional weight of ERS installations... when it's ALL of those things in too tight a succession, you end up with a very expensive formula that is rather slow.... I don't know, maybe a slow as the cars were 15 years ago? Actually if you look at the Australian GP, even the 1997 race was quicker than 2014... and it was a lap longer!

It's not "technically" anything it is F1, it's a car based on advanced technology to the highest tier of a formula like no other. What you've done is show a biased view, and then furthered it along by making it seem as if the general fan base is just a fly by night group looking for a simple show. Also the FOM did turn up the mix and make it louder for tv audiences and to the point where at times it is difficult to tell what the commentators are saying, most times from the feeds I watch they both drown each other out a bit especially from the cockpit view.

 

[FormulaKimball]

It's not "technically" anything it is F1, it's a car based on advanced technology to the highest tier of a formula like no other. What you've done is show a biased view, and then furthered it along by making it seem as if the general fan base is just a fly by night group looking for a simple show. Also the FOM did turn up the mix and make it louder for tv audiences and to the point where at times it is difficult to tell what the commentators are saying, most times from the feeds I watch they both drown each other out a bit especially from the cockpit view.

What feeds are you watching? On the channel I watched (NBC Sports) the only time I could hear anything with the cars was the onboard - even all the new sounds like tire squeal etc. Never had a problem understanding what they are saying even on cockpit view.

I don't mean to suggest the audience is simple - to word it another way, out of love for F1 it's preferable to dwell on the positives of all the changes, hence looking for ways the racing has improved.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

What feeds are you watching? On the channel I watched (NBC Sports) the only time I could hear anything with the cars was the onboard - even all the new sounds like tire squeal etc. Never had a problem understanding what they are saying even on cockpit view.

I watch Sky and BBC because NBCSN is a joke.

I don't mean to suggest the audience is simple - to word it another way, out of love for F1 it's preferable to dwell on the positives of all the changes, hence looking for ways the racing has improved.

And that is a problem how? Surely playing the nostalgia bit and wanting to see a return of things that are unrealistic and a waste of resources that would surely have teams and manufactures leave. Then again this has been covered quite a bit on other F1 related threads and racing threads in general like the Hybrid one.

 

[FormulaKimball]

And that is a problem how? Surely playing the nostalgia bit and wanting to see a return of things that are unrealistic and a waste of resources that would surely have teams and manufactures leave. Then again this has been covered quite a bit on other F1 related threads and racing threads in general like the Hybrid one.

I wasn't saying that's a problem, just clarifying that you shouldn't take it as a negative on my part. I could comment more on the rest but I agree we're starting to get off topic here.

Incidentally, I was thinking quite often during the Spain GP that I might enjoy it a lot more if I could simply turn off the commentary altogether. Can you do that with Sky and/or BBC? About the only intelligent thing I remember was when Will Buxton called out Maldonato for never accepting responsibility for anything...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I wasn't saying that's a problem, just clarifying that you shouldn't take it as a negative on my part. I could comment more on the rest but I agree we're starting to get off topic here.

Incidentally, I was thinking quite often during the Spain GP that I might enjoy it a lot more if I could simply turn off the commentary altogether. Can you do that with Sky and/or BBC? About the only intelligent thing I remember was when Will Buxton called out Maldonato for never accepting responsibility for anything...

No I can't do that, and to be honest I wouldn't because they're quite good about bringing up info real time of issues and such going on. NBC and prior Speed couldn't do that because they weren't track side really only for a few races and most of what they did was just purely commentate from what I remember on what we all saw through the FOM feed.

 

[chromatic9]

Can't turn off commentary on the BBC

I can hear the cars fine on the BBC but quite a lot of times its a soft humming noise and every few minutes a car will pass near a mic and you get something decent sounding. The humming noise does sound a bit like motorbikes in the distance. I think we need a whole rethink on the mics and they relate to what the director cuts to.

I've got the race recorded if anyone wanted to hear a clip

Nico Rosberg says the new trumpet exhaust his Mercedes team tested on Wednesday in Barcelona did not work
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/27418196

 

[FormulaKimball]

I can hear the cars fine on the BBC but quite a lot of times its a soft humming noise and every few minutes a car will pass near a mic and you get something decent sounding. The humming noise does sound a bit like motorbikes in the distance. I think we need a whole rethink on the mics and they relate to what the director cuts to.

Absolutely. Some directional mics perhaps? To me it feels like the sound and video are usually too high and far away (which contributes to making the cars look slower). What I want a lot more of is the onboard plus, crucially, still camera shots that do not pan as the cars go by - no zooming, either - just sit there and capture the zzzzzzzzzoom! on straights, or on corner entries the long highest note coming toward you that suddenly slams into braking and a bunch of downshifts.

And back to the commentary - my first F1 race was the 1985 Adelaide GP which I saw on ESPN, and they only had two guys talking on that and what they said was much more measured, insightful, without hype (I've been able to watch it again a few times recently, thanks to my 1985 self who made use of our VCR . It was so refreshing that they let each other breathe a bit so we could hear the cars doing their thing. The engines were pretty much always audible and the shots were often close enough that background was flying by in a total blur. Imagine if today's races could be experienced like that.

 

[Barra333]

Despite the fact that I understand sod all of the commentary, the Dutch feed is not bad - choice of FOM feed + commentary, rotation of on board (incl telemetry), or pit lane (incl lots more radio transmissions). Can split screen them too. My favorites are the GPs BBC cover. That gives BBC on tv and the on board/pit lane on my laptop, with volume in the pit channel.